View Full Version : Harvey Smith on Invisible War

15th Nov 2008, 19:55
How many people have seen the video of Warren Spector and Harvey Smith talking about the mistakes they made in Invisible War?

Because... I just watched it, and... for all intents and purposes... EM is doing exactly what they said ruined the second game.


In this video... Harvey Smith says they realized in order to make a sequel to a game as unique as DX1, you have to spend 80% of the development time talking to the players of the original game.

He talks about why the stats system was removed... and how it was a mistake to remove it. He more or less says Listen to the Majority of the Fans. Don't listen to "designers" or trust your own instinct when making a high budget game. But rather... talk to the people who bought the game that was already a success... and make it to their vision from a game play point of view.

Pretty much... EVERYTHING Eidos Montreal is doing... Harvey and Spector view as mistakes.


This video has to be at least semi new, since he refers to Blacksite.

15th Nov 2008, 21:21
Posted long ago. ;)

15th Nov 2008, 22:29
I think it was a lot more than that anyways. they were rushed, and it was Harvey's first big game. on top of that, they were doing dual platform development, and that was on the old consoles. thats what gave us so much of the over simplification, IMO.

hopefully EM will do like 2k did with bioshock and have a separate group assigned to optimize the game for the PC. I know, I know; BS had it's flaws. but it wasn't from co-development.

16th Nov 2008, 00:34
It seems pretty clear in retrospect that them designing for XBox was a mistake.

The technology just wasn't there. Compare Liberty Island in both games.

Also everything was just too streamlined and simplified but at the same time kinda clunky and awkward.

Mind you, it was what they did with DX to a degree. Streamlined and game'd stuff up.

Blacksite was bloody terrible btw so if that's a game he made by catering to an audience... :nut:

Also notice that what he says isn't actually that 80% of the man hours should be spent on the forums just that it's what you let yourself in for if you go too hardcore with weird features and could in fact be read as him being in favour of making a game for an audience instead of just hardcore fans.

Check out the other videos on Deus Ex and read the stuff on Gamasutra btw. Also interesting.

One of the things they say about the stat system was that they wanted it to be immediately clear to the player what everything did. In some ways I think EM are carrying through on that with some less subtle augs.

You also do not know what they are doing with the skills system unless there's some new information somewhere I missed.

The only place we're pretty sure it's gone is the shooting and the FPS element in DX was not it's strongest component. If Harvey Smith says otherwise someone should beat him around the head and shoulders with a copy of Blacksite.

16th Nov 2008, 01:40
If they want DX3 to be good, they need to design it specifically for the PC and then later port it over to console.

Its what they did with DX1.

16th Nov 2008, 02:05
They have said they will be doing this.

They said they know they will be on PC, and they aren't sure what other platforms they will be on. So naturally they will design the game to work beautifully on PC, while console ports will come second.

16th Nov 2008, 06:58
This has been posted already, and please complain in one of the other fifty threads regarding "Why DX3 iz goig 2 b massif phail."