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Thread: things fans want in LOK 6

  1. #451
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by BigKevSexyMan
    I guess I agree with Umah, except I still stand by my statement. There's a difference between loose strings and gapping plot holes that can't be explained(Vorador might be one). What story-wise things were those people complaining about besides Vorador in BO2?
    Janos, Umah, Hylden Lord, Nexus stone, Moebius...that's the majority of them, I think. I'm sure if you look back far enough you can come across a lot. No offense, but I really haven't seen a lot of "praise" for the "alternate timeline" explanation either.

    If you want a good example of a canyon of a plot hole take Trish from DMC; nearly major character in the first game, totally left out of the sequel. That would be like taking Janos out of the future LOK game and pretending like he was never there to begin with, IMO.

  2. #452
    Well, by plot holes I mean things like good ol' Moe meeting Raziel when he should be dead. Things that either can't, or won't be explained in the future.

    When is Janos a plothole? Are you talking about things before Defiance?

  3. #453
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    I tell you guys, people exploding and imploding just like in BO1!!

  4. #454
    Hiya Peeps,

    Quote Originally Posted by Primordial Blade
    So video games are about education to you? Is that where you get your education? Sorry. But I get my education from school, and I get my entertainment from video games. I consider the two to be seperate.

    There is a form of entertainment that focuses solely on story line and cinematics. It's called movie watching. And that's available to you. But, I think if you ask most gamers, they will tell you that story line should never take presidence over game play. If you've already got a game with fun and exciting game play, I consider that to be the icing on the cake, but it should never be the bulk of the product.
    Im sorry you feel that you have to explain what education is about especially since I have a degree. Fortunately I need not explain myself because unlike you I am working in the gaming industry.

    Entertainment does not solely focus on storylines in cinematics. Gameplay takes a large precedence in that respect but it does not take a large portion of that. Gameplay and story as Umah stated go hand-in-hand. The fight between Raziel and Kain was both story and gameplay driven. A small example of how the 2 work together seemlessly.

    Quote Originally Posted by BigKevSexyMan
    Well, all I gotta say is thank God you're not part of the LoK development team, if there still are any. What you're proposing is a sacralige(sp?) to the entire Legacy of Kain series. You do not sacrifice story for gameplay. Do you really think anyone would continue to play the legacy of kain series with fairly better gameplay and tons of irredemable plot holes?

    And by the way, your Raziel vs. Raziel idea isn't even that good gameplay wise. ESPECIALLY, since you probably won't even play as Raziel.
    Touché my friend. I would be very worried if he was somehow involved with the design/gameplay with the next sequel.

    Quote Originally Posted by Umah Bloodomen
    And the majority of games (e.g. survival horror, action/adventure, RPG) are essentially movies that we play a role in the outcome, are they not? How many of those types of games have alternate endings we (the gamer) have to unlock for crying out loud?

    No offense, but I seriously wouldn't play any game like LOK, PoP, FF, RE, etc. if it was merely about jumping around, looking in boxes, killing a thing or two and casting a spell here and there if (overall) there was nothing in it for me and I didn't have a clue as to why I was doing it. What would be the point? What purpose do characters like Kain, Raz, various S.T.A.R.S members, The Prince, Cloud, Sephiroth etc. serve if they have no history, goal to reach or basically, a reason for being? If I wanted to play something I'm not necessarily "attached" to, I'd pick up sport game - those at least, I can concur that your "gameplay precedence" notion applies to.



    And in what fictional universe would your gamer demographic reside?



    Perhaps I'm reading this wrong as it really appears to be contradictory to your previous opinion.



    Now we all know there have been many-a-post from members who were frustrated (to say the least) with what they consider to be flaws in the storyline and have threatened to give up on it. There have been just about as many about the "infamous" LOKD camera and BO2 "bugs" and have threatened the same as well. (Trust me, I've closed and/or merged a lot of them).

    The point I'm trying to make is that without the storyline, the gameplay is moot. On the other hand though, without the gameplay, the storyline is ultimately comprimised as it cannot be enjoyed as much. For a game to be really "good" (as in "perfect"), storyline and gameplay BOTH have to share precedence. It's a symbiotic relationship, IMO. To see this illustrated, I agree totally with babfrience on the Prince of Persia series (especially The Two Thrones). I really haven't come across much better than that.

    LOK is a great series in its ownright as well. Personally, I play it for the story (hence why many of the "gameplay" issues that troubled some, didn't really bother me all that much). Heck, I'm one of the minority who isn't really interested in the Tomb Raider series as Lara Croft's story and adventures just don't suck me in like LOK. The gameplay in the installments I have played really wasn't that amazing either. I don't think they're horrible games, they're just not my cup of tea and therefore my desire to play them is essentially non-existent. I'm willing to try the new one (Legend) when it comes out just to check out CD's efforts (mostly for gameplay reasons - although I hear the storyline may be up my alley for once).
    Nuff said really .


