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Thread: A different approach

  1. #1

    A different approach

    Hey all,

    I've been a big fan of the LoK series over the years and thought that Defiance was a work of pure art although not all of the questions seemed to be answered. It also doesn't look like the series is not receiving as much attention from the powers that be as of late. Eidos has been focusing on the Tomb Raider series because it's been making money. So in order to have another LoK game made, one needs to make sure that there is a return on the product. How would one do that? I can think of two ways.

    1) Re-release the games on the new platform(s) (PS3, Xbox360, Wii, etc) as an all-in-one game. The technology is there now to do it. And it has worked for Megaman

    2) Make a DVD of all the movie clips from the games to sell. This could bring in people that haven't played the games before up to speed faster and probably get them interested in future games. This route revived Family Guy and Futurama is heading in that direction.

    Either of these options would probably not cost much to Eidos for development since they have most of that locked away somewhere. This is a great series that deserves another release.

    Of course, these are just thoughts. Feel free to tear them apart.

  2. #2
    Personally I like both of them, though you'd have to have some explination between clips or *GASP* new footage inbetween them
    Help out with the effort for a new Legacy of Kain game! (list updated on December 6th)
    http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthr...74#post1270474

  3. #3

    .

    Since the release of the PS3, I felt that Eidos was holding back on any more LOK for a while until they got comfortable with developing games for the PS3system. When you think about the differences between Blood omen and Soul Reaver, they seem like such a jump, yet were developed for the same system, the PS1. There is so much that can be done now with the PS3, and I'm sure they want to squeeze every ounce of power out of the machine.

    You take a game like Tomb Raider, that you know you got an almost gaurenteed hit, develop a game engine for it, exploit it in various ways, like additional games Tomb Raider this, Tomb Raider That... and then take this Tomb Raider "template" and use it for a new LOK title. Your basically recycling what was developed for Tomb Raider, and applying it toward another similar game, without having to invest money and time developing a new game from scratch.

    From an article I read, Eidos was waiting to develop games for the PS3 because of laging sales. They were holding off until 2008 for some games, because they were waiting for the PS3 price drop to get more systems sold and in more houses.

    I still don't own a PS3, although I did buy a PS2 to play SR2 and a few other games... it didn't completly go to waste. But, I hate to say it, I think when a new LOK title is released, I'll be buying a PS3.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by swordsicle View Post
    But, I hate to say it, I think when a new LOK title is released, I'll be buying a PS3.
    Oh trust me, when the next Legacy of Kain game comes out I'll buy whatever system it's on, even if it costs me a grand to do it.

    Also, you would appear to be new to the forums, if someone hasn't already said it then let me say welcome and I hope you have fun! There are a lot of negative people around here speculating about when/if there will be a new LOK title, and I'm glad to see you're not only one of the "when" group (as am I) but also not sour over the prospect of a long wait. I say let them take as much time as they need to give a great title.
    Help out with the effort for a new Legacy of Kain game! (list updated on December 6th)
    http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthr...74#post1270474

  5. #5
    The only problem that happened with Defiance was it wasn't hyped enough. All I remember seeing was a brief commercial on WWE Monday Night Raw and that was it. Me being an LOK die-hard immediately bought the game but Eidos needed something else to attract the other gamers. Defiance was better than 3/4 of the games that were released that year. And the only major problem was the camera. So why wasn't it hyped?

  6. #6

    .

    Well, there could be a couple of reasons. If they implemented a poor marketing plan, it just didn't get the exposure that advertised the game. That sounds a bit counterproductive, but other factors could contribute to it. If they didn't budget enough for advertising, or needed to pull money from the advertising budget to compensate for cost over runs while producing the game.

    If there were other games being released at the time, they could have leached some of the advertising away frome Defiance.... maybe it was Tomb Raider. If Eidos wanted to really sell a game, they could have dumped more money into advertising it, hoping they could develop another viable franchise, and they hoped that the LOK series could just sell itself.

  7. #7

    LOk, for die hards only.

    I think that the LOK franchise has always been more or less made for die hard gamers, and not really focused at the casual gamers. The sad truth is that, the gaming industry has focused less on us hardcore gamers, and more on whats making money. By the time Defiance had came out, the only people who really scooped up the game were people who were familar to the series. If the series is to come back, they will totally have to reinvent the franchise. In doing so, I hope they stay true to us who care about the series. If they can revamp (NO PUN INTENDED LOL), like they have with Laura, than perhaps LOK can survive in the next Gen market. I also believe it would make some sense to release either a compilation disc, or allow downloads through Via Xbox live and or Playstation market, to allow some new exposure to people who are new gaming, or who would just enjoy playing the series on their next Gen systems. Lets face it, if you dont use your computer to play the games, than Im sure your playstation or X box by now have seen some better days!

  8. #8
    I agree. Eidos should release the older games on Xbox live or the Virtual Console. Especially classics like Blood Omen and Soul Reaver. Should help revitalize LOK.

  9. #9
    Both are good ideas. Though, admittedly, Blood Omen is crazy hard for me to get used to every time I replay it. I guess I'm just used to the more modern combat systems and gameplay. However, throwback games seem pretty popular on Xbox Live, so the response would probably be good.

