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Thread: Legacy of Kain 6 - The first section of the game

  1. #1
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    Legacy of Kain 6 - The entire first section of the game

    I've made a significant number of further discoveries over the last few days, and feel confident that I can now speculate on the possible first section of The Dark Prophecy / Blood Omen 3.

    I discovered the DeviantArt profile of Andez Gaston, which led me to his portfolio. Andez and his brother Anderson were hired by Eidos as concept artists for the game, and produced a wealth of material of which I have only recently found the bulk of. For the first time, some of the disjointed segments of information and artwork are starting to connect to each other

    This thread will try and surmise how the game would have begun, using the assets, conclusions based on the notes found in the artwork, the image filenames given by the artists, and the story lore. This is all reasoned guesswork of which only some might be correct. Please treat it as infomed speculation, and enjoy.


    The End of Legacy of Kain: Defiance

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KoI-8-CVbzo

    Kain is now cured of the corruption and madness that Nupraptor infected him with. Raziel and Ariel are gone, and the Pillars of Nosgoth have just exploded and triggered the apocalypse. Moebius is dead for good this time, the Elder is no longer shrouded and the Hylden are free. It is immediately after the events of Blood Omen, Kain stands on the balcony of the ruined vampire citadel, overlooking the devastated land.


    The ruins of The Pillars and The Seer

    Kain visits the burning ruins of The Pillars of Nosgoth, the epicenter of the massive magical explosion that has just devastated and doomed the land. (1)




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    Here Kain meets The Seer, a mysterious being that his younger self met briefly in the future in Blood Omen 2. (2)


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    The Seer informs Kain of The Dark Prophecy, which is the Hylden equivalent of the vampires own Scion of Balance prophecy. The nature of this prophecy is uncertain. (3)

    She explains that the Hylden General/Sarafan Lord is commencing the events of Blood Omen 2 (conquering Meridian/defeating and eventually being defeated by Kain's younger self in the future/returning to the Demon Dimensions in shame).

    She explains that as Kain has now exposed the existence of The Elder, and killed his time-travelling agent Moebius, a second tier of the invasion is beginning. She explains that The Hylden King intends to wake his forces, hidden in the world, and rule the land now uninfluenced by the ancient vampires and Moebius' machinations. (4)


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    The Seer explains that a foothold has already been gained at the now-vacant Malek's Bastion, and suggests Kain begins his quest by travelling there. She warns Kain that due to the Hylden's magic, he will not be able to access the summit of the bastion in his bat form and must travel there on foot. (5)


    The Journey to Malek's Bastion

    Kain travels North from The Pillars to reach Malek's Bastion.


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    During his journey, demons are already beginning to raid Nosgoth from the Demon Dimensions, and carnage is spreading across the land. Kain must fight many demons who are after his blood. (6)


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    The magical fallout from the Pillars collapse has also mutated some of the nearby humans of Nosgoth into twisted beastial creatures. Kain must also overcome these abominations. (7)


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    Reaching Malek's Bastion


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    Picure taken from Blood Omen.

    Kain reaches the base of Malek's Bastion, a Sarafan military compound secured on the flat plateau of a shaped mountain. Using a series of ancient vampire transport gates built into cliff walls, Kain ascends the mountain. (8)

    This area is called The Bridge.


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    Kain eventually reaches a chamber where an ancient elevator will ascend him the rest of the way and into the heart of Malek's Bastion. (9)


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  2. #2
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    Malek's Bastion

    Kain emerges in the frozen bastion and explores.


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    The Animated Armor

    Kain discovers that the Bastion is not empty. Animated suits of armour, possessed by the green glowing aura of disembodied Hylden, attack him on sight. (10)


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    The Reaver Forge

    Hidden in the maze of corridors, Kain discovers an ancient vampire Reaver Forge, revealing that the mountain is one of their constructs. (11)


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    Kain overcomes the Hylden Armor Soldiers and the Reaver Forge puzzle, and imbues the Soul Reaver with a new ability.

