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Thread: More Historical/Technical Errors

More Historical/Technical Errors

  1. #1

    More Historical/Technical Errors

    The type of B-17 in the game is the B-17G. The "G" version didn't appear until later in the war and never in the Pacific theatre. The type shown should be B-17E variants. The type has less guns and lacks the chin turret, plus other differences...http://1000aircraftphotos.com/APS/2100.jpg

    Also, why can't aircraft drop their drop-tanks? A fighter would always jettison the fuel drop-tanks before a dog fight...

  2. #2
    Interesting about the b17.

    On the Zero's having fuel tanks in dog fights,I completely agree that they should drop them when told to engage...if they could program it. It creates unneeded drag and slows you down (well,not in the game).

    Heres something I didn't know until today; When you equip your fighters with bombs,they are slower and don't manuever near as well (this I am happy about). Keep this in mind when you are about to change the default load out of fighters.

  3. #3
    Yeah and those big drop tanks on the Wildcats would be gone before a fight too.....they would cause even more serious drag than the single slim tank on the Zero.

    Interesting about the bomb load outs!

  4. #4
    the drop tanks are just there for looks, there is no fuel in the game, so drop tanks are not needed
    Sincerity is the key to life, once you can fake that you’ve got it made

  5. #5
    I know that, but it just seems stupid to be in a game where the ranges are so short that drop tanks would not be used, and then put them on the fighters which are spending their time in combat when the drop tanks (if they were needed) would be jettisoned.....seems kinda silly!

  6. #6

    Agree!

    I too have noticed many historical and factual errors in this game.

    * Ranges in the game are much shorter than in real life. Carrier battles usually took place with 4 or more hours flight time between the opposing forces. In game, it rarely takes longer than 2 minutes. This is unrealistic and spoils the game's enjoyment for me.

    * In real life, fighter planes fly at altitudes of up to 20,000 feet. In game, it is impossible to fly higher than about 5000 feet.

    * When flying at high altitudes, temperatures inside a plane's cockpit would drop to near freezing. Even when flying at maximum altitude, the temperature inside my bedroom holds at a steady 20 degrees Celsius.

    * The Renown-class Battlecruiser had a crew of around 1000 men. I have counted the little men walking around on the ship, and I can only see 20 or so. I very much doubt that there are 980 more little men hiding inside.

    * To test the above hypothesis, I opened the in-game model using Lightwave. To my surprise, I discovered that all the ship models are completely hollow inside. A real-life ship would have many partitions and floors inside, dividing the ship into areas such as engine room, ammunition stores, fuel tanks, ward rooms, mess halls, food stores, toilets and sleeping quarters. None of these were present. I also was able to confirm that there were not 980 little men hiding inside. This is probably for the best, as they would have nowhere to eat, sleep or expel waste matter, nor would they have a floor to stand on.

    * In the game, the Player views his ship, plane or submarine from an external view, by my estimate from a point on a circular orbit some 100 yards or so away from the vehicle. In real life, the person controlling the vehicle would be sitting inside it, looking at the outside world through a window or periscope. To replicate the external view seen in this game, the captain of a ship would have to be tethered to a helium balloon attached to the ship, with crew men pulling him around to achieve the circular orbit. He would also need some form of communication to tell his officers what he wanted them to do, which would probably have been either via semaphore or else by static telephone line at this time of the war. I do not think this would have been an effective way to command a ship.

    * Going back to the little men for a moment, I examined the model closely and discovered that all the little men look exactly the same. This would not be the case in real-life, as there is only a 1 in ~1,000,000,000 chance that any two crew members looked the same. Unless they were identical twins of course. However, from my reading on the subject, I can inform you that the only ship in the US Navy on which identical twins served was the USS Missouri, and that was not in service in the time period covered by this game. I do not have access to IJN service records covering this period, but I cannot imagine they had significantly more genetically identical crewmen serving on their ships.

    * Finally, I noticed that when you crash a plane or your ship is sunk in this game, you are able to change to control another ship, plane or submarine. In real life, you would be dead if your plane crashed or you were in a ship which sunk (unless you were lucky enough to be trapped in an air pocket and the ship settled in shallow water, in which case you would remain alive in a stinking, dark, wet little cavity until your air ran out and you died. In fact, this doesn't sound so lucky after all). In real life, if you die, you are permanently dead from that point on. To simulate this, the game would have to immediately stop if you crashed a plane, and you would never be able to play it again. Also, the game publishers might send a coffin to your house and insist that you sleep in it from then on. I would not be able to do this, as I have quite severe particle allergies, and the wood dust would give me sneezing fits. Also, my Mom would be really mad, as she says my room is untidy enough as it is, and she thinks coffins are morbid.

