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Thread: Final Fantasy XIII-2: Speed Kills Discussions

Final Fantasy XIII-2: Speed Kills Discussions

  1. #1

    THREAD NOTES (READ THIS FIRST): Before posting, please ensure that your posts are related to speed kills stuffs, speed kill video transcripts, speed kill strategies and etc. I will follow the following guidelines in posting in my thread:



    <ul>[*]This thread is open up for theory speed kills. You can use this if you're up for discussion.[*]Strategies that are stated that are NOT working, no need to post about FLAMING.[*]Speed Kills are heavily based on HIGH LUCK, optimized strategies, and etc.[*]If a strategy is not working, that does not mean it solely doesn't work at all. Speed Kills are heavily based on HIGH LUCK and multiple tests.[*]NO flaming and trolling on a non-working strategy. [*]Videos are optional.[*]If you haven't yet finished/bought the game, please refrain from discussions.[*]Some XIII-2 games have version difference (most especially from the Japanese version that I use), so feel free to disagree.[*]Refrain from off-topics. [*]DLC weapons and DLC Japanese accessories are prohibited.[/list]
    Hello, and welcome to my speed kill discussion! Furthermore, if you're in need of other fun stuffs in Final Fantasy XIII-2, here is a good breeze thread for trying. If you have guessed right, yes, I transferred the discussion from GameFAQs to SE site for some reasons. I guess you probably read the ABOVE POST.

    SPEED KILL GUIDELINES:

    1. Speed Kills are based on HIGH LUCK and multiple tests. Why luck? Some factors including enemy attacks (e.g. Raspatil spawning Ceith monsters), positioning (for faster SYN buffs), and etc. Why multiple tests? 'Cause you'll end up getting results that are "not" qualified as a speed kills, and it's up to you to shorter the battle duration.

    2. Ally: KO Power Surge II is prohibited. This stat and ability is doable on any or most post-game monsters, so no need to post some strategies/discussions about them. I'll consider Critical: Power Surge II thought.

    3. Monster recommendations are also up for discussions. If you have a better monster substitute to the selected strategy, you can post and discuss about it here. Builds are optional, since you are opt to include them in your strategies anyway.

    4. Some Speed Kills are NOT recommended for safe kills and post/pre-post kills. Take it as this - some speed kills are more offense building rather than defense building. You take MORE RISKS to get the ULTIMATE reward (which is to get the best time).

    5. Some speed kills required GIMPING your monster and human builds. Example of this are Lightning on Power Build on PuPu, or Noel as MAG oriented.

    6. Consider both Feral and NON-Feral Link speed kills. The two mentioned are different in how they do, so I'll be happy to accept any of the two. Take Note that Feral Link usage FREEZES the Battle time.

    7. In considered speed kills, I'll include them in the first post (HERE). It explains it all.

    8. It is recommended that you know the game's mechanics. I'll post below the game's mechanics and calculations.



    VERSION DIFFERENCES AS OF NOW (TAKE NOTE):

    JAPANESE VERSION:
    - Exclusive accessories are found in the Famitsu JAPANESE gaming.
    - Feral Links of opponents (especially in the DLC colisseum) are mostly ignoring resistance of party.


    GAME MECHANICS TO CONSIDER IN SPEED KILLS:


    <ul>[*]Bravery and Faith is a 1.75 multiplier[*]Role Resonance is an additive 20%[*]Pack Mentality is an additive 30%[*]En-spells doubles your damage input[*]Base is 100%[*]Allies give 16%[*]Enhanced -insert role- is 50%[*]VLight's Enhanced COM (acts as a COM Bonus Boost) is 100%[*]Yakshini's Fanatical Dance buffs last for a minute (unless you re-buff them)[*]CloudBurst's Friendly Fire buffs last for 30 seconds (Still not sure)[*]Power Surges grant you an additive 100%[*]Adrenaline and Vigor are 20% additive[/list]

    VERSION HISTORY:
    6/18/12:
    Edited the Yomi ones. Copied the wrong information. Enfire isn't cast and not working 'cause Yomi halves/resists all elements, and En-spells will "disappear". Edited the paradigm name in L and A fight to Superiority to Guerilla. Updated another tip in the Yomi part.


    Speed Kills that are CONFIRMED will be post below.