  3. #3
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    The Soul Mine

    Kain descends beneath the bastion and into the mountain itself. He discovers an ancient mine used to ferry materials by cart to a facility below. (12)


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    Kain also discovers the bodies of many slave workers. (13)


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    Secret Underground Chambers

    Following the mine cart tracks and overcoming the Hylden Armor Soldiers, Kain discovers a secret buried complex. (14)


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    The Soul Machine and the Hylden Organic Core

    Kain discovers The Soul Machine, an ancient device that was previously used by Malek to infuse the souls of Sarafan troops into animated living armor. With Malek defeated by Vorador, the Hylden have attached an organic piece of technology to the machine to enhance its capability. The machine is now reaching out of this reality and into the Demon Dimensions, retreiving the exiled Hylden souls and infusing them into living armor. (15)


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    Kain destroys the machine.


    The Boss Arena

    After destroying the machine, Kain enters a boss chamber to fight a powerful foe. (16)


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    Kain soundly defeats the Boss and leaves Malek's Bastion.

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    Further events

    We have no more artwork or disclosed locations from which to establish where in Nosgoth the story takes Kain next. Wherever Kain travels to, the following events are expected to take place.


    The Hylden Return

    The Hylden in their pure form return to the world of Nosgoth and commence their invasion.(17)


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    The Soul Reaver

    In some unknown fashion, Raziel is awoken.


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    Supporting notes

    These notes address each of the numbers scattered in the text above, as an attempt to evidence the proposed events.

    (1) Kain ends the last game staring at The Pillars. The screenshots are found on the portfolio of a Crystal Dynamics staffer and show the area in a time not covered in any of the games. Crystal Dynamics staff may have done this initial work before the bulk of the project was moved over to Ritual Entertainment in 2004.

    (2) The only prophet in the games who exists in this era is The Seer, and the concept art attached looks incredibly similar to her. She also knows Kain very well when she meets his younger self during the future events of Blood Omen 2.

    As a prophecy exists to be told, someone must tell it to Kain and she seems to be the only possible candidate.

    (3) The Hylden General repeatedly calls Kain "Dark One" so any Dark Prophecy as delivered by the Hylden may refer to his future. It also fits in with idea of each of the two ancient races having parallel prophecies. In Defiance both the Hylden and the Ancients predicted Raziel and Kain's fateful battle at Avernus. While the Ancients also predicted the Scion of Balance, it was never revealed what parallel prophecy the Hylden had made. This could be the Dark Prophecy.

    (4) The Hylden King is uncorrupted as per the art. He must have somehow survived the effects of The Binding as The Seer and The Builder did. As he has not directly been involved in any events or mentioned up until this point, he could be somehow asleep somewhere, in stasis with his troops and protected.

    (5) There must be some explanation given as to why Kain cannot simply fly up the retreat as he did in Blood Omen.

    (6) This explains the demon concept art, and Soul Reaver 2 shows us that immediately following the Pillars collapse, demon raids became common.

    (7) Soul Reaver 2's grim future shows us mutants created by the corrupted landscape. If the corruption comes from the Pillars, then it seems possible that those near to their collapse would suffer immediate ill effects.

    (8) The artwork shows devices very similar to the teleportation gates in Defiance. The art also shows multiple devices across distant platforms, suggesting they are part of a teleportation puzzle of sorts.

    (9) The concept pieces have "elevator" in their filenames.

    (10) In Defiance, the green aura is indicative of Hylden possession.

    (11) The concept pieces have references to "reaver forge" in their filenames.

    (12) The concept pieces refer to the mine as being part of the "soul machine" section.

    (13) There are no humans in the Bastion as per Kain's visit in Blood Omen 1. As the machines are active and the mine still in use (as evidenced by the minecarts), it makes sense that humans were being held here as slaves and used to mine ores. These ores were likely used to forge the armors and fuel the soul machine.

    (14) The corridors are also labelled as being part of the "soul machine" section.

    (15) The art labels the attached Hylden Technology as organic.

    Malek had machines of a similar nature in Blood Omen 1, which Kain shut down. However, consider Moebius and his facility. Moebius was like Malek, a member of the Circle of Nine and had many time machines scattered around the world. Soul Reaver 1 reveals that deep underneath his lair, there was a collossal ancient time machine called the Chronoplast. The "Soul Machine" beneath the bastion could be Malek's equivalent.

