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Thread: A few tips for the people playing as one or playing with one.

A few tips for the people playing as one or playing with one.

  1. #1

    A few tips for the people playing as one or playing with one.

    Heya guys! So, I've been playing non stop for a while now and there's a few things I noticed while playing this wonderful class that I wanted to share. I'd love to do an extensive guide but I'm very tired at the moment I'm writing this so this is the compromise I made with myself because I absolutely wanted to post a few things about the Tyrant. Keep in mind while reading these that this is my personal opinion based on extensive gameplay experience with the class and in no way are these facts or do they reflect anything more than my idea of the class's function.


    1) You are not a damage dealer. This doesn't mean you don't deal damage. It simply means that your role in the group should not be spamming AAs (autoattacks) or trying to go in last so you can clean up.

    2) You are an initiator. A warmachine. A Juggernaut. A deathbringer. When you play as a Tyrant , you should look at that 1400 hp and understand the reason you have so much. It enables you to withstand massive amounts of punishment while you charge/jump into the human group and make them wet their underpants.It does not however mean that you are invulnerable.Which brings me to my next point.

    3) You are a WALL. Some of you may use the word "tank" but it would not be appropriate here because of the magnificent collision detection system the game has. The Tyrant is the only class that can use itself as a moving obstacle (provided you are not at 100 hp when you decide to do so). Ignore Pain is not there to just help you out of a sticky situation. No. My blood-sucking fellows, Ignore Pain combined with some decent maneuvering can offer your teammates the breathing room they need to get out of a sticky situation by completely blocking a human's attacks/skills.(It's also humorously "bad mannered" as you can pop it and just hug someone with it, showing them who's baws. )

    4) When you use charge, try not to be in line of sight of an enemy. Instead try to get a good idea of where the humans are positioned and start charging out of line of sight so that they have less time to react to it. Always be mindful of the distance you need to cover between the starting position and where you want to end up. Charge has a 3.75 second duration so be careful you don't end up almost hitting someone with it and instead stopping right in front of them :P . Also be aware that you can steer sideways during the charge animation with the A and D keys.

    5)Jump is awkward and requires a lot of practice before you start hitting with it so spam it hard until you get the hang of it. Also don't fret when you have jump equipped and the humans are camped inside buildings. Remember: You are a vampire,and a tough one at that. You can still jump around rooftops so you can get at a better spot and you can even walk right into them. But, in my opinion, ALWAYS run Shockwave with Jump, so that you at least have a ranged engage option if Jump is out of the question.Also, Jump can be used as an escape tool. And if you jump from lower ground and land on a rooftop before or VERY shortly after you start descending Jump will not go on cooldown.

    6)Last but not least! Always make sure you understand the reason for your current loadout(unless you are a beginner in which case just try out whatever you want to get a hang of it :P). Don't just pick skills because they look pretty or strong. Pick them because you want to help synergize with the team's composition as effectively as possible.

    One more thing. Rage in my opinion is a horrible choice for the Tyrant. It doesn't buff the damage of his skills, merely his autoattacks and it forces him into a Reaver-esque playstyle where you try to get in after your buddies so you can do damage with it. Ignore Pain will ALWAYS be the superior choice in that regard because it simply gives you the option to get into and out of a fight safely and because you are not screwed when you get Bola'd. Also Ignore Pain kills alchemists who spam , because they take friendly fire damage from their own attacks if you hug them and you force them to either stop attacking or deal damage to themselves :P

    I hope I helped, if I forgot about anything I'll just edit it in See you in the fields of slaughter people !

    EDIT: Enrage buffs skills! Wasn't aware since it's not in the tooltip TY cmstache (it also buffs fall damage caused by those skills which is ridiculous ) This changes a few things but mostly it means I'll be spamming Tyrant today -_-

    EDIT#2: Got a ton of matches with enrage in today. I still believe Ignore Pain is the superior choice for competitive play, but my opinion will remain purely theoretical since party making isn't enabled yet. However I must say, the opportunities that Enrage offers and the amount of instakills you can get with it certainly make it a lot more viable than I believed it to be.Of course one day is not enough and as I said there will be extensive testing done, but these are my thought on it for now. Also Enrage kinda kills Jump thus far for me. But then again maybe I need to find a better way to utilize those two skills together.I will be overhauling this thread into a guide when I feel that I am experienced enough to do that.
    Last edited by CoOkiedude; 5th Feb 2014 at 05:13.

