Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 52

Thread: Vorador killed 6 Guardians. (or 7!??)

  1. #1

    Arrow Vorador killed 6 Guardians. (or 7!??)

    I started playing SR2 again. Yea it`s fun and the game still looks awesome , but I have noticed something. Those pictures on the wall show us Vorador killing a total of 6 guardians. But you don`t see Malek on 1 of them.

    So did he actually kill 7 guardians? Or were the creators lazy enough to show 6 random guardians? :P

    Discuss...
    There he is!
    I`ll kill him!
    We once put you down Kain, we can do it again!

  2. #2
    Vorador didn't kill Malek, nor was Malek's death blamed on him.

    Now I'm wondering why Malek got a memorial stone in the sarafan's tomb.

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoke_Z
    Vorador didn't kill Malek, nor was Malek's death blamed on him.

    Now I'm wondering why Malek got a memorial stone in the sarafan's tomb.
    Well Vorador did kill Malek, twice even. The first time he was put back to life. But I guess your right, it wasn`t blamed on him the first time because he was brought back to life...

    The 2nd time in Dark Eden Vorador finished Malek and well they lay him down into his tomb.

  4. #4
    rabban Guest
    no vorador spared malek the first time...

    Vorador
    After slaughtering six of the sheep I defeated their pathetic little shepherd - Malek...


    he defeated malek...he did not kill him.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Lost in eternal limbo.
    Posts
    1,496
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoke_Z
    Vorador didn't kill Malek, nor was Malek's death blamed on him.

    Now I'm wondering why Malek got a memorial stone in the sarafan's tomb.

    Remember that you see the statue as Kain, and that's just a few hours after Raziel and Vorador went on their killing spree, so that statue's probably been there for a while and it was probably built because he's the best Sarafan there is and maybe the leader. He was the Gaurdian of Conflict afterall, so he had to be one hell of a fighter.
    As for his death. It shows Vorador beat up Malek, but not kill him. After Vorador left, Malek probably stayed in the room, disgusted with himself for letting his fellow Gaurdians die and for not being able to kill Vorador, until Mortanius came for him and had him taken to Avernus, where we see him get bound to his armour.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    Lost in eternal limbo.
    Posts
    1,496
    Oh hell! I totally misunderstood that! Oops! Well, he was still one hell of a Sarafan, so I guess that's why he has his name in the tomb.

  7. #7
    Vorador did not kill Malek. You clearly see in the scene that Vorador decides to spare Malek.

    (Technically, it was Mortanius who killed Malek by removing his soul from his body and infusing it to a suit of armor.)
    Our futures are predestined. It is my fate to write this and yours to read this. Free will is an illusion.

  8. #8
    Vorador killed seven gaurdians in BO (if you count wraith Malek).
    Yet Kain only killed six.
    I guess Kain killed Moe a second time in defiance to even the score.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by LOKFan
    Vorador did not kill Malek. You clearly see in the scene that Vorador decides to spare Malek.

    (Technically, it was Mortanius who killed Malek by removing his soul from his body and infusing it to a suit of armor.)
    Clearly?? What are you talking about? I thought it was clearly Vorador was beating the crap out of him and was just about to finish him off and drink his blood - end cutscene...

    AND...I think Malek did die, and Mortanius revived him kinda like he revived Kain, and then punished him by making him turn into some sort of ghost with no flesh.

  10. #10
    No, Vorador simply knocked Malek out, he survived and his soul was transfered to the armor while he was still alive, so he never actually seen the spectral realm.

    Kain and his descendants are the only ones who who seem to be able to evade the wheel indefinitely, aside from the hylden. The curse the hylden put on the vamps just made it so they couldn't die naturally. That's why I think that HL may have had something to do with Kain's resurrection. I mean if a spell was used to bring Kain back than Kain should have done that to create his lieutenants, but instead he had to infuse his own essence.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by soothsayer
    No, Vorador simply knocked Malek out, he survived and his soul was transfered to the armor while he was still alive, so he never actually seen the spectral realm.
    You have no proof. Just admit this looks the best way to you, while I find both ways good enough.


