Thread: Chasing and Blending

Chasing and Blending

  1. #26
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    If it's not broke, don't fix it!
    Then why we discussed new ideas for 2 years?You think new ideas are unnecessary? Yes, every new idea doesn't have to be good but still I think this one would be nice.

    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    EDIT: It looks like they're changing the logo? http://www.thief4.com/ (I get nothing there now).
    I hope you are right. I get nothing there too. Just a black screen.

    Originally Posted by jtr7
    Blending in AC is literally the player triggering group AI behavior, a programmed mechanic where the AIs stop acting realistic, and it doesn't even try to look natural. The near AIs stupidly stay clumped tightly around the player, and the enemy AIs go stupid, and for all the programming, if it's in T4, it won't be rare.
    Yes, blending in AC is very stupid. I hope it is better in AC2 -I don't think to play it though.-
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  2. #27
    New? I don't think they should copy that, hopefully they (developers) think that to. It wouldn't be "new" if T4 copied that. Besides, would AC even be here if it weren't for T1?

    Believe this: They're going to come up with something awesome, because that's what they do. The standards of todays games on any platform are very high. Those developers were raised in a video gaming world and have had ideas, wishes, & dreams for video games since they were kids playing atari, nintendo, whatever. Now they have a chance to make them come true & they're going to do just that. They'll have something new & they're just not telling you yet.
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

  3. #28
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    Besides, would AC even be here if it weren't for T1?
    If you mean that the devs of AC looked at the features of T1 and implemented just pickpocketing and eavesdropping, then yes. Other than that, I don't see any reason to think that Thief spawned AC.

    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    again and again and again etc.
    Could you please stop doing that? It makes you look like an ass and also that nothing you say can be taken seriously. Really, you use that crazy-emote in every post you make.

  4. #29
    Originally Posted by Platinumoxicity
    Could you please stop doing that? It makes you look like an ass and also that nothing you say can be taken seriously. Really, you use that crazy-emote in every post you make.
    HA!

    Drive you "NUTS"?

    I don't think AC would be here if it weren't for Thief. Didn't Thief invent the "stealth" tech? I could be wrong about that though, I admit.
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

  5. #30
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    New? I don't think they should copy that, hopefully they (developers) think that to. It wouldn't be "new" if T4 copied that. Besides, would AC even be here if it weren't for T1?

    Believe this: They're going to come up with something awesome, because that's what they do. The standards of todays games on any platform are very high. Those developers were raised in a video gaming world and have had ideas, wishes, & dreams for video games since they were kids playing atari, nintendo, whatever. Now they have a chance to make them come true & they're going to do just that. They'll have something new & they're just not telling you yet.
    There is no harm to see a good idea and to adapt it. That is called development.
    And I don't believe they have very good ideas. Don't fool yourself.
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  6. #31
    --

  7. #32
    Look what they did with Dues, they did an awesome job. Why doubt what they're going to do with Thief?
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

  8. #33
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    Yeah very good job, forced 3rd poerson, yellow highlights. Anyway, I couldn't know before I play, neither you.
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  9. #34
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    I don't think AC would be here if it weren't for Thief. Didn't Thief invent the "stealth" tech? I could be wrong about that though, I admit.
    Thief invented player's visibility to enemies that was based on light. Metal Gear and the original Castle Wolfenstein were all about being in cover from enemies' vision. In Thief you could for the first time use darkness in a realistic way. Thief also created realistic AI hearing.

    But those things are nowhere to be found in AC. Thief and AC are nothing alike. These 2 games have the same amout of stuff in common as a car and a shopping trolley. Both have 4 wheels and you can transport things with them, and that's about it.

  10. #35
    If T4 copied that, then the whole world would know they copied it... bad idea...
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

  11. #36
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    No, what is bad is your arguement.
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  12. #37
    I wouldn't mind this being an evasive option, but it might have to be linked to thinks like timing (how long were you out of the guard's vision?) lighting, how many folks are around, etc. It would be cool to run from an alley into a tavern and plop down into a chair and just sit there, then have the guard come rushing in and look for you. Maybe you would get noticed if you had no drink at your table, maybe if you were swift enough you could swipe a mug and set it down in front of you as though you've been there for some time.

    I never played AC, but it seems like a logical way to try to give pursuers the slip. I like the idea of whipping around a corner into a group of merchants and having to drop from run to walk, hoping a guard bypasses you. But, then, if I did get seen I failed in my first attempt at being a pro thief, and if a guard were after me I would look for a way in/out/up/down in the shadows before stopping by an apple cart.
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  13. #38
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    I'd rather lose guards in crowds by having the crowds slow them or obfuscate their view of me to the point I could escape, as opposed to suddenly blending in for no real reason. Crowds should be an obstacle akin to a door being closed between you and your pursuer- and seriously, how can someone ignore the man in the bright white robes walking in the group of peasants?