  2. #2
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    Best advice I can give in addition to that is don't try to chain charge or jump into groundslam or shockwave, you'll get stunned and killed.

  3. #3
    Originally Posted by Oroibahazopi
    Best advice I can give in addition to that is don't try to chain charge or jump into groundslam or shockwave, you'll get stunned and killed.
    So very, very true. After Charge or Jump, there's a small cooldown timer on Groundslam or Shockwave. After Jump it's best to get a melee attack in and then use Q.If you actually bullseye someone with Jump you will stun them so in theory you have time to use Q but more often than not , they have friends around them so don't be reckless. With Charge it really depends on your game plan at that specific moment so it's up to you

  4. #4
    Originally Posted by Oroibahazopi
    (...)or jump into groundslam or shockwave, you'll get stunned and killed.
    This has happened more than I care to admit.

  5. #5
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    Great words of advice Cookie ...I love Tyrant lol he rules

    I'd say maybe try keep an eye on your vampy friends too - if it looks like they are coming along to attack then jump/charge in and lead the attack by causing some chaos which gives them chance then to do their thing whilst the humans focus on you (it can fail if your buddies don't back you up though). If your mates are already attacking and you're a bit late to the party then disturb the humans by leaping on their heads yeeeeaaaaahhhhhhhh!

  6. #6
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    Originally Posted by CoOkiedude
    So very, very true. After Charge or Jump, there's a small cooldown timer on Groundslam or Shockwave. After Jump it's best to get a melee attack in and then use Q.If you actually bullseye someone with Jump you will stun them so in theory you have time to use Q but more often than not , they have friends around them so don't be reckless. With Charge it really depends on your game plan at that specific moment so it's up to you
    You may find yourself needing to hit f as soon as you land/finish running vs good teams. I usually Jump, mash f as hard as I can because I'm standing in traps, grenades or firewalls and have been hit on the way in by scouts for 30-50% of my hp, walk off out of sight and come back to shockwave after ignore pain is finished to help clean up.

  7. #7
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    Enrage does indeed buff skills. It also buffs any fall damage taken because of those skills (I've taken 550 fall damage from a medium height because I got shockwaved and thrown back.) It can literally be an instakill. Enrage is just harder to use (only like 3-4 players use it effectively). The ones who do typically score 20k plus almost every match.
    Sausage-Member of 200g-My Twitch Stream, Livesignature image

  8. #8
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    Another thing is you can let Reavers blanker in smoke bombs before you charge or leap, which blinds humans quite nicely, leading for an easier and safer charge/leap
    In-game: Sirshua, being a sir everywhere.

  9. #9
    Originally Posted by cmstache
    Enrage does indeed buff skills. It also buffs any fall damage taken because of those skills (I've taken 550 fall damage from a medium height because I got shockwaved and thrown back.) It can literally be an instakill. Enrage is just harder to use (only like 3-4 players use it effectively). The ones who do typically score 20k plus almost every match.

    I wasn't aware of that. It's not in the tooltip,is it intended? If it is, it changes a great deal of things for me :P

  10. #10
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    I'm not sure. I know why it does it, but not sure if it's intended. Fall damage is attributed to anything that caused it. So the if a shockwave is buffed, so is the damage the fall causes as long as it's active.
    Sausage-Member of 200g-My Twitch Stream, Livesignature image

  11. #11
    Originally Posted by CoOkiedude
    2) You are an initiator. A warmachine. A Juggernaut. A deathbringer. When you play as a Tyrant , you should look at that 1400 hp and understand the reason you have so much. It enables you to withstand massive amounts of punishment while you charge/jump into the human group and make them wet their underpants.It does not however mean that you are invulnerable.Which brings me to my next point.
    Great tips all around. This one in particular appeals to me, because any time I play Tyrant in the office I love to jump in, throw on Ignore Pain, and (rather loudly) yell "Beast moooooooooooooode!"

