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IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 14:11
What i want to see in game, is that movement speed is layed into mousescroller. As scrolling down on scroller reduses your speed to walk and down to sneak. While scrolling up raise your speed to run and up to sprint. Other thing i want to see is the weaponbelt. That is simple two slots in your inventory that are actionbased slots/macros to your 1 to 2 key (left and right side). This makes you lay two weapons of your choise, hanging into your weaponbelt. Even this weapons make different much of noice in different kind of speeds, when hanging down at your weaponbelt. (Like a rifle hanging down will easy hit your hip and make some noice, while pistols/revolvers hangs more steady.) While in sneak those are silent enuff for sneaking but in walk those will make some of noice. In run and sprint you make lots of noice and can't even run so fast with a rifle hanging in your weaponbelt. Even cooler thing could be to set in (two pistols/revolvers of choise). If you pick up two pistols or revolvers of same kind. You can use this to dual wild, only to set those two pistols/revolvers to slot 1 and 2 (must be of same kind/brand). When you are going to dual wild, you simply have to press on 1 or 2 key and both pistols will come up. Like as two sights in the HUD with some space betwin them and lefthand side sight autoaim on left side as righthand side sight autoaim on rightside of the screen at close range. This could be cool to make fast take down of small rooms.

Just a thoght. Would give lots of atmosphere to the gameplay.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 16:02
I can't see it affecting atmosphere in the slightest. I can see the gung ho player loving it but atmosphere would be untouched. The weapon belt, there's the problem of accessibility. I know that trying to increase accessibility is what ruined IW but it still needs to start somewhere, and making the mousewheel the movement toggle, that would confuse everyone who's used to it being the weapon select. What you seem to forget with the clicking weapon select, is that you need to put your weapons away regularly. This was achieved with right click in the original, and it should have been right click in IW. Adding all these effects to combat features will draw attention away from the controls needed for other ways of doing it, like stealth and maintanence. It would lose the diversity until it became just a shooter with an above average story. Frankly, realism can bugger off if it's gonna be responsible for me being unable to access what I need when I need it. To quote Yahtzee, "I'd rather be stupid and having fun than bored out of my immense cranium". The same applies to games that try too hard to be realistic. At the end of the day it is a game, and games don't have to be real.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 16:12
Games have to be so real those ever can get, to have a story you can even belive in. Yeah it's sure you will loose the weapon select on scroller. But how fast can you pick up a wanted weapon from a fully filled backpacker, in real life. Actually there is only chance that you have two weapons for fast pickups, while the rest of them is packed in your inventory. Movement is even depending on how much stuff you are carring in your inventory, as like what you have handy in your weaponbelt. So why not split inventory from weaponbelt. This action will give game huge amount of realism, while it's still a cyberpunk game.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 16:47
DX had an abominable physics engine, borderline painful AI and let me lug around a GEP gun, a flamer and a plasma gun in addition to a complemant of grenades, 10 to a square, a pistol or 2, the crossbow, a knife and a batton. Realism was not a priority but it was still incredibely involving. It was a game where you'd actually forget that you need to save it was sso involving, and that was nothing to do with the realism of the system. If we're going to be realistic, a .22 round is going to have me bleeding out on the ground reguardless of where I got hit and a brick is going to cause permenant damage that won't be repaired by prodding a bot. Deus Ex doesn't involve you with the realism of the combat, it involved you with the story. If they need to make combat ultra real to involve players, then Eidos need to hire a new design team.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 18:37
No. It's should be really easy to fix, in my point of view. Yeah i'am with you that DX1 had the item bar just all the way down the HUD. But like our game technology involves, like does the realism in games. Why then not just lay the same item bar in DX3, but set those slots/keys/macros only from 3 to 9 and only for placement for your 7 favorite gadgets (no weapons at all). And lay that like your "gadget box" and *ONLY* weapons to 1 to 2 slots/keys/macros like your "weaponbelt". Like if you press 3 to 9 keys/macros. You see your character pick up his gadgetbox and take up the gadget you have been choosen to use at the specific moment. Weapons should not been shuffled with gadgets and in the other ways. Those should have two different placements in the game and have different timelimits to been bringed up. Like it should be really hard to scroll throw all weapons in your eguipment by scrolling the mousewheel. Those weapons that you don't have been attached to your belt, should take time to take up from your rest of eguipment.

:)

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 19:21
this would involve a very high number of gadgets. Which I like. I jusy find it hard to concieve that even when going for the realitic side of carrying, you would still be limited to 2. maybe a space on your back for large weapons that took a notable amount of time, a medium weapon dangling from your belt/strapped to the outside of your leg depending on size, a pistol sized weapon in a secure holster and a melee weapon held somewhere on your torso, but 2 weapons seems a bit limiting, especially for a multipurpose superagent who was manufactured to adapt on the fly.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 20:08
Well. What i ment was to have a overall eguipment inventory with weapons and gadgets, like old inventory menu. But separate those two different fast choosements to 2 weapons to weaponbelt and only 7 gadgets into gadgetbox. But you will still have your inventory "backpacker" with 10-30 more weapons and gadgets in your way of taste. But from the inventory you can only choose two weapons to your weaponbelt as like seven gadgets to your gadget kit. = To 1-9 slots/keys/macros...

You can choose to carry two rifles in your belt, but will be really slow in movement and make very much of noice in fast speeds. Best are to carry one rifle and one pistol or grenades to get speed back and reduse your noice. Two equal pistols/revolvers will make you move in full speed and reduse your noice to almost to zero. This will even make the dual wild go on automaticly, but still you have no grenades and have less fire power from your two pistols. Just only to clean out rooms with only short distances.

But if you go in with rifle and grenades in your waponbelt. You will have more firepower on range and grenades to send into room. This is just up to you to choose and maybe even up to your skills. You maybe go for a silenced rifle instead of two silenced pistols, that cost more money and require other skills. There is lots of thing to experiment in this case, i belive.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 20:25
Still the issue of right click's original purpose, for interaction and pacifying your weapons. The only real alternative would be to use "e" as the interact button, but then we've lost the lean option. Unless our character is unexplainabley crippled in the right knee.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 20:34
Still the issue of right click's original purpose, for interaction and pacifying your weapons. The only real alternative would be to use "e" as the interact button, but then we've lost the lean option. Unless our character is unexplainabley crippled in the right knee.

Why would it matter on right click ? The right click is still in use. But you have choose of weapons on 1 and 2 key and not at mouse at all. :scratch:

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 20:40
Even if you choose to use rifle and grenades or pistol grenades, what ever. The grenades will be thrown on that key you have placed the grenades. So you have only to set rifle or pistol to 1 slot/key for example and grenades to 2 slot/key. Then it's on nessery to press 1 key ones and rifle is on, then press on 2 key to throw your choosen type of grenades from your belt.

If you have dual pistols those most both be with or without same attachments. Like silencers or other stuff. To go into the dual wild mode. You can't get into dual wild with a pistol and revolver in the other hand. Both must be of same type and have same attachments on them.

If those are not the same, they will only pop up for them self. But if these are the same. It's enuff for you to press 1 or 2 key and both pistols or revolvers is coming up and you going into dual wild mode.

