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Thread: Dog Days in the media

Dog Days in the media

  1. #651
    Ok, read it...not much that we didn't know, wasn't it?

  2. #652

    Arrow

    *you want it?* ...

    It was , once again , more about 'what' he was saying , doesn't have to make it new ... ... though , to me , some of the formation of his ideas are 'new' ...
    That or i didn't paid enough attention before , but i doubt it ...

    We always thought [Kane & Lynch] could be an interesting new franchise, especially the characters and the universe around it,” says Karsten Lund, game director at IO. We feel an important part of what we do is create franchises and expand upon them.
    So now we know that Shanghai is the worst place on earth ...
    Powerful corporate men and government officials are corrupt and crime affiliated ... and often asian ...
    Lynch and Kane are still *** loosers ...
    They are not alone (the expats) ...

    Interestingly , the idea of the 'expats' was the least explored scenario in Dog Days , despite being a equivalent of a militia of Lynch and Kane sibblings ...

    Putting the "2" in the title should stand something ...

    So two things can happen now for Kane & Lynch III :
    either we get No story at all , and basically just make it another game with the psychos running around in exotic locations and shooting at things ...
    Or , we get a huge overload of story content , expansion of the universe , and so on ...

    Eventually Lynch and Kane are going to have an 'end' in this life of theirs , and i will not see this franchise milked into an undying saga unless each episode carried a equal amount of substance as the previous entry ...
    But with the example Dog Days is giving , i'm going to ask for the third game to be the final one ...

    Of course, you have to be adaptive and reactive to the world around you, so had Kane & Lynch performed poorly we might have reconsidered.
    That is an odd logic ...
    At least , it will be to one of the Freedom Fighter fans ...
    With the Mini Ninjas fan right behind ...
    And a whole armada of Hitman fans in the entire building ...

    It needs to come out of wanting to do it – otherwise it’s not going to be good – and then it needs to reflect what people want to buy.
    Which is exactly why Dog Days had an art style that made the huge majority of these 'people' calling the game Dog months before the game came out ...

    Meanwhile the folks who seems to be quite pleased about it , means us , are in this forum ... this same forum where ... Nothing happens between the game makers and its unhingely dedicated consumers ...

    We did two things: we read all the reviews and came up with a sort of… a feature matrix, I suppose you might call it, showing all the important features that didn’t get well reviewed. Then we made a shortlist of the top points that we wanted to try and address.
    This is kind of scary , because think about what they'll be doing for Kane & Lynch III ...

    "yeah let's take a look at Dog Days' reviews again" ...

    I don't even have to make up the rest ...

    IO should have just stick to themselves ...
    They Knew that Dead Men wasn't the game they wanted it to be , they didn't had the time to finish it , so finish it now ! they should have worked on it and finish it ! ...
    Not saying that they should have remade Dead Men , i'm saying Dog Days should have been the game they wanted Dead Men to be , albeit with a new setting and storyline of course ...

    What they end up doing is looking at the reviews (most of them being poorly misguided by the way) on a Unfinished Product , and based their new product on it ...

    It ... it just don't fit ...

    And hey , look at the brilliant result ! people , yes , the PEOPLE who seems to matter so much considered Dog Days to be either slightly better or flat out worst than Dead Men ...

    Great social experiment ...

    Oh sure sure sure you , me , and us here Still , by some incomprehensible force continues to appreciate the franchise ...

    So let's wait and see who they're going to listen to next time ...

    From the get-go, we wanted to make the game stand out – not just from the competition but also from the first title, so we had something new to offer that wasn’t just more of the same.
    Well that worked ...
    Some may call it a tad bit too 'extreme' , but it worked , if that's what they really wanted ...

    The research confirmed IO’s suspicions: players were far happier when Kane and Lynch were cutting a swathe through the streets, skyscrapers and nightclubs of Tokyo than in Havana dressed in military fatigues.
    True , the thoughts in this community weren't so different ...

    “That’s what we liked ourselves,” says Lund. “I think the characters fit better than in the military setting. I mean, the whole military thing, you can go to a lot of places to get that. We need to bring something only we can deliver.”
    Which is exactly why during the last act of Dog Days Lynch and Kane mowed down entire garrisons of soldiers and elite task forces ...

    But hey ! at least this time the duo aren't dressed in military fatigues ! yeah , they're dressed like tourists ! ...


    See , now i don't even know whether i should be laughing or twitching ...

    The intervention of the military in Dog Days , and the fact that Lynch and Kane still managed to get away with it ... could have worked intelligently , as a cathartic exposition where even the most out-of-luck , foolish and ugly bastards were of such strength that nothing , Nothing in society could stand in their way to escape the harsh madness of reality ....
    It could have been something that isn't laughable , unfortunately it is ...

