Thread: Plot Speculation

Plot Speculation

  1. #1

    Plot Speculation

    I want to play a game. Let's share some ideas on what we think DX3 will be about. Both prequel and sequel concepts are acceptable. We need to see some details for this to work, so think of the who, what, where, when, why, and how.

    Rules: We are all aware of the successes and failures of both DX1 and DX2, so there should be no need to beat the proverbial dead horse. Also, be civil; there is no need for attacking other people's ideas.

    With that said, here are my ideas:

    I believe DX3 will be a sequel. The ending from DX2 will most likely be the JC-Helios ending, perhaps with parts of one or more of the others influencing the outcome to add some conflict. Basically, JC-Helios will have uplinked with most of the people, but something goes wrong. Maybe the Templars are still in the picture and are convincing people to resist the uplink? Maybe the Illuminati are still attempting to gain control? Maybe the Omar are taking a more active role in the world, and seeing JC as competition? Or maybe everyone embraces the uplink, but there are complications such as uplink failures or sicknesses/deaths? Regardless of which one is used, JC and friends have more work to do to achieve the post-human civilization, and they need to find out ways to fix the problem and stomp out the not-so-benevolent competitors.

    The player character will most likely be someone new, perhaps just a rookie follower of the Dentons with fresh augmentations/biomods. JC and Paul will be the boys in charge of trying to get everything under control, giving orders and overseeing operations from place to place (perhaps even aiding the player in sticky situations). Alex will probably be a lieutenant/field operative doing his own thing or mentoring the player even. Of course Tracer Tong will be back in action, probably as a technician of sorts, taking on the role of the "new Alex Jacobson." And speaking of him, a return of old faces may happen, or at least a mention of their whereabouts since we never learned what happened to all of JC and Paul's old friends. Antagonists will depend on whichever parties are involved, but I would imagine some of the major players in the DX universe will return.

    As for locations, I would imagine we'll see some old places as well as some new. Liberty island is a must, can't have a DX game without it. I imagine we'll see the aftermath of various ruins, such as Chicago and Area 51 (wishful thinking at any rate). As for new locations, I've got nothing. The player character will most likely have to globe hop like his predecessors in order to work his/her way through the webs of mystery, conspiracy, and deceit. I would think that we would see more of the gritty and slummy areas of the world in which people who are not uplinked or people who are opposing the Dentons will hide, complete with their own anti-augmented societies and prejudice.

    Concerning the time period, my guess is a sequel would take place no more than a few years into the future from DX2. Too much time passing would create plot holes, in my opinion. Plus, important figures would be aging too much.

    That's all I've got for now. Time to hear from someone else.

  2. #2
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    Originally Posted by Fuzzman
    I want to play a game. Let's share some ideas on what we think DX3 will be about. Both prequel and sequel concepts are acceptable. We need to see some details for this to work, so think of the who, what, where, when, why, and how.

    Rules: We are all aware of the successes and failures of both DX1 and DX2, so there should be no need to beat the proverbial dead horse. Also, be civil; there is no need for attacking other people's ideas.

    With that said, here are my ideas:

    I believe DX3 will be a sequel. The ending from DX2 will most likely be the JC-Helios ending, perhaps with parts of one or more of the others influencing the outcome to add some conflict. Basically, JC-Helios will have uplinked with most of the people, but something goes wrong. Maybe the Templars are still in the picture and are convincing people to resist the uplink? Maybe the Illuminati are still attempting to gain control? Maybe the Omar are taking a more active role in the world, and seeing JC as competition? Or maybe everyone embraces the uplink, but there are complications such as uplink failures or sicknesses/deaths? Regardless of which one is used, JC and friends have more work to do to achieve the post-human civilization, and they need to find out ways to fix the problem and stomp out the not-so-benevolent competitors.

    The player character will most likely be someone new, perhaps just a rookie follower of the Dentons with fresh augmentations/biomods. JC and Paul will be the boys in charge of trying to get everything under control, giving orders and overseeing operations from place to place (perhaps even aiding the player in sticky situations). Alex will probably be a lieutenant/field operative doing his own thing or mentoring the player even. Of course Tracer Tong will be back in action, probably as a technician of sorts, taking on the role of the "new Alex Jacobson." And speaking of him, a return of old faces may happen, or at least a mention of their whereabouts since we never learned what happened to all of JC and Paul's old friends. Antagonists will depend on whichever parties are involved, but I would imagine some of the major players in the DX universe will return.