    Anyways, I don't see this as being used much - it may not even be worth working on unless there's alot more out door during the day time than there usually is.
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  14. #39
    Originally Posted by Hypevosa
    I'd rather lose guards in crowds by having the crowds slow them or obfuscate their view of me to the point I could escape, as opposed to suddenly blending in for no real reason. Crowds should be an obstacle akin to a door being closed between you and your pursuer- and seriously, how can someone ignore the man in the bright white robes walking in the group of peasants?

    Anyways, I don't see this as being used much - it may not even be worth working on unless there's alot more out door during the day time than there usually is.
    Is there a reason why the blend feature should be implemented like it was in AC? I have seen no-one suggest so. People just assume so cause it is done that way in AC - not able or willing to see any different options to implementing a crowd-blending feature, save for the one that was used in the particular game.
    In Thief "press x to blend" kind of blending would feel utterly generic. It should be a dynamic action instead of being bound under some specific key, as you described.

    What comes to your question, I have no explanation on how a character wearing such distinguishable robes as the one in AC could go unnoticed by anyone.

    I think Thief 4 should compile the best aspects of stealth. Be it social stealth or play with light and shadow. Of course, primary emphasis should be upon what Thief originally was - light and shadow.
    ~You reap what you sow~

  15. #40
    Originally Posted by Hamadriyad
    Crowds mean money, think again. and I am sure some good scenarios can be found.
    Not meaning to sound like a jerk about it here

    But I simply don't agree, the chasing and blending part of AC is stupid as well if you ask me. It's one of those features that makes people go "AMMA GAWD THAT IS SO COOL YA NOW, LIKE, NEVAH SEEN IT BEFORE." Doing it once is sort of cool, but just like with everything else in AC it gets tedious after a while, I don't see why we need an option in Thief to blend in with the crowds. And as the AI in AC is horrendous it just makes everything so easy, there's no real challenge if you can just stand amongst people that sort of look like you to escape, and what people sort of look like Garrett? Keepers? Meh, I don't know.

    There aren't any good scenarios really, it could be used in the city amongst many people, probably in broad daylight, which is rather stupid and not so thiefy. A nightclub...? At a Master-Thief convention perhaps? I don't know really.

    I'll be expecting a Thief where, if there are crowds, I can easily avoid even being laid an eye upon. I mean, I'm taking on the role as the greatest thief the world has never seen. I don't want to go all touchy with random strangers in a crowd to escape some lobotomized guards who don't even know what they're looking for.

    Oh and also, if this feature would actually be added. I'd reckon that you'd have to try it out in some sort of tutorial, as well as actually having a constant use of it. What's the point in coding that AI behaviour if you're never going to use it? Or only once? It would, if implemented, be something that you can use throughout the game, the designers and programmers would have to take all this into consideration and everything would be just heading in the wrong direction really.
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  16. #41
    Also not trying to be a jerk, just pointing out:

    Originally Posted by TheJoker
    But I simply don't agree, the chasing and blending part of AC is stupid as well if you ask me. It's one of those features that makes people go "AMMA GAWD THAT IS SO COOL YA NOW, LIKE, NEVAH SEEN IT BEFORE." Doing it once is sort of cool, but just like with everything else in AC it gets tedious after a while, I don't see why we need an option in Thief to blend in with the crowds. And as the AI in AC is pretty bad it just makes everything so easy, there's no real challenge if you can just stand amongst people that sort of look like you, and what people sort of look like Garrett? Keepers? Meh, I don't know.
    This was just what I meant. There's this idea that Garrett could go unnoticed in crowds, inspired by what we saw in AC. Now, that doesn't mean we should copy the feature as it is in AC, but to make suggestions how it would work in Thief.

    There aren't any good scenarios really, it could be used in the city amongst many people, probably in broad daylight, which is rather stupid and not so thiefy. A nightclub...? At a Master-Thief convention perhaps? I don't know really.
    I wouldn't mind one (1) mission that took place in broad day-light, on the streets of the City (cause hey, that has never happened in Thief this far). Also, it could go in a mission that took place during a party. I also think streets should be more populated during night time as well. There could be areas in the City which would serve as a hub for low-lives, bustling even during little hours. I think there could be plenty room for this kind of feature.
    ~You reap what you sow~

  17. #42
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    Originally Posted by Nightwynd

    This was just what I meant. There's this idea that Garrett could go unnoticed in crowds, inspired by what we saw in AC. Now, that doesn't mean we should copy the feature as it is in AC, but to make suggestions how it would work in Thief.
    Yes, that's what I am trying to say from the beginning. Blending in AC may be stupid, but it doesn't mean it will be like that in Thief.