    As far as systems go, I really hope they release a new game for all of the systems. I own an Xbox 360, but don't really think I can justify spending the bones on another system this time around ... especially for one game. I would probably cave in and by it anyway for a LOK game, but I'd rather not have to.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Soju Fett View Post
    As far as systems go, I really hope they release a new game for all of the systems. I own an Xbox 360, but don't really think I can justify spending the bones on another system this time around ... especially for one game. I would probably cave in and by it anyway for a LOK game, but I'd rather not have to.
    Indeed

  11. #11
    Join Date
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sparkus816 View Post
    I think that the LOK franchise has always been more or less made for die hard gamers, and not really focused at the casual gamers. The sad truth is that, the gaming industry has focused less on us hardcore gamers, and more on whats making money. By the time Defiance had came out, the only people who really scooped up the game were people who were familar to the series.
    Yeah. From Defiance alone, you had no idea what was going on. Why's the green guy breaking in to that building? Who's Raziel and why does he want him? What's the deal with the squid? Why's Raz in the underworld? What's going on with the sword? Who's Turel?

    All of that is unexplained for newcomers. Not the best way to market a game.

  12. #12

    .

    VERY VERY True, I couldn't imagine trying to play 1 game in a series, if I wasn't familiar with the rest of the series, I would be totally lost. I'm glad I was able to play all the LOK games as they came out, and understand the story line.

    I think Tomb Raider (I keep using this as an example) does a good job because it creates stand alone games. I could play just about any Tomb Raider and wouldn't need to have played a previous one to understand the game.

    But the LOK series is a continuing story line. Each game plays off the previous one. I think Eidos would be hard pressed to create a stand alone LOK game, while at the same time continuing the previous story line.
    It could be done if they branched off from the series, using an aspect from the game, and going in a different direction, but right now, if Eidos makes another LOK game, it would be for the fans who have played the series.

  13. #13
    Hence the reason to either re-release all of the games all in one PS3/XBOX360 disk or compile a DVD collection of the story. That way, everyone could enjoy future installments, if/when they ever come out.

  14. #14
    Join Date
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    I think the problem lies in the fact that PS3 is incapable of playing many playstation 2 games. If they re-released all the LOK series as a package set for the PS3 including the new game I would buy because it would be worth it. To me, if I have to keep unplugging my PS3, plugging in my PS2 or perhaps having both plugged in at the same time with a spaghetti junction of leads just so I can play most of the LOK series it is far too much hassle. I like both ideas I would buy re-released games and a cutscene movie.

  15. #15

    .

    Ok, would you pay to buy updated versions of the previous LOK and SR games like Eidos did with Tomb Raider anniversary, or would you like to be able to download the games as they were originally released for free off of a site like Game Tap or something similar?

  16. #16

    Lets here it for gametap!

    First Id like to thank Game Tap for being cool enough to admit the Lok games in its frre to play catergories! Also, I know that if a a new LOK game comes around, than its going to have to be reinvented. Lets face it, only us die hards bought Defiance. The casual gamer wouldn't know Raziel from a twisted human from dark Eden. Kains story defeniatley is the best work Eidos has done. Simon Templeton is probably the coolest voice actor ever! But if we do get a new LOK game, stuff is sure to be different. I think alot of Die hards are going to have some hurt feelers.

  17. #17

    'Nother Idea

    It seems to me that this series greatest strength is its own weakness. The story is so complex and enthralling that maybe before any new games are made. Because of this, maybe it would be more beneficial to make the existing story (ie: from the past games) into some kind of limited cgi/cartoon series on HBO, Sci-fi channel, or Adult Swim. The thinking behind this is that I started playing SR2 this past week and remembered that while the story was phenomenal, the game play was less than stellar (in my opinion). This would help explain the story line for future games.

    Just trying to plant the seeds...

  18. #18
    It may be that by making TR: Underworld for the PS3 first, SCi/Eidos/Crystal Dynamics is minimizing the dev cost for a new Kain (or other series) game on the PS3. Most of the work will have been done under the TR banner, which is guaranteed to turn a significant profit. Then that same engine and toolchain can be used to build a non-TR game with just some tweaks. Basically the reverse of how the Defiance engine was updated a bit and used for Legend/Anniversary. In that case, the cost of upgrading the SR2 engine to the capabilities of the one used for Defiance was (I'm assuming) paid for out of the LoK budget, which is (also assuming) much smaller than the budget for a TR game.
    I sort of hope that the Underworld engine is yet another evolution of Gex. It would be cool in a nerdy way for even a small bit of its code to have survived through three generations of Playstation hardware.

  19. #19
    I still remember being dead impressed with the gex engine, especially in it's incarnation into the SR2 engine. seeing the facial animation at the time was better than everything out there (and in some cases, still better than some "next-generation" games).

    The other great thing about the engine was no loading times. I thought that was so cool. Obviously Defiance needed loading as the locations jumped about a fair bit, but they were still quick.

    Did any of you guys play Shenmue 2 on XBox? it came with an hour long DvD containing all the major story cutscenes (and some basic gameplay to break it up ) and was worth a watch. Perhaps this could be added to the next game? although how they would retell Blood Omen's story is beyond me (not the cutscenes, but the ingame voiceover moments)
    -Raziel: [to Elder God] "I'm beginning to think the vampires committed suicide only to escape your singing!"
    -Kain: [after failing to paint the Mona Lisa] "I always was considered artless!" (both improvised )

  20. #20
    That would be cool, like a mini LOK movie, 60 min long, bringing people up to date about the story thus far. It wouldn't be the cut scenes , but something new, like they did with Advent Children. It would take BO1, SR, SR2, BO2, and Defiance, and condense the story, so if you haven't played the games before, you could catch up, or just refresh your memory. I would pay $20 just for that, and still buy the game.

  21. #21
    a different approach would be giving Kain long dark curly hair, neck-breaking feet, and a cool irak accent

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