    As for locations, I would imagine we'll see some old places as well as some new. Liberty island is a must, can't have a DX game without it. I imagine we'll see the aftermath of various ruins, such as Chicago and Area 51 (wishful thinking at any rate). As for new locations, I've got nothing. The player character will most likely have to globe hop like his predecessors in order to work his/her way through the webs of mystery, conspiracy, and deceit. I would think that we would see more of the gritty and slummy areas of the world in which people who are not uplinked or people who are opposing the Dentons will hide, complete with their own anti-augmented societies and prejudice.

    Concerning the time period, my guess is a sequel would take place no more than a few years into the future from DX2. Too much time passing would create plot holes, in my opinion. Plus, important figures would be aging too much.

    That's all I've got for now. Time to hear from someone else.
    I also think that they will follow the Apostlecorp ending, but will "Superman Returns" it and make the history slightly fuzzy to allow for wiggle-room. Perhaps some terrorist sect will find a way to jam communications because they want privacy and will detonate a series of bombs. I don't know exactly, but something has to get the world back into a broken-state with stranded people and several shady groups at odds with each other, all attempting a power-grab.

  3. #3
    The world is certainly post DX2. It certainly won't be after an unimaginable amount of time from the events of DX2, since the unique atmosphere of DX series derive from its arguably realistic depiction of the future society and technologies.

    One of the major themes most likely to be pursued in DX3 would be academic/technological definition of life and consciousness, in light of much transhumanistic possibilities offered by technology of universal biomodification. How far can we go before the distinctions of humanity and life are blurred, the line between the creator and cretion not as clearly defined? Certainly, this will be a human civilization on brink of a significant choice on deciding what they are and what they are not.

    In order to provide gameplay balance and intriguing yet realistic plot development in such a world, it is very likely for the main character to be a reasonably average human being (about as average as anyone can be in such an age), living in an era shadowed by the almost superhuman efforts of the personalities and societies from DX1 and DX2.

    While this is the future where garage biohacking would be a nice pastime for toddlers, and the basics of nanotechnology taught alongside arithmetics, the rules of humanity and the rules of economics still apply, and Plato and Adams holds as much truth as before. Even with distribution of UC and biomod techs all across the globe, it's still pretty damn miserable to be poor and powerless.

    While forming the world for DX3 is a relatively simple matter, the groups and power balances within that world format is very difficult to figure out. Maybe the designers would want to consult some people studying the modern day power balances in professional capacity and apply to their own world as necessary (seeing that the unchanging nature of human ambition and ideal seem to be one of the main atmosphere makers of the DX series, and perhaps the only thing that stopped conspiracy theories from sounding cliched or ridiculous). One issue regarding the power balance of the DX3 world would be the nature and extent of internationalization of law and economy, and what physical medium is to be utilized to achieve such humanity-wide connection. Will it be nano-mechanism mediated thought-internet as suggested in DX2? Physical networks using permanent man-machine interface, if not executed properly, might sound very boring and stereotypical during the playthrough.

  4. #4
    The further I read, the more I hope, that it won't follow DX:IW. Don't misunderstand me, I'm certain that those story ideas might be very interesting, but it wouldn't be Deus Ex anymore, just a random science-fiction. The strength of world of Deus Ex is that it's believable. It's our own world, just the technology has developed more and the economy is in collapse. I hope, that DX3 will return to the roots and will have more real-world feeling. A prequel or DX1 setting with different storyline and characters.

    Plus, the worst story idea, the DX3 developers could come up is "the bad guys have been defeated, but they emerge once again".

  5. #5
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    I think it'll mostly ignore Invisible War, or follow some set of events that we weren't shown. I don't think Eidos wants to carry this franchise further into the future and further away from what made it popular in the first place.

  6. #6

    i agree

    I agree with CarloGervasi. The farther you move into the future, the less real the game appears.