    Originally Posted by Nightwynd
    I wouldn't mind one (1) mission that took place in broad day-light, on the streets of the City (cause hey, that has never happened in Thief this far). Also, it could go in a mission that took place during a party. I also think streets should be more populated during night time as well. There could be areas in the City which would serve as a hub for low-lives, bustling even during little hours. I think there could be plenty room for this kind of feature.
    Exactly. We have no broad daylight missions, or a mission in a crowded place. It may bring a fresh air to Thief. I never said, it should be a new feature that we can use all the time. Just some difference.Anyone played Prince of Persia Two Thrones before? There is a mission that we drive a horse. Then we never drive a horse again. I loved that mission. It was different and fun.
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  18. #43
    I don't know, a crowd would probably ruin that "loner" feeling of the game. Even a simple servant or someone like that gave me a heart attack. In crowds there wouldn't be tension.

  19. #44
    Originally Posted by Hypevosa
    Crowds should be an obstacle akin to a door being closed between you and your pursuer-
    This gave me an idea. It would be cool to create obstacles to block doors permanently (because in T1-2 crates were not really useful for that). Anyone played Amnesia or Penumbra? That sort of thing.

  20. #45
    Originally Posted by Hamadriyad
    No, what is bad is your arguement.
    I don't agree...

    The crowds in Thief aren't big enough for this. And most of the time they're trying to kill you (or each other).

    Just turn around & throw a flash bomb if you're getting chased (or run, or climb a wall). Save the blending for mixing margaritas. They shouldn't copy what another stealth game tried to do while trying to be as good as THIEF (and failed imo). It just wouldn't work for Garrett.
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

  21. #46
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    They shouldn't copy what another stealth game tried to do while trying to be as good as THIEF (and failed imo).
    It'd be like Indiana Jones 4, that movie seemed to borrow ideas from derivatives and cheap imitations of the first three movies. That's a f4il.

  22. #47
    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    They shouldn't copy what another stealth game tried to do
    Assassin's Creed wasn't a stealth game. That's why I really dislike it when the two are compared with each other.

    Crowds? Daylight mission? In Thief? No way.

  23. #48
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    Originally Posted by cGREGgo
    I don't agree...

    The crowds in Thief aren't big enough for this. And most of the time they're trying to kill you (or each other).

    Just turn around & throw a flash bomb if you're getting chased (or run, or climb a wall). Save the blending for mixing margaritas. They shouldn't copy what another stealth game tried to do while trying to be as good as THIEF (and failed imo). It just wouldn't work for Garrett.
    Sure you don't.
    I am going to post even though I know you won't understand.
    The crowds weren't big enough for this. Most of the time, they were trying to kill Garrett, and this should be improve, because this is just stupid, why they trying to kill -or run from- somebody they don't know? I am just walking like you, why are you yelling? "Thieeef, help mee!" Geez!
    About the copying you insist so badly, I am not talking about copying, I am talking about inspiring and improving. Thief didn't copy stealth from Metal Gear, it took it, improve it, and turned to something new. Copy that?
    Good night! -or whatever the time it is in your country.-


    Originally Posted by Izztyrr
    Crowds? Daylight mission? In Thief? No way.
    I strongly recommend you to play Ashen Age. It is a FM, it is broad light and it is awesome!
    "Not all shadows are cast by light, some are cast by darkness."

  24. #49
    Originally Posted by Hamadriyad
    I strongly recommend you to play Ashen Age. It is a FM, it is broad light and it is awesome!
    Okay, I'll give it a try.

  25. #50
    Originally Posted by Hamadriyad
    Sure you don't.
    I am going to post even though I know you won't understand.
    The crowds weren't big enough for this. Most of the time, they were trying to kill Garrett, and this should be improve, because this is just stupid, why they trying to kill -or run from- somebody they don't know? I am just walking like you, why are you yelling? "Thieeef, help mee!" Geez!
    About the copying you insist so badly, I am not talking about copying, I am talking about inspiring and improving. Thief didn't copy stealth from Metal Gear, it took it, improve it, and turned to something new. Copy that?
    Good night! -or whatever the time it is in your country.-
    Where do I begin?

    I do understand, we just don't see eye to eye on it & will have to agree to disagree I suppose.

    YES, the crowds in T3 did know Garrett, he had "wanted" posters up all over town! That's why city folks would go running for city watch screaming "There he is!" (or did you not get that in the game?).

    And get real on this "blending"... You know, I know, everyone knows... if T4 copied (or are "inspired" as you say) with this "blending" you're hyped up all about, the game will be an "epic fail". Websites all over the internet that rate games will shoot a fire arrow (haha) at it & watch it go down in flames. I don't think they'll use the word "inspired" no matter how inspiring your remarks may be, I think they'll use "copied".
    Wake me up when Thief 4 is released!

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