Hahaha. Just been in other thread and been momorised about the throwing knifes in DX1. Think going dual wild with only knifes. Whohoho. What a mess and loads of fun, but also a very dangerous act to do. But still really awesome. Don't know or remember how the knifes will be sorted in eguipment. But think if those will be sorted like 5 and 5 in every slot. Then it's only to lay 5 knifes to slot 1 and 5 knifes to slot 2 and you going dual wild with throwing knifes only.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 21:02
Deus Ex was a working system, it was simplistic where it needed to be and complicated where it enhanced the story, you seem to be trying quite hard to change that. Duel weilding is a cliche that is usually poorly achieved these days. There will be people whining if they can't have their 2 pistols on hand simultaneously, one for supressive fire with lots of ammo and one as a finisher. more people than there would if we just left a working system. And I can't for the life of me think why the hell I'd want so many types of pistol. A 10mm pistol with a reasonable clip is the only practical thing to do in a combat situation. All this hype about .50cal is plain bull because they're noisy, heavy, have about 6 rounds before they need reloading. Revolvers would just be dated pieces of rubbish that would have the firing mechanism removed, gilded a bit and put on display. No one would be caught using one unless they had some serious attention deficit.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 21:21
Deus Ex was a working system, it was simplistic where it needed to be and complicated where it enhanced the story, you seem to be trying quite hard to change that. Duel weilding is a cliche that is usually poorly achieved these days. There will be people whining if they can't have their 2 pistols on hand simultaneously, one for supressive fire with lots of ammo and one as a finisher. more people than there would if we just left a working system. And I can't for the life of me think why the hell I'd want so many types of pistol. A 10mm pistol with a reasonable clip is the only practical thing to do in a combat situation. All this hype about .50cal is plain bull because they're noisy, heavy, have about 6 rounds before they need reloading. Revolvers would just be dated pieces of rubbish that would have the firing mechanism removed, gilded a bit and put on display. No one would be caught using one unless they had some serious attention deficit.

I know. I don't say, that this dual wilding will be even useful in full combat and full range combat. But just if you have to clean out a small room or in close quarters combats. But still this pistols/revolvers must be of same brand and have the equal of balance to the other. So if people like to use a supressive fire pistol and one finisher pistol. They only need to choose a rifle in the other slot and a pistol in the other slot. Rifle for supressive fire and the pistol for finisher. Why would they go for supressive fire with a pistol any how ? :scratch:

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 21:24
Evidently I misunderstood your definition of duel weilding and firing, because that last post implied that you wished to be firing a rifle sized weapon with one hand and a pistol or some similar weapon with the other. Is this the case?

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 21:26
Evidently I misunderstood your definition of duel weilding and firing, because that last post implied that you wished to be firing a rifle sized weapon with one hand and a pistol or some similar weapon with the other. Is this the case?

No, no... You have to have two same brand of *ONLY* two pistols/revolvers in both of slots. No rifle and pistol at the same time in slots. No balance at all. :)

But if you have rifle in slot 1 and pistol in slot 2. You can change in hurry betwin those both.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 21:30
But then people will whine that they can't use their machine pistol which everyone seems to think would be a good idea and their high calibre pistol which is the result of a similar delusion being uncombinable. Some people may wish to vary their tactics with on hand wepaons, said machine pistol throwing them into cover whilst you bravely rambofy onwards with your more ammo efficient pistol dropping them as the brave the stream of lead. In the end there'd be more objections than simply not using it at all.

IceBallz
25th Mar 2008, 21:44
But then people will whine that they can't use their machine pistol which everyone seems to think would be a good idea and their high calibre pistol which is the result of a similar delusion being uncombinable. Some people may wish to vary their tactics with on hand wepaons, said machine pistol throwing them into cover whilst you bravely rambofy onwards with your more ammo efficient pistol dropping them as the brave the stream of lead. In the end there'd be more objections than simply not using it at all.

Machine pistol and high caliber pistol are not the same brand and have no balance to others. This will make aiming even difficult in real life shooting. So there is no risk this goes under the dual wild mode. You have to bring in two machine pistols or two high caliber pistols into slots to get them into dual wild mode. Even the aim should be different in dual wild, for different kind of pistols/revolvers depending to thier mechanics and caliber when set to dual wild mode.

So, yes. If you choose to have a machine pistol in slot 1 and a high calibre pistol in slot 2. This will come up like singular and not in dual wild.

GruntOwner
25th Mar 2008, 22:10
That's exactly the problem, without the option of varying your hand layout people are going to have less options. They will start ranting that they want a different weapon in each hand and the number of complaints would be worse than if duel weilding were left out all together.

m72
26th Mar 2008, 02:07
I say, scrap the DX's weapon belt system and limit what the character can bring to a more realistic level. Or allow the character to buy say a piece of coat which double as a place to store weapons or other piece of clothing that would benefit the character at some level. and i would love to see dual wielding, but in response to the person that said it in reality it would be impossible to balance the two guns, just add the dual wielding as skills, D&D style

Kevyne-Shandris
26th Mar 2008, 02:53
If they need to make combat ultra real to involve players, then Eidos need to hire a new design team.

Hope the emphasis won't be on just weapons. They're fun with FPS games, but Deus Ex is more than combat.

What I like to see is more hacking, cracking and unlocking. Some with explosive timers and/or turret activation if you don't hurry (then add the misery of a foot patrol, as you try to duck and wait until the timer is reset). To me the hacking (or trying to find the passwords to hack into email or the defenses) is what made DX special, as it's not RPG or FPS, it's classic cyberpunk, though.

Then add some more arms and what not sellers (if we could pick up extras to buy/sell/trade with such sellers, the better -- that's the RPG side that's appealing -- so we can customize our hardware [again, cyberpunk terminology and mindset]).

And how about being able to get in and use a bot ourselves, to be a mech warrior for a while? Or to drive a car/helicopter to the next destination, even if it's a mindless 10 minute drive/flight with flashbacks that we learn more of JC's past (it's a good way to introduce more history even for new players, without getting even ADD/ADHD players bored)?

This game has so much to offer.

IceBallz
26th Mar 2008, 05:41
I say, scrap the DX's weapon belt system and limit what the character can bring to a more realistic level. Or allow the character to buy say a piece of coat which double as a place to store weapons or other piece of clothing that would benefit the character at some level. and i would love to see dual wielding, but in response to the person that said it in reality it would be impossible to balance the two guns, just add the dual wielding as skills, D&D style

You have not been reading all my posts or you don't understand my idea. Weaponbelt is not the same with your inventory. Weaponbelt is only two open slots for weapon macros only, like key 1 and key 2. Like as gadgetbox is only for gadget macros, like lockpick, hacktool, wallmine, etc, etc and are placed on key 3 to key 9. Then you have inventory on "I" key like in DX1. The thing is that you can't set more then max two weapons like macros. Only key 1 and 2 is used for ONLY weapons. If you want to use another weapon you have to go into your inventory and place them into your weaponbelt (macros) or from weaponbelt place them into inventory. Like as gadgetbox works like the same, but don't take in any of your weapons like macros. Just only gadgets. But still you have more space in your inventory then only weaponbelt macros and gadgetbox macros together. With me ?