    But it's kind of a catch-22, because if you move too far back you lose augmentation.

    Here is my idea.

    I would make it a prequel about Paul Denton. That would add some parallelism, because you have a trilogy with a game about each Denton brother. Think about all the plot elements that are only briefly discussed in the first game involving Paul Denton.

    -His alliance with the Silhouette terrorist group and the Luminous Path
    -His interaction with Maggie Chow
    -His previous work with Unatco (any mission in the world)
    -His joining of the NSF
    -His actions at Versalife
    -His failed assasination attempt of Tracer Tong
    -His friendships with Juan Lebedev, Jock, Smuggler and Jaime Reyes
    -The hostility between him and Gunther Hermann and Anna Navarra


    The game could cover a longer span of time then the other two games. It could start out with Denton training at the academy (perhaps JC is entering just as Paul is about to leave). Then his employment into Unatco. He does a few missions, but as he works he becomes more and more suspicious of the actions of Unatco. This involves the release of the virus, the bombing of the statue of liberty, and all the other junk involved.

    Even though it is a prequel, the game could go into a lot of different directions. It could simply end once Paul decides to leave Unatco, or it could go all the way into the story of Deus Ex 1. What was Paul Denton doing while JC was involved in all that other stuff? It never seemed like Paul was completely open with JC. Perhaps there was another side of the story that was never uncovered (another problem that Paul handled without JC's help).

    I like this idea because it totally replicates the atmosphere that made the first deus ex so cool, keeps the augmentations, keeps all of the interesting characters, and will fill in any gaps in the story.

    I certainly don't want another jump into the future by 20 years, when every character from the original game is either dead or in a nursing home. At the same time if you go back 20 years from the first one, JC is a toddler.

  7. #7
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    Originally Posted by eddiegorey
    I agree with CarloGervasi. The farther you move into the future, the less real the game appears.

    But it's kind of a catch-22, because if you move too far back you lose augmentation.

    Here is my idea.

    I would make it a prequel about Paul Denton. That would add some parallelism, because you have a trilogy with a game about each Denton brother. Think about all the plot elements that are only briefly discussed in the first game involving Paul Denton.

    -His alliance with the Silhouette terrorist group and the Luminous Path
    -His interaction with Maggie Chow
    -His previous work with Unatco (any mission in the world)
    -His joining of the NSF
    -His actions at Versalife
    -His failed assasination attempt of Tracer Tong
    -His friendships with Juan Lebedev, Jock, Smuggler and Jaime Reyes
    -The hostility between him and Gunther Hermann and Anna Navarra


    The game could cover a longer span of time then the other two games. It could start out with Denton training at the academy (perhaps JC is entering just as Paul is about to leave). Then his employment into Unatco. He does a few missions, but as he works he becomes more and more suspicious of the actions of Unatco. This involves the release of the virus, the bombing of the statue of liberty, and all the other junk involved.

    Even though it is a prequel, the game could go into a lot of different directions. It could simply end once Paul decides to leave Unatco, or it could go all the way into the story of Deus Ex 1. What was Paul Denton doing while JC was involved in all that other stuff? It never seemed like Paul was completely open with JC. Perhaps there was another side of the story that was never uncovered (another problem that Paul handled without JC's help).

    I like this idea because it totally replicates the atmosphere that made the first deus ex so cool, keeps the augmentations, keeps all of the interesting characters, and will fill in any gaps in the story.

    I certainly don't want another jump into the future by 20 years, when every character from the original game is either dead or in a nursing home. At the same time if you go back 20 years from the first one, JC is a toddler.
    I really have to agree with you in the sense that Deus Ex 3 should be around the timeframe of Deus Ex 1. Or maybe just dumb-down the future so that it's not as advanced as Deus Ex 2, and more in the vein of Deus Ex 1's more believable setting.

    Since Paul Denton's so well-documented as is, it would have to be a pretty linear game to stay within the confines of the established Deus Ex story. I agree that it would be really cool to have a look into the life of Paul Denton, but for Deus Ex 3, I think it would be better to just have an all-new character.