  12. #12
    Originally Posted by Psyonix_Eric
    Great tips all around. This one in particular appeals to me, because any time I play Tyrant in the office I love to jump in, throw on Ignore Pain, and (rather loudly) yell "Beast moooooooooooooode!"

    I know the feeling...so awesome!

  13. #13
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    Favourite Tyrant moments are when the stars align and I can get all four guys with a tyrant charge.

    Also I did this one humongous leap. It was perfect. All the Humans clustered on the bridge in Sommerdamm. If I hit two of them would have fallen off. Used Tab to check hit points (pre-leap). One of them would have died. Team was at my back. They hadn't noticed me from so high above, so it was a full 1350 HP of whoop-ass raining in on the unsuspecting fools.
    Plot Twist: Hits that furshluggining skinny tiny wooden toothpick of a lamp post... Falls beside bridge. Humans un affected. I scramble as team mates had joined in just a tad late. Get Bola'd so I need to use ignore pain. Team-mates slaughtered. I survive because full HP plus ignore pain+being ignored while humans bring down team-mates. I hate that lamp post.
    In-game: Sirshua, being a sir everywhere.

  14. #14
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    Geometry is a boon and a curse, you can really exploit dodgy jumps to your advantage.

    Such as jumping right up against a wall to go completely vertical or finding which ceilings are just high enough to cut your vertical movement short but let you land and do full damage.

  15. #15
    I'm gonna say... hitting the hard ceiling with jump in Sommerdamm and landing like a sack of potatoes in front of the humans instead of on them....Not fun.This might need some looking at perhaps.Few too many occassions

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by CoOkiedude
    I'm gonna say... hitting the hard ceiling with jump in Sommerdamm and landing like a sack of potatoes in front of the humans instead of on them....Not fun.This might need some looking at perhaps.Few too many occassions
    We've been working on this internally and we've got some fixes in place. It just needs to find its way to live servers.

  17. #17
    Originally Posted by Psyonix_Eric
    We've been working on this internally and we've got some fixes in place. It just needs to find its way to live servers.

    Oh that's cool By the way Eric, would you happen to know if Enrage is working as intended at the moment? The tooltip says melee attacks only but it also affects skills. If it's working as intended I'm loving every second of it, I just wanted a confirmation if it's not too much trouble.
    Last edited by CoOkiedude; 5th Feb 2014 at 05:30.

  18. #18
    I feel like people aren't playing Tyrant enough. It seems like most of the games I get into are nothing but Dumahim and Razielim and everyone is missing out because Dumahim are damge dealers and Razielim have a cool gimmick.

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by CoOkiedude
    Oh that's cool By the way Eric, would you happen to know if Enrage is working as intended at the moment? The tooltip says melee attacks only but it also affects skills. If it's working as intended I'm loving every second of it, I just wanted a confirmation if it's not too much trouble.
    It's not that it's not WAI right now, it's more that we're discussing whether or not we want to keep it this way. We're trying to determine how we want the skill to work with regards to this. At the moment it's not an exploit or anything but it may change once we decide what we want.

  20. #20
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    Originally Posted by Psyonix_Eric
    It's not that it's not WAI right now, it's more that we're discussing whether or not we want to keep it this way. We're trying to determine how we want the skill to work with regards to this. At the moment it's not an exploit or anything but it may change once we decide what we want.
    You probably have thrown most arguments at each other and the only thing left is the decision. However in the case that my feedback might help on decisionmaking, I'll just post it here:

    I'd like to see Enrage to stay the way at it is now. And thats not because of pure strength (there'd always be the way to nerf/buff the values of the ability anyway), but because I'd feel uncomfortable using abilities while enraged and to be left with the choice to 1. just not use any ability while enraged or 2. to use an ability but waste quite some of my precious enraged-time.

    Although it is true, that I do most enraged-damage with normal hits either way, that problem would still get to me. It could probably be compensated by giving Enrage a higher bufftime, but it likely still wouldnt remove that awkward feeling.