    To conclude, I have to admit that I quite like this game, and would give it 7.75 out of 10. However, if the above points were addressed, it would definitely make it a 10 out of 10 for me. I would be happy to act as reality consultant on the sequel to this game if the developers want me to, as I think I have an excellent grasp on what is and isn't possible in reality, and I think this could really help Eidos Hungary improve their future games.

  7. #7
    Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit...

    The point is that the wrong type of bomber was used...that could have easily been researched properly as there is a B-17 in the game....just the wrong type.

    As for the drop tanks, it would have saved modelling time to not include them...

    I think my statements are very reasonable....the more arcade nature of the game doesn't bother me, but it's a shame that some things like that weren't fixed... I mean, can the Catalina i've seen screenshots of actually retract it's wingtip floats? It should be able to.

    Things like ranges are shortened for gameplay, but for the physical look of vehicles to be incorrect, that takes something away.

    Please post intelligently, or don't bother...

  8. #8
    I thinks it better just to leave the ship hollow and for the devs not to waste ther time to make capartments in these ships when they cna make more ships planes, ect and it dosent really matter at all.

  9. #9
    And the award for most pointless post in history goes to...

  10. #10
    Originally Posted by Dark Decimator
    Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit...
    Yeah, right

  11. #11
    Not heard that one before? I guess you'd have to have some kind of education to understand it...

  12. It is not a simulation

    Originally Posted by Gridbug
    I too have noticed many historical and factual errors in this game.

    * Ranges in the game are much shorter than in real life. Carrier battles usually took place with 4 or more hours flight time between the opposing forces. In game, it rarely takes longer than 2 minutes. This is unrealistic and spoils the game's enjoyment for me.

    * In real life, fighter planes fly at altitudes of up to 20,000 feet. In game, it is impossible to fly higher than about 5000 feet.

    * When flying at high altitudes, temperatures inside a plane's cockpit would drop to near freezing. Even when flying at maximum altitude, the temperature inside my bedroom holds at a steady 20 degrees Celsius.

    * The Renown-class Battlecruiser had a crew of around 1000 men. I have counted the little men walking around on the ship, and I can only see 20 or so. I very much doubt that there are 980 more little men hiding inside.

    * To test the above hypothesis, I opened the in-game model using Lightwave. To my surprise, I discovered that all the ship models are completely hollow inside. A real-life ship would have many partitions and floors inside, dividing the ship into areas such as engine room, ammunition stores, fuel tanks, ward rooms, mess halls, food stores, toilets and sleeping quarters. None of these were present. I also was able to confirm that there were not 980 little men hiding inside. This is probably for the best, as they would have nowhere to eat, sleep or expel waste matter, nor would they have a floor to stand on.

    * In the game, the Player views his ship, plane or submarine from an external view, by my estimate from a point on a circular orbit some 100 yards or so away from the vehicle. In real life, the person controlling the vehicle would be sitting inside it, looking at the outside world through a window or periscope. To replicate the external view seen in this game, the captain of a ship would have to be tethered to a helium balloon attached to the ship, with crew men pulling him around to achieve the circular orbit. He would also need some form of communication to tell his officers what he wanted them to do, which would probably have been either via semaphore or else by static telephone line at this time of the war. I do not think this would have been an effective way to command a ship.

    * Going back to the little men for a moment, I examined the model closely and discovered that all the little men look exactly the same. This would not be the case in real-life, as there is only a 1 in ~1,000,000,000 chance that any two crew members looked the same. Unless they were identical twins of course. However, from my reading on the subject, I can inform you that the only ship in the US Navy on which identical twins served was the USS Missouri, and that was not in service in the time period covered by this game. I do not have access to IJN service records covering this period, but I cannot imagine they had significantly more genetically identical crewmen serving on their ships.

