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View Full Version : DX3 to be set in between DX and IW?



gamer0004
4th Sep 2008, 18:39
Right now most evidence indicates DX3 is going to be a sequel to DX but a prequel to IW (concept art, weapon model and the numbers in the trailer "represent[ing] a movement from disorder to natural balance in a sense"). And I am very very dissapointed by this.
I mean, yeah, this setting could be very very awesome and be perfect for a DX game. But there are some problems.
First of all many people don't seem to understand the huge consequences of a Collapse. No internet, no radio, no television, no energy! This would mean chaos, and besides that total stagnation at every aspect of civilization. There would be no scientific research (no labs!) because... who would they work for? And even if they'd work for a small regional company, how could they get the materials? Or the specialists? And how could real (meaning not just discovering new fuels that are slightly more efficient but real new research in departments like physics and augmentations) research be profitable? It has to be profitable or it won't be done. Companies aren't going to invest huge amounts of money into something of which they know that it's never going to earn them big amounts of money. And especially not small companies that don't have big budgets like today's companies.
Same for weapon manufacturers. There would probably be some progress, but since companies won't be able to get big orders since there are no big organisations or large amounts of civilans who can buy them they wouldn't make weapons like these (http://i106.photobucket.com/albums/m268/ares7777/DSCN4012.jpg) (not that they would ever design that kind of weapons because they are completely unfeasable and unpractical) because that's quite a radical change from the assault rifle in DX.
So if we would have a DX game that's set in between DX and IW, then there would be chaos and small private companies and organisations would be trying to eliminate other companies or organisations. The first signs of globalisation could be noticed, but there would still be huge limits to it. The illuminati would have no way to influence anything so they would be nothing in this new Dark age (just like Tracer Tong told us). Which means that there won't be many possibilities for conspiracies...

So. What do you think?

imported_van_HellSing
4th Sep 2008, 18:46
My thoughts:

1. Your thread title is bait.

2. Occam's Razor still says "Prequel".

K^2
4th Sep 2008, 18:46
Collapse does not mean that the whole world went into the dark ages. If it did, there would be no recovering from Collapse over less than a century.

Collapse was caused by loss of communication. The universal Aquinas protocol was lost. But that doesn't mean that everything suddenly stops working. Yes, in a lot of places it does, but you'd have to have some self-sufficient pockets remain all over the world. Otherwise, recovery would be impossible. This is sufficient as the backdrop for the DX one-and-a-half. In fact, having both highly technological enclaves and ruined cities with no electricity would be even better than what we had in original.

Absentia
4th Sep 2008, 20:02
Where the hell did that image come from? I know its fairly minor, but ****, I never knew of that being let out.. Unless I've been living under a rock on these forums?

Uh, I don't think its at all possible to accurately speculate about the setting of DX3 at this stage, and it's even more stupid to be disappointed at the game before its even been released yet.

imported_van_HellSing
4th Sep 2008, 20:07
Renee kindly provided it to us :). It's from one of the modellers presentation at this year's Siggraph.

AaronJ
4th Sep 2008, 21:07
1. Your thread title is bait.

AND SCARED THE **** OUT OF ME.



2. Occam's Razor still says "Prequel".

ALSO SCARES THE **** OUT OF ME.

imported_van_HellSing
4th Sep 2008, 21:23
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4008/nosequel1dx8.jpg

j/k ;)

Absentia
4th Sep 2008, 23:09
nice edit, van_hellsing, but if you're taking on the sequelists, you'll have to get through me!

I must admit though, I'm trying, really hard, to become aquainted with the idea of a prequel, just so i don't throw a big wobbly if it turns out to be one (which from the concept art and the images from the trailer, it may suggest it) However I think the amount that people speculate already based on what we have is just crazy.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
4th Sep 2008, 23:10
http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/4008/nosequel1dx8.jpg

j/k ;)

Love that, haha! :D :cool:

K^2
4th Sep 2008, 23:21
I think the amount that people speculate already based on what we have is just crazy.
Yeah, but otherwise, the forum would be dead. So speculate away, I say. Even when people just make stuff up, it is sometimes fun to read.

*Waits for someone to post a "PREQUEL PEOPLE" version of the image.*

gamer0004
5th Sep 2008, 13:24
Collapse does not mean that the whole world went into the dark ages. If it did, there would be no recovering from Collapse over less than a century.


I don't agree. No communications means no energy except for some local windmills or something similar. The governments would restore order, the cities would adapt to the new civilization. Some people would probably leave the city to find food as there isn't much in the city. After a while the cities have adapted, found new forms of 'easy' energy and fuel and start to get in touch with each other once again. This can in fact happen in 10 years because there is already so much technology and knowledge.

LatwPIAT
5th Sep 2008, 14:30
I've always considered the best way to solve he problem of a dislikedpart of a franchise is to overwrite it. Keep the good parts from it (So I heard you like the Omar?) remove the bad (Universal Ammo) and forget it ever happened, freeing you from the restrictions of a badly written storyline, essentially rewriting it.

Red
5th Sep 2008, 14:39
Why opening a new thread while there are at least two of them already open?

PREQUEL!!! SEQUEL!!! (http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=79524)

Sequel: What could be the situation? (http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=75107)

foxberg
5th Sep 2008, 16:09
My thoughts:

1. Your thread title is bait.

2. Occam's Razor still says "Prequel".

If you are referring to a principle then I think that the simplest solution is this game being a sequel. This is more logical form a chronological point of view to have a second game set up at the date later then the first and the third later then the second.
JMO

K^2
5th Sep 2008, 16:44
I don't agree. No communications means no energy except for some local windmills or something similar. The governments would restore order, the cities would adapt to the new civilization. Some people would probably leave the city to find food as there isn't much in the city. After a while the cities have adapted, found new forms of 'easy' energy and fuel and start to get in touch with each other once again. This can in fact happen in 10 years because there is already so much technology and knowledge.
I don't think you quite realize the level of dependence on electrical in an advanced society. Right now, if electricity goes, you'll still have transportation. Two decades from now, it will no longer be true.