If you talk about smaller inventory, it's a another thing. But i'am talking about something all different idea.

Like i have told in posts before this one. Dual wild works in small places, like small rooms and close combat. But not so good in long distance (like not at all). Even the autoaim won't work and accury will be to wide and make it too far hard to hit anything at all. Then you can't even get dual wide to work with two different pistols/revolvers or with a rifle in the other hand. Must have some balance to it, like two pistols/revolvers of same type and with same attachments. Then it will go on and be only useful in small rooms and close range.

I see the main figure in Deus Ex like as some kind of hero character. But not like a superhero, who can scroll trhow 10 different weapons under 10 nano seconds. Even he should have limits.

+ Grenades should even go under gadgets. Like if you have dual wide on or rifle and pistol in weaponbelt. You can still go for a grenade in your gadgetbox. But this action will put your weapons down in 2 seconds, becurse you go into your gadgetbox to pick up a grenade. But this will make that your weapons must be layed down and a grenade will come into your hand instead.
Not like if you had choosen to have rifle in slot 1 in your weaponbelt and grenades in slot 2 in your weaponbelt. Here the grenade would be trhown instantly when hitting the 2 key and rifle still left in your other hand. You with me, this far ? Very simple controls and realistic.

v.dog
26th Mar 2008, 07:41
Games have to be so real those ever can get, to have a story you can even belive in.I hasten to disagree. Half-Life, System Shock 2, Portal, Thief, Deus Ex, KOTOR, and their ilk weren't the most realistic games, not by a long shot, but you could believe in their stories because they maintained consistency with the the rules set down by their universe. In KOTOR, you could shoot lightning from your fingertips, or send people flying through the air by waving your hand, because that what the laws of the Star Wars universe says you can do. If, on the other hand, you had the power to turn people into a dancing, cartoon fish that sings 'Don't eat the yellow snow', you'd be pulled out of the story because it makes no sense compared to everything else.

Also, the primary goal of a game is always to be fun. Aspects of reality should be added, removed, or modified, according to how much fun they add to the game. Things like eating, sleeping, drinking, and going to the toilet, whilst realistic, aren't all that fun, and so most games tend to avoid them. As a developer, you've got to ask yourself, is this something the player will enjoy doing? If not, ditch it, regardless of how 'real' it is.
Trespasser is one of the best examples of a game that failed to ask that question.

dimaf1985
26th Mar 2008, 08:00
Ya i agree. There's no sense in reaching TOO far for realism. The weaponbelt idea that Iceballz put out there is original, but unnecessary. For instance, i dont remember a time in DX1 when i needed to "clear out a room." The combat was set up in such a way where you have to tactically approach a combat situation. Snipe, evade, hide, use Ballistic Protection, Invisibility, etc. If you really had to take down a group of enemies, throw a couple of gas grenades and take them out with a shottie while theyre coughing. And so on and so forth. Setting up weapon macros detracts from the action, and has you focussed more on what buttons to press on your mouse and keyboard. Remember, the whole point of the belt in DX1 was to quickly access some of the items you use OFTEN out of your inventory, so you dont have to press the 'I' key every two seconds to equip them. If theres one thing i would change about the inventory system, it would be carrying capacity. One of the VERY VERY FEW things i would take from DX2 is the ability to add inventory slots if you have the nano-muscle aug. Makes sense right? If youre stronger you can carry more.

IceBallz
26th Mar 2008, 09:12
Ya i agree. There's no sense in reaching TOO far for realism. The weaponbelt idea that Iceballz put out there is original, but unnecessary. For instance, i dont remember a time in DX1 when i needed to "clear out a room." The combat was set up in such a way where you have to tactically approach a combat situation. Snipe, evade, hide, use Ballistic Protection, Invisibility, etc. If you really had to take down a group of enemies, throw a couple of gas grenades and take them out with a shottie while theyre coughing. And so on and so forth. Setting up weapon macros detracts from the action, and has you focussed more on what buttons to press on your mouse and keyboard. Remember, the whole point of the belt in DX1 was to quickly access some of the items you use OFTEN out of your inventory, so you dont have to press the 'I' key every two seconds to equip them. If theres one thing i would change about the inventory system, it would be carrying capacity. One of the VERY VERY FEW things i would take from DX2 is the ability to add inventory slots if you have the nano-muscle aug. Makes sense right? If youre stronger you can carry more.

Still the left mouse button will be shoot and right mouse button will be interact. But like in DX1 you could first throw a gas grenade and then instant throw a frag grenade on them. But in my idea you can't in that speed limit, if not those both greandes is attached to your weaponbelt. But it would be really waste of grenades and you could not use a rifle or pistol.

Just becurse you don't get handicap, it don't mean necessery that it's a bad idea. Well if you could carry a trailer on your back, it still mean that you can't just pull up 10 different weapons in 10 nano seconds ? I don't really understand what's the problem to have specific slots for weapons like as gadgets.

Still i go for max two weapons in same time in inventory bar, not more and no less. If you don't go for fast throwing of grenades or dual wild. Still you have rest of your inventory bar left of 7 slots to your often used other eguipment, but no weapons here. Only grenades. But in this case your weapons will go down and this will make it slower to get a grenade up. But you still have the possibilty to take your hands to grenades, with easy macro key press.

I would lay up my weaponbelt like macro key 1 pistol/revolver, macro key 2 rifle and macro key 3 for grenades, but in gadgetbox. So you see, you have still grenades there. But not in your weaponbelt, this will make your grenades take time to be pulled up from gadgetbelt. But if you want them come up faster. Change pistol to grenades instead, in weaponbelt and you get instant throw on grenades. You even don't need to hold them, before throwing then at enemy. Very easy and realistic in simple way. He still have only two arms and limits of weapons of choose to carry close to his arms.

I actually want some kind of realism, even in cyberpunk games. :)

P.S : And who said we are going for a mod of DX1 or DX2 here ?!? Not to be insulting, but i can't but it up more different. Sorry... We maybe will found places in DX3 there we have to clear out rooms, who knows ?

dimaf1985
26th Mar 2008, 09:48
I see what you're saying. You can pull out weapons in the weaponbelt faster, and have different combinations like a gun and a grenade. Or two grenades , but that would be a waste of the weaponbelt. You can still have grenades in the gadgets, but it would take more time to pull them out. Like i said it is an original idea, i just think it is too much. Every game that has a quick inventory system for the 1-9 buttons is there for the convenience of the player. They don't use it to add realism to the game, just make it easy to access inventory. I never said your idea was bad, just unnecessary. Maybe I'm wrong. If it is tweaked propely your idea could work. It is very original, still a very minor detail. I hope they get plot/setting/engine/characters/RPG elements/SDK worked out properly first, and then work on the finer points.

IceBallz
26th Mar 2008, 10:01
I see what you're saying. You can pull out weapons in the weaponbelt faster, and have different combinations like a gun and a grenade. Or two grenades , but that would be a waste of the weaponbelt. You can still have grenades in the gadgets, but it would take more time to pull them out. Like i said it is an original idea, i just think it is too much. Every game that has a quick inventory system for the 1-9 buttons is there for the convenience of the player. They don't use it to add realism to the game, just make it easy to access inventory. I never said your idea was bad, just unnecessary. Maybe I'm wrong. If it is tweaked propely your idea could work. It is very original, still a very minor detail. I hope they get plot/setting/engine/characters/RPG elements/SDK worked out properly first, and then work on the finer points.