  2. #2

    CONFIRMED SPEED KILLS, AS OF NOW:



    OPERATION XII-2
    Restrictions: No DLC, No Chichu, No Feral Link
    Strategy Used: N/A
    Best Time: 0:34

    Serah: Weapon: Indrajit Accessories: x2 Shaman's Mark
    - MAG: 1344
    Noel: Weapon: Romulus and Remus Accessories: x2 Brawler's Wristband
    - STR: 1299

    Monsters: Cactuar: Power
    Important Passives: Role Resonance , STR 35%
    Important Abilities: 5 ATB
    Blue Chocobo: Mana
    Important Passives: Role Resonance, MAG 35%
    Important Abilities: 6ATB
    Imp: Vitality
    Important Passives: N/A
    Important Abillities: 6ATB, Vigilaga

    Paradigms: Serah Noel Monster
    Guerilla SAB RAV Imp Wide
    Guerilla SAB RAV Imp Wide
    Tri-Disaster RAV RAV Blue Chocobo
    Cerberus COM COM Cactuar Wide
    Cerberus COM COM Cactuar Wide

    Transcript:
    - Stick Imperil on Amodar while Imp casts Shellga and Vigilaga. Switch your target to Lightning.
    - Stick Deprotect on Light while Imp casts Bravega and Faithga.
    - Switch to tri-disaster, and built chain on Light. This can let you atb refresh for the next step.
    - Build damage; Thanks to Cactuar's pre-stagger kill, with Deprotect on Light he will use Deprotect Chaser, and he will not use Stagger Wound. He will do insane damage to Light so Cactuar will finish it quickly. Serah and Noel will finish Amodar in a quick manner of time.

    Tips:
    - to ensure best time, you should win the fight before Bravega and Faithga disappears. Estimated time of disappearance of Bravega and Faithga is around 12 - 15 seconds (that includes the blinking).
    - Cactuar IS best suited here because he will not use Stagger: Wound , and he will have 30% more of his strength because of Deprotect Chaser.
    - If the one of the two opponents are defeated, and the other one uses Limit Breech, Cactuar will deal very insane damage because of Bravery feeder (on Light's limit breech) or protect feeder (on Amodar's Limit Breech). Take note that this is a rare occurrence because you'll end up defeating the two opponents at the same time.
    - For the best time, again, you need to stick Deprotect on Light in 5 ATB gauge. It's a matter of luck really, but retrying is your friend right? Sticking Deprotect in 5 ATBs has a probability of about 1/20 tries.










    Yomi



    Restrictions: No Chichu, No Magic Noel, No items, no ally KO strategy, No items, No Feral Link usage

    Strategy used: Chocobo Pack Mentality;


    Best time using this method (0:26)

    Equipment: Noel: Grasitha: Durable Hero's Amulet, Durable Power Wristband
    Serah: Gandiva: Durable Shaman's Mark, Magician's MArk x2

    MONSTERS: Purple Chocobo: built on Mana, and offense build (no defensive spells), AUTO-FAITH
    Red Chocobo: Built on mana
    Blue Chocobo: Built on mana

    Paradigms: Noel Serah Monster
    SYN SAB Purple Chocobo
    RAV RAV Purple Chocobo
    RAV RAV Purple Chocobo
    SAB SAB Blue Chocobo
    COM COM Red Chocobo

    Battle Transcript:
    - Cast Vigilaga at battle starts.
    - Put your debuffs in 1 round (3 deprotect and 2 Imperil) while Serah does Deshell.
    - Refresh in between, and STAGGER by the time Purple Chocobo gets all buffs on the part (Faith/Bravery)
    - Build damage in a short time before he actually gets to Aura. Do remember that your Red Chocobo will be doing 99999 dmg. (at least for me) with Pack Mentality so your red chocobo is dealing 600,000 in 500 to 700% stagger chain. Meteor Javelin will help you extend the stagger chain when Yomi goes to aura, and thus extending your Red Chocobo's attacks.

    TIP: Since you're going for the time before Yomi actually gets to Aura, it's approximately in between 20 seconds to 23. By that time you're nearly 25% of his life, getting Meteor Javelin into play is a must.
    If you're using Serah as leader, you can use Ultima arrow to raise the chain drastically so you won't worry to build stagger chain to raise damage potential. But this is risky though, since the AI Noel might cast a different -Ga spell and you have no time to switch to Noel to use Meteor Javelin by the second Yomi enters aura.


    Update: Yomi's Inpenetrable Aura is a random time duration. Sometimes, when he is receiving heavy damage, he always go to the Impenetrable Aura. Take note.






    Theory Speed Kills - in approval


    N/A at the moment.

  3. #3

    Well, to be honest I'm going for Speed Kills on XIII-2 also. I've done so far is Omega and Ultros and Typhon. I'll keep track of the thread and post here when I get my full stats on those two.