    PEACE OUT !!!
    One Man Can Make a Difference ! (Wilton Knight - Founder of the Knight Foundation)

  5. #455
    well enough argueing, take BO1 for instance, I still consider it one of my favourite games even if it has:

    -poor graphics (by today's standards)
    -almost no variety in combat (there wasn't even a combat system)
    -not a lot of speed in the game (unlike: DMC, GOW, and the rest of the LOK series)

    -can't say a bad word about the exploration though

    BUT storywise I consider it one of the best storylines, if not the best, a game has ever had.

  6. #456
    Hi i am a new member. I have been playing LOK games since 2001 in this order, sr1,sr2,defiance and blood omen 2. I have not been able to get a copy of blood omen 1 in the PAL version as a british gamer . I too admire the LOK series mainly for its brilliant story. Sure i like it for its other elements like puzziling, graphics etc but the story is what really counts if there is going to be another LOK game.

  7. #457
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    Big Grin

    ALL i can say is there's 2 types of gamers: The thinker & the Doer.
    Just happens to be that LoK appeals to both & both types share a lil of the others tastes.

    I'd say that's a simplified way of resolving this arguement>> Mwahahahaha:P

    BTW>> i'am more a DOER! >>>thinking can get in the way of a bloody good time

  8. #458
    They solved that already by making the cutscenes skipable.
    "If events are matched closely enough to course, they have a way of restructuring themselves to familiar outcomes." ~ Scorpius, Farscape

  9. #459
    I want dismemberment by the reaver. That would be so cool seeing a limb get chopped off of a human and seeing him run in fright from kain . Or even seeing a mutant vampire grow the limb back if you don't kill him in time. Blood gushing and everything. I think we can all agree to bring back the gore.

  10. #460
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    Quote Originally Posted by BigKevSexyMan
    I want dismemberment by the reaver. That would be so cool seeing a limb get chopped off of a human and seeing him run in fright from kain . Or even seeing a mutant vampire grow the limb back if you don't kill him in time. Blood gushing and everything. I think we can all agree to bring back the gore.
    *grins evilly* Oh yes, let there be blood and gore

  11. #461
    *thinks to what happened in BO1 when you hit someone with the reaver*
    If it doesn't hurt you're not doing it properly

  12. #462
    In LOK6 i would like a huge 3 sided war between the vampire army, revenant form Hylden (they cant enter the world in full form without the portal being opened by the nexus stone) and the huge mass of the EG. The vampire army would be raised if and when Kain ressurects Vorador and they could build a huge vampire army with Kain's new purfied soul.

  13. #463
    use shader model 3 graphics with bloom effects.

    Keep the defiance camera....more spectacular. of course...make improvements to it.

  14. #464
    Well, I don't think they should use the defiance camera. The defiance camera is for level based gameplay, but LoK6 really should be free-roaming so they should use one like in SR.

    Oh, and bring back carryable items like in SR2. I was very wierded out by Kain walking up to that giant bird thingy and it just disappeared into his inventory.

  15. #465
    Quote Originally Posted by OugaBooga
    BTW>> i'am more a DOER! >>>thinking can get in the way of a bloody good time
    I'll drink to that!
    If it doesn't hurt you're not doing it properly

  16. #466
    I got another good idea. How about TK torturing? Basically you can freeze the weaker enemies in the air and impale them with the reaver, light them on fire, fry them with lightning, etc. Just imagine the screams of agony.

  17. #467
    I just want to be able to rip ppl apart with my bare hands/claws again.... I didn't like they took that out of defiance simply saying "if you've got the reaver why fight with anything else??"

    I liked being able to sidekick someone into a wall before snapping a hylden's neck like a twig.....
    If it doesn't hurt you're not doing it properly

  18. #468
    Hiya Peeps,

    Quote Originally Posted by fneh
    I just want to be able to rip ppl apart with my bare hands/claws again.... I didn't like they took that out of defiance simply saying "if you've got the reaver why fight with anything else??"

    I liked being able to sidekick someone into a wall before snapping a hylden's neck like a twig.....
    On some level I have to agree. It would be nice to be able to choose whether you can select the reaver or simply use a bare handed attack. I really preferred the prototype looking berserk animation in BO2 that was never used in the final version. It was almost matrixey . The blurring of the attacks made the illusion of the moves appear faster and more agressive.