Me too. Everything is just been started up, i belive. So there is not much to go on. The biggest danger for my idea is, if the game will be to much for consol controls.

Damn i hate this consol freaks. They destroying everything with HUD, interface, controls, just everything that makes games to envolve. I think consol should have their own games and controls to them and PC have their own games and controls. Then we can really start to see new game ideas to pop-up to PC, aslike to consols. Well, we will see soon. What have been done, this far with Deus Ex 3. Damn, Deus Ex 3 could even be like World of Warcraft. If it keeps it only for PC only.

GruntOwner
26th Mar 2008, 11:04
Me too. Everything is just been started up, i belive. So there is not much to go on. The biggest danger for my idea is, if the game will be to much for consol controls.

Damn i hate this consol freaks. They destroying everything with HUD, interface, controls, just everything that makes games to envolve. I think consol should have their own games and controls to them and PC have their own games and controls. Then we can really start to see new game ideas to pop-up to PC, aslike to consols. Well, we will see soon. What have been done, this far with Deus Ex 3. Damn, Deus Ex 3 could even be like World of Warcraft. If it keeps it only for PC only.

Seconced, where do I sign? Console features like extremely limited on hand equipment and realism heavy combat have their place, in military sims and console games. Deus Ex is neither of them and with any luck never will be.

dimaf1985
26th Mar 2008, 20:19
Me too. Everything is just been started up, i belive. So there is not much to go on. The biggest danger for my idea is, if the game will be to much for consol controls.

Damn i hate this consol freaks. They destroying everything with HUD, interface, controls, just everything that makes games to envolve. I think consol should have their own games and controls to them and PC have their own games and controls. Then we can really start to see new game ideas to pop-up to PC, aslike to consols. Well, we will see soon. What have been done, this far with Deus Ex 3. Damn, Deus Ex 3 could even be like World of Warcraft. If it keeps it only for PC only.

Well now i understand exactly why you want to use your weaponbelt idea. DX3 needs to have complex menus, lots of controls and different characteristics to the weapons. I agree with you completely about the console kids. DX2 made everyone angry with its console garbage. They have to do EVERYTHING that they can to make it a PC game FIRST.

However, I remember playing the Hardcore mod for DX1. It was fun to play ONCE, but if they made the original game like that, it would not have worked. Too much emphasis on combat mechanics takes away from focus on other aspects, like atmosphere, augs, and stealth. But i do agree that there needs to be a steep learning curve like in DX1.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 06:00
I think loads of players will enjoy this split of eguipment bar that i have been suggesting. Like have only two different weapons in eguipment bar ones/per choose. This will make the choices much more complex and will give players all different choices while they playing the game. Well, it may take like 15min for some players. To just learn all the tweaks they can do with their all different setups, to tweaking their weapons choices to their weaponbelt to maximum every time they go into fights. But this will be like a realtime skill from player to player and a thing that will make gameplay value go up even more. Some maybe want to lay more skills to their dual wild skill, then heavy-weapon skill for example. Two different skills, but both of this skills maybe will be the same of importens in the game and will give more or less to all players, just depending on different type of player styles. There could even be a skill that gives you more speed in changing betwin weaponbelt and gadgetbox. This skill maybe will fit some players more then dual wild skill, the heavy-weapon skill, light-weapon skill or hacking skill for example. But just to explore all the different setups you can do with choice of weapons to your weaponbelt is amazing. Or place pistol and rifle in weaponbelt and grenades in gadgetbox, for example. Or just go in with dual wild. Even throwing knifes can be in one hand or set in both hands and dual wild with knifes will be activated. That would be cool to see, too. But like i said in begin. Rifles, submachineguns, heavymachineguns, rocketlaunchers or heavier stuff is out of question in dual wild mode. Only up to pistols, revolvers and knifes if that could be done.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 09:10
TWEAKS YOU CAN CHOOSE TO USE IN DIFFERENT MOMENTS :

Tweak 1 : You can have pistol placed under key/macro 1 and rifle placed under key/macro 2 in your weaponbelt. In this setup you can even have grenades and/or knives placed under key/macro 3 to 9 in your gadgetbox [pockets]. In this setup your character will pull down his pistol or rifle depending what's up at the moment if you go for a grenade/knife. Then the left mouse buttom will be fire for grenade or knife. But notice, that your other weapons will be pulled down in this tweak. Becurse of the rifle in your weaponbelt, it will slow you down. All rifles, like as shotguns in weaponbelt will slow character movements down.

Tweak 2 : You can have a rifle placed under key/macro 1 and grenades/knifes placed under key/macro 2, depending what throwing weapon you go for to have in your weaponbelt. In this setup you can still place extra throwing weapons in key/macro 3 to 9. But this will still make your character to pull his weapons down, for reaching his gadgetbox [pockets]. Here you have throwing weapon placed in your weaponbelt and not only pockets. So like here you have grenades/knifes in your key/macro 2. So it's enuff to press the key/macro 2 for throwing weapon instanly been thrown at enemy and your rifle still been up in your hand.

Tweak 3 : You can have a pistol/revolver/knife placed under key/macro 1 and pistol/revolver/knife placed under key/macro 2. In this tweak you can only go in with two pistols, two revolvers or two knifes of same type, with same attachments. This will make the dual wild go on, both on pressing on key/macro 1 as like pressing on key/macro 2 [choice is all yours]. This will make lefthand weapon to autoaim on enemies that is maximum 5m from you only on the leftside of the screen. Like the same with righthand weapon, but only autoaiming on rightside of screen and max 5m from you. But notice. Here you can't change to rifle, becurse gadgetbox [pockets] don't take any guns. But still you can go for grenades in your pockets. Notice that you have no rifle/shotgun/rocketlauncher in weaponbelt at all, so this make your character movements more fast.

Tweak 4 : You can have a shotgun/rifle placed under key/macro 1 and a shotgun/rifle placed under key/macro 2. This tweak will make your movement very slow becurse that you have two shotguns/rifles placed in your weaponbelt. But here you have fast reloading, with only change of shotgun/rifle and more ammo in one shootout round. So more ammo, fast reload in one shootout round and more firepower. But your character movements are much more slower. So this is up to player type. Wild marksman shooter or a flexibel dual wilder.

Tweak 5 : You can have a sniper rifle placed under key/macro 1 and wallmines placed under key/macro 2. This will make you to easily shoot on enemy in thin corridors and have fast to get your hands on your wallmines. Only to press key/macro 2 and your character throws a wallmine at the wall you are pointing at. This will make your fallback floating much more faster. Then have to go for the wallmines in your gadgetbox [pockets]. Here you even don't have to pull down your sniper rifle, while throwing the wallmine at the wall. But you don't have any other gun to get your hands too. So this tweak is more for the players that are more like snipers in their style. 1 shot, 1 kill...