  8. #8
    Originally Posted by eddiegorey
    I agree with CarloGervasi. The farther you move into the future, the less real the game appears.

    But it's kind of a catch-22, because if you move too far back you lose augmentation.

    Here is my idea.

    I would make it a prequel about Paul Denton.
    (see people - you don't have to quote the entire post )

    i've actually thought about this before: "Deus Ex: Brothers in Arms." i've seen evidence that this is going to be a prequel set in the 2020's [pun] so at least they should have a clear vision for the story.[/pun]

    but yeah, there is a problem: according to DX1, Paul Denton was the first person to recieve nanoaugmentation. so if it is a sequel, there are 2 possibilities:
    1. it turns out that there was in fact an earlier nano-aug program that we didn't know about. (this may be the reason that walton simons is augmented, even though he is conceivable older than both Dentons, and perhaps he shows more scarring because he was in an earlier, less sophisticated program).
    2. you play as a mech aug. now that would be badass. i would actually really like to play as a cyborg - i think that it would allow for some really cool stuff. if you were a mech aug, you could have a gun installed in your arm, a grappling hook in the other, one of your fingers could be a jack to hack computers, plus the more standard upgrades like hydraulic pistons in your legs to make you jump higher, titanium laced skin to make you damage resistant.

    but either way, if it's implemented well, it'll be fun. but what i really want them to do is really do the fights against other augmented (mech or nano) agents. all they really were in both games were enemies with a lot of health. anna navarre turned invisible, and that was about it. Gunther never got that skull gun, if you turned invisible, anna could never use that augmented eye to see your body heat, and i even found a document in the MJ12 base (or was it Versalife?) that said that Walton Simons had the aggressive defense aug, but guess what? you can shoot rockets at him, and never stops them! i mean, it's awesome having these abilities, but having no one in the game who can counter them makes it kind of cheap.

  9. #9
    A prequel would be very cool. Perhaps it could overlap a bit with the original Deus Ex events. Theres a lot of history to the Deus Ex world that the developers could pull from.

  10. #10
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    I'd like to play as a mech. Please no Paul Denton, I've seen him enough in DX1 (althouogh I really liked him), and a bit too much in DX2 (I saved him on my first playthrough, but he was just so... dull. On my 2nd and 3rd playtrhough I killed him). The game would just be too similar to DX1 if you'd play with Paul Denton.

  11. #11
    Originally Posted by Nathan2000
    The further I read, the more I hope, that it won't follow DX:IW. Don't misunderstand me, I'm certain that those story ideas might be very interesting, but it wouldn't be Deus Ex anymore, just a random science-fiction. The strength of world of Deus Ex is that it's believable. It's our own world, just the technology has developed more and the economy is in collapse. I hope, that DX3 will return to the roots and will have more real-world feeling. A prequel or DX1 setting with different storyline and characters.

    Plus, the worst story idea, the DX3 developers could come up is "the bad guys have been defeated, but they emerge once again".
    Precisely. The whole DX-unique goodness come from believable world, even more so than the story itself. Believable not in that it's advanced software-wise, but in that it allows player-interaction and input to the nth degree, and the background actually allows some degree of thinking and speculation based on the events of the real world. And I should stress again, that any decent DX3 team should set aside some time to study the real world, and learn just what kind of balance and mechanisms (political and otherwise) this world revolves around.

  12. #12
    What about someone who shares the same genetics as the Dentons- the father perhaps? That could tie into an earlier augmentation program. Maybe he could have been an employee of Versalife or MJ12 that "volunteered" for the augmentation project. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't there several other "projects" going on at Area 51 when JC goes through the facility? Were they of the same genetics as JC and Paul, or were they based on someone else?

