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View Full Version : Far Cry 2 has given me some hope about DX3's auto-heal



dixieflatline
24th Oct 2008, 21:28
Hi guys. Quick intro: first time poster, long, long time gamer, huge DX fan.

Like most of you guys (it seems), I'm against auto-healing. But after playing Far Cry 2 last night, I sort of decided to reserve judgment until I see how the dev team handles it.

Far Cry 2 heal system is technically auto-healing, but it is done really well IMHO, and I hope the Deus Ex 3 has something similarly complex.

In Far Cry 2, you have one life bar, with five portions. If you take a small amount of damage ( a fraction of one life portion), and then you get out of harm's way, than that piece of the life bar will heal pretty quickly.

You can also heal yourself, to a limited degree. If you have less than 2/5 of your life, you can 'heal', your character does a quick self surgery on yourself, and you stabilize at 3/5 life.

You also have 3 or 4 'syringes'. These take about 3 seconds to administer -- if you are not being shot at the time, you can use these to replenish your life bar. At save points you get new syringes.

Hopefully I described it clearly enough. Anyways I just wanted to say "Guys, there is hope that they can pull this auto-healing off."

The healing system in Far Cry 2 does NOT make the game too easy (I'm playing on hardcore difficulty, and it is tough.) The healing system DOES help keep the action going.

Sure, I'd maybe prefer the old system, found in DX1. But after seeing Far Cry 2's system in action now I've decided that I'm going to wait to see how the auto-heal system is fully implemented before I pass judgment. I think everyone at least has to admit the --possibility-- that it MIGHT be the best system for the game they are designing.

I sort of hate what Bethesda did to the Fallout series, but from what I've seen so far, I have far more hope that Eidos is actually on the right track to pull off a great Deus Ex 3. I just hope they hire a talented writer for the plot...

Icky6
24th Oct 2008, 22:10
Wow that actually sounds like a good auto-regen solution. I had never thought about the fact that the auto-heal doesn't have to heal you back to full health... it would keep the challenge there I suppose.

Jerion
24th Oct 2008, 22:14
Wow that actually sounds like a good auto-regen solution. I had never thought about the fact that the auto-heal doesn't have to heal you back to full health... it would keep the challenge there I suppose.

Wisdom! Nothing can beat it! :thumbsup:

El_Bel
24th Oct 2008, 22:29
What worries me is that in PCzone magazine they said it is more like CoD than fallout 3.. What could that mean?
The other thing that worries me is that we havent seen yet localized damage and auto regen... And localized damage is one of my favorite futures..

WhatsHisFace
24th Oct 2008, 22:32
What worries me is that in PCzone magazine they said it is more like CoD than fallout 3.. What could that mean?

It means "get Fallout 3 and don't look back".

Larington
24th Oct 2008, 22:59
Difficult to be sure what it means as they never stop to clarify the statement.

For instance, I'm amongst the people who don't like this whole screen goes blurry and red, then you die... Its too indistinct and difficult to read with any precission (Plus sometimes it can get you killed as you can't see enough through the blur/red to take any life saving actions).
That said I know the reason why developers have started doing these sorts of things - They want to try and do away with interface elements that don't make sense in the context of the setting of the game, so, for instance, an ammo counter would be built into the gun instead of your view/perspective, or for example with dead-space, your health meter is displayed on the back of your characters/avatars armour instead of being pasted directly onto the screen.

It could be that they are referring to some sort of system like that (At the beginning of the game, your characters eyes probably aren't augmented, and may never be.
However, I'm really not sure if thats a design decision I want making its way into DX3, I'd rather have some element built into your equipment, say, an arm mounted or helmet HUD screen biometer that displays your health in an easily readable distinct form.

Thats my view, anyway.

dixieflatline
24th Oct 2008, 23:03
I haven't played Dead Space, but from the vid's and screenies I saw, the UI is awesome. I love how the character's information and maps and what not is projected from the guys helmet... really helps with immersion.

Larington
24th Oct 2008, 23:07
I'm hearing a lot of positive talk about Dead Space, as if the designers frequently made the right decisions and had enough breathing space to do so (IE, publisher not breathing down their neck telling them not to take risks).

Whats more, it appears as though they've used third person view in a way that makes complete sense so that it works. I'm currently contemplating moving it up from my buy on budget to my buy asap list, cept I've got uni work and a recently recieved copy of far cry 2 calling to me.

