PDA

View Full Version : Sin Bin?, Prison?, Noose?



Flashart
21st May 2009, 14:29
Should there be a prison like in TDS where you can get thrown if caught, or do you
just want a "Mission Fail" message.
If there's a freeroaming city it might be a good "extra" level to include there.
I also wondered about maybe 5 chances of getting caught, after each time the gallows in the city square gets built a little more, until on the 5th time.....

Corvin25
21st May 2009, 14:31
Should there be a prison like in TDS where you can get thrown if caught, or do you
just want a "Mission Fail" message.
If there's a freeroaming city it might be a good "extra" level to include there.
I also wondered about maybe 5 chances of getting caught, after each time the gallows in the city square gets built a little more, until on the 5th time.....

I've never heard of a dark fantasy world with a "5 strikes" system. No, I don't think this would work. If a secret "caught" level was included though, it shouldn't have any loot. It would be pretty silly if players TRIED to get caught just so they could escape.

LightWarriorK
21st May 2009, 14:55
This type of thing is pretty useless with the quicksaving/loading format Thief has always used. People will just reload rather than get sent to the prison.

Now.... I WOULD be in favor of a situation where a mission ends with Garrett (or whomever) being captured and put in jail, and the next mission being a breakout mission. But that would be pretty linear. In an open world game (IF they chose to make Thief 4 that way) you'd have to set it up where there's something in the prison Garrett wants, and he has to get captured in order to get inside and steal it (sort of like Cragsclef, but without the easy way in.)

hellwalker
21st May 2009, 15:06
Nah, it was not very well done in DS, and probably only other option would be GTA style "busting" and that would suck.

DarthEnder
21st May 2009, 15:29
Yeah, its a fantasy world, they aren't just gonna release you on bail when they catch you, they're gonna cut your hand off or some ****.

Blue Sky
21st May 2009, 15:45
I liked the idea of getting sent to prison in Deadly Shadows and it was a fun little side mission!

I still can't help thinking negatively towards the whole idea of an open city scenario, though, and would much prefer a set of missions.

Hypevosa
21st May 2009, 15:57
I never knew there was a prison? O.o but you do realize that with how notorious Garrett is they'd probably just hang him or kill him as quick as they could. I say if there is a system like this, you have one chance to be in and escape jail. After they realize they can't hold you, they really will just kill you on the spot. The only way I see around this would be if the Hammer's vouched for you one last time (you did destroy the trickster afterall) and maybe then you could get out of jail 2 times.

Espion
21st May 2009, 16:33
I never knew there was a prison?

Snap.

This is Garrett we're talking about. Why would they lock him up instead of kill him? They might as well tell him he's been a naughty boy and that he's not to do it again o_O

BlooferLady
21st May 2009, 16:46
Well, that's how it worked in TDS. You went to prison once, but after that they just killed you. I think it works, logically. A guard who catches the most wanted thief in the city alive would have a nice feather in his cap. It would give a lot of people satisfaction to try a man like Garrett. But once they realize their prison doesn't keep him in, it's just straight to the killing from then on.

I enjoyed breaking out of the prison. It made me happy to rub those guards' noses in their inadequate security. I'd be glad to see another prison break-out mission. Even if it is just once, like in TDS.

I don't know about in-mission jailings, though. Seems to me that any thug hired to patrol a hallway isn't going to be too concerned with collecting intruders. He's much more likely to just try and gut you.

Hypevosa
21st May 2009, 17:00
Well, that's how it worked in TDS. You went to prison once, but after that they just killed you. I think it works, logically. A guard who catches the most wanted thief in the city alive would have a nice feather in his cap. It would give a lot of people satisfaction to try a man like Garrett. But once they realize their prison doesn't keep him in, it's just straight to the killing from then on.

I enjoyed breaking out of the prison. It made me happy to rub those guards' noses in their inadequate security. I'd be glad to see another prison break-out mission. Even if it is just once, like in TDS.

I don't know about in-mission jailings, though. Seems to me that any thug hired to patrol a hallway isn't going to be too concerned with collecting intruders. He's much more likely to just try and gut you.

Actually, if we're talking about crime syndicates and thugs I can so see them attempting to extort Garrett for the location of his stash... Garrett HAS to have a rather extensive rainy day fund at this point.

GmanPro
21st May 2009, 17:37
I'd rather just keep to the traditions set by Dark Project and Metal Age. A trip to an even more epic prison would be a welcome mission in my book.

Direlord
21st May 2009, 17:42
Actually, if we're talking about crime syndicates and thugs I can so see them attempting to extort Garrett for the location of his stash... Garrett HAS to have a rather extensive rainy day fund at this point.

I dunno the way Garrett keeps having to be a thief since he seems to never have enough to pay his rent puts a damper on the whole rainy day fund.

TDS I intenionally got caught once just to see what the prison lvl was like and frankly i didn't like it. If there is going to be a prison mission make it more like from I think the first game where you have to break in get something or break someone out.

MasterTaffer
21st May 2009, 18:25
Snap.

This is Garrett we're talking about. Why would they lock him up instead of kill him? They might as well tell him he's been a naughty boy and that he's not to do it again o_O

Because they got cocky and wanted a public execution to show off the fact that they caught the legendary Master Thief. Cops get a big head about catching extremely wanted men.


Actually, if we're talking about crime syndicates and thugs I can so see them attempting to extort Garrett for the location of his stash... Garrett HAS to have a rather extensive rainy day fund at this point.