    (16) The screenshots and concept art label the area as being a "boss chamber".

    (17) As these creatures are elegant and match the murals shown in Blood Omen 2, they have clearly never been exposed to the Demon Dimensions. The possibility exists that they have been asleep, protected and hidden in the world, and survived in this statis during the binding of The Pillars.

    The existence of The Seer and the Builder in Blood Omen 2 as purebreed Hylden, evidence that the binding can be survived with the right planning. The Hylden General being the de-facto leader of the Blood Omen 2 corrupt Hylden, suggest that the Hylden King does not control or exist with this faction.


    Final words and bonus artwork

    To finish, I'm going to use my next post to attach all the miscellaneous art I have uncovered from this cancelled game, in case you are interested. Some of this is new, some of this is old.

    I hope you enjoyed this attempt to put together the jigsaw that is Legacy of Kain: The Dark Prophecy.

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    And that's the lot.

  6. #6
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    Whoa, thanks for the ride. Appreciated.

    News of the vamire forge is interesting. It's most logical that they were the first settlers and the humans and now hylden have moved in as squatters, since that big rock just screamed of being an eyrie.

    I liked the scaled serpent doors in the miscellaneous art too. It would have been nice to see a drake in this series to explain why the vamps have so much dragon decor in their dwellings.

    I don't know if you were the same one who posted those raziel pics before, but others have been sceptical that he was really intended to appear in this game other than in a flashback or something. But come to think of it, if Kain had timetraveled he may have encountered Raziel that way, so that we could see Raz again without reversing his death.

    and that one pic of the cart/machine area looks like a Mattel factory floor. Seems out of place for the ancients, but I guess Prophecy had to go there since Malek used the machines as a production line.

    anyways, sweet.

  7. #7
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    I think your idea does make quite a bit of sense. But one thing I have to add is that the mutants don't necessarily have to do with the Pillars collapsing. I always assumed the ones we see in Soul Reaver 2 had to do with the mutants from Dark Eden. Remember that there were mutants all over the place there in Blood Omen because of the Guardians there, especially the Nature and States Guardians.
    One little complaint I have though, another Reaver Forge? I mean, hadn't we done this enough in the games?

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    Great stuff. Most of it. I do like the open vertical and grand scale of the architecture, not so linear and flat like in Defiance. Thanks for posting as always

    One note (not going to go too in depth here on things, since there's not much more you can do than the speculation you gave, which most of it was sound ) :

    Quote Originally Posted by Divine Shadow View Post
    She explains that the Hylden General/Sarafan Lord is commencing the events of Blood Omen 2 (conquering Meridian/defeating and eventually being defeated by Kain's younger self in the future/returning to the Demon Dimensions in shame).
    The Sarafan Lord/Hylden Lord was actually reaved by the Soul Reaver. The ending FMV of BO2 shows this, so unless I am confusing this statement (or, unless that was an impostor Kain reaved), he doesn't return in shame.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheSquid View Post
    and that one pic of the cart/machine area looks like a Mattel factory floor. Seems out of place for the ancients, but I guess Prophecy had to go there since Malek used the machines as a production line.
    Actually, it reminds me of either the cart/mini-train cars and tracks in Blood Omen 2, or the mines from Blood Omen 1 that went under various locations, like Wilendorf and a couple mountainous areas leading from after the Bastion. I would rather think of the Blood Omen 1 reference and that makes this very cool.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zulgbrtzchllha View Post
    I think your idea does make quite a bit of sense. But one thing I have to add is that the mutants don't necessarily have to do with the Pillars collapsing. I always assumed the ones we see in Soul Reaver 2 had to do with the mutants from Dark Eden. Remember that there were mutants all over the place there in Blood Omen because of the Guardians there, especially the Nature and States Guardians.
    Yeah, that's what I was about to type, lol

    One little complaint I have though, another Reaver Forge? I mean, hadn't we done this enough in the games?
    Yup, I had the same reaction.

  9. #9
    That was an outstanding post, or 'posts' I guess. You've done a very neat work both with the collection and the speculation.