Lo Bruto
24th Oct 2008, 23:22
Far Cry 2 healing animations are awesome.
The guy uses a knife to remove a bullet from his arm... without leaving the first person point of view.

ZylonBane
25th Oct 2008, 01:43
When playing System Shock 2 the first time, I remember how great -- and tension-inducing -- it was that absolutely everything took place in real-time. Whether you were hacking or reading a log or checking your map, the game kept going. Then the same guys went on to make Bioshock, but this time they completely pussied out, caved to the braindead focus groups, and reverted to the primitve old model of pretty much everything freezing the gameworld until you're done.

Now with Far Cry 2, it's good to see that at least some developers are left who "get it", and have the courage to stick to their vision.

Officer Half
25th Oct 2008, 05:23
Or it could be a simple slow trickle that goes outside of combat.
For example:
You have 100hp total. While out of combat you regenerate 3 hp a second.

Sounds good to me! Of course, I'm not the best informed about the auto-heal system, I haven't read all that much on it. That's only one possibility I see that would make relative sense.

gamer0004
25th Oct 2008, 08:29
This all sounds very cool but it will be a Call of Duty 4 health-regenaration system (see "information topic").

Absentia
25th Oct 2008, 14:33
A similar system was used on Riddck:EFBB. I know I seem to bang on about that game all the time, but that's because it's great. You started with 4 health segments, and if you didn't lose all of one segment then you would gradually regain it over time (the speed of which depends on the difficulty level) but once you lost that segment it was gone until you found a health station, which maxes out your health to its full potential (but could only be used 1-3 times, dependign on the station. But, if you'd collected a health canister you could refill the machine (sadly though, this was a concept that was introduced but never really given that much attention through the rest of the game) You also got super duper health stations at some points in the game (or as secret areas) which permanently gave you an extra segment.



This all sounds very cool but it will be a Call of Duty 4 health-regenaration system (see "information topic").

Uhm, it's very likely that it was PCZONE who drew the line between "auto-heal system" and Call of Duty. I don't see why EM would, when questioned about their design, intentionally compare their game to Call of Duty without PCZONE inferring it from just them saying it was auto-heal. On the other hand, there's no evidence to say that EM didn't already compare it to COD, so who knows.
I really hope they do have something more clever than the system from COD or Halo though. On the other hand, if this is overshadowed enough by excellence in every other field of gameplay, then I don't think I'll mind.

AaronJ
25th Oct 2008, 14:48
I'm still not convinced, especially if they're going to have the bar split up into like 5 portions.

DXeXodus
27th Oct 2008, 04:55
This all sounds very cool but it will be a Call of Duty 4 health-regenaration system (see "information topic").

But Rene said that they don't even know how they are doing it yet so I am not sure how the magazines can say that it will be like COD4.

By the way, I am not saying that the magazines did not say this. I am just saying that I am not sure how they could say this when the dev's don't even know how they are doing it.

Jerion
27th Oct 2008, 08:12
But Rene said that they don't even know how they are doing it yet so I am not sure how the magazines can say that it will be like COD4.

By the way, I am not saying that the magazines did not say this. I am just saying that I am not sure how they could say this when the dev's don't even know how they are doing it.

Exactly. It's that fun thing called balancing, which happens throughout the entire dev process right up until the game goes Gold.

I'd be willing to bet that the Magazines just used CoD4 as a comparison because it was a game that also utilized health regen, was released recently, and is immensely popular. Not because they know exactly how it will work.

At least, that's what I took away from the article.

Tracer Tong
27th Oct 2008, 09:40
is farcry 2 worth buying?

DXeXodus
27th Oct 2008, 09:44
From what I hear it is definitely worth buying. The only reason I haven't bought it yet is because I am worried about how my PC will handle it. I am holding off on a graphics card upgrade until just before DX3 comes out :)

But I have heard many people recommend it.

Absentia
27th Oct 2008, 10:14
I have also heard the DRM is so bad that it makes the game unplayable for many a user. Some people couldn't even get past the installation because it said their serial number couldnt be registered. But all of the reviews on Amazon that actually deal with the gameplay are extremely positive. I think your best bet would be to get it on Steam, because at least Steam uses its own tried and tested way of verifying games, which usually works fine.

SageSavage
27th Oct 2008, 11:21
is farcry 2 worth buying?