    * Finally, I noticed that when you crash a plane or your ship is sunk in this game, you are able to change to control another ship, plane or submarine. In real life, you would be dead if your plane crashed or you were in a ship which sunk (unless you were lucky enough to be trapped in an air pocket and the ship settled in shallow water, in which case you would remain alive in a stinking, dark, wet little cavity until your air ran out and you died. In fact, this doesn't sound so lucky after all). In real life, if you die, you are permanently dead from that point on. To simulate this, the game would have to immediately stop if you crashed a plane, and you would never be able to play it again. Also, the game publishers might send a coffin to your house and insist that you sleep in it from then on. I would not be able to do this, as I have quite severe particle allergies, and the wood dust would give me sneezing fits. Also, my Mom would be really mad, as she says my room is untidy enough as it is, and she thinks coffins are morbid.

    To conclude, I have to admit that I quite like this game, and would give it 7.75 out of 10. However, if the above points were addressed, it would definitely make it a 10 out of 10 for me. I would be happy to act as reality consultant on the sequel to this game if the developers want me to, as I think I have an excellent grasp on what is and isn't possible in reality, and I think this could really help Eidos Hungary improve their future games.


    Remember that this is not a simulation but a game. What would be the point of modeling the interior of a battleship? There is no point of course unless you want to waste resources. Also, is modeling 980 little sailors worth the system resources that would be used to model such?

    I think what you are looking for is a naval simulation rather than an arcade like experience. Focus on the big picture, not the details and you will rank this game much higher than 7.7.
    http://www.glop.org/gamercard/card/S...forumgames.png.
    Never, never, never believe any war will be smooth and easy, or that anyone who embarks on the strange voyage can measure the tides and hurricanes he will encounter. -Sir Winston Churchill

  13. #13
    Originally Posted by Gridbug
    I too have noticed many historical and factual errors in this game.

    * Ranges in the game are much shorter than in real life. Carrier battles usually took place with 4 or more hours flight time between the opposing forces. In game, it rarely takes longer than 2 minutes. This is unrealistic and spoils the game's enjoyment for me.

    * In real life, fighter planes fly at altitudes of up to 20,000 feet. In game, it is impossible to fly higher than about 5000 feet.

    * When flying at high altitudes, temperatures inside a plane's cockpit would drop to near freezing. Even when flying at maximum altitude, the temperature inside my bedroom holds at a steady 20 degrees Celsius.

    * The Renown-class Battlecruiser had a crew of around 1000 men. I have counted the little men walking around on the ship, and I can only see 20 or so. I very much doubt that there are 980 more little men hiding inside.

    * To test the above hypothesis, I opened the in-game model using Lightwave. To my surprise, I discovered that all the ship models are completely hollow inside. A real-life ship would have many partitions and floors inside, dividing the ship into areas such as engine room, ammunition stores, fuel tanks, ward rooms, mess halls, food stores, toilets and sleeping quarters. None of these were present. I also was able to confirm that there were not 980 little men hiding inside. This is probably for the best, as they would have nowhere to eat, sleep or expel waste matter, nor would they have a floor to stand on.

    * In the game, the Player views his ship, plane or submarine from an external view, by my estimate from a point on a circular orbit some 100 yards or so away from the vehicle. In real life, the person controlling the vehicle would be sitting inside it, looking at the outside world through a window or periscope. To replicate the external view seen in this game, the captain of a ship would have to be tethered to a helium balloon attached to the ship, with crew men pulling him around to achieve the circular orbit. He would also need some form of communication to tell his officers what he wanted them to do, which would probably have been either via semaphore or else by static telephone line at this time of the war. I do not think this would have been an effective way to command a ship.

    * Going back to the little men for a moment, I examined the model closely and discovered that all the little men look exactly the same. This would not be the case in real-life, as there is only a 1 in ~1,000,000,000 chance that any two crew members looked the same. Unless they were identical twins of course. However, from my reading on the subject, I can inform you that the only ship in the US Navy on which identical twins served was the USS Missouri, and that was not in service in the time period covered by this game. I do not have access to IJN service records covering this period, but I cannot imagine they had significantly more genetically identical crewmen serving on their ships.

    * Finally, I noticed that when you crash a plane or your ship is sunk in this game, you are able to change to control another ship, plane or submarine. In real life, you would be dead if your plane crashed or you were in a ship which sunk (unless you were lucky enough to be trapped in an air pocket and the ship settled in shallow water, in which case you would remain alive in a stinking, dark, wet little cavity until your air ran out and you died. In fact, this doesn't sound so lucky after all). In real life, if you die, you are permanently dead from that point on. To simulate this, the game would have to immediately stop if you crashed a plane, and you would never be able to play it again. Also, the game publishers might send a coffin to your house and insist that you sleep in it from then on. I would not be able to do this, as I have quite severe particle allergies, and the wood dust would give me sneezing fits. Also, my Mom would be really mad, as she says my room is untidy enough as it is, and she thinks coffins are morbid.