    Quote Originally Posted by soothsayer
    I mean if a spell was used to bring Kain back than Kain should have done that to create his lieutenants, but instead he had to infuse his own essence.
    Well maybe Kain didn`t have that spell, and Mortanius did. Well anyway other guys made Bo1 so we can all make up stories and try to connect Bo1 to the other series while we know damn right that some things just aren`t connected.
    There he is!
    I`ll kill him!
    We once put you down Kain, we can do it again!

  12. #12
    Raziel: (incredulous)
    And you somehow survived this massacre?

    Moebius:
    I, and two others. The Circle was devastated; only we three were spared.
    The three survivors were Moebius, Mortainius and Malek.
    It's certain.

    And I beg to differ that LoK has quite often connected the event of BO to newer games, and even explained how Kain changed history in it.

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by soothsayer
    The three survivors were Moebius, Mortainius and Malek.
    It's certain.

    And I beg to differ that LoK has quite often connected the event of BO to newer games, and even explained how Kain changed history in it.
    Ok, fair enough.

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Smoke_Z
    Vorador didn't kill Malek, nor was Malek's death blamed on him.

    Now I'm wondering why Malek got a memorial stone in the sarafan's tomb.
    Your talking about the tomb of the sarafan in SR1 aren't you? Considering he wasn't buried there I'd say the tomb was made in preparation of their death, long before they died. But with Malek's failure to protect the circle he wasn't given the honor of being buried with them. (besides that he was killed (again) 500 years after the others. The Tomb was probably sealed and forgotten about by then.

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by DMraider
    Clearly?? What are you talking about? I thought it was clearly Vorador was beating the crap out of him and was just about to finish him off and drink his blood - end cutscene...

    AND...I think Malek did die, and Mortanius revived him kinda like he revived Kain, and then punished him by making him turn into some sort of ghost with no flesh.
    Watch again. Vorador hits Malek with a spell, is about to deliver a finishing blow but decides against it and teleports away.
    Our futures are predestined. It is my fate to write this and yours to read this. Free will is an illusion.

  16. #16
    Oh lol, I remembered the intro and they don`t show the whole fight.

    So did Vorador kill mind, nature, energy, states, dimension and the guardian of balance?

  17. #17
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1,788
    I assume so. I think he killed them all except for Malek, Moebius, and Mortanius.

  18. #18
    Hmm at first I thought the death of Ariel, the balance guardian caused the pillars to collapse, but it was the guardians who were corrupted and used their magic for bad purposes right?

  19. #19
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1,788
    This is my understanding of the events. Moebius and Mortanius led a revolt of the human guardians against the ancients. This resulted in weaker guardians since they didn't receive the dark gift, so the Pillars were not as strong as they should have been. Then the Sarafan group killed Janos, which angered Vorador into wiping out 6 of the guardians. Then new guardians were born to replace them. I think that those new guardians were the ones that Kain fights in BO1 (I don't think there were any other guardians in between). Somewhere along the line, Mortanius and Azimuth were contacted by Hylden and began to do the Hylden's bidding. Then Mortanius realized what he was dealing with and decided it was worse than dealing with vampires, so he devised a plan to create the circumstances under which the Scion of Balance could be chosen. He killed Ariel, which resulted in Kain becoming the Scion of Balance, and also caused Nupraptor to taint the entire circle with his madness. This taint severely crippled the Pillars. The Pillars didn't actually collapse until Kain refused the sacrifice, though. When Raziel said that the Pillars were brought down by the Circle's corruption, he meant that the net result of Moebius working for EG and Mortanius and Azimuth working for the Hylden was that there was no way for Kain to *not* destroy the Pillars.

  20. #20
    I have a couple disagreeances with that scenario.
    1. The demons Raziel fought in the SR2 sarafan era couldn't be under Azimuth's control since she wasn't born yet, so the original hylden discovery was made by her predessessor, or Morti.

    2. Mortainius did not willingly kill Ariel, it was done by HL in Morti's body, and the whole pillar corruption thing was HL's idea. taking over his body to kill ariel was what turned Morti away from hylden worship. Morti believed that he created Kain to restore the pillars through his interpretation of the prophecy, but it might just be that HL, and his knowledge of the future, allowed Morti to create the one who would set them free.

  21. #21
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1,788
    You like arguing, don't you?

    I never said that the demons in SR2 were under Azimuth's control. Summoning demons was based on the dimensional powers, not her pact with the Hylden. Presumably the dimension guardian during the SR2 time had the same powers as Azimuth. That doesn't mean that the dimension guardian in SR2 had to be working for the Hylden to summon demons from other dimensions.