Yes, it is! It's not for everyone though. Personally I was hoping for a worthy um... spiritual succesor... to the first three "Delta Force" games - and they delivered with some nice extras! I totally loved the huge maps, freeroaming in the natural environments with real weapons and the ability to change the load-out to my tastes. You have to decide for one secondary, one primary and one special weapon (you can replace them with weapons of your enemies at anytime though) - plus frag grenades and Molotov-cocktails. There are silenced weapons as well, which work especially well during nighttimes and in combination with the optional camo-suit. Additionally there are upgrades available to improve the precision or the reliabilty of a specific weapon. The weapons you find on the battlefield are pretty worn out and unreliable so you better buy them new in one of the weaponshops. You pay with diamonds that you occasionally find on the map or receive as payment for some wetwork. You also have to unlock the weapons first by doing missions for the weaponshop owners.

I love sniping in FC2 as much as I only did in Delta Force before. There is quite a number of different weapons and they all feel good and useful. Unfortunaltely they din't include an option to switch the rate of fire - which would have been awesome. As well as some civillians. If you leave the trails, there is some impressive looking wildlife though. I heared that a patch will further increase that.

I play the PC-version and the ingame-controls proved to be very intuitive. The steering of all the vehicles (cars, trucks and a buggy) feels direct - contrary to Crysis or the horrible Mercenaries 2. They better do because you'll drive a lot. One thing Crysis and Mercs 2 did a little bit better was the physics part. Many but not all things are destroyable like they should. The PC-version let's you save and load everywhere and at any time, by the way.

The story picks up very slowly and is, well... debatable. To be honest, there were some events I found pretty dumb but I didn't care too much because in this sandbox-shooter it's mostly about having good battles and enjoying the world. There is not very much variety in the missions either but the fights are extremely good and tactical because the AI (with exceptions of course) is quite acceptable.

It has not very much to do with Far Cry 1, which I didn't like very much because it somehow felt wrong (in the sense of "like plastic") to me and in that case the story really put me off. Probalbly because FC1 was much more story driven.

Sound and graphics are really satisfiying and the game runs absolutley perfect on my machine (Crysis ran ok but showed me the limits of my machine: C2D E6750, GF8800, 2Gb RAM). Some people seem to have technical issues but I have experienced almost no bugs so far (around 60% finished and 17hours ingame played). There are a few glitches I have encountered but they all seem patchable and weren't dramatic.

Haven't tried MP but I read that it's not running very smooth yet. We'll see how that part turns out once the first big wave is gone.

Far Cry 2 is not perfect but to me it's the very best sandbox-shooter so far! I love it.

MaxxQ1
27th Oct 2008, 12:54
Like Fox, I'm liking FC2 as well. There are a few things that bother me though.

The main gripe I have is that it seems all the guard posts respawn enemies after I've cleared them. It happens almost immediately after I get out of sight of the post, then go back and hey - there's more guards. I wouldn't mind it if the game had some sort of mechanic for having the posts cleared for 24 hours or so.

The other major problem I have is that the game is SO huge, that I sometimes have trouble starting one from a save. When I first installed it, the game set my graphics settings to medium (my comp is just a little over the minimum recommended specs). When I went to actually start playing, I waited 25+ minutes before shutting the comp off by pressing and holding the power button (Alt-Tab, Esc, or Ctrl-Alt-Del never worked for stopping the loading).

Anyway, I lowered all settings to low and tried again, and it worked great, except when reloading a save game after dying. Then I have to go through the whole shut down and restart thing again. My comp is about 3 years old, so I knew I wouldn't get the best looks or performance out of the game. Even so, the game looks good on low settings (about the level of Far Cry on high, but not ultra-high), and runs VERY smoothly once it loads the area. Framerates are smooth, there's no loading between areas, and I've yet to experience ANY kind of stutter or hiccup.

Gameplay is typical of an FPS, and there is even some decent stealth. I've been able to sneak up behind someone and take them out with my machete, even in daylight (I haven't got any silenced weapons - other than the machete, and I haven't gotten the camo suit yet). I haven't experimented enough, but it seems that the stealth is light, LOS, and sound-based. It definitely works well, if you're careful. It definitely would work in DX3, and might silence some of the "purists".

Fire is fun to play with, but it can also, pardon the pun, turn on you and burn you. If you set an area on fire using the flamethrower, a molotov cocktail, or blowing up barrels, propane tanks, atcetylene cylinders, or vehicles, it can and will spread, and make sure you're upwind, because you CAN get caught in it. It's really cool watching it jump from tree to tree, sometimes from the tops of the trees.

