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Surfrider
13th Jul 2009, 23:29
Sorry if this has already been covered or if there's an official thread for little rants like this but I didn't see one.

First of all I have to give the standard intro, love Batman, love how this game looks, think this game will be the best Batman game ever yadda yadda. However there's just one thing that has me really worried about the direction they're taking this game.

It's the bats, the bats that fly out of Batman's cape and up at the screen everytime he silently incapacitates a bad guy. They cheapen the whole thing and make it far more arcade like. I hate when games have a brilliant immersive atmosphere and then ruin it by throwing in some real videogame cliche like giant floating orbs of light or number of points earned popping up over an enemy's head after they've been hit. I can't help but feel the magical bats flying out of Batman's cape and into the screen will have that same effect, effectively shouting at you 'YOU'RE PLAYING A VIDEOGAME, THIS ISN'T REAL'. It's really one step above having enemies flash and disappear after being killed.

I can handle the cartoony lightning flashes over an enemy's head when they're about to attack from behind, I'd prefer something a little more subtle but I'm sure there are fights in the game when you'll be thankful it's such a noticeable indicator. I just don't see what possible good can come from having all these supernatural bats fly out of Batman's cape after he knocks someone out. Batman isn't magic, he's not some ghost lord of bats or something. It's as silly an idea as having him knocked into pieces and reassembling himself T1000 style or firing Hadoukens at his enemies. It just ruins the immersive feel of being Batman, a regular human being in an advanced costume.

After seeing that Batman could be killed by a few hard blows to the head or a short burst of gunfire I was really excited that this would be the game that finally understood Batman's humanity and lack of any actual superpowers is an essential component of his coolness. You might think I'm overreacting about a seemingly small element that doesn't affect the gameplay but I come from the angle of being a movie buff and I look for a good immersive experience in games. I feel that games have to drop all of these old cliche aspects if they're ever truly going to challenge movies or music as actual forms of art and not just hobbies.

I'm just a little worried that the developers might have spent a little too long trying to improve this game and added all kinds of little flashes and garish effects that take the game into overkill and ruin it's original intention. Anyway, that's my two cents (or considering how long this rant is it probably adds up to being my 2000 dollars). I'm not insulting the game, I'm not threatening to boycott the game. I'm not crying my eyes out. Thanks for reading all of this if you have but before you respond, remember that I'm looking forward to this game just as much as you are. I just want to make sure they don't ruin it.

LoboUDL
13th Jul 2009, 23:34
I pretty much agree to an extent. It was neat to see a few times but I was over it pretty fast. I hope there's an option to turn it off. If not, I can live with it.

CapedCrusader1495
13th Jul 2009, 23:35
I don't even know why they put the Bats there. They look kinda tacky. I can live with it though, I just didn't know Batman had an instant supply of Bats that fly out of his ***! :rasp:

Dark Cape
13th Jul 2009, 23:37
I can see what your saying but i kind of like it. As it represents the XP that your gaining, i believe its a good substitute for number flashing above your head.

MCREF
13th Jul 2009, 23:37
Wow. Pretty ambitious for a first post. I agree with you on some points (good points by the way) but the game is pretty much done and seeing as the release was already pushed back before I will suffer no fools. Take that!:

:poke:

lol. Really though, game's almost done so any complaint no matter how valid is basically talking to the wind at this point. I don't like the bat thing or the lines when he kicks or punches much, but I'm not bothered by it. Hopefully you wont be either when you actually pick up the controller and play this for an hour or so.

Nino9LFC
13th Jul 2009, 23:43
Good Point The Bats Should Be Removed

EliteF50
13th Jul 2009, 23:44
I disagree completely. I love the Bats.

Disco Phantasm
13th Jul 2009, 23:54
I dislike the tacky bat crap too but who says you can't immerse yourself into something just because it's unreal. o_0

How awful if you think that!

Sterlington
13th Jul 2009, 23:57
Perfect the way it is.. how esle will you know when youve earned exp.?

KnowHowIGotTheseScars?
13th Jul 2009, 23:58
I like the bats

brodudeman1
14th Jul 2009, 00:01
I also agree. With the bats flying out of his cape wouldn't the goon with no peripheral vision next to the guy you just knocked out even notice the swarm of bats going buy him, lol. Even with that I am still really looking foward to this game.