    Though, there's a lil fact that should be clarified. About Note (3): "In Defiance both the Hylden and the Ancients predicted Raziel and Kain's fateful battle at Avernus", it was confirmed at the end of the game that no (known) Prophecy ever predicted a battle between Raziel and the Scion of Balance (Kain). The famous always depicted 'battle' was the one between the Vampire and Hylden Champions, and both were Raziel.

    Also, I agree with the guys in the two last points TheHylden revised:

    1.- The mutants in SR2 being remnants of Dark Eden experiments would be a very sweet connection with BO1's Nosgoth. If it wasn't conceived that way, it would still totally have the potential to be so; a potential that should be exploited, at least in our minds.

    2.- Aside from the fact that we have seen too many Forges already, we should keep in mind that the recently (and finally) created Soul Reaver is the same blade (young) Kain has had since the first Storyline we saw him in; meaning that it has already become everything it needed to be before going to Avernus Cathedral (or, more likely, to Moebius hands at some point before giving the sword to William the Just) in order to play its role in Blood Omen 1. To make it short: No more Reaver enhancements please! However, enhancements for Kain in Dark Prophecy would have likely been obtained through more pieces of the Balance Emblem.

    Thanks for raising such an interesting topic!
    "Hope."

  10. #10
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    Of course there have been too many forges.
    I think Raziel died from the shock of realizing all the forging was finally done.
    Still, it would be interesting to discover an ancient temple at Malek's.
    I have no idea what we'd still be trying to jam into the sword at this point, though.

    I have the faintest memory of some SR2 materials linking that game's mutants to pillar corruption and leaving it at that. This may be what the Shadow was referring to. Dark Eden too can be described as the results of pillar corruption, so we're all saying the same thing.

  11. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by TheSquid View Post
    so we're all saying the same thing.
    Alright, just to put it out there: Reaver forge is unnecessary(another way of upgrading Kain would have been better, e.g. SR & BO2 way) and the mutants are likely from Dark Eden, because we like that to be.

    I'm surprised however that none of this is in the Soul Reaver era, I suspected the outside shots were from that period...

    How much I would have loved this game...

  12. #12
    This is pictures seem to be just from the first chapter. Areas could have changed drastically later. And, man, everybody is saying the same in every post! xD
    "Hope."

  13. #13
    Quote Originally Posted by Divine Shadow View Post
    The Soul Reaver

    In some unknown fashion, Raziel is awoken.
    This point shattered my hopes...

  14. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by Balance Reaver View Post
    This point shattered my hopes...
    Chill, buddy. Give that a break.
    "Hope."

  15. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by Balance Reaver View Post
    This point shattered my hopes...
    Yeah forgot that one, if this was going to be in there, then I probably would have hated it.

  16. #16
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    Looks like it would have been an awesome game, very beautiful. That was an amazing (theory) walkthrough would have worked well but I suppose we'll never know unless they decide to continue making it!

  17. #17
    I'd agree with the no more forges posts but as Nessdark pointed out there is still more room on the Balance Emblem for Kain.
    He has -
    Flame/Conflict, Dimension, Lightning/Energy and Time.
    So still room for -
    Mind, Nature, States and Death.

    I would have guessed that the Seer and any other non-wasted Hylden are because of something Kain would do to restore Nosgoth's balance by going to the distant past. I don't mean by altering time again, just that it has been part of the the timeline since it was last altered in SR2. I got the impression the Seer knew Kain's older self. Then again I've no evidence whatsoever, it would just be a mistake if Hylden were suddenly appearing out of the banishment in pristine condition for this game only.

    Wasn't there a suggestion a while ago that Dark prophecy would involve both the older and younger Kains as protagonists or did I imagine that?
    The body is but a vessel for the soul. A puppet that bends to the soul's tyranny...
    ...but body and soul both demand chocolate.

  18. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by ChocolateRob View Post
    Wasn't there a suggestion a while ago that Dark prophecy would involve both the older and younger Kains as protagonists or did I imagine that?
    I wouldn't have liked that very much though. I think they should leave young Kain after BO2 to stick back to the events as they happened in the first storyline.
    "Hope."