    I know that the corruption of the Pillars was the HL's idea. He corrupted the Circle from within. I just checked the dialogue and it does say that the Unspoken took credit for silencing Ariel. In Defiance, though, Mortanius knew that Kain was the Scion of Balance, and he claimed that he had planned for Kain to fight the Hylden all along. I figured that Mortanius had enough control over himself to manipulate HL into killing Ariel at the right moment for Kain to become Scion. It never said *why* Mortanius turned from the Hylden. I assumed that he discovered what they were before Ariel's death, so then they were forced to possess him physically when he refused to do what they asked of him. If HL could really see the future, I doubt he would have willingly allowed Kain to become Scion.

  22. #22
    Listen to what the demons say...

    Gas Demon:
    We've been expecting you, little Raziel...

    Lightning Demon:
    Do you really think you can save Nosgoth!?

    Second Lightning Demon:
    Let me enlighten you, poor Raziel.

    Fire Demon:
    There he is, the savior of Nosgoth!

    Black Demon:
    Come closer, Raziel...

    Black Demon:
    You shall not pass!

    Black Demon:
    He thinks he can change his destiny.

    Second Black Demon:
    What a fool.
    Now, to me it looks that Azimuth's predecessor is speaking through these demons.
    And what the demon's say mirror's that which the hylden say.
    So it looks like Azimuth's predessor was a hylden worshipper.

    I figured that Mortanius had enough control over himself to manipulate HL into killing Ariel at the right moment for Kain to become Scion.
    That doesn't make any sense, why would he corupt the pillars only for the purpose of creating a being to repair them?

    The best I can figure is Morti was a hylden worshipper. When he was alone with Ariel, HL took over and killed her. Shocked by this, Morti realyzed what the hylden were and tried to figure out how to fix this. By using scaps of prophacy, he figured out what he could do and tried to create the fortold scion of balance to right things. But this was what HL was counting on this, and he knew Kain would refuse to complete the quest, destroy the pillars and free him and his kind.

  23. #23
    rabban Guest
    what sayer said...

  24. #24
    Join Date
    Dec 2003
    Posts
    1,788
    Quote Originally Posted by soothsayer
    Listen to what the demons say...



    Now, to me it looks that Azimuth's predecessor is speaking through these demons.
    And what the demon's say mirror's that which the hylden say.
    So it looks like Azimuth's predessor was a hylden worshipper.



    That doesn't make any sense, why would he corupt the pillars only for the purpose of creating a being to repair them?

    The best I can figure is Morti was a hylden worshipper. When he was alone with Ariel, HL took over and killed her. Shocked by this, Morti realyzed what the hylden were and tried to figure out how to fix this. By using scaps of prophacy, he figured out what he could do and tried to create the fortold scion of balance to right things. But this was what HL was counting on this, and he knew Kain would refuse to complete the quest, destroy the pillars and free him and his kind.
    I don't think that Azimuth's predecessor was speaking through the demons. I think that the demons are intelligent in their own right. They are from the dimension the Hylden were banished to, so it's likely that they picked up the Hylden's knowledge and plans. It doesn't necessarily mean that Azimuth's predecessor knew of the Hylden or worshipped them, just that the dimension guardian summoned demons from the demon dimension.

    I didn't mean that Mortanius intentionally corrupted the Pillars just to have them restored. I meant that he didn't have control over whether or not Ariel was killed, but I think he did manage to influence the circumstances in which the HL killed her in order to allow the Scion of Balance to take over for her. I really don't think that the HL would physically possess Mortanius and risk destroying such a valuable pawn unless Mortanius had already refused to do what he was told. I don't think that the Hylden can see the future. It seems to me like they only know what they've overheard, and what the vampire prophecies say, so I don't think that the HL would know that Kain would become Balance Guardian and would refuse the sacrifice. Mortanius likely stole something of Moebius' to look into the future and managed to keep his knowledge from HL or else he never would have been allowed to follow through with his plans.

  25. #25
    rabban Guest
    well i'm pretty sure those demons came via the direct orders of the hylden...they were not summoned via a cenobite like in lokd and i would assume because the dimension guardian was no where to be seen in the 100 years after azimuth died that the hylden were doing it all along in sr2.

Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •