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View Full Version : Deus Ex 3's free roaming/big environment...



Gizmostuff
15th May 2008, 18:16
It should be a lot like this game...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2N1TJP1cxmo

People are giving Deus Ex 2 such a bad rap, well, this is why imo...I felt almost claustrophobic playing the game. It's not that it doesn't have any good qualities; if it did have a bigger environment, I'd have to say the game would be at the very least good.

The cities were there; Seattle, a great city to choose from but practically no where to explore! Trier, probably the best city to experience, but didn't quite give it the feel I was hoping for. It's a really old city, but I didn't see it.

I'm really hoping to see Deus Ex 3 to have some real exploring game play. Not that it's the only key point to improve on from the second Deus Ex, I think it's a good place to start.

gamer0004
15th May 2008, 18:46
I'd like some of those options in DX3. Mantling worked very well in DX:IW and they should include it in DX3 too.
And of course I want big maps.

jordan_a
15th May 2008, 20:01
This video is pretty impressive technically. Big environments are a must we all agree on that.

Gary_Savage
15th May 2008, 20:35
I so loved the music from that video. One moment I felt like I was melting, while the next, I felt like I was breathing in the fresh air in the warm, morning sun.

The dystopia mood in broad daylight really did it for me: I love such ironies. It reminds me that I had wanted to read works which had such ironies, but never got to; works like Darkness at Noon.

The music was relaxing; not the kind that gets me all tensed up, or excited, like the game music from the "Command and Conquer" series did. That kind of music was appropriate there, but this music relaxes me, so I can enjoy the finer, story elements, of the game. I would like this sort of thing in DX3. I would definitely like for some levels to have this kind of music. Some ironies would also be appreciated, like the irony in DX1, where a once public figure like Stanton Dowd had to meet JC under the cover of a burned/destroyed building.

P.S. From watching the Gamereactor interview (http://youtube.com/watch?v=CXMe3bRagzs&feature=related), I think this game could be a bit of a daylight version of DX. Either that, or I'm reading into Ted Morgan's "My Battle of Algiers" too much; a book that makes the information exchange of those on the fringe look very important. Other than that, the developer does mention that the storyline is very important, and that things are subtle, and that there is no real black and white. Also, the city architecture is influenced by real cities, like Dubai (in the United Arab Emirates).

Blade_hunter
15th May 2008, 21:57
Ah! I'm glad to see this video I always wanted a big number of movement features for DX like the video, Huge maps and most of optional ways. the only inconvenient of this Video it's we can the only a little indoor part...
And I find some Infos about this game, and the global gameplay is different than other FPS because the weapons can be a serious inconvenient, and the bigger part is to use your body to make your objectives.
The big greatness of this game is the immersion because we can see our body and how it act on each situation, and the dev's makes simple controls for an easy control. I wait the game itself but I think it can be a great game for one reason. It add's a new gameplay style and it innovates on the gameplay features.

I always wanted to see our body parts in a FPS game and uses some features of third person games in a FPS; this game has these features on it.
A hand to hand combat is always an interesting thing, and make some tricks like the movie matrix, uses some biomods and weapons as a super power like some marvel comics in a realistic way; super powers but not a super hero; like the first game but more enhanced than before ...

In the first game when I return back to Hell's kitchen with the Speed enhancement I used this power to jump on some rooftops and take dawn the unatco troops on the ground in a easy form

This kind of movements makes all sens of an agility skill
Agility skill allows to run faster makes better jumps and a better control of our body, this skill adds some "special" movements like some max payne movements and the ability to slide on the ground and some special Hand to hand attacks (not a super attack of course but it can give other way's to beat an enemy with hands...)

Gary_Savage
16th May 2008, 01:35
Now I have a model of exactly what to ask for, in terms of character movement/physical abilities skills, for my DX3 player character to have. Those parkour moves, and the hand to hand combat are exactly what I would want my DX3 player character to have, and I want these skills to be upgradable, with the higher skill levels allowing jumps from a higher precipice, a run up a higher wall, and a wall run for a longer horizontal distance.

It would make sense (if we have a prequel) that the player character has to have skills for a parkour roll, whereas, in DX1 the augmentations to the muscles allowed him (JC) to jump from high places without rolling; just as David Belle (French traceur), Sebastian Foucan (seen in the movie Casino Royale) (and some other traceurs and free runners) can jump off the second floor (first floor, under the British system) without having to roll, owing to their very well developed legs, whereas many traceurs and free runners will have to roll out of such a drop. Of course, I would want to see these skills even if we have a sequel.