Like you noticed, i said wallmines in weaponbelt. Yeah it's possible to lay gadgets into weaponbelt, but not weapons into gadgetbox [pockets]. But in this case the weaponbelt will loose some of it's character. But like in "Tweak 5" it could do some reason, to have gadgets (wallmines) in weaponbelt. Maybe even lay the drone remotecontrol in the weaponbelt, instead of having it in your gadgetbox [pockets].

There maybe are more tweaks, but this is some of them. :)

gamer0004
27th Mar 2008, 10:18
I don't think it is a good idea. You could easily avoid it by pressing F1 every time you spot an enemy and equip the gun you like, although it'd be really annoying if you'd have to do so everytime.
Besides, I really don't like it when they have this kind of system in games 'cause you'll have to choose what weapon you're going to use before you fight. When the situation is different than how you'd expected it'd be, you've got a big problem. You're not flexible enough.
Well, when you're playing a game the brainy way, it's not a problem, but I want to play the game as an FPS too.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 11:42
I don't think it is a good idea. You could easily avoid it by pressing F1 every time you spot an enemy and equip the gun you like, although it'd be really annoying if you'd have to do so everytime.
Besides, I really don't like it when they have this kind of system in games 'cause you'll have to choose what weapon you're going to use before you fight. When the situation is different than how you'd expected it'd be, you've got a big problem. You're not flexible enough.
Well, when you're playing a game the brainy way, it's not a problem, but I want to play the game as an FPS too.

Then choose a rifle into key/macro 1 and a pistol into key/macro 2... In first place, easy...

Hehehe you still can. Belive me. It's just to have eyes open, what will happen behind next corner or just run into every room or field like a pure FPS-player and be killed with wrong setup into your weaponbelt. But i love to act like a pro and use my skills like a RPG player aswell a FPS player and combine those two all the time. If you go into Deus Ex world, it's not like Counter Strike or Half Life. It should be Deus Ex all the way. Envolved gameplay, that makes people to feel the connection to the world they play in. Like DX did 2000, DX3 will do even harder 2008. Eight years later. I want to be rid of this eight armed squid from 2000 and envolve it to a two armed human-oid in 2008 version.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 12:06
tou feel connected because of the storyline, not because you have to get an inhuman amount of intel better known as "save, die, learn and load". It limits the player too much and even today you can have at least 4 weapons on hand with no fuss, assuming that they're of variable sizes. If we're tyring for IRL combat it stops being Deus Ex, it becomes a gears of war clone with s slightly better storyline, which in the long run you don't really care about because they put so much work into the combat realism and having eleventy trillion of every weapon type to bother with a plot. IRL a single round to the chest will kill you, a single round in the leg will cripple you and probably leave you bleeding out. Conclusion, stop trying for realism, make the surroundings believable but the combat honestly doesn't matter. For the most part I avoided combat on the first unless there was loot involved.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 12:28
tou feel connected because of the storyline, not because you have to get an inhuman amount of intel better known as "save, die, learn and load". It limits the player too much and even today you can have at least 4 weapons on hand with no fuss, assuming that they're of variable sizes. If we're tyring for IRL combat it stops being Deus Ex, it becomes a gears of war clone with s slightly better storyline, which in the long run you don't really care about because they put so much work into the combat realism and having eleventy trillion of every weapon type to bother with a plot. IRL a single round to the chest will kill you, a single round in the leg will cripple you and probably leave you bleeding out. Conclusion, stop trying for realism, make the surroundings believable but the combat honestly doesn't matter. For the most part I avoided combat on the first unless there was loot involved.

Still you can't have 4 weapons on hand with no fuss. Not IRL at least. Yes in games you can have up to 9 weapons on hand with no problem, even 10 or 100 weapons if there is so many weapons in game. But have like 4 weapons on hand, with the load of eguipment we are supposed to carry in Deus Ex 3, wont work out. Then if we try 4 weapons on hand IRL with a fully loaded backpack with 20 gadgets, of a total weight on 30-40kg. Then it is just insane, that you can have all 4 weapons on hand. It's just impossible, even in games by my thoughts.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 12:50
It's the age of nanotech, a kevlar vest as thick as a modern flak jacket would offer the same protetion as a modern blast door. Size and weight differ significantly, and bear in mind that with any luck we'll be wearing a trenchcoat. I think it's bowling for columbine that shows how you can inconspicuously keep about 11 firearms concealed on your person assuming that your willing to look a tad chubby, then add to that the fact that all weapons will probably collapse their barrel when not in use, after all, we're measuring things by the nano meter, it's not going to make a noticable difference to have the barrel fold into itself. It's easy to have four weapons on hand today, they might stand out a bit but that's what the coat is for, and the coat in itself can add to that capacity.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 13:15
It's the age of nanotech, a kevlar vest as thick as a modern flak jacket would offer the same protetion as a modern blast door. Size and weight differ significantly, and bear in mind that with any luck we'll be wearing a trenchcoat. I think it's bowling for columbine that shows how you can inconspicuously keep about 11 firearms concealed on your person assuming that your willing to look a tad chubby, then add to that the fact that all weapons will probably collapse their barrel when not in use, after all, we're measuring things by the nano meter, it's not going to make a noticable difference to have the barrel fold into itself. It's easy to have four weapons on hand today, they might stand out a bit but that's what the coat is for, and the coat in itself can add to that capacity.

We will still fire with iron and iron have a weight that is 1g for 1g iron. Nothing of it will change in modern time. Then if we put 4 weapons into a coat, we will be very unflexible and slow. Even slower to go into prone or lay down would take years to make with a fully loaded coat of 4 weapons. Coat have pockets, that works like the gadgetbox [pockets]. Weaponbelt is a belt there you set your two weapons of choose. This won't make your prone or lay down movement to slow down. Becurse weapons hanging below your torso. There is a imported vector part in your body and this you find there your belt are placed. So if you hang your weapons on your belt, you make this importent moves to not change or be slowed down.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 13:34
If I'm storing all my on hand weapons, all 2 of them, by my waste then the fact of the matter is that I deserve to die throiugh Darwinism. Also, you fail to drasp the concept of nanotech. A single nanometer is 10 atoms across, and still strong. We won't need 1kg of iron because we would be able to achieve the sam resistence to forces with 10g of iron. A strand of hait would be as strong as a girder. Bullets would be hollowed out for the most part, weapons would be extremely light, even disposable rocket launchers, They would fold into easy to store shapes by folding as necessary and what was a buky assault rifle in the modern era will become an incredibely thin, so thin in fact that it cound easily pass as your back if you don't mind it being a bit loose to keep the spine moving, collapsable bullet hose that weighs about .75kg rather than 7.5kg.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 13:54
If I'm storing all my on hand weapons, all 2 of them, by my waste then the fact of the matter is that I deserve to die throiugh Darwinism. Also, you fail to drasp the concept of nanotech. A single nanometer is 10 atoms across, and still strong. We won't need 1kg of iron because we would be able to achieve the sam resistence to forces with 10g of iron. A strand of hait would be as strong as a girder. Bullets would be hollowed out for the most part, weapons would be extremely light, even disposable rocket launchers, They would fold into easy to store shapes by folding as necessary and what was a buky assault rifle in the modern era will become an incredibely thin, so thin in fact that it cound easily pass as your back if you don't mind it being a bit loose to keep the spine moving, collapsable bullet hose that weighs about .75kg rather than 7.5kg.