    I don't even know why the some of us is still criticizing Kyle Ward's script for the Kane & Lynch movie , because we just *** played it ! ...

    The third act of Dog Days just showed how stupid this is going to be ...
    Two men , blowing up ... and that's about it ...
    Pop corn entertainment , and the pop corn isn't even for free ! ...

    Had Lynch and Kane died , or at least succomb and past out due to their injuries then i might have second thoughts about it ...
    But without any dramatic notions to back it up , this is defendless ...

    The Havana section in Dead Men made sense , it was a way of showing just how egotistical and selfish Kane is towards his own sense of morality ; hundreds of rebels goes to die for him , Kane doesn't care , they were meat shields , tools of distraction , the civil war tipped in favor of the rebels not because of some man with a true patriotic belief , no , this man just wanted to kill some people to protect his own image of being a good father ...

    ...

    Hot damn , i never knew i liked that Havana part so damn much ...
    And the jungle sections were there to emphesize on the entering to the heart of darkness (which is where the game eventually ends on the river) ...
    I do have complains to make on the gameplay which was really in the jungle and the hacienda ... but they didn't had time to finish up the game ! ...

    So they should have worked on it , make it better next time , not toss it around and say "nah , they didn't liked the military thing , maybe we had something better in mind but screw it" ...

    I mean it's true , when a cake looks distasteful it doesn't necessarily mean that its ingredients are bad , maybe it's just the presentation that was kind of messed up ... so , a new cake can always be baked again with the same old ingredients ... no ? ...

    ...

    Oh crap , now you're going to say that same logic can be applied to Dog Days ...

    Well fine , fine ! no really , if they can bake another identical cake , but without having it melt after putting it on the table , then i'll blow up a whole continent just to show my excitement on how i could finally die knowing my life was entertained ...


    That exageration came out wrong , me thinks ...

    “Lynch is unique, and unlike anything we’ve tried before,” says Lund. “In the name of providing a fresh take and a fresh angle on the same franchise, that was an obvious choice. Every time we mentioned it when we started concepting, it always brought smiles to people’s faces – that had to mean something. It also allowed us to revamp the game mechanics to fit him.”
    I say that it still wasn't pushed enough into the fact that we're playing as a medicated psychopath , that and the fact that Lynch's story as a lead character happens to be a copy paste of Kane's crusade ...
    But oh well , let's just say they didn't quite realized it while making the game ...

    It’s hard to let a phrase like “revamping the game mechanics” slip by without further questioning, but Lund wasn’t prepared to reveal too many details. In Dead Men’s offline co-op mode, the second player would assume control of Lynch, and all of the baggage that came with it. Occasionally, Lynch would experience a psychotic lapse: every NPC would appear as a police officer, some wearing grotesquely over-sized animal heads. The player momentarily lost the ability to differentiate enemies from innocents. The only option was to shoot back, wait for the veil of insanity to lift, and be confronted with the reality of the situation.
    Now that part was absolutely Golden ...

    No no not the description of what playing as Lynch in Dead Men was like , but this ...

    "Lund wasn’t prepared to reveal too many details"

    Because ... There ... Weren't ... ANY ! ...


    Oh , you mean the fact of changing the entire game into a arcade like shooter ? ...

    Well it's the same on all three types :
    It's the same when playing as Lynch ...
    Same as Kane ...
    Same as the Expats ...

    However, with Lynch taking centre-stage in Dog Days, his mental instability has become a core consideration for the gameplay. “Of course, you can’t have him go around doing stuff you didn’t tell him to,” says Lund. “In order to maintain a solid gameplay experience you also need that sense of control, but the scenarios and the storyline and everything that unravels around him is…[pause] We wanted to make a game where the gameplay elements and what you’re actually doing revolve around the desperation and intensity of being in a position like his.
    You know , this would work quite well had the surprisingly large number of soldiers you had to shoot down only appeared in Lynch's mind , as an emphesis on his perception of being constantly persecuted ...

    But it appears that Kane is sharing the same point of view ...

    So ...
    Either Lynch and Kane are in fact one and the same person and this is just a personality dissociative order situation ...
    Or , the gorilla did it ...

    “Gameplay is essentially about choices, and reacting to whatever the game throws at you. We wanted the player to be in a position where they’re pinned down, and feel that desperate measures must be taken to get through the game. I think that ties the whole thing together. It’s Lynch: this is how he sees the world, and the world is attacking him.”
    Again , Kane sees the world just like Lynch does ...
    Maybe something happened in the past three years and Kane submited to the cracks that appeared in his own sanity ...