  19. #19
    Quote Originally Posted by Nessdark View Post
    I wouldn't have liked that very much though. I think they should leave young Kain after BO2 to stick back to the events as they happened in the first storyline.
    I would have loved that very much though :P I think it could perhaps explain what happens to Vorador and how he was raised, since that also remains pretty unclear. I would also like to have seen the "hylden's trap" in this part, that has been referred to by Kain in both SR2 and Defiance...

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nessdark View Post
    I wouldn't have liked that very much though. I think they should leave young Kain after BO2 to stick back to the events as they happened in the first storyline.
    Well, it's not like there's no space to fill in there. As far as anyone knows, all Kain did in that period was raise the lieutenants then flit around the Pillars and the Chronoplast for a thousand years.

  21. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by Corlagon View Post
    Well, it's not like there's no space to fill in there. As far as anyone knows, all Kain did in that period was raise the lieutenants then flit around the Pillars and the Chronoplast for a thousand years.
    Yeah, don't get me wrong, my concerns were about the developers inventing more new post-paradox events.
    "Hope."

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by ChocolateRob View Post
    I'd agree with the no more forges posts but as Nessdark pointed out there is still more room on the Balance Emblem for Kain.
    He has -
    Flame/Conflict, Dimension, Lightning/Energy and Time.
    So still room for -
    Mind, Nature, States and Death.
    Yeah, but Kain said in Defiance the Balance Emblem was complete, and it was a complete wheel. Having to complete it again gets old, fast. As Squid mentioned, Raziel probably relished entering the blade to pull up a beach chair and a good book while Kain took over the maddening sessions of continuing to imbue the sword with abilities each and every game...

    Plus, and I've got to say this, I was not a fan of Kain having to gain powers he already had. This was a problem in BO2, and kind of even worse in Defiance, looking back. In the interviews after and leading up to Defiance, the team at Crystal confirmed that Kain had all of the spells, powers, and forms he gained in Blood Omen 1, and that he only chose to use certain ones now, explaining why they don't have him able to use all of those lovely spells and such. Yet, if that's true, then why does Kain have to gain powers to enhance both he and the Reaver with the same powers he already has? In Blood Omen 1, Kain already has Inspire Hate, which is the Conflict power in Defiance -- the exact same look to the spell (red aura around) and the exact same outcome of using it. He already is able to teleport before the Soul Reaver 2 paradoxical changes -- seen in SR1's battles with Kain, the intro FMV of SR2, and the game, itself -- and he had the Sanctuary Spell -- a precursor to that teleport anywhere spell already -- in Blood Omen 1. Yet, he has to gain the ability of Dimension, which has him teleport all over the place in combat. Kain gained the Lightning Spell in Blood Omen 1, which was far more deadly and lethal than the Lightning Power gained in Defiance, and he had Slow Time in BO1, which, of course, slows time the exact same way as he "gains" in Defiance...

    Even the "enhancement" to his telekinetic power that lets him light sconces and such on fire in Defiance is the same as Immolate in Blood Omen 2, but of course, this time not used on a living being. He's got all the stuff he has to gain in Defiance already, so why did we have to gain the same stuff again, especially when the creators also confirm that Kain still has every spell and form??

    It reminds me that, while the story was mostly great in most every game and crafted with care, a lot of the care to carry forth some characters, like Kain, and even Raziel (who looses all the powers besides swim and climb (which, was really lame, given he has claws that can pierce stone so why can't he just climb on his own without Zephon's soul?) he gains in SR1, and makes them meaningless), as well as some of the majesty of the world started from Blood Omen 1, was lacking as we progressed further into the Soul Reaver arc of this tale. It's a shame. You start off with not only carrying over Kain from Blood Omen in SR1, but you state from Raziel's voice over in the game, and in the manual his own words, that Kain and the rest also went into states of change every century, or so, and that they emerge with even more gifts. So, here we have Kain, who is about 2,000 years old in the game after Raziel awakes, and you've never really said what gifts he's gained since we saw him last in BO1, but of course he already has all of these crazy great abilities. Now, he's gotten more over the ages, and not only him, but the Lieutenants also had to have started off with powers, then gained more, yet we never, ever learn what ones Raziel had before being abyssed... Raziel makes a lot of leaps after being reborn as a Wraith, but what did he already have? What powers, what forms? Anything? He had to have at least gone into the state of change maybe 8-10 times during the long millennium he served Kain as a vampire, and he only ever emerged with cloven feet and claws, and wings? What about the other times? Nothing was really thought on, or expressed that it was, to further flesh this out. It's just tossed out there. I point this out because this lack of expansion to the world and the physicality of the characters and their powers leads us into ruts like Kain having to imbue himself and the Reaver with powers he had 2 millennia ago. And, which he is stated to still have. It just doesn't make any sense.