Hehehe. Yeah maybe. If we go throw two or four more world wars, we will maybe see this technology. But i fear, not. I belive more in large laser rifles then folded rocketlaunchers and thin rifles.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 13:59
We don't need the wars to encourage advancement, the space elevator has been work-in-progress for ages, and it relies on nano tech. Curing cancer cn be achieved with it, and as far as technological breakthroughs go, an efficient means of producing it would be right up there with fusion power. A war would only slow the progress with countries baring themselves off from foreign researchers.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 14:08
We don't need the wars to encourage advancement, the space elevator has been work-in-progress for ages, and it relies on nano tech. Curing cancer cn be achieved with it, and as far as technological breakthroughs go, an efficient means of producing it would be right up there with fusion power. A war would only slow the progress with countries baring themselves off from foreign researchers.

Well nano is reality, like as fusion power. But still have 4 weapons on a human torso is really impossible. Human body is structured in one specific way. If you don't now rebuild this body into something unhuman. Not even nano tech will change this fact, like you can't lick your elbow. Same thing. But nano tech can give you power to carry more. But to nano tech making weapons to not be in the way for human bodystructure, no way.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 14:16
One weapon slung over your back, collapsed into an east to carry box like form. A medium weapon strapped to your leg, also in a compact box form, one pitol sized weapon in a secure holster on thw waist, another on the lower leg, or save that for a melee weapon, one in a pouch on the torso, and a trechcoat laden with ammo. Possible, and given that we're soaking up bullets like a tank on steroids, I think we can ignore the realism aspect of minor restrictions.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 14:38
One weapon slung over your back, collapsed into an east to carry box like form. A medium weapon strapped to your leg, also in a compact box form, one pitol sized weapon in a secure holster on thw waist, another on the lower leg, or save that for a melee weapon, one in a pouch on the torso, and a trechcoat laden with ammo. Possible, and given that we're soaking up bullets like a tank on steroids, I think we can ignore the realism aspect of minor restrictions.

Well we can. But i want still to get game more complex, then just made up with pistols everywhere over my body. I like to see my character to carry full sized rifles/shotguns hanging in my belt under the coat. Like when it's time to reload, I just pull down the shotgun and go for next shotgun in my belt. So you can go into battle with two fully loaded shotguns, if the place and time is okej. Or you just keep to the pistol and rifle, for example. But have loads of weapons attached to your body, keeps it not intresting at all. I want every battle to mean something in game, like in DX1. But here even more. Really hate the original setups in RPG games with the limitless setup of your macrobar. It's like going into Call of Duty, with 2 rifles and 3 pistols at the same time. No sence at all. I want to act with care in my Deus Ex gaming and not just have to go in like a noob FPS-player.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 14:55
First off, I am in no way endorsing several makes of each weapon type, I was merely stating how it is more than possible to carry more than two weapons, secondly, if you won't want to run around like a duke nukem wannabe, then sneak more and talk your way to solutions. If you don't like how comabt was done, then don't do the combat and don't spend resources changing the combat, simply change your technique. There were almost always ways around combat, or at least direct firefights. Use them and stop trying to change the system that everyone else loves. The weapon belt idea was tried, if less complex than your way, in IW and it sucked like Kate Moss in the presence of cocaine.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 15:24
First off, I am in no way endorsing several makes of each weapon type, I was merely stating how it is more than possible to carry more than two weapons, secondly, if you won't want to run around like a duke nukem wannabe, then sneak more and talk your way to solutions. If you don't like how comabt was done, then don't do the combat and don't spend resources changing the combat, simply change your technique. There were almost always ways around combat, or at least direct firefights. Use them and stop trying to change the system that everyone else loves. The weapon belt idea was tried, if less complex than your way, in IW and it sucked like Kate Moss in the presence of cocaine.

DX2 system was not even close to my idea, so don't bring in that stuff. Becurse it was and i have saying that all the time. My system is more complex and makes it even more dangerous to go for battle. Then it's better to avoid a battle and sneak around or talk your way to solutions. Then go in game with more weapons then two, in your coat and go for instant kill. Like you have been telling me. So my system with weaponbelt are not making it more easier to kill. It's just opposite, all the way. You have just be awake and tweak your belt to your enveiroment, all the time. But original DX1 equipment bar was just to simple and not so complex. DX2 tried to be complex, too complex. But had all weapons in weaponbelt all the time. Becurse the HUD was made for consols, like as PC-game. My idea is complex to all technology and not a make-up to get the game to work in consols too.

:eek:

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 15:31
Screw comprimise for the consoles, make the game around the PC, compromise kills complexity. As for changing the wepaon to your environment, it just means people will save, scout out what sort it is and then load to get the correct layout, it won't be more fast paced, it will just be trial and error in the style of ye olde tomb raider. I never said that it would make combat easier, merely that if you don't like the combat system of the original, don't use it, but if you make combat so arkward that there's no real reason to use it, we don't have deus ex anymore, we have splinter cell with a different engine for gameplay purposes. All options should be balanced, otherwise it's not a choise, it's an idiot test.

IceBallz
27th Mar 2008, 15:45
Screw comprimise for the consoles, make the game around the PC, compromise kills complexity. As for changing the wepaon to your environment, it just means people will save, scout out what sort it is and then load to get the correct layout, it won't be more fast paced, it will just be trial and error in the style of ye olde tomb raider. I never said that it would make combat easier, merely that if you don't like the combat system of the original, don't use it, but if you make combat so arkward that there's no real reason to use it, we don't have deus ex anymore, we have splinter cell with a different engine for gameplay purposes. All options should be balanced, otherwise it's not a choise, it's an idiot test.

Save limits can be done or even take away every kind of saves. I have even suggesting that enemies spawn in random places and not the same places every time. As weapon chooses are mostly depending on how the place looks like. Wide open, better to go with rifle in hand and pistol in belt. Small and short corridors assault rifle/submachinegun and grenades in belt or long corridors even sniper rifle and pistol in belt. Offices/small rooms go in with dual wild or assault rifle and grenades in belt or what ever. But this all will be limited to your weaponbelt and pockets. Then the skill are up to you, how good you are on reading the environment. All this skill are up to the person that plays the game and not to the augs and biomods. You are the hero who are aware about your characters life, every moment in game. By actually read of the places you are in and make recons on places you are heading into. So there is no way this idea will make this game to a crazy FPS.

More like a hardcore RPG/FPS with loads of personal skill to it too.