    But then , if that's the case , then why make it all so personnal of putting Lynch as the default main playable character ? ...

    You're putting Lynch on the center stage , You Are putting the character that was so unique and special on the foreground , You had the silver platter You Yourselves Created And You Blew It ! ...

    Who the was i playing as ? some guy who wears glasses at night and screams around even when he isn't getting shot at and ... who the is this ? the local street hobo ? it sure as wasn't the same 'Lynch' they unleashed in Dead Men , hell , it wasn't even the same Lynch i saw in the CG trailers ! ...
    Why didn't they left Kane as a choosable character to play , that way it would kept a lot of angry fans calm , especially considering there was really no need to make a riot afterall ...

    Wait ... what did i say ? ...
    "the silver platter You Yourselves Created" ? ...

    Oh ... right ... as far as i remember , He wasn't the one who created Lynch , or Kane for that matter ...

    Well that shows a lot ... and a good waste of opportunity ...


    ...

    I did enjoyed Dog Days ... i enjoyed it alot , a bit too much i think ...
    As a game it did proved to be more satisfying than Dead Men ever was , especially basing on my last playthrough on both games ... but it still isn't quite there yet ... and there wasn't enough of it ...
    And as you see , most importantly , the story flew itself out of the window ...

    I don't see how it couldn't have been both : a substancial work on storyline and a mindless arcade shooter ...
    It really could have been both ...

    You see , had they flat out say in the beginning that this was going to be just a cover shooter with a decor-story , then we would have known what to expect ...

    But here he is making such a big deal about the rich direction the team is making for and what happened ? nothing ! ...

    Now you might actually be saying that it's My Fault if i hoped too much of it ...
    Thing is that i didn't ...

    You remember , i was pessimistic as hell for Dog Days , and i didn't read any of these interviews and words from game director Karsten Lund , i've only read them After i played Dog Days ...
    Now i'm trying to imagine what people had in mind when they actually read all that before the game ever came out ...

    Why do you think the Kane & Lynch serie has always been associated with the notion of 'disappointment' ? because it is ! look at what they're introducing their product as being and look at the result ? a half baked cake ... for both games it was like that , except that once it was the left side of the cake that was missing , now it's the right side ...
    Are you really going to tell me that what Lund said is what we saw in the game ? ... I'm not asking for a hundred percent synchronisation of both what one's mind had and the end project itself , i'm asking for something remotely similar , which is only fair ...

    So , i also keep myself aware that my vision is flawed because of the nature of my mind ... but then i see that i am not alone on this matter , i might look like the only mad dog barking at all this but i am not being delirious ...
    And that helps ...

    But again and again i know that there will always be a logical argument to counter all my thoughts ...
    So , shoot me ...


    There’s always a difference between your vision and the final product. Don’t let anybody tell you otherwise – there always is, but it’s not a bad thing. It starts out as a vision in a single mind, and it turns into the collective effort of an entire team.
    Well i do agree , which is why i myself am taking so much time to finalize my concept for Kane & Lynch III with myselves ...
    The experience i have tooken on the past three months showed me a lot of how indeed it is to make sure that the vision we have in our mind can even alone be transcribed on paper without looking utterly grotesque , so re-writes and especially re-thinking are needed ... and perhaps in my case a bit too much , anywya , we'll see ...

    In this case, that was totally for the best. It has turned out so much better than I expected.
    Now i'm curious , just how bad was Lund's original idea for Dog Days ? ...
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  3. #653
    oooh ffs, here we go again.

    So two things can happen now for Kane & Lynch III
    Or not, maybe it'll be something different that you don't know about, much like you didn't predict DD to begin with.

    That is an odd logic ...
    At least , it will be to one of the Freedom Fighter fans ...
    With the Mini Ninjas fan right behind ...
    And a whole armada of Hitman fans in the entire building ...
    It's an odd only if you're interested in bankroupt the company and leave 200 more or less people without a job. You know, even DaVinci had to make money for a living.

    Which is exactly why Dog Days had an art style that made the huge majority of these 'people' calling the game Dog months before the game came out ...

    Meanwhile the folks who seems to be quite pleased about it , means us , are in this forum ... this same forum where ... Nothing happens between the game makers and its unhingely dedicated consumers ...
    Can't say that IOI has a great attention to the comunity myself...