DXeXodus
16th May 2008, 03:58
That video was absoloutly beautiful. The clean, crisp environments reminded me of portal in a way. I loved the interactivity. It is this kind of interactivity that we (to an extent) need in DX3. Whether or not they can do it in the crystal dynamics engine is another story. It is a tomb raider engine though, so maybe we can see some of these things in the new DX.

Ah man, I think it's time for another piece of concept art or something :)

Gary_Savage
16th May 2008, 04:26
Yeah, I am pacing, waiting for another piece of concept art, but I don't want to ask for it, because I don't want the team to feel pressured, yet. I don't know how to contain myself, while letting the Eidos team some peace of mind to produce a quality piece of work.

I like it that the first concept art seems to show a nice field of view. I want the devs to implement that in the game; maybe even have the PC's eyes focus on what lies on the center of screen, thus blurring out the periphery of the view, a bit (Far Cry may have implemented something like this). That, I think, would add to the immersion quite a bit.

The only thing in the video that I don't want the DX3 team doing is highlighting the possible paths in a mission. I want to find these things out, myself. Of course, the Mirror's Edge team might have done that only to make the game look less daunting to first time viewers. Other than that, for DX3, the more parkour, the better. :D

DXeXodus
16th May 2008, 04:44
Yeah, I am pacing, waiting for another piece of concept art, but I don't want to ask for it, because I don't want the team to feel pressured, yet.

I hate the fact that I'm getting myself so hyped over this game. But I just can't help it. It's like I'm setting myself up for a big heartbreak or something but I'm too naive to not let it happen. Im holding on to the hope that it will be good and that I will enjoy it and that it will be a true DX game.

Gary_Savage
16th May 2008, 05:00
You know, it might be better, for the both of us, to enjoy this community, and just hope (though not be entirely convinced) for a good game. That way, even if the game turns out to be a disappointment, we will still have enjoyed the company of countless DX fans, so we won't have too much to regret. Personally, I am liking all the discussions about the technologies (e.g., strength of a mech arm vs. a nano auged arm), ethical issues, gameplay mechanics, etc. here; it's just that that alone is not enough to get me detached from the final product from the DX3 team. :mad2:

O, who am I kidding? I doubt I can be detached from whether or not DX3 turns out to be worthy of the DX name... certainly not after reading through pages and pages of GameSpot reviews, trying to find even a close cousin to the original DX1.

A lot of RPGs have the immersive story elements that made DX1 great, but the ones that I found delve so deeply into fantasy that I loose my suspension of disbelief. I guess my mother was right to regret raising me on facts, and not telling me fairy tales, when I was kid.

DXeXodus
16th May 2008, 05:09
You know, it might be better, for the both of us, to enjoy this community, and just hope (though not be entirely convinced) for a good game. That way, even if the game turns out to be a disappointment, we will still have enjoyed the company of countless DX fans, so we won't have too much to regret.

So true. OK then, I shall remain hyped. But i swear, if they announce universal ammo, I'm out!

gamer0004
16th May 2008, 06:58
Now I have a model of exactly what to ask for, in terms of character movement/physical abilities skills, for my DX3 player character to have. Those parkour moves, and the hand to hand combat are exactly what I would want my DX3 player character to have, and I want these skills to be upgradable, with the higher skill levels allowing jumps from a higher precipice, a run up a higher wall, and a wall run for a longer horizontal distance.

It would make sense (if we have a prequel) that the player character has to have skills for a parkour roll, whereas, in DX1 the augmentations to the muscles allowed him (JC) to jump from high places without rolling; just as David Belle (French traceur), Sebastian Foucan (seen in the movie Casino Royale) (and some other traceurs and free runners) can jump off the second floor (first floor, under the British system) without having to roll, owing to their very well developed legs, whereas many traceurs and free runners will have to roll out of such a drop. Of course, I would want to see these skills even if we have a sequel.

I don't want to be able to do all those things. Yes, I would love it, but DX isn't a parcour game. I want to be able to do some of those things. I think the devs should spend most time on the more important parts - storyline, augs, skills, fighting, sneaking etc.

Gary_Savage
16th May 2008, 07:21
I think the devs should spend most time on the more important parts - storyline, augs, skills, fighting, sneaking etc.

Wouldn't be a DX game without these, would it? To paraphrase something I mentioned in an earlier thread: core before parkour.