GruntOwner
27th Mar 2008, 15:58
Limited saves have already been discounted as an awful idea due to the complexity of the story. Enemies spawning in random areas will just get annoying and senseless, in the original it made sense for them to be where they were because it was a viable patrol route with tactical advantages. finding a guard patrolling the lunch room with a GEP gun would be exactly what mindless shooters represent. Why put so much effort into taking chances when the current system workes beautifully?

gamer0004
27th Mar 2008, 18:02
Well we can. But i want still to get game more complex, then just made up with pistols everywhere over my body. I like to see my character to carry full sized rifles/shotguns hanging in my belt under the coat. Like when it's time to reload, I just pull down the shotgun and go for next shotgun in my belt. So you can go into battle with two fully loaded shotguns, if the place and time is okej. Or you just keep to the pistol and rifle, for example. But have loads of weapons attached to your body, keeps it not intresting at all. I want every battle to mean something in game, like in DX1. But here even more. Really hate the original setups in RPG games with the limitless setup of your macrobar. It's like going into Call of Duty, with 2 rifles and 3 pistols at the same time. No sence at all. I want to act with care in my Deus Ex gaming and not just have to go in like a noob FPS-player.

You might want the game to be more complex on this point but I don't. These systems are always very annoying. Besides, DX isn't meant to be realistic. You can hide a GEP gun, a sniper rifle and a flamethrower under your coat but you can't equip 3 pistols?

DforDontAsk
27th Mar 2008, 21:24
Hope the emphasis won't be on just weapons. They're fun with FPS games, but Deus Ex is more than combat.

What I like to see is more hacking, cracking and unlocking. Some with explosive timers and/or turret activation if you don't hurry (then add the misery of a foot patrol, as you try to duck and wait until the timer is reset). To me the hacking (or trying to find the passwords to hack into email or the defenses) is what made DX special, as it's not RPG or FPS, it's classic cyberpunk, though.

Then add some more arms and what not sellers (if we could pick up extras to buy/sell/trade with such sellers, the better -- that's the RPG side that's appealing -- so we can customize our hardware [again, cyberpunk terminology and mindset]).

And how about being able to get in and use a bot ourselves, to be a mech warrior for a while? Or to drive a car/helicopter to the next destination, even if it's a mindless 10 minute drive/flight with flashbacks that we learn more of JC's past (it's a good way to introduce more history even for new players, without getting even ADD/ADHD players bored)?

This game has so much to offer.


So much awesome packed in so little text. The ONLY thing that bothers me is the flashbacks. I feel it would be a little out of place in a Deus Ex game.

As for Dual Wielding, the mousewheel changing your run speed, and a weaponbelt, it would make combat and the game in general more complicated than it should be.

Caradoc
27th Mar 2008, 21:52
Just keep things simple and base the inventory carrying limit on item weight. (first game simulated this quite well). It makes most sense. A pistol for example weights less than a shotgun thus JC can easily carry more pistols than shotguns. Don't change what isn't broken. About the quick item belt, just do exactly same as in DX1. Ten quickslots and no hassle.

IceBallz
28th Mar 2008, 05:48
Just keep things simple and base the inventory carrying limit on item weight. (first game simulated this quite well). It makes most sense. A pistol for example weights less than a shotgun thus JC can easily carry more pistols than shotguns. Don't change what isn't broken. About the quick item belt, just do exactly same as in DX1. Ten quickslots and no hassle.

Waste the ten quickslots. Have two quickslots to shooting weapons and eight quickslots, like working as pockets to gadgets for the most. But this eight won't take any shooting weapons, like as the other two first does.

It's not how many pistols you can have in inventory or how much weight you can have in inventory. I talk about the equipment bar in the HUD, like DX1. There you could put up your macros to eguipment in inventory. This macrobar should only have place for max two shooting weapon macros. Like 2 pistols/rifles in the same time and not like even up to 3 shooting weapons of any sort. Then your inventory interface can include like 20 weapons, if you want to or have space. But no more then 2 shooting weapon macros in macrobar in the gaming HUD. If people can't handle this simple task, they can't even handle the storyline in DX3. Could be to advanced to understand. :nut:

OMG, kids. Give me a break. To advaced to handle. The only advanced here is that people want only to mod DX1 and wont not see new possibilties to the controls. Even some nutcases are to much for a consol version, so they just throw my idea straight out of the window. They even don't blink. They want DX3 be like DX1, but while you start to think about it. You even can't make the DX3 to look like DX1. Becurse if people goes for easy consol controls and waste all advanced ideas. There will be a screen covered with a huge HUD, like in DX2 and graphics will be messy. But it's just only my thought. I go for PC and envolved cotrols, then if some consol kids here throw my idea. Great. Then they will get a updated DX2, thanks.

Romeo
28th Mar 2008, 06:28
Me too. Everything is just been started up, i belive. So there is not much to go on. The biggest danger for my idea is, if the game will be to much for consol controls.

Damn i hate this consol freaks. They destroying everything with HUD, interface, controls, just everything that makes games to envolve. I think consol should have their own games and controls to them and PC have their own games and controls. Then we can really start to see new game ideas to pop-up to PC, aslike to consols. Well, we will see soon. What have been done, this far with Deus Ex 3. Damn, Deus Ex 3 could even be like World of Warcraft. If it keeps it only for PC only.

I own Deus Ex for both PC and Xbox, and I honestly find this to be an incredibly stupid comment. 90% of the time, the consoles have absolutely no effect on their PC brethren, as they're either released after the PC versions have been optimized, or are built in a seperated manner, which generally results in the consoles getting a de-tuned version of the PC. If your going to try and slam something, have the courtesy to back it up with something sensible.

IceBallz
28th Mar 2008, 07:18
I own Deus Ex for both PC and Xbox, and I honestly find this to be an incredibly stupid comment. 90% of the time, the consoles have absolutely no effect on their PC brethren, as they're either released after the PC versions have been optimized, or are built in a seperated manner, which generally results in the consoles getting a de-tuned version of the PC. If your going to try and slam something, have the courtesy to back it up with something sensible.

Then my idea is just great, then.

Wikipedia : Deus Ex features combat similar to first-person shooters, with real-time action, a first-person perspective and reflex-based gameplay. As the player will often encounter enemies in groups, combat often tends toward a tactical approach, including the use of cover, strafing, and "hit-and-run".

Combat often tends toward a tactical approad. Hmmm, well... If this is the case with DX1. Then why are my idea so hard to learn or use in a envolved DX3 from DX1. Is this just some bull, a nutcase have written in Wikipedia or is it just me and him. If we make the character only have two shooting weapons to hand or all weapons at the same time. Witch of this setups are actually envolving the fact that combat often tends toward a tactical approad, including the use of cover, strafing, and "hit-and-run". My split of the macrobar will envolve every acpect of the game features that have been written into Wikipedia about DX1. But still it's all different from DX2, that are not at all the same to DX1 or my idea. I like evolution of DX1, but not DX2 at all. Evolution are not made by keep old stuff from DX1 like it was, quite it was good. But not best, it was good at that point of time. Like year 2000. Then i say, welcome to 2008.

Romeo
29th Mar 2008, 03:06
I don't have a problem with your idea, you misinterpret me. My problem was with the one fellow trying to blame consoles for the lackluster performence of some PC games.

IceBallz
29th Mar 2008, 04:08
I don't have a problem with your idea, you misinterpret me. My problem was with the one fellow trying to blame consoles for the lackluster performence of some PC games.