I'm definitely having fun with this game, and feel if you like this kind of game, it's worth the money.

Edit: Hell I forgot to mention the healing bit. Yes, the auto-heal is very well implemented. One thing I haven't seen mentioned is that if you're critically wounded (down to the last health bar), it slowly gets lower and lower - because you're bleeding out - and if you don't do anything to stop the bleeding, you die. When you DO stop the bleeding, it ONLY fills the last health bar. After that, you need to use syrettes or water bottles to heal the rest of the way. The system works very well, and even running away to "auto-heal" won't work, since the enemies will follow you.

gamer0004
27th Oct 2008, 14:13
But Rene said that they don't even know how they are doing it yet so I am not sure how the magazines can say that it will be like COD4.

By the way, I am not saying that the magazines did not say this. I am just saying that I am not sure how they could say this when the dev's don't even know how they are doing it.

I believe he actually said something like "I can't make any further comments in this matter".

imported_van_HellSing
27th Oct 2008, 15:38
I think your best bet would be to get it on Steam, because at least Steam uses its own tried and tested way of verifying games, which usually works fine.

Ignorance is bliss.

The Steam release carries SecuROM v7 + finite no. of activations.

spm1138
27th Oct 2008, 16:38
Apart from the DRM I have heard people complaining about it being repetitive, about the amount of driving and about the random patrols and checkpoints you run into.

SageSavage
27th Oct 2008, 16:46
Apart from the DRM I have heard people complaining about it being repetitive, about the amount of driving and about the random patrols and checkpoints you run into.
Yep, those are the issues but it's still the best sandbox-shooter I know.

dixieflatline
27th Oct 2008, 18:10
Apart from the DRM I have heard people complaining about it being repetitive, about the amount of driving and about the random patrols and checkpoints you run into.

These things are a drag, for sure. But the game is still pretty good. I love the selection of weapons myself.

Tracer Tong
27th Oct 2008, 20:26
I hate DRM. Makes pirates less frustrated than us money-payers.. (heck, this began with half-life 2 and the steam issues)

You know what's weird? Console games do not bear DRM systems (apart from xbox live). Is this just a conspiracy to stop the PC from being a gaming entertainment device?

Red
27th Oct 2008, 21:17
Another lesson EM could learn from FC2 is immersion.

In FC2 you never ever ever ever ever ever leave 1st person view.

Not to mention the interaction with world objects (picking up weapons/ammo/health, unjamming weapons, driving vehicles, repairing them, administering first aid to oneself etc etc...) - in 1st person, it is truly awesome. Everything is so nicely incorporated to smallest detail that you feel as if you actually were in the game, truly watching through the eyes of the protagonist.

Tracer Tong
27th Oct 2008, 21:30
Funny, Farcry 2 was developed by Ubisoft Montreal. Guess the EM team can give the UM team a visit (to some industrial extent).

I just read the wikipedia article on far cry 2 and decided that, thanks to you guys and since the engine is so new and awesome (destructible environment, day/night cycle, weather, fire propagation and so on), I'm going to buy this game.

EM must never repeat the DRM mistake. SecuROM is the ************ing devil. :p

SageSavage
27th Oct 2008, 21:42
Funny, Farcry 2 was developed by Ubisoft Montreal. Guess the EM team can give the UM team a visit (to some industrial extent).

I just read the wikipedia article on far cry 2 and decided that, thanks to you guys and since the engine is so new and awesome (destructible environment, day/night cycle, weather, fire propagation and so on), I'm going to buy this game.

EM must never repeat the DRM mistake. SecuROM is the ************ing devil. :p
Not everything is destructible. Just keep that in mind, ok?

Absentia
27th Oct 2008, 22:45
Ignorance is bliss.

The Steam release carries SecuROM v7 + finite no. of activations.

Owch. Yes, it certainly is...

DXeXodus
28th Oct 2008, 03:57
I believe he actually said something like "I can't make any further comments in this matter".

I can't find the quote at the moment unfortunately gamer0004, but I clearly remember Rene saying this.

Tracer Tong
28th Oct 2008, 06:09
I can't find the quote at the moment unfortunately gamer0004, but I clearly remember Rene saying this.

Try the thread with the first DX3 information from the PC Zone mag