  4. #4

    Why disallow Ally KO: PS II? This seems like an extremely effective tool for speedrunning, IMO, and there are ways to make it work as consistently as anything in a speed run.


    t~

  5. #5

    Hey tiornys, like I said back in GameFAQs, Ally KO: PS II is already a doable and reliable method for speed running. Almost all post-bosses can be speed ran by Ally KO: PS II. Well that's at the moment. I might change the decision - but it is what I want right now.

  6. #6

    I'm probably in, hey. I agree with the non-Ally KO Power Surge 2. The strategy is all the same for the AKO: PS II, you just need to adjust your strategies inferior to the opponent.





    I'm trying out some good speed kills as of the moment. Since I don't have the Snow DLC yet, I'm sticking up with the earlier DLCs. More info later. I've got my hands on speed killing Omega without Pack Mentality skills.





    - Sym

  7. #7
    Wow! So many flaws in those theories. Do you want me to point them out?

  8. #8

    Eternal





    God, you already pointed that out back in GameFAQs - which in turn is false. Go out Exentryk, if your flaws are true then I'm SORRY because I just copied those in my thread. Maybe I copied the theory ones, so in turn I'LL just edit them to the right one. That's why there's a VERSION history.





    -----------





    Nothing special at the moment. Trying to beat out the crap on some monsters. Also, please look at the version history for editing/added/etc edits in the first posts. Edited the En-spell shenanigans too in the Yomi, copied the wrong info >_<

  9. #9

    If trolls came to troll the same thing all over again, they should be ignored.





    I kinda want to speed run in this game. It's very fun, and leads you to learn more the game mechanics etc. Let's see if what's my take on this..

  10. #10

    Originally Posted by Xiaonanigans


    If trolls came to troll the same thing all over again, they should be ignored.

    Yeah. I should have ignored Yoko when he created this thread, but I had to inform people about the legitimacy of these claims. I'll let you guys be in peace now.




  11. #11

    Originally Posted by Eternal


    Originally Posted by Xiaonanigans


    If trolls came to troll the same thing all over again, they should be ignored.

    Yeah. I should have ignored Yoko when he created this thread, but I had to inform people about the legitimacy of these claims. I'll let you guys be in peace now.









    You're the one referred by him as a troll.





    What's special about this claims? I haven't seen anyone posting this in any other forums except him.





    I have a question: Can I contribute if the strategy is over 1 minute?

  12. #12

    I'm talking to Eternal as a troll, lol.





    @Symbiosis:





    I think you can when against Gilgamesh and Valdofr.

  13. #13

    Lol.





    Symbiosis





    You can, but I can conclude that you can only use over 1 min. speed kills on Gilgamesh, Valdofr (LVL. 99), and Long Gui.

  14. #14

    Thanks. I saw a speed kill video on Long Gui below a minute, and it involves Pack Mentality as well. Without Pack Mentality, we can get about a minute too. Using Valkyrie Lightning as a pack is also good imo.





    Some hunches for my speed kill part:


    Omega: No items/No PM/No Feral Link


    Gilgamesh: No items/No PM/No Feral Link


    Snow: NO items/No PM/No Chichu/No DLC


    Valdofor level 99: No items/No PM





    I'm testing some things on Omega first, trying to beat the best record on YT (0:28) without PM.

  15. #15

    Gonna include a lot of speed kill theories later.. Along with some friends too (yes, from GameFAQs).

  16. #16

    Haven't posted in for a while. Anyways, I still am doing tests on Omega speed kill - great that you have VLight PM in to play. Sazh is still a good SYN, at level 16 the party will be buffed by augments. And yep, Augment Maintenance II - Sazh learns it too. Just to be sure, you should be watching out the augment durations for Faith/ga and Brave/ga, they give off very small durations.

  17. #17

    How's the going guys?





    Discussion is on going on facebook however. Might as well transfer here. Current discussion is against Light and Amodar.


    -----------------


    Invadah89





    Army of One deals at around 3000 (est.) damage without SEN on everybody. Whilst Physical Resistance is needed here. If you're doing the Math, If your current monster has HP+30%, you will deal roughly 1000 damage when you compare to the non-HP 30%. With Physical Resistance, you net the same too. Both are alternatives, since you're aiming for non-Limit Breech for speed killing L&A.





    AND, don't FORGET to SIGN UP NOW!





    CrissCross





    You gain more slots since the two of them are optional. Like I said, having no Limit Breech done is necessary for maintaining good time. If you're competent and worrying about going under green, focus on using Feral Links of pseudo-SYNs (or Yakshini) for healing the whole party. Cactuar's only weakness is Fire, which doesn't actually is not used by the two enemies. But do remember to have Vigilance on him thought.





    Sign up too.