    Cant wait for this game. Tomb Raider Legend and Hitman: Blood Money are coming out very soon, im soo eager for Crystal Dynamics to be free (time-wise) and concentrate hard core on LoK: 6. I have been itching since 2005 for this new title. If this game does not come out some time this year I will never expect another LoK title to appear. Looking at the gaps between each LoK title, there has only been one gap of 3 years where BO1 pretty much got remade as SR1 where Raziel was the new anti-hero.

    I know Eidos has seen some fianancial hardship where they were bought out by SCI, but I still think if Eidos does not release it sometime soon most fans will be waiting in vain. I hope theres some kind of announcement soon because my patience is going to falter. Lets keep the faith in knowing that Kain needs to complete his destiny and that CD must continue to write it out .


    PEACE OUT !!!
    One Man Can Make a Difference ! (Wilton Knight - Founder of the Knight Foundation)

  19. #469
    Maybe they should do something like in SR2. That way you can reallistically carry items, pick up other weapons, or use the soul reaver.

  20. #470
    Quote Originally Posted by BigKevSexyMan
    Maybe they should do something like in SR2. That way you can reallistically carry items, pick up other weapons, or use the soul reaver.

    Their excuse in defiance was that they could have lots of moves for 1 weapon (the reaver) or just a few for lost of different weapons.

    Tho after playing defiance I didn't find they to be that many weapons really. I still found myself repeating the same moves over and over again. I don't see why they can't program reaver and bare hands. there wouldn't need to be a lot of work into implementing that. I understand that including an extensive array of weapons like the SR games had would create problems though.

    hand to hand and the reaver/chars main weapon would make a lot of variety in combat and the character wouldn't need to gather the other weapons they can use. (which I admit I did rather enjoy but I can live without it)
    If it doesn't hurt you're not doing it properly

  21. #471
    You mean like he has a default three slash combo in Defiance and it could be like a slash-slash-punch-kick combo as the default for light attack or something like that? Then perhaps his heavy attack could be knock into the air or from the air into the ground. And get rid of the stuff he only got by leveling up (to be replaced by spells doing more damage). I think that would do as his basic moves, but keep the TK.
    "If events are matched closely enough to course, they have a way of restructuring themselves to familiar outcomes." ~ Scorpius, Farscape

  22. #472
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    I do like bare-handed combat. I wouldn't mind if it was only the Reaver, though. In any case, I want a free-form fighting system like in PoP 3. I also would like some really cool spells

  23. #473
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    Lightbulb More Time Travel Needed

    Ok,From Blood Omen 2 to an as it were a would have been blood omen 3, With out it kain never raises his vampire sons and never builds his empire or even the time that the vampires evolve. (After the end of Soul Reaver 1.) So There Still Needs to be that part to it. Even If you have to go back in time. (The Older Kain) He can go back in to time the help the younger kain bulid his empire. With out it there would be a pardox and kain would die young. (You must understand time to understand your destiny.) So You See If Bo3 is not going to be made then that must be made into the game(s) after defince. That way you can eather help the vampires evolve or you could add a dark hellish version or dark cloud 2's house buliding thing to kain's building of his empire. So anyway that means that kain is at the end of blood omen 1 at the end of defince. Ok Well,then kain will use time travel maby more in this game(s). That way the missing times that you don't get to it in past game(s) you could see in the future games. I hope to see what the group will do to replace amy hening. I have'nt heard of her being replaced? This the best thing that I can come up with so that you can see the events of bo3/pre-soul reaver and anything else that I may have missed. Defince is over. Pre-Bo2 begins. The Key Is More Time Travel. -Fuse

  24. #474
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    I think that there should be just enough time travel to tie together a few loose ends (like how young Kain gets the Soul Reaver if elder Kain has it now, which I could easily infer but would prefer to see in the game anyway). Other than that, time travel should be kept to a minimum. I think that they have rewritten/re-explained the events from BO1 enough and that any more exploration of this time period will be overkill. The events between BO1 and BO2 and the events between BO2 and SR1 would be interesting to see, but they would seem more like spin-off games and I prefer to finish off the EG story arc first.

  25. #475
    Personally, I'd love to see some more hand-to-hand combat. I'm going to have to agree with Fneh on this one: In Defiance I also found myself using the same moves over and over, and I put forth effort to mix it up

    Also, the next game should deffinantly be aimed at a more mature croud. I like the idea of bringing back some of the more gorey parts, and the regeneration idea for vampires sounds great.

    One more thing: Am I the only one who'd like to see the ability to choose what time you go to? I'm a little tired of being hurled through time with no say as to when it is. I'd really like it if in the next game there was a bit more choice in what happens to you
    Help out with the effort for a new Legacy of Kain game! (list updated on December 6th)
    http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthr...74#post1270474

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