Ok. Well, this would work in consols and PC-version. It's just that my own experience of the DX:IW was that the HUD was to arcadish and to much ment to be a consol game. So all controls (macros) was just put into the HUD, that made the player screen look like a mess. I don't want to experince that again. I just want to envolve the DX1 macrobar to it's old look, with some new tactical element to it. Like just only have max two shooting weapons in same time in the macrobar or HUD. This is the ultimate for making game to use more of this tactical approad and hit-and-run. Like having mousescroller only for regulate your movement speed. Like rifles/shotguns make more noice in your weaponbelt and make your movement slower. This could make it hard to fix into consols, becurse there is no scrollers in handcontrols. This have many people been saying no too, becurse they want the scroller to be for equipment choose and like it will not work in consols. That's why i don't like to discuss about this. Like why i want anything about this. This just makes me too see a replica of DX2 in DX3 and nothing else or better. Becurse some envolved controls and HUD's are better not to be seen or be seen in DX3. This tells me much of how consols screws new ideas up, for PC-games to envolve in the controls and like as overall gameplay.

Romeo
29th Mar 2008, 07:20
Ok, yes, I completely agree with the fact the H.U.D. in Invisible War a sin to gamers, however that can hardly be attributed to consoles. The console version was started after the PC version had, so it's quite obvious that the miserable H.U.D. would have existed whether or not consoles recieved the game. You'll generally find games are made for PC first, and console second (Morrowind, Deus Ex, pretty much every RTS in existence), however devellopers are being forced to publish on consoles now as well, simply due to the high rate of piracy among PC games. The only way to see substantial enough sales is to sell to those who piracy is slightly more difficult to perform: Consoles. So though you can detest the fact that consoles are here now too, you should probably learn to accept it, and not blame a game's problems on them, because they're not going anywhere soon.

IceBallz
29th Mar 2008, 09:35
DX:IW was planned for consols in the beginning. There was just some issues in the graphic engine, that made it take more time to been finished to consol. Then this about piracy. There is just the same amount of piracy to consol games, like there is to PC games. Maybe even bigger, in value of lost of money. The only thing that is making piracy so big today, is the lack of content that have been layed into modern games and the lack of envolving new stuff to them. Much of piracy is just that people don't pay loads of money to get nothing of value. People pay money to get much of cotent and envolved games. The only thing that makes piracy go away, is to get the most games worth their price. Like DX1 was, but that DX2 never reached up to. I buy every game that have heart in them and have been programmed with some great new ideas in them. Like the Call of Duty 4 was short in story but had great cinamatic graphic and had this new ranking system to multiplay as a new great idea to envolve the Call of Duty series online. Maybe even this new ranking system was the thing that envolved and saved Call of Duty 4 from the most piracy out there and not consols.

DforDontAsk
29th Mar 2008, 15:04
IceBallz, I have the perfect solution for you. When Deus Ex 3 comes out, YOU pick the two slots that you'll use for weapons and 5 for gadgets or whatever. And leave the inventory bar alone for the rest of us.

IceBallz
29th Mar 2008, 15:18
Well why you don't download a cheat patch to the game when it comes out. That makes it possible to but even more weapon macros into game. Like to F1 to F12 keys, so you can run with 22 macros at the same time. Becurse you are so lame to even learn to hit the "I" button betwin "U" and "O"... Or even plan your approach in game in some manner ways, or even learn the whole system...

:lol:

Are u a squid or do you want to be one in future ?!? :lmao:

DforDontAsk
29th Mar 2008, 15:48
Are u a squid or do you want to be one in future ?!?

Yes I do. It's supposed to be the future, dammit, not a military simulator.

You know what would be really lame? If Edios Montreal had a collective stroke and thought that putting your two-weapon and gadget bar system in DX3 was a good idea.

I'm not downloading a patch because your stupid ass idea might have somehow made it through the screening process.

IceBallz
29th Mar 2008, 17:07
I know, you have a console and have no more keys to hit. :lmao:

GruntOwner
30th Mar 2008, 12:13
Iceballz. grow up. The whole forum is up in arms against this idea. Let it die and stop with the petty mud slinging.

IceBallz
30th Mar 2008, 15:48
Guys like System Shock 2 ? :scratch:

Guys like Deus Ex ? :scratch:

Guys like S.T.A.L.K.E.R. ? :scratch:

Oh no. :eek: They like hardcore shoot'em up games, stupied me trying to envolve a tactical-RPG. :nut:

If there is so big fan core of Halo and Crisis fans here, it maybe better to just wait and keep shut up of any new ideas. :whistle:

Becurse i can still burn bad games on my lawn and DX2 was one of those victims.

GruntOwner
30th Mar 2008, 18:49
I'm a ahlo fanatic on a level that makes ghandi look like a shifty crack dealer, but Halo was an FPS, pure FPS. Deus Ex offers more options than Halo and at the end of the day the 2 are incomparable. Halo's features have their place and Deus Ex's features have their place, but at the end of the day they are not the same game type. They never will be and anyone who tries to merge them needs to understand that it's going to take more than limiting the player to having fewer options and saving game more often.

Kneo24
30th Mar 2008, 20:31
Iceballz. grow up. The whole forum is up in arms against this idea. Let it die and stop with the petty mud slinging.

He was laughed off this section of the Eidos forums when this one first started for the same ****. I guess he thought he could get away with it again since most of those people aren't around anymore.

IceBallz
2nd Apr 2008, 07:30
He was laughed off this section of the Eidos forums when this one first started for the same ****. I guess he thought he could get away with it again since most of those people aren't around anymore.

Who spilled my drink !!!

minus0ne
2nd Apr 2008, 11:59
Who spilled my drink !!!
You're really going to keep going aren't you?

gamer0004
2nd Apr 2008, 14:44
Guys like System Shock 2 ? :scratch:

Guys like Deus Ex ? :scratch:

Guys like S.T.A.L.K.E.R. ? :scratch:

Oh no. :eek: They like hardcore shoot'em up games, stupied me trying to envolve a tactical-RPG. :nut:

If there is so big fan core of Halo and Crisis fans here, it maybe better to just wait and keep shut up of any new ideas. :whistle:

Becurse i can still burn bad games on my lawn and DX2 was one of those victims.

There is simply no point in the system. If this feature would implemented then they'd have to down-scale the inventory too. Oh and the augs, 'cause they're not realistic. Oh and the year 2052 or whatever time in the future, because we don't exactly know what will happen then.

IceBallz
2nd Apr 2008, 19:11
You're really going to keep going aren't you?

You too ?

IceBallz
2nd Apr 2008, 19:12
There is simply no point in the system. If this feature would implemented then they'd have to down-scale the inventory too. Oh and the augs, 'cause they're not realistic. Oh and the year 2052 or whatever time in the future, because we don't exactly know what will happen then.

Why should they need to down-scale the inventory ? :scratch:

minus0ne
2nd Apr 2008, 20:37
I can just see JCD with his 'weapon belt' now, sporting a sniper rifle and GEP gun hanging from his belt. Not ridiculous in the least.

Vasarto
2nd Apr 2008, 21:17
Well the weaponbelt should work the same way as in deus Ex 1..maybe with a few improvments as well. However I do not feel we need to Dual Wield in Deus Ex 3 as this is a game that is SUPPOST to be more stealth and conspiracy than a halo 1-3 game. Dual wielding would just ruin the experiance.