CapedCrusader1495
14th Jul 2009, 00:02
Perfect the way it is.. how esle will you know when youve earned exp.?

It could pop in the corner saying something like +*insert number here* XP.

Why So Serious ?
14th Jul 2009, 00:06
nah they should leave it as it is, if not we will never get the game if they keep making chnages

KnowHowIGotTheseScars?
14th Jul 2009, 00:24
I like them they ... it makes me think of Batman Returns (my 2nd favorite Batman movie) ... When the title come up

38 secs*

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h2fhhAZmF9Y

Batfan22
14th Jul 2009, 00:46
I dont like them but i dont dislike them either, im more concerned with thugs with no peripheral vision like brodudeman 1 mentioned

WallaMalla
14th Jul 2009, 00:53
I think the bats are cool, don't be such a nitpicker :rasp:!

Sterlington
14th Jul 2009, 01:04
It could pop in the corner saying something like +*insert number here* XP.

Too much like the new transformers game which got annoying.

brodudeman1
14th Jul 2009, 01:05
I dont like them but i dont dislike them either, im more concerned with thugs with no peripheral vision like brodudeman 1 mentioned


Yeah, I can see Batman being able to pull off something like that but just not at that angle. like I said though still looks like an awsome game.

robinsnotstupid
14th Jul 2009, 01:06
i agree, the bats break the imersion factor for me too and kinda hurt the whole this is what it would be like to be batman feeling.

maybe we can turn them off like some games let you turn of the hitpoints that float out of an enemy when you hit them.

vulcanraven213
14th Jul 2009, 02:11
for everyone who likes something their is someone who hates it. you cant please everyone in this world. for the record I like the bats.

Zombie-Gamer
14th Jul 2009, 02:20
When your busy kickin' ass you probably won't really notice and if you do you'll probs be more worried about Bane or Killer Croc about to rip you in half :D

Sivart
14th Jul 2009, 02:22
I like the bats. They tell me when someone is down and out. And I understand that a man dressing up as a bat-ninja fighting crime and surviving through everything as well as having unofficial police support is about as realistic as an alien coming to Earth as a baby and developing superpowers because of the solar radiation Earth recieves. So, a few bats does nothing to my already prepared suspension of belief.

scarecrow22
14th Jul 2009, 02:56
you make some great points homee but it probably wont bother me
thats just me though...
and Sivart im pretty sure batman is a tiny bit more realistic than that

PS3/PSPGamer7
14th Jul 2009, 02:57
Yes I too do not like the bats, sadly there is nothing going to be done about it :( Its not game breaking and I'll still get it, but it just doesn't fit, same with the whole rain thing but I won't start that here

Sivart
14th Jul 2009, 03:04
and Sivart im pretty sure batman is a tiny bit more realistic than that

I'm pretty sure ANYONE would've been shot within the first year, or taken in by the police.

Bruce is inhumanly good at what he does. Borderline Metahuman. ;)

2seenot
14th Jul 2009, 03:08
I like the bats. They tell me when someone is down and out. And I understand that a man dressing up as a bat-ninja fighting crime and surviving through everything as well as having unofficial police support is about as realistic as an alien coming to Earth as a baby and developing superpowers because of the solar radiation Earth recieves. So, a few bats does nothing to my already prepared suspension of belief.

Lol, nice reference.

And I dont think the bats have any effect on me what-so ever, I plan on enjoying the game no matter what.

The_Hylden
14th Jul 2009, 03:56
It's not like the bats are meant to be really there. It's just a 4th wall visual clue to us, the player... The same can be said flor glowy orbs in Devil May Cry, or God of War. We just get bats, not glowy orbs:p

Flying fox
14th Jul 2009, 04:13
I agree, I mean...they could just circle around instead of the bat thing. There is a ton of cheeseorama in many games and it does not belong in Batman games. I have the same
problem with HP Lovecraft movies, for who Arkham is named in his honor.

Black sabbith102
14th Jul 2009, 05:12
I don't really mind too much. at least their trying to be original in some way. Its not like orbs or something lame like that.