    One last thing. That falldamage caused by enraged abilities gets increased as well feels really fun and gimicky as a Tyrant, but I do think that its also probably hard to understand and confusing for most players who are the victim of that. On the other hand it doesnt happen too often. Well from my perspective I'd still like for enraged falldamage to stay cause its fun, but I guess I still wanted to rais the point.
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  21. #21
    I guess I should weigh in too, since Plux, Oroi and I have probably played more tyrant than anyone else. The points you bring up are great for newer players, however enrage is far better than you think for many reasons.

    The obvious which has already been brought up is that enrage enhances ALL your damage, from abilities to fall damage to straight up melee.

    Second you are faster while enraging, this is a massive massive plus as a tyrant. You can close the distance faster and become more unpredictable since your punching and moving at least 30% faster OUCH.

    Also I would like to point out that jump and ignore pain synergize way better than jump and enrage. A lot of people run jump and therefore assume enrage sucks. However, should you learn to charge properly you will learn quickly how devastating that combo is OMG nuf said. In certain areas you can kill a human with a well placed charge while enraged in a single hit. Provance for example, if you charge someone off the bridge close to the little house in the center it will kill them. May not be entirely intended but basically you get enrage damage on the charge which is over 500 dmg depending on how you hit them, plus enrage fall damage = dead.

    Charge is far more unpredictable than jump, with jump you are a huge target for a good 1-2 seconds before you land and are really easy to see most of the time. This is why ignore pain is necessary versus a decent human lineup. With charge you have a whole lot going for you, you can't be stunned, you enter fast and can charge out if you see the situation is too risky. If you hit 3 people you pretty much won the fight for your team. You don't even have to live, just spam enrage throw out a shockwave and punch once or twice. You just RIPPED the team a new one, they all have less than half life and spent the last 2-3 seconds focusing you down, GG. I also often do an enraged charge, this does mean that I may be easier to kill because I can't use enrage to escape, but it does mean a lot of damage, so if I know I can land a 2+ enrage charge I'll do it.

    I actually prefer charge now, and even like the short standard charge over marathon, even before the nerf to marathon. The reason for that is because I can overcome the length of the charge with superior positioning and getting closer before I commit, and the upside will be that I can charge again before the fight is over if things go well. Now after the marathon nerf I would recommend using the standard charge and learning how to use it. Its actually quite good if not better than marathon in almost any situation. Marathon has its advantage when there is a lot of open space to the target, and if you intend to charge in and get out.

  22. #22
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    Does the speed boost make your charge movement faster?

    I couldn't use enrage unless I had a team I could trust, which right now never happens and was rare enough before.

  23. #23
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    O.o maybe, that'd be something to test. time to organize racing tyrants
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  24. #24
    Even with a horrible team I can usually break 12k+ with charge and enrage. Sausage can attest, but it's still frustrating as hell.

    As for the speed boost I honestly don't know, its extremely difficult to tell unless you have a really good example to compare it with. I can tell Enrage itself makes me faster but thats really easy to see. I'll test it next time I play, I can run the same stretch enraged and without, see how far I make it .

  25. #25
    Originally Posted by Strike5150
    Even with a horrible team I can usually break 12k+ with charge and enrage. Sausage can attest, but it's still frustrating as hell.

    As for the speed boost I honestly don't know, its extremely difficult to tell unless you have a really good example to compare it with. I can tell Enrage itself makes me faster but thats really easy to see. I'll test it next time I play, I can run the same stretch enraged and without, see how far I make it .
    Right. A few things. I was gonna say something on your first post, but in case you didn't notice I made this thread about 8 days before you posted and on top of that the very next day I edited in that Enrage is very powerful in its own way. Now a few more things.I'm fairly certain that if we take skill completely out of the equation I've played Tyrant a LOT. A crapton actually. Like, my game time with reaver is 5-6 hours, sentinel is 2-3 and Tyrant is 15. (Taken from the profile thingy in-game). So I'm fairly certain I may not be the best or anything like that (nor do I claim to be ) but I'm quite knowledgeable and decent at it. In fact right after cmstache made me aware of how Enrage works, I playtested even the most ridiculous situations for 5 days straight to figure the skill out.