Without electricity, government won't be able to do much. They won't be able to transport troops. They'll lose all long-range radio communication. It will be complete chaos, and no way to turn things back.

Invisible War does not point to such a complete breakdown of infrastructure. Nobody in their right mind would wire a nuclear power plant's cooling system to a global network. It would run on its own, even after the entire net goes dead. There are no references to nuclear meltdowns, entire world going without power, or anything like that in IW.

What you do get when your communication systems break down is a total crash of all market economy, political turmoil, central governments losing power, and local governments taking over. These are the things that are referenced in IW, and that is what happened during Collapse. It was not a breakdown of infrastructure. It was a breakdown of economy and political system.

AaronJ
5th Sep 2008, 16:49
It's a sequel.

gamer0004
5th Sep 2008, 19:15
I don't think you quite realize the level of dependence on electrical in an advanced society. Right now, if electricity goes, you'll still have transportation. Two decades from now, it will no longer be true.

Without electricity, government won't be able to do much. They won't be able to transport troops. They'll lose all long-range radio communication. It will be complete chaos, and no way to turn things back.

Invisible War does not point to such a complete breakdown of infrastructure. Nobody in their right mind would wire a nuclear power plant's cooling system to a global network. It would run on its own, even after the entire net goes dead. There are no references to nuclear meltdowns, entire world going without power, or anything like that in IW.

What you do get when your communication systems break down is a total crash of all market economy, political turmoil, central governments losing power, and local governments taking over. These are the things that are referenced in IW, and that is what happened during Collapse. It was not a breakdown of infrastructure. It was a breakdown of economy and political system.

It's fairly simple. Without communications you can't run a power plant. Nuclear power plants, for instance, need uranium. And no communications=no fuel. Because how could they get it to the customers? And so on. We nowadays completely depend on (global) communications.

foxberg
5th Sep 2008, 19:22
We nowadays completely depend on (global) communications.

Have you forgotten about augmented pigeons?

jordan_a
5th Sep 2008, 22:44
My thought:

DX3 is going to be a sequel to DX but a prequel to IW. ;)

El_Bel
5th Sep 2008, 23:21
Is that what you would like to see jordan or you know something we dont? :D

Absentia
5th Sep 2008, 23:59
Yeah exactly, jordan shouldnt be able to make his own "comments" on the game now that its been revealed to him, it just confuses our poor anxious news-deprived brains!

jordan_a
6th Sep 2008, 11:36
Mystery... :D

El_Bel
6th Sep 2008, 13:36
Party girl: You're sooo baaaaaaaaad :p


Come on tell us, we will protect you!! I know the dragon head!!

DXeXodus
8th Sep 2008, 04:22
Have you forgotten about augmented pigeons?

Augmented pigeons FTW. I think we should have one as our forum mascott.

K^2
8th Sep 2008, 05:24
It's fairly simple. Without communications you can't run a power plant. Nuclear power plants, for instance, need uranium. And no communications=no fuel. Because how could they get it to the customers? And so on. We nowadays completely depend on (global) communications.
Do you have any idea how long Uranium rods can last? It's long enough for you to send a runner to the supplier, and have people carry replacements to the plant.

Of course, we don't have enough known Uranium reserves to run nuclear power plants for that long in the future. There are two possibilities. Either most of the power will be solar, or it will be thermonuclear. In the later case, fuel is water. In former, the Sun. Either one - easy enough to obtain.

Finally, what you really need to understand is that failure of Aquinas protocol is not a complete communication blackout. It is a breakdown of fast, reliable, global communication. Local radio and even wired networks will arise within hours of a collapse of Aquinas. These will be very inefficient and slow, but they will be mostly targeted at keeping the vital industries going. That means food and power production first and foremost. If inter-city comm will be needed, it will be established. If they'll have to, they'll grab a spool of wire, run a cable from city to city by dropping it from the truck, and use a battery and a light bulb to send Morse Code signals. Though, I'm sure things won't be bad enough to get that drastic.

The way such networks usually work, there are many different levels. The Aquinas protocol is the most abstract and generalized level. Different hardware and software layers would form the underlying structure for it. This is very similar to how Internet works. Now, picture entire Internet going down. This doesn't stop you from taking two computers, running a cross-over cable between them, and exchanging data over Ethernet. Similarly, Aquinas going down won't stop all communication. You'll still be able to build local networks for whatever you need, and if you agree on how to do so in advance, you'll be able to exchange data between two such networks. In many cases, I'm sure, people will fall back on older protocols.

So again, if you think that failure of Aquinas will lead to a complete communication blackout, you are mistaken. It will be so for remote, otherwise unreachable locations, such as evident from abandoned Versalife base in Antarctica, but this is rather an exception. For most places, some form of communication will be re-established within hours, and within days you'll have global communication. This isn't long enough for infrastructure to fail, but it is long enough for economies and governments to fail.

El_Bel
8th Sep 2008, 08:07
And remove the power to control global communications from the hands of Page/Illuminati...

K^2
8th Sep 2008, 14:22
Well, anyone, really, since it would have been forced to become decentralized. A p2p of sorts, but on a more global scale. Which is what I believe communication should be like, so that's a good thing. Would be nicer as a smooth transition without a market collapse, poverty, civil unrest, and most likely civil (and not so much) wars, but you take what you can get.