DarkCrusader67
14th Jul 2009, 05:39
at least we dont have to run around and collect the damn bats after!

daklog
14th Jul 2009, 05:54
at least we dont have to run around and collect the damn bats after!

this is what is important, i'd rather have bats fly out of my cape instead of having to break the immersion completely and collect random orbs that only waste space on an active screen filled with other enemies that distract me from the gameplay. it's nice of the bats to wait while batman is beating on all of his foes to come out so they don't obstruct your beating them to a pulp

thedarknight2016
14th Jul 2009, 06:22
i actually like the bats i think it gives a piece of the character while playing it shows that hey im batman and this is the kinda cool **** i could do even though im just a human even if it takes an infintismal amount of realism from the gameplay i think its cool and not a problem

CaptainMcMulla
14th Jul 2009, 07:31
the bats swirling around the incapacitated enemies is awesome imo

thebatman226
14th Jul 2009, 07:36
The bats are okay, i dont mind them.
But theyll get annoying if it happens everytime you take someone out.

imported_The_Dark_Knight
14th Jul 2009, 07:46
I really like the bats.

GibsonSGBat
14th Jul 2009, 07:48
I personally thought the bats look cool! I heard somewhere that they seem to signify when you/that you have gained experiece.

Argel319
14th Jul 2009, 07:57
What bats? Lol, I seriously didn't know there were bats in Batman's cape.

Surfrider
14th Jul 2009, 08:21
Whoa, busy board. Most places you have to wait a day or two to get one reply. You're all actually using words and making points too rather than just telling me to 'stfu noob'. I'm freaked out.

If the bat thing only happens every now and then as a sort of a 'level up' signifier I wouldn't mind too much. It would just suck as someone else pointed out if it happens every time you perform a silent takedown or something.

I probably overstated it too, I don't desperately want this out of the game like it's a dealbreaker or something. It just feels to me like if you were reading the Arkham Asylum graphic novel and you found a page that had a bunch of lift up flaps or shiny holograms or something. Or let's say you're watching the opening bank robbery scene of The Dark knight and the joker lifts up his mask, says, 'Whatever doesn't kill you only makes you ... stranger' then laughs crazily and the scene ends with a big CGI clown face flying out of his mouth and swallowing the camera. You'd have to turn to the person next to you and say, 'That was a little .... unnecessary'.

It's not even specifically the bats it's more the feeling that the developers and programmers are showing off and adding all kinds of little bells and whistles to the game that it just doesn't need. Like the saying goes, the key to creating art is knowing when to say when. I just can't shake this image of them sitting at their computers bored after pushing back the deadline on an almost finished game, staring at the computer screen and suddenly jumping up in an inspired fit and shouting, 'I know, I'll make it so a bunch of bats fly out of Batman's tushy into the camera every time he takes someone down!' and then another person standing up and shouting, 'I know, I'll add a shiny blue aura to the batarangs! Then another, 'and I'll start work on adding collectible orbs! and so on and so on.

TheCaptain
14th Jul 2009, 08:53
Sorry if this has already been covered or if there's an official thread for little rants like this but I didn't see one.

First of all I have to give the standard intro, love Batman, love how this game looks, think this game will be the best Batman game ever yadda yadda. However there's just one thing that has me really worried about the direction they're taking this game.

It's the bats, the bats that fly out of Batman's cape and up at the screen everytime he silently incapacitates a bad guy. They cheapen the whole thing and make it far more arcade like. I hate when games have a brilliant immersive atmosphere and then ruin it by throwing in some real videogame cliche like giant floating orbs of light or number of points earned popping up over an enemy's head after they've been hit. I can't help but feel the magical bats flying out of Batman's cape and into the screen will have that same effect, effectively shouting at you 'YOU'RE PLAYING A VIDEOGAME, THIS ISN'T REAL'. It's really one step above having enemies flash and disappear after being killed.

I can handle the cartoony lightning flashes over an enemy's head when they're about to attack from behind, I'd prefer something a little more subtle but I'm sure there are fights in the game when you'll be thankful it's such a noticeable indicator. I just don't see what possible good can come from having all these supernatural bats fly out of Batman's cape after he knocks someone out. Batman isn't magic, he's not some ghost lord of bats or something. It's as silly an idea as having him knocked into pieces and reassembling himself T1000 style or firing Hadoukens at his enemies. It just ruins the immersive feel of being Batman, a regular human being in an advanced costume.