With the story set as the most important element of the DX3 game (and I think I speak for everyone here, on that point), and the skills and augs second, I would like to see parkour as a way to evade and escape enemies (i.e., I see parkour as an aid to sneaking and "vanishing"), and the hand-to-hand combat as an aid to non-lethal take-downs. Now you know why I see these two things as being so important to the DX3 game.

DXeXodus
16th May 2008, 07:41
Wouldn't be a DX game without these, would it? To paraphrase something I mentioned in an earlier thread: core before parkour.

With the story set as the most important element of the DX3 game (and I think I speak for everyone here, on that point), and the skills and augs second, I would like to see parkour as a way to evade and escape enemies (i.e., I see parkour as an aid to sneaking and "vanishing"), and the hand-to-hand combat as an aid to non-lethal take-downs. Now you know why I see these two things as being so important to the DX3 game.

Agreed. these things allow for a much more diverse play style and would be a welcome inclusion IMHO.

Blade_hunter
20th May 2008, 22:15
These things allows more usefulness for skills

Movement capability is good with an agility skill, like obtain some moves like max payne or lara croft on their respective games, allows some moves a la sam fisher and solid snake.

The game haven't only one gameplay type on it, the first game wants to mix most gameplay parts from other game types, when some suggestions wants to upgrade the DX movement possibilities, I think most of us never see this game, and some movements can be done automatically or press quickly on the direction button

When we tap twice a direction button it makes new dodge moves like rolling
When we tap three a direction button we can make a spacial directional jump
When we tap twice the crouch button we can be on prone position it can be useful to go on certain locations and be more stealthy.
When we tap twice the jump button we can jump with a "couched" position
When we tap three the jump button we are jumping with a flip.

Some other moves can be done automatically like to pass a grid or jump over an higher crate, we can allow the wall jumps and other special positions and moves these things allows us some meas to infiltrate and stay stealthy or some moves useful on combat situations

Skills like endurance, strength and agility will unlock some moves and allow us to make better the basic moves.

DX is game that allows stealth tactics and combat tactics we can expand it with some new moves

Rindill the Red
10th Jun 2008, 05:51
It should be a lot like this game...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2N1TJP1cxmo

People are giving Deus Ex 2 such a bad rap, well, this is why imo...I felt almost claustrophobic playing the game. It's not that it doesn't have any good qualities; if it did have a bigger environment, I'd have to say the game would be at the very least good.

The cities were there; Seattle, a great city to choose from but practically no where to explore! Trier, probably the best city to experience, but didn't quite give it the feel I was hoping for. It's a really old city, but I didn't see it.

I'm really hoping to see Deus Ex 3 to have some real exploring game play. Not that it's the only key point to improve on from the second Deus Ex, I think it's a good place to start.

Yes, levels much to small and cramped and load times and everything for Deus Ex 2. Annoying game overall. I posted a long time ago on this forum, back in 2006 about all the things Deus Ex one had good and Deus Ex 2 had good and what Deus Ex 2 did wrong.

Fen
10th Jun 2008, 08:33
Im all for large environments, but keep the environments interactive. Theres no point in having a city with 500 buildings when we can only enter 4.

As for the parkour. Im also for it, but moderation is necessary here. We've got to remember that dues ex is a conglomeration of lots of different playstyles.

If you go ahead and make an extremely complex and indepth hacking game for example, then what about those who choose not to be hackers (a choice which I think should be made a little more viable).

The same goes for parkour. Add some in, yes. But dont go over the top and make the game a parkour game. If a game feature isnt practical and usable, then theres no point in creating it. If you add in a really in depth parkour part to the game, then youll need to cater the game around that feature.

The game is about choice. When implementing pathways, skills, weapon choices. The devs should be very aware that people shouldnt be forced into any direction.

J.CDenton
10th Jun 2008, 09:21
I agree for the environment part. It was so closed in DX2. I was just playing DX1 yesterday and wandering in Paris street. Incredible to see that even after completing the game four time I still manage to find new places and secrets. IN DX2 you where just having the main road, a ladder or you just have to go through ventilation holes. I pretty hope we'll have open spaces.

For the movement part I think the idea to be really interresting. It could be usefull for fighting. We'll see that the guys will propose us.

Blade_hunter
10th Jun 2008, 22:09
I agree with you



The game is about choice. When implementing pathways, skills, weapon choices. The devs should be very aware that people shouldn't be forced into any direction.

To be forced to use one way it depends how we seems it about forcing, some ways are more easy than others. and all players prefer takes one way instead of an other because we are a good fighter, skilled in parkour games or we have good infiltration capabilities, etc.
the skills can represents and make easier a task that we are skilled.