    Sorry for the long post regarding this, but like I've said in another thread, recently playing through the games again, I've noticed a lot of what Dennis Dyack was alluding to in his statement regarding the dilution of Blood Omen since CD took it over, that it was nearly Legacy of Kain in name only by the end. The stories were still great, but there was so much more that could have been preserved and expanded on from the rich world of Blood Omen that just wasn't, and it's a shame, and noticeable when one has stepped back from the series for a few years now. Even some characters were altered that I wish weren't, like Vorador, even Kain was a bit more subdued in the end.

    What I do like, again, here in these concepts and the screens, is that the expanse and architecture Kain is going through in the Bastion and in the mines there looks more fleshed out than the numbing Vampire Citadel, for example. I mean, it does seem a little like Defiance was running on fumes, playing it again.

    Wasn't there a suggestion a while ago that Dark prophecy would involve both the older and younger Kains as protagonists or did I imagine that?
    There was a desire to do so with both elder and younger Kain in Soul Reaver 2, Defiance, and I am sure it was considered yet again for this game.

    Edit: Revised Kain's proper age, which I knew was wrong when I typed it...

  23. #23
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    Wow The Hylden, are you me posting when I'm asleep? I agree with pretty much everything you said, except I'd like to point out that Kain did lose everything after fighting the Sarafan Lord at the beginning of Blood Omen 2! So that's why he lost all his cool spells! Seriously though, that is pretty much how I think of it. It's the only explanation I can come up with for why Kain doesn't just use those sadistic and super powerful spells from Blood Omen.
    You touch on something I've also thought before, and was reminded by Dyack as well. There is so much to Nosgoth shown in Blood Omen, yet as the series goes on, our view becomes narrower and narrower. I personally am not a fan of having pretty much everything in Nosgoth have a Hylden or Ancient Vampire origin, though I do like the idea of discovering ancient ruins and other things from them every so often, has a sort of Robert E. Howard feel to it, the idea that this stuff has been sitting there all along, and no one has known about it.
    You also mentioned that there were allusions at least that Kain would have his old forms again, and that just reminds me how much I wanted to see wolf form again. I mean, when I was waiting for Soul Reaver 2, I was imagining fighting Vampires of the time that Moebius was around (since we had seen him at the end of Soul Reaver) and just imagining seeing a Vampire turn to wolf form and start attacking Raziel like that. Also when Blood Omen 2 was announced I thought for sure that Kain would be able to turn into a wolf since he had gained that ability in Blood Omen, but of course, we never see the wolf form after Blood Omen. Yeah, yeah, it's not that major a thing, but I always loved turning into a wolf in Blood Omen and running around killing people like that. I was very pleasently surprised when I saw the Dire Wolf concept art for Dark Prophecy. I thought for sure that my dream of seeing Kain as a wolf again was never going to happen.
    I'm not a fan of doing more Reaver forging, but I do like the idea of just having Kain gain new abilities and spells, and then maybe using the Soul Reaver as a channel or amplifier or something.