After seeing that Batman could be killed by a few hard blows to the head or a short burst of gunfire I was really excited that this would be the game that finally understood Batman's humanity and lack of any actual superpowers is an essential component of his coolness. You might think I'm overreacting about a seemingly small element that doesn't affect the gameplay but I come from the angle of being a movie buff and I look for a good immersive experience in games. I feel that games have to drop all of these old cliche aspects if they're ever truly going to challenge movies or music as actual forms of art and not just hobbies.

I'm just a little worried that the developers might have spent a little too long trying to improve this game and added all kinds of little flashes and garish effects that take the game into overkill and ruin it's original intention. Anyway, that's my two cents (or considering how long this rant is it probably adds up to being my 2000 dollars). I'm not insulting the game, I'm not threatening to boycott the game. I'm not crying my eyes out. Thanks for reading all of this if you have but before you respond, remember that I'm looking forward to this game just as much as you are. I just want to make sure they don't ruin it.

That's because it's NOT REAL and it IS A VIDEOGAME. I personally have no problem with the bats appearing. I know that this is only a game. Are you Batman? Do you have some secret pent up emotion toward this game. I really have nothing against the way that this game has been developed. I will have a problem if it's delayed again. I'm a little drunk so I'm sure you guys will make fun of me. First time poster, long time reader. I'm just trying to say I have no problem against the bats. Just don't delay the game again. Sorry I probably sound like a dumbass.

seth1138
14th Jul 2009, 09:41
If the bat thing only happens every now and then as a sort of a 'level up' signifier I wouldn't mind too much. It would just suck as someone else pointed out if it happens every time you perform a silent takedown or something.


I hope it only happens when Batman levels up, a bit like Wolverine does in the X-men Wolverine game were he glows and yells, but if this isn't the case it wont spoil the game for me.

morphman30
14th Jul 2009, 16:02
i wouldnt mind it happening every silent takedown. i think it is pretty cool!

TheJoker.
14th Jul 2009, 16:07
The bats look awesome.
To get rid of them would be awful, remove the bats and he is just:
Guy In a Black Cape With Gadgets and Ninja Skills - Not Batman

Joker's Jolly Jester
14th Jul 2009, 16:08
the bats are a nice effect but i understand why you may not like them also would you rather have bats or superman 64?

DarkKnightDanny
14th Jul 2009, 16:58
The bats look awesome.
To get rid of them would be awful, remove the bats and he is just:
Guy In a Black Cape With Gadgets and Ninja Skills - Not Batman

but we dont see it in the films?

do you see (insert batman actor here) as just a Guy In a Black Cape With Gadgets and Ninja Skills?.

i personally dont mind. i agree with what youre saying surfrider, to some extent

darrinwright
14th Jul 2009, 17:42
I can see your point about the bats... I guess I've just learned to ignore them in the vids I've seen. That may be different once I'm actually playing, but I don't think they'll be that big a deal. As far as losing the immersion, I already realize I'm playing a game when I find myself pushing a button to throw a punch. Maybe I just don't get as immersed as I should be.

The_Clown_Prince_Of_Crime
14th Jul 2009, 17:55
I agreed up until the point you said your being reminded that 'YOUR PLAYING A VIDEO GAME,IT ISN'T REAL'
You do know it isn't real don't you??I'm just saying that the last person who believed a game was real was an idiot who played Manhunt,couldn't tell the game from reality,went completely sideways & killed his best mate.Not a good one.Games are supposed to be an escape from reality,offering you the chance to do things you couldn;t in everyday existence.If you want reality I'd suggest picking up a copy of The Sims,plus it's much safer for all of us when you can't tell the game from reality

AdamWest
14th Jul 2009, 17:58
Instead of regular bat heads they need to put Keir's head on all the bats IMO

GibsonSGBat
14th Jul 2009, 17:59
Instead of regular bat heads they need to put Keir's head on all the bats IMO

Lol! that would be really cool!:D:lol:

robinsnotstupid
14th Jul 2009, 18:38
for everyone who likes something their is someone who hates it. you cant please everyone in this world. for the record I like the bats.

since some people are goign to like the bats, and some arent, why dont they make turning the bats off an option, so we can all be happy.

happy gamers spend money on downloadable content after all...