    IO should have just stick to themselves ...
    They Knew that Dead Men wasn't the game they wanted it to be , they didn't had the time to finish it , so finish it now ! they should have worked on it and finish it ! ...
    Not saying that they should have remade Dead Men , i'm saying Dog Days should have been the game they wanted Dead Men to be , albeit with a new setting and storyline of course ...
    So it's odd to look for successfull formulas, but it's not good to try new things?
    Look, things are not as black and white as you make them, I think Lund(?) said it best in an interview, you have to listen to the criticism, but you also have to know when you have to stop listening and do your thing.

    Dead Men wasn't only an unfinished product, was also a really messy one from the beginning, DD isn't just a sequel that tries to have its own identity, it's also their way of doing the genre right. It's more streamlined, but works better as whole, K&L is their take on AAA games and you can tell that on DD they pushed it. The glacier engine never looked this good, and there whole production is better than anything they ever done before, it also comes with its own problems, I'm not denying that.

    Well that worked ...
    Some may call it a tad bit too 'extreme' , but it worked , if that's what they really wanted ...
    There there, now in a world full of unimaginative sequels you want to come here and pretend one?

    The intervention of the military in Dog Days , and the fact that Lynch and Kane still managed to get away with it ... could have worked intelligently , as a cathartic exposition where even the most out-of-luck , foolish and ugly bastards were of such strength that nothing , Nothing in society could stand in their way to escape the harsh madness of reality ....
    It could have been something that isn't laughable , unfortunately it is ...
    Was it also laughable when in DM they escaped all the cops in the USA after a butchery in a bank and riots in the streets? escaped in a subway no less, at least a plane isn't on tracks. What about the Tokyo streets then? What about the Mizuki? Come on now, if you look at it too closely nothing makes too much sense in K&L, after all it is inspired by action movies, with a tendency to the drama of course, but it's still an action packed thing.

    It's the suspension of disbelief right there, and for you doesn't work because you're looking for it; there's something here about bad game design, but it's too long and pointless so I'll skip it.

    I say that it still wasn't pushed enough into the fact that we're playing as a medicated psychopath , that and the fact that Lynch's story as a lead character happens to be a copy paste of Kane's crusade ...
    But oh well , let's just say they didn't quite realized it while making the game ...
    Now if it would've been something entierly different you would've pointed out how there are no parallelism with Kane's story, wouldn't you

    Well it's the same on all three types :
    It's the same when playing as Lynch ...
    Same as Kane ...
    Same as the Expats ...
    You know , this would work quite well had the surprisingly large number of soldiers you had to shoot down only appeared in Lynch's mind , as an emphesis on his perception of being constantly persecuted ...

    But it appears that Kane is sharing the same point of view ...

    So ...
    Either Lynch and Kane are in fact one and the same person and this is just a personality dissociative order situation ...
    Or , the gorilla did it ...
    Again , Kane sees the world just like Lynch does ...
    Maybe something happened in the past three years and Kane submited to the cracks that appeared in his own sanity ...

    But then , if that's the case , then why make it all so personnal of putting Lynch as the default main playable character ? ...
    Same on DM then, the whole style was Kane's desolation, so why was it the same when playing Lynch? or in multiplayer? Because that would've taken three times longer to develop, that's why. Also it's not just the way the charcters see the world, it also becomes the theme of the game.

  4. #654

    Unhappy

    It's an odd only if you're interested in bankroupt the company and leave 200 more or less people without a job.
    So making a sequel to their worst rated game instead of the more demanded ones is the right way in keeping them in the business...

    If this is all so dandy then this industry isn't so bad, far from it...
    now in a world full of unimaginative sequels you want to come here and pretend one?
    The problem is that in this case, everyone, including IO, actually Wanted More of the Same...
    if you look at it too closely nothing makes too much sense in K&L,
    It's the suspension of disbelief right there, and for you doesn't work because you're looking for it
    You have no idea just how helpful that enlightenment was for me and my baby Kane & Lynch III plot pitch...

    Man Hugs und Kisses...
    Now if it would've been something entierly different you would've pointed out how there are no parallelism with Kane's story, wouldn't you
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  5. #655

    Unhappy

    Actually no, i wanted it to be something completely different...

    It's "Kane" & "Lynch", two separate entities, they're not united under one banner, they're not called "The Hobos" for instance...
    Same on DM then, the whole style was Kane's desolation, so why was it the same when playing Lynch?
    Actually it was different... mostly due to the little details with the audio flashbacks and the psychotic visions, but at least, despite playing the same game, you knew when you were playing as Lynch and when as Kane...

    In Dog Days it makes no difference...
    It's even easier to tell thanks to the shift to Kane in the end...
    Asside from the Pause menu stating who are you playing as, the game does nothing to differentiate Kane from Lynch...
    Perhaps it was intentional, showing us how close they need to be to survive this predicament, but...
    Because that would've taken three times longer to develop, that's why.
    ...