  24. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
    Yeah, but Kain said in Defiance the Balance Emblem was complete, and it was a complete wheel. Having to complete it again gets old, fast. As Squid mentioned, Raziel probably relished entering the blade to pull up a beach chair and a good book while Kain took over the maddening sessions of continuing to imbue the sword with abilities each and every game...
    As far as I know, it was planned to reintroduce the 4 'missing' parts of the emblem in the next game, though inconsistent with what Kain said, (that'd be odd, I know). And yeah, I'm sick of those enhancements too, specially with the (il)logical explanations they've been tossing at us.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
    Even the "enhancement" to his telekinetic power that lets him light sconces and such on fire in Defiance is the same as Immolate in Blood Omen 2, but of course, this time not used on a living being. He's got all the stuff he has to gain in Defiance already, so why did we have to gain the same stuff again, especially when the creators also confirm that Kain still has every spell and form??
    I believe it was a huge mistake of the creators to state such a thing. When something like that doesn't make any sense, I prefer to find the 'true' anwser by myself. Just like Kain awakening in the Demon Dimension without the Heart of Darkness only "because he is the Scion of Balance". I agree in that they have taken, perhaps, too many licenses; and some of us, consumers, indeed hate to have our intellect taken lightly.

    However, I'm glad to see you allow the co-existence of both your love for the series and a harsh criticism towards its weak points. In the end, it is this attitude what can bring more wealth to the series, (in quality I mean). But, of course, I'm not considering the fact that there's no new game in development, lol. Nonetheless, it's a very clever posture.

    And, @Zulgbrtzchllha, (I'm sorry I'm still not able to properly multiquote manually, your post came while I typed this), even though BO2's famous "loss of abilities" can serve as an excuse for Kain not having any of his former spells, you're not considering that until the end of SR2, things should have worked the same with or without the events in BO2; meaning that, in the pre-paradox storyline, the loss of abilities would be lacking an explanation, (inevitably leading to be the same case in the post-paradox storyline). Also, it has been officially (if i remember correctly) stated that Kain slowly kept regaining his old abilities after BO2's end.

    I, personally, prefer to believe that the stages of vampiric evolution the guys experienced could bring up new abilities and traits while leaving some others to 'rust'. That'd mean there would be some sort of exchange of features over the centuries, different in each of the Lieutenants (and Kain). That would at least have some support in what we saw of Rahab and Turel.

    Also, it would be accurate (in a matter of acceptance) to bring back a thing such as Wolf Form. Though, it would need to come with the proper explanation, not just the current "Yeah, he could have always used it, he just didn't wanna."

    And about BO1's Nosgoth... yeah, that world was indeed a hellish Paradise. Hard to see coming back in full measure; but, well, we still got its legacy... heh
    "Hope."

  25. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by The Hylden View Post
    Yet, if that's true, then why does Kain have to gain powers to enhance both he and the Reaver with the same powers he already has? In Blood Omen 1, Kain already has Inspire Hate, which is the Conflict power in Defiance -- the exact same look to the spell (red aura around) and the exact same outcome of using it. He already is able to teleport before the Soul Reaver 2 paradoxical changes -- seen in SR1's battles with Kain, the intro FMV of SR2, and the game, itself -- and he had the Sanctuary Spell -- a precursor to that teleport anywhere spell already -- in Blood Omen 1. Yet, he has to gain the ability of Dimension, which has him teleport all over the place in combat. Kain gained the Lightning Spell in Blood Omen 1, which was far more deadly and lethal than the Lightning Power gained in Defiance, and he had Slow Time in BO1, which, of course, slows time the exact same way as he "gains" in Defiance...
    Ah, I've got an answer for you here: in Defiance it is never said that he gained those abilities because of the emblem, so he could be using his own powers there And he needed the Balance Emblem to first break the barriers with the Reaver, then boost his tk/immolate powers to reach a bit higher than he was used to and then the final pieces to open certain locks. Does not sound very illogical to me...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nessdark View Post
    Just like Kain awakening in the Demon Dimension without the Heart of Darkness only "because he is the Scion of Balance". I agree in that they have taken, perhaps, too many licenses; and some of us, consumers, indeed hate to have our intellect taken lightly.
    Yes that was a bit of weak thing said in the interview. It can in other ways be easily explained however, because he wasn't killed in a way that would kill vampires in SR(e.g. staking, burning, devouring souls). Also Kain's reference as to the fact that Raziel had the only weapon that could kill him, the Soul Reaver, does suggest that he needs to be killed with that weapon, and in no other way.

    BTW:

    (click image to enlarge)
    This might be the reason as to why Eidos cancelled the game

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