LoboUDL
15th Jul 2009, 02:50
That's because it's NOT REAL and it IS A VIDEOGAME. I personally have no problem with the bats appearing. I know that this is only a game. Are you Batman? Do you have some secret pent up emotion toward this game. I really have nothing against the way that this game has been developed. I will have a problem if it's delayed again. I'm a little drunk so I'm sure you guys will make fun of me. First time poster, long time reader. I'm just trying to say I have no problem against the bats. Just don't delay the game again. Sorry I probably sound like a dumbass.


At first I was thinking, what a douche. And then you said you were drunk...and I've been guilty of drunk mesageboarding too...so I'm right there with you. :D I was a long time reader first time poster the other day too. :)

KnowHowIGotTheseScars?
15th Jul 2009, 02:55
I think its HILARIOUS how people are upset with the XP bats saying it takes away from the realism of the game :lol::lol::lol: ...... oh and the giant crocodile, toxic infusion mammoth, and woman who can control giant plants DOESNT??? :lol::lol::lol:

akaWarMachine
15th Jul 2009, 03:03
^You must be from the same planet as me

The bats are cool, and I think they are related to XP or when you finish beating up all the baddies in an area. If you have trouble imagining that you are Batman and the video game feels unrealistic then, you are SOL because it is a video game about a fictional character. So either engineer a new console/computer with CryEngine 3 capabilities or smoke some bud.

stoobytoons
15th Jul 2009, 03:23
Okay. I'm gonna weigh in on this:

I think the bats are cool but only to an extent. My thoughts are that less is more. Really special takedowns or moves should be rewarded with the fireworks, and the minimal stuff should only be tallied under the radar. Too many bats can get distracting, and let's face it, a little annoying.
As far as the most recent "realism" argument, I'd say both sides are weak. Firstly, it's a game. Secondly, it's a game. Thirdly, it's a game. So, I hope that clears up my opinion. Have a nice day.

kadashi666
15th Jul 2009, 04:33
i like the bats idea as a level signifier, to point out when youve reached a new level, gives it a little bit more of a dark RPG element to it, and it IS something better then say orbs shooting out of enemies butts that you have to collect (looking at you dante...). however, when you beat any enemy bats swirl around them immediately and that can become annoying.

for example, the chattering teeth that you find in the game can be bateranged and destroyed, and when you do that little bats swirl around the remains of the teeth. i personally don't need bats to tell me when i have destroyed teeth, the fact that they stop chattering is enough for me!

i guese what im saying is, bats in moderation is a decent effect, but having them appear for every enemy just seems like its over done. i will be very happy if there is a toggle for the bats though, it will make up for the bats in its entirety if they do so.

akaWarMachine
15th Jul 2009, 04:37
Less is more...that sums it up perfectly.

cpmd4
15th Jul 2009, 20:06
I can see what your saying but i kind of like it. As it represents the XP that your gaining, i believe its a good substitute for number flashing above your head.

I agree. The bats are a much better way to show this than numbers or glowy orbs.

A Dark Hunter
15th Jul 2009, 20:15
In my opinion, the bats are helpful. They show when an enemy is KOed. That way you don't have to be like, "Ok, I've KOed everyone! Yes! I am the champio-CLANG!-oh crap I just got hit in the head with a pipe". That's why I think they are helpful. And who knows, maybe on a higher difficulty the bats won't be there. Just like the lightning bolts over the guards heads when they are about to attack you.

GibsonSGBat
15th Jul 2009, 20:16
I agree. The bats are a much better way to show this than numbers or glowy orbs.

Definately! glowy orbs in fable 2.....:mad2:

Billyman
16th Jul 2009, 01:38
I think the bats are better than the aforementioned glowing orbs...they go with the dark tone.

I always play games like how you said...pretending im in another world. I have no problem doing that with other games that have said cliches.

Billyman
16th Jul 2009, 01:39
I think its HILARIOUS how people are upset with the XP bats saying it takes away from the realism of the game :lol::lol::lol: ...... oh and the giant crocodile, toxic infusion mammoth, and woman who can control giant plants DOESNT??? :lol::lol::lol:

haha ain't that the truth!

MCREF
16th Jul 2009, 02:10
I already weighed in I'm just trying to get something clarified. I don't think the Bats are coming from Batman. They're coming from the fallen thugs. I'll find a vid to prove it but yeah that's my opinion until then.