Each way is an accomplishment of our natural abilities and gives us a challenge when we do everything.

Combat is a challenge
Parkour is a challenge
Infiltration is a challenge

We have more eases to make one thing.
For example I'm skilled for combat.
Parkour I'm medium
I'm bad for infiltration

I prefer to combat and make some traps, than infiltrate without be seen because I'm not very stealthy, and the guards come on the place and kill me with ease.

I agree the fact like you I don't want a ton of buildings with only 4 we can infiltrate

For me the choice is the primary thing on DX, the first game is the best demonstration about choice.


As for the parkour. Im also for it, but moderation is necessary here. We've got to remember that dues ex is a conglomeration of lots of different playstyles.

As you say DX is a mix of playstyles and must keep this And I agree the game mustn't be a parkour game only got some freedom if we want to jump everywhere that will be a choice.

In hell's kitchen I used my "parkour" abilities to go on roofs tops, in the NSF generator too

I want the third game give us more choices than the first game.
More choices on the gameplay parts, and more control on the story.

Fen
11th Jun 2008, 15:45
I definately agree with this. It could add some great parts to the game. Just as long as the devs dont turn around and make JC the acrobat.

Having some simple parkour as an upgradable skill I think would be great. Using it in combination with some augs could create some interesting playstyles. Just as long as no-one is forced to go down the path of parkour, then Im happy.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
2nd Jul 2008, 20:23
Yes, I want a BIG free-roaming environment on all levels, please! :cool:

I'm kind of hoping they will do the same for the upcoming Thief game too. :)

Blade_hunter
2nd Jul 2008, 21:40
Yes and I want to confirm some things now with the new game engines we can get great levels with high detail.
And the levels must be great and keep the maximum interactivity with both elements of the game.
I say detail but I prefer to see a great detail to the environment (items, objects, things) instead of graphical details like an HD texture, I think I prefer to see a game with medium graphics and a great gameplay than a game with great graphics and a simple gameplay.

The games now can combine the twice but if one thing must be sacrificed it should be the graphics
Anyway the game should have better graphics than UT 2k4

Kevyne-Shandris
2nd Jul 2008, 23:41
Yes and I want to confirm some things now with the new game engines we can get great levels with high detail.

Is it true DX10 offers maps that doesn't even need fog? The beauty of DX, even low res at it was, it had no fog. So at even the Liberty Island level you could see the city lights w-a-y across the map.

Big bummer in BF2142 is that it has HUGE maps, but fog is there, despite the mipmaps. Couldn't even sniper well from the Titan to the ground AAs, because all I'd see is that haze. 300m (only 900ft, where a sniper can snipe much further), is the cut off zone. In DX, even tiny like ants in the scope, could still pick them off.

Big maps and no fog = gamer's delight! :)

El_Bel
13th Jul 2008, 13:05
wow, i am in love with this game.. ah, love love, i missed you so much.. I want to play it!!

As for deus ex, i dont know. The engine supports streaming, so i am expecting big environments.

Fen
13th Jul 2008, 13:15
Big bummer in BF2142 is that it has HUGE maps, but fog is there, despite the mipmaps. Couldn't even sniper well from the Titan to the ground AAs, because all I'd see is that haze. 300m (only 900ft, where a sniper can snipe much further), is the cut off zone. In DX, even tiny like ants in the scope, could still pick them off.

Haha I remember this in Battlefield Vietnman (the only one I played). Was soo frustrating that your view distance was shorter than your effective shooting distance.

DXeXodus
29th Jul 2008, 09:47
So since Jordan_a's visit to the Eidos headquarters in Montreal he stated the following:


if you're looking for freedom in DX3 you should not be disappointed, it will be a key element

I for one think that this is good news. Having more room to move around will be great after playing in the smaller levels of Invisible war. :)

Blade_hunter
29th Jul 2008, 10:25
He he because tiny levels makes the sniping and the sniper rifle a bit useless :D

DXeXodus
29th Jul 2008, 10:33
^^ I kind of just gave up using the sniper rifle for 'sniping'. I just ended up using it as a bolt action rifle
But now it seems we can return to long-range sniping agian... :)

jcp28
29th Jul 2008, 15:42
^Great, maybe we can have more levels like that one rooftop area before the Osgood and Sons' warehouse.

AaronJ
29th Jul 2008, 15:45
This is exactly how I took Jordans comment