    ...

    I know, it's true...

    No money, no time...

    it
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  6. #656

    Question

    GamerZone's "What went wrong for IO?s lovable pair of mischievous ragamuffins?" ...
    http://pc.gamezone.com/editorials/it..._2_-_dog_days/
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  7. #657

    Old

    i wish IOI can buy back Kane & Lynch !

  8. #658
    Originally Posted by jam13
    A translation/subtitles of this would be very, very helpful!
    "You see it too? For me, it's always like this..."
    (Angela Orosco - Silent Hill 2)

  9. #659

    Thumbs Up

    Speaking of old news ...

    This is one way to make a sales chart into a 'interesting' bit of news rather than just numbers ...
    http://www.gadgetsandgizmos.org/gami...m-toy-story-3/

    I mean the comparison is just ... whoa ...
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  10. #660
    i wish IOI can buy back Kane & Lynch !

  11. #661
    Originally Posted by gnrGrievous
    Apparently Dead Men was available for free for the PC users on GFWL Marketplace earlier today ...

    Must have been a glitch in the system because it's all back to normal now ...

    Which , depending on your individual sense of humor , could have been both a good and bad thing ...

    Dead Men was disappeared on gamesforwindows.com for a long time.
    i wish IOI can buy back Kane & Lynch !

  12. #662

    Lightbulb

    i wish IOI can buy back Kane & Lynch !

  13. #663
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdVpkDUilCg
    off beat and funny review for dog days worth the watch only one crappy joke about sharks the rest pretty funny

  14. #664

    Thumbs Up

    Take a wild guess at who makes an appearance in GamesRadar's "ultimate hated character battle" ...

    http://www.gamesradar.com/f/gamesrad...29155921785014

    But since the appearance is full of genius , i won't even dare to spoil it , you all go on and facepalm all by yourselves ...

    Might not be the funniest cameo we are craving for , but still , it's genius ... ... ... in a semi-humiliating fashion ...
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  15. #665
    "You see it too? For me, it's always like this..."
    (Angela Orosco - Silent Hill 2)

  16. #666
    Why people that like the game always wake up when it's already dead?

  17. #667
    Ever heard of posthumous recognition?
    "You see it too? For me, it's always like this..."
    (Angela Orosco - Silent Hill 2)

  18. #668

    Question

    Well the fella makes sense... but... well, tell me something, did any one of you thought about Dog Days that way when you played it ?...
    Did the visual style really appeared to you as something this deep ?...

    Just wondering...
    Anywya, a few things...

    the two men convince themselves that if they can escape the country that things will somehow be all right.
    Well it always worked so far no?...
    You would think that being brutally tortured would be a wake up call for both men, but that isn't the case.
    I was more disappointed by the total lack of difference in terms of gameplay, but whatever
    it's fascinating to see a game let its aesthetics do all (or nearly all) the talking
    I didn't saw it that way before, just not This deep
    Bravo sir!
    the result is a great exercise in nihilistic expressionism ? one that reminds us the worst trips through hell are the ones that are ultimately meaningless.
    ... but wasn't that what Dead Men was?
    Hi, i'm the one who makes Wall of Text Armadas in a unhinged regular fashion.
    If you remember me, best start taking your pills again.

  19. #669
    Originally Posted by gnrGrievous
    did any one of you thought about Dog Days that way when you played it ?...
    Of course not. Nobody did. Not even the dev's, I'm sure.

    Usually interpretations such as these spawn from fans that see something they want to see. For instance, I can also come up with some fancy theory explaining the final boss of Dog Days (y'know, the two dogs), doesn't mean it's a valid one.

    However, yes, Dog Days is a descent into hell but there's no need to be overanalytical as it's obvious from the very start of the game... Sometimes it's just better to read between the lines and leave it for what it is.
    "You see it too? For me, it's always like this..."
    (Angela Orosco - Silent Hill 2)

  20. #670
    Gaming's Most Notorious Anti-Heroes

    Here are gaming's top 25 anti-heroes a player can control (in no particular order), fighting the bad fight for all the wrong reasons...

    The Game Comics: Kane and Lynch

    Spoiler Warning

    The funny thing is, unlike the games, on the comics page Kane and Lynch come off as... likable.

    Some love for Lynch
    The Top 7… Mentally damaged characters we love



    Co-Optimus
    Good Co-Op. Bad Co-Op. Kane and Lynch 2 Short
    i wish IOI can buy back Kane & Lynch !

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