    To conclude, I have to admit that I quite like this game, and would give it 7.75 out of 10. However, if the above points were addressed, it would definitely make it a 10 out of 10 for me. I would be happy to act as reality consultant on the sequel to this game if the developers want me to, as I think I have an excellent grasp on what is and isn't possible in reality, and I think this could really help Eidos Hungary improve their future games.

    well, i for one am not interested in flying for four hours on my lcd tv just to engage a ship or base. lol. and i have no interest in virtually flying through the below decks of a battleship to look at all the compartments.

  14. #14
    GridBug, I for one appreciated your humor I got a good laugh out of your post

  15. #15
    Me as well, Gridbug. Lowest form of wit? Perhaps, but it's still funny. :^)

    Corvall

  16. #16
    Originally Posted by BitBucket
    GridBug, I for one appreciated your humor I got a good laugh out of your post
    I feel the same way awsome post

  17. #17
    I got it too. Sarcasm - Look it up.

  18. #18
    Your post gave me some laughs Gridbug..

    I dont know what was funnier, your post.. or the few that followed.

  19. #19
    Originally Posted by Ryback14
    well, i for one am not interested in flying for four hours on my lcd tv just to engage a ship or base. lol. and i have no interest in virtually flying through the below decks of a battleship to look at all the compartments.
    i agree this game is not meant to go into great detail on any one object you have to look at the big picture this game is graphically sound and for the amount of vehicles in this game i think they did a great job this is not a strategy this game lets you control air sea and underwater vehicles

  20. #20

    Major Historical Innaccuracy

    I have found some of the posts pointing out erros to be fascinating reading. It makes me want to buy an anorak in fact.

    Anyhoo I just realised......... in WWII not ONE of the planes or ships modelled in this game were controlled using either an xbox controller or a mouse and keyboard! What were the developers thinking????

    Also in chess should the bishops molest the pawns?

    I drift sometimes.................... drifting................... drifting............. drifted.

  21. #21
    Yeah, people forget that this is not a simulation game.

    Sacrifices had to be made in order to maintain balance. I think they've done a great job, and the mistakes are rather minor, or are for a specific purpose.

  22. #22
    It's pretty pretty decent. I mean they resisted putting in Hellcats which are more popular but would be really inaccurate.

    At least it's better than battlefield 1942 (still a great game) which had the Yamato and Prince of Wales square off at the Battle of Midway. Heck the very idea that it had the HMS Prince of Wales in a game with "1942" in the title is comical since at no point in that year was that ship even above water.

  23. #23
    Well I am grognard (that's "historic realism dude" for ya) but honestly I am OK with 95% of design elements of this game because I understand it has to be enjoyable mixture of realism and fun.

    In fact I am amazed by how much they got right.

    One thing I cannot stand (and I know I am repeating myself ) is SUBS TORPEDOING PORTS (shipyards). It never happened, it will never happen and this gamey technique should not be available in the game, period.

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    17
    Originally Posted by Muddled Muppet
    Anyhoo I just realised......... in WWII not ONE of the planes or ships modelled in this game were controlled using either an xbox controller or a mouse and keyboard! What were the developers thinking????
    I am shocked and appalled.
    We had better get the history shocktroops of the forum down to the devs offices and sort this mess out straight away.

    I beleive also that there is 12 vertical bars on the forward handrails on the bridge of the repulse while IRL there were 13!

  25. #25
    I have to admit, that was one of the best responses I've read in a long time, even if it was unneccessary or sarcastic.

    Everybody talks about what they would've done better, or what the devs did wrong.

    Big f-ing deal if there are some inaccuracies. Would you rather they spent more time on historical research or on gameplay and mechanics research?

    Personally, I'd rather the game was close to historically accurate but spot on for gameplay and mechanics, than the game was 100% accurate but a piece of crap to play.

    You want historical accuracy, go play one of the games released by the history channel. They suck for gameplay, but they are accurate.

    You want an excellent gameplay experience, forget the historical inaccuracies and focus on things that really make a game great.

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