Except I would think at this point in Garrett's career, most other criminals would steer clear of Garrett. It would seem he would get a reputation after robbing Ramirez in his own counting room. Robbing a city crime warden in the locked up tight section of his own manor certainly would communicate, "If you screw with me, you're not safe anywhere."

And as far as I can tell from Thief TDP, Wardens are the biggest crime lords in the City. So if a warden can't take out or push Garrett around, why would a small stall of thieves think they would do any better?

Hypevosa
21st May 2009, 21:01
Except I would think at this point in Garrett's career, most other criminals would steer clear of Garrett. It would seem he would get a reputation after robbing Ramirez in his own counting room. Robbing a city crime warden in the locked up tight section of his own manor certainly would communicate, "If you screw with me, you're not safe anywhere."

And as far as I can tell from Thief TDP, Wardens are the biggest crime lords in the City. So if a warden can't take out or push Garrett around, why would a small stall of thieves think they would do any better?

You know how stupid people can be (especially in thief) and how cocky they can be. I don't think the major crime bosses wouldn't try anything ever again... especially if the reward outweighs the risks (i.e. Garrett has some awesome piece of loot), and especially if they felt they had their eyes on it first...

Thieffanman
22nd May 2009, 05:01
Keep it the way it was in TDS: Get caught once, get thrown in prison and break out :). Get caught twice, and you're just too stupid to live, let alone continue thieving ;).

--Thieffanman

Flashart
22nd May 2009, 09:02
I'm talking just about "freeroaming" areas but what about...
Caught 1: Police station Jail
Caught 2 Court House Jail
Caught 3: Prison
Caught 4: Execution

That way you could have incremental difficulty, and 3 "bonus" missions that you'd wouldn't have to play. The only problem with this is that it seems like a "reward" for failure, but I'm just thinking out loud.

Maethius
22nd May 2009, 15:03
I wouldn't favor the prison concept again for getting caught... I would favor a mission that involved Garrett getting caught and thrown in prison. Besides, in a game of "reload and retry" it would make the whole prison affair a moot point.

colouringbook
22nd May 2009, 15:07
I'm pretty sure guards and the like just try and kill Garret when they catch him being in the wrong place stealing stuff.

Espion
23rd May 2009, 10:33
I wouldn't favor the prison concept again for getting caught... I would favor a mission that involved Garrett getting caught and thrown in prison. Besides, in a game of "reload and retry" it would make the whole prison affair a moot point.

I'm not even sure I'd like a mission where Garrett gets caught, unless he's intentionally doing it as a way to get into the prison to retrieve something he needs. I enjoyed breaking into Cragscleft.

He's meant to be a Master Thief. If he gets unintentionally caught then he's not really the Master anymore. It kind of breaks the character.

Thievingtaffer
23rd May 2009, 10:45
It was fine in TDP. I don't like the idea of playing a Master Thief who gets caught...Mission Failed.

WVI
24th May 2009, 20:52
Pavelock Prison was great. Sure, bring on another.

Knight
6th Jun 2009, 21:14
Once a prison like in t3, and second a Death scene^^ When u die in a mission then Death too, but when u kill some1, while killing isnt allowed, then Mission Failed

Inspector Drept
7th Jun 2009, 01:06
I remember that I was having some trouble going back home after scaping the Keeper Coumpound.
I was getting owned by the Keeper Assassins. So I remember it right I decided to just get killed by the guards so that I would scape Pavelock Prison and be closer to home.

It was a bit of RPG too. Like Garrett thinking "I´m being hunted by super assassins. How I´m going to scape? Oh, I will get caught by the guards and scape the prison that is near home!"

DoomyDoomyDoomDoom
7th Jun 2009, 15:41
holy crap I feel stupid. I don't remember ever playing that prison escape thing in Deadly Shadows.

I just got killed on purpose and they sent me there. That was a neat little place. It was easy enough to sneak out, so before I left I decided to knock out all the guards and free the prisoners. Not that it means anything, but it was amusing. I actually used noisemaker arrows to lure a couple of guards over this 'pit cell' that had a switch to open the top. I got them to stand on the top, rushed to the switch and they went down:D Trapped in their own prison cell. Edit. Went back and this time I just got every guard to chase me to the cell and I made them fall in by flipping the switch. Archers prefer to stand off. I had to use noisemakers over the opening cell to get them right where I wanted them.

If they do the open city thing again, I wouldn't mind seeing that fun little diversion return. Better though would be an actual mission where I have to escape or maybe another Cragscleft style mission where I have to bust somebody out. I hinted before that I didn't like cragscleft, but really I just didn't like the place itself (look and layout). I prefer the look of TDS' Pavelock Prison.

That little prison mission would've been so fun if it was actually a whole big mission with a bunch of objectives.

ps. In Pavelock, there was this part with a ladder you can use to avoid the noisy stairs. For F sake though, I couldn't get off the ladder to get onto the second floor. I kept jumping straight down and making quite a racket. Is it actually possible to hop off a ladder in TDS and actually go where you mean to? In this example the ladder itself didn't face the second floor, it was to the side of it. I just couldn't get off that stupid ladder without falling straight down:mad2:

edit. just want to share because I thought it was hilarious. This is every guard in Pavelock, alive and trapped in a cell.
http://img4.imageshack.us/i/t3main2009060712344357.png/
http://img192.imageshack.us/i/t3main2009060712375348.png/
http://img38.imageshack.us/i/t3main2009060712400701.png/
http://img194.imageshack.us/i/t3main2009060712402360.png/

heh I had nothing better to do. All the prisoners are free! It's anarchy at Pavelock!