    A few clarifications. Enrage does buff your movement speed while charging. It buffs everything basically. As cmstache said, it even buffs the fall damage taken when you get thrown off a cliff by an Enraged Tyrant. Also Enrage breaks Shockwave. What that means is, when you are at or below 50% hp with enrage on sometimes, for reasons unknown to me , it will buff the animation speed of shockwave and it will come out faster.Also , Enraging+Charging when your hp is at 70% or lower, will allow you to travel roughly the same distance as a 5 second Marathon Charge.

    Now on to a few points you made.Enrage is cool and all, and can do a lot of things but my instincts were spot on before I even tried it. It basically changes your function in the game. Even if you know exactly 100% of the time what to do and how to engage, playing with Enrage simply means you have to be twice more cautious than before about engaging and a lot of times you will probably not even engage because you will get shredded too fast.You switch roles from engaging to dealing damage. There's a small problem with that however. This plan works against unorganized teams and people who don't understand what it means when a Tyrant goes red (I'm not talking about not recognizing Enrage, I will explain shortly) but it will never work against people who are experienced in this game and know the ins and outs of it thus far.

    What this means is, by forgoing Ignore Pain , you basically assume you will get good charges without being spotted often and that you will be able to get a few hard hitting Shockwaves even if that doesn't quite work out the way you wanted.That's a neat plan and all (I had the same plan at the start)but then you play against Omhz's or Derputy Potato's or Vae Victis's Hunters or Raina's Alchemist and suddenly the problem sort of dawns on you.You are a Reaver with no Choking Haze and no way to escape if you get focus fire'd. Sure you can charge people from out of sight and try and get the better of them but these are again, tactics against people with no or limited awareness and very little experience in the game. Playing against high level players has taught me that with Enrage the optimal way to go into a group of humans, is waiting on another vampire to initiate, besides yourself. So in a situation where you have a second Tyrant doing the heavy duty work this could work. If you are the only Tyrant however against a group of skilled players, Enrage will always, always, always be sub-par to Ignore Pain. ALWAYS. Because those skilled people will punish you for it.

    Since you mentioned my tips were good for beginners, I figured since I constantly play with what I consider the top players these past days I should go into some more advanced advice right?So as a Tyrant you should always be mindful of the number of Hunters in a group if you want to run Enrage. If there's 2 or more and you don't have Ignore Pain, you're basically suiciding. Bola DESTROYS Enrage Tyrants for breakfast. Seriously it's the most obnoxious thing, to pop your Enrage and try and get a good shockwave or a few attacks in , only to get bola'd in the face and then annihilated by incoming fire. A good concept to engage humans with Enrage is popping it before you attack, dropping on them from a cliff or a rooftop, Shockwaving and then Charging immediately so you can avoid possible incoming CC. As I mentioned before ,however, by picking Enrage you aren't an initiator anymore so you have to wait for someone to go in before you or with you , otherwise even if you pop Enrage and charge into them , you will still get shredded.

    Good humans NEVER bunch up and always know how to dodge a Charge most of the time so before Charging in , make sure you understand how the humans are positioned at that moment. Otherwise you will end up being completely dodged+shredded to pieces.Which is why Marathon Charge is in a lot of cases superior. Its long cooldown is an issue for sure but being able to start Charge from a longer distance means the Humans won't hear the audio cue of your voice and you will also have some space to catch those dodging at the last moment.That doesn't mean that regular charge doesn't have its merits. It simply means the skill is a little weird at the moment and in my humble opinion those 2 should be merged together into one skill. Like a 18 cd Charge for 325 damage that goes for 5 seconds or 4.75. But that's another story.

    Lastly I want to say this. Breaking 12k with a horrible team is cool, but you could probably break 12k with Ignore Pain too(in my experience), simply by being able to go in more often. And don't forget, being able to effectively soak up damage, allows your team to go in as well and creates more opportunities.Generally when you play with a mindset of dealing damage as a Tyrant , more often than not, you're not doing your job right.But I covered my reasons in my initial post. Of course I'm talking high level play games of which we have very few at the moment and not random games where there's usually 2-3 people who know what they're doing and the rest just try to get to know the game better.Also. Jump is very unpredictable too and VERY terrifying if you know how to manipulate it but I don't want to go into details yet =).
    Last edited by CoOkiedude; 13th Feb 2014 at 00:31.
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