    Xiaonanigans





    Yeah, you'll just gimp out your monster's passive if you infuse first strike. Since you'll be probably using more refreshes and Feral Links, First Strike is nothing good. Only infuse First Strike if you're on non-preemptive strike ones, Auto-Haste (or Auto-SYN), or etc. Also, auto-buff durations lasts for 30 seconds (?), tested on Auto-Haste thought.

  18. #18

    Here's a random fact that will help us in our speed kills: Feral links freezes battle time!





    --------------------------------





    You can use delicate accessories to lessen the capacity rate, plus you gain synthesize abilites too (with that small slot)

  19. #19

    Originally Posted by YoshiKatYoko


    - For the best time, again, you need to stick Deprotect on Light in 5 ATB gauge. It's a matter of luck really, but retrying is your friend right? Sticking Deprotect in 5 ATBs has a probability of about 1/20 tries.
    How are you calculating this probability? I haven't yet done any in-depth testing, but anecdotal evidence and preliminary experience suggest that there's absolutely no luck involved with sticking debuffs in XIII-2, unlike XIII.


    t~

  20. #20

    There's actually a certain luck when you are actually sticking debuffs. No calculations, but probabilities. I think he's saying that out of 20 tries, you get 1 time where that certain debuff sticks. I tested it already, but I'm on 1/50 tries. I'll record if the time is free.







  21. #21

    Originally Posted by tiornys


    Originally Posted by YoshiKatYoko


    - For the best time, again, you need to stick Deprotect on Light in 5 ATB gauge. It's a matter of luck really, but retrying is your friend right? Sticking Deprotect in 5 ATBs has a probability of about 1/20 tries.
    How are you calculating this probability? I haven't yet done any in-depth testing, but anecdotal evidence and preliminary experience suggest that there's absolutely no luck involved with sticking debuffs in XIII-2, unlike XIII.


    t~



    No calculation. Just personal thoughts and testings.

  22. #22

    Yeah, avoid the use of Limit Breeches of the opponents for the best time.





    Isn't debuffs a matter of luck, too? It has the same mechanics like XIII.

  23. #23

    XIII's debuffs were matters of luck, although it was possible to get the odds above 100%. XIII-2 appears to have changed that from casual observation. For example, the standard strategy against Gilgamesh relies on the fact that one Deprotect, one Deshell, and three Imperil will consistently stick all three debuffs immediately after staggering him. No luck appears to be involved; Deprotect sticks on the first cast, Deshell sticks on the first cast, and Imperil sticks on the third. This type of behavior--debuffs consistently requiring a set number of casts to stick--has been observed against several other enemies.


    t~

  24. #24

    Yeah I agree with tiornys. But the "luck" that I believe is pre-stagger sticking. All non-immuned debuffs stick post-stagger, because you probably have the higher stagger percent. At enemies that are hard to stick with debuffs pre-stagger (esp. Gilgamesh, Yomi [sometimes], Ochu, Raspatil, Jihl) have a low rate of sticking with debuffs.





    Some debuffs have a higher rate of sticking and there are less rate too. Like Imperil have a high rate of sticking that Deshell/Deprotect on Ochu. There are still many other cases, but too lazy. Gonna post thought tomorrow.

  25. #25

    It has been stated elsewhere (can't remember) that luck is not really involved with debuffs in this game - even for pre-stagger.


    The following is all very rough and off the top of my head, so it could be wrong in places, but the basic idea is this: All enemies have a certain "resistance" to debuffs and once that value has been bypassed the debuff will stick. Say, for example, each usage of Deprotect inflicts 20 points of "damage" to the corresponding resistance value. If the enemy has a resistance of 40 it will take exactly 2 Deprotects to inflict the status. For a resistance of 100 it will take 5 casts and so on.


    To work with this, SAB Bonus Boosts do not actually increase the chance of inflicting a status effect. Instead they increase the "damage to resistance" of the various abilities.


    Over time, an enemy will gradually "regenerate" its resistance value, though I really can't remember how that works.


    The final bit I can think of is that current chain percentage increases the "damage" of the debuffs, so although it may be advantageous to get debuffs early it can be better to wait it out for a little while, or even until stagger. Staggering the enemy drops their resistances massively - see Gilgamesh.


    You can, through testing, figure out exact enemy resistances to various statuses and how best to exploit them at various chain percentages. For example, (as previously mentioned) staggered Gilgamesh will ALWAYS be fully debuffed through 1 Deprotect, 1 Deshell and 3 Imperils. Another random example is Paradox Royal Ripeness - it will ALWAYS be debuffed through 2 Deprotects and 2 Deshells with no chaining beforehand. There is little/no luck involved in debuffs, and you should experiment with them to figure out the most efficient means for various battles.

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