  13. #13

    Lightbulb

    Originally Posted by joseph5891
    2. you play as a mech aug. now that would be badass. i would actually really like to play as a cyborg - i think that it would allow for some really cool stuff. if you were a mech aug, you could have a gun installed in your arm, a grappling hook in the other, one of your fingers could be a jack to hack computers, plus the more standard upgrades like hydraulic pistons in your legs to make you jump higher, titanium laced skin to make you damage resistant.

    but what i really want them to do is really do the fights against other augmented (mech or nano) agents. all they really were in both games were enemies with a lot of health. anna navarre turned invisible, and that was about it. Gunther never got that skull gun, if you turned invisible, anna could never use that augmented eye to see your body heat, and i even found a document in the MJ12 base (or was it Versalife?) that said that Walton Simons had the aggressive defense aug, but guess what? you can shoot rockets at him, and never stops them! i mean, it's awesome having these abilities, but having no one in the game who can counter them makes it kind of cheap.
    Have to say that I'm not too sure about the player being a "mech-aug" exactly, although any new augs they might come up with for DX3 could certainly have that kind of potential. If DX3 is a sequel to the other two, why not put the Skull Gun in there as an aug you can actually use? IW shows that one was made but never made it to its intended owner in time. I don't know if Nano-Augs like JC and Paul could make use of upgrades intended for Mech-Augs like Gunther (and vice-versa), but I still can't help but wonder where that Skull Gun might be laying around now and what it might be like using it.

    I do agree with your point that no other augmented characters actually made use of their abilities (I seem to remember Walton Simons cloaking, but that's about it). To have an ADS-blessed enemy take down your rockets before they even reached him, or someone with enhanced sight rendering your cloak useless and leaving you with nowhere to hide would be an interesting challenge, perhaps forcing you to rethink your strategy. Depending on how many other augmented characters would be in DX3 and exactly which capabilities each person has, it could be a lot to keep track of, but I think it would make for a nice touch.

  14. #14
    The problem of a prequel is that we know how everything turns out, so my guess is a sequel but I have no idea about the story. I think that the rapid image sequence from the teaser that indicates events prior to DX1 is just a speeded up part of the intro from DX3.
    Possibly there was a yet unknown incident after DX2 that caused the non augmented majority to turn against the augmented. That would repeat the history shown in the image sequence from the teaser. Just my 2 cents...

  15. #15

    no mechs

    I'd certainly not want to be a mech.

    If it was a sequel, the only endings that would kind of work would be the Illuminati or the Templars. The Templars would probably be best. It could be kind of like Star Wars, when there are only a few augmented individuals left, and they are being systematically hunted down.

    I just wouldn't want the scenery and equipment to be too advanced. I prefer Hell's kitchen and assault rifles to the WTO Encalves and Mag Rails.

  16. #16
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    Originally Posted by eddiegorey
    If it was a sequel, the only endings that would kind of work would be the Illuminati or the Templars. The Templars would probably be best. It could be kind of like Star Wars, when there are only a few augmented individuals left, and they are being systematically hunted down.
    That's by far one of the most interesting takes I've seen on the situation, while it's unlikely they'll choose a cannon ending, they could just kinda leave it gray and the systematic killing of augmented people (by whomever for whatever reason) would kind of be bringing the world back to the times before deus ex 1 was set, segregation, division, strife, martial law, the same bleak dark setting that made the original so original.

    I really don't know what to think of the game anymore,because they can't really just ignore IW or remake the first one, it would have to be set before or after both games and honestly if it were to be a sequel they would have to ignore the exsisting endings and kinda make their own (not like the collapse where it was a "d.all of the above",but a sort of "e.none of the above" ending) whatever the setting, I think the teaser is clearly setting it up for a transhumanism vs. naturalist setting much like the setting was in the 20's/30's of the deus ex universe.

    ...might be interesting to let you choose if you're even augmented when you create your character. (if they even let us create a character )

  17. #17
    Problem with continuing the templar ending would be the lack of freedom in plot progression. If the main character is augmented, and there's a whole world full of templars, it's kind of obvious what will happen.

  18. #18
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    yeah but let's say it wasn't really that ending per se,and that the population was very divided,sort of a global civil war between augmented humans and natural humans. (obviously with the neutral parties sprinkled in between.)
    That's assuming they can't come up with a much better alternate ending to IW. (which honestly can't be all that hard)

  19. #19
    I really think that they'll try to avoid IW. Post Collapse civilization (between the two games) would probably have the most options without reminding us of IW or snuffing it completely. Paul Denton is a cool choice, I can see why some people don't like the idea but there is a lot of potential.