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View Full Version : (Dx1) Dragons Tooth VS (Dx:IW) Ninja Sword



B0b_P@ge
11th Feb 2008, 03:57
Mannn, I was so incredibly disappointed when I found the ninja sword in DX:IW. I was fully augmented with melee-augs, sneaked behind characters and I had to swing twice (usually by the first swing, they turn around and kill you). WTF. Dx1 did it right with making the Dragons Tooth powerful only if you heavily invested in your characters melee abilities. Not to mention it looked infinitely cooler, I mean the sword glowed blue! In night levels I usually used it to lighten my path, plus the flesh-piercing/ bone-cutting sound it made when you hit people was so satisfying. The ninja sword didn't add any cool sounds. Also, it couldn't break through weak/wooden doors like the dragons tooth could. Dx1 was about being to play any style you wanted, and if you played as a melee character, it would of been properly balanced to work. In DX:IW, they totally dropped the ball, characters where really difficult to kill, regardless of tactics (sneak, or lure) and the levels where to small to even try out alternate paths to sneak & kill or avoid altogether. In Dx1, even MJ12 commands weren't impossible to kill IF you sneaked behind them and hit them in the head, but in DX:IW it didn't matter! Like I said before, man did the DXIW team drop the ball!

Kill Switch
11th Feb 2008, 04:12
Yes the Dragon Tooth sword is so incredibly cool looking and power full that it heavily amusing. But in my opinion, I enjoyed my runs through where I did not use the Dragon Tooth. I felt so over powered, switching on invisibility and run augmentations then quickly dispose of my enemy. Do not get me wrong, I wouldn't of had it any other way.

Meh, my two cents.

DXeXodus
11th Feb 2008, 05:41
The dragons tooth sword was great and there was a certain satisfaction felt by both finding the thing as well as using it to dispose of your enemies. I never even bothered with the stupid sword from DX:IW.

Yes, Eidos did drop the ball with DX2. A big heavy ball. Lets hope it landed on their foot and the pain it caused made them realise that they must try alot harder this time....

BTW.. B0b_P@ge: you say: "In night levels I usually used it to lighten my path"

Think you mean "dark areas"... DX never had day levels :)

Angel/0A
11th Feb 2008, 06:26
The only thing that sucked about the DTS was if you applied the multiplayer patch, the sword was essentially changed from a single blade into a shotgun, meaning it had 5 damage points instead of 1, so you couldn't use it to destroy some of the more durable destructible items anymore.

DXeXodus
11th Feb 2008, 09:07
I remember finding the dragons tooth sword and thinking "How the hell am I going to squeeze this thing in my inventory?" It took up four slots.... atleast you could drop all your other melle weapons for it... but still.

I suppose that is where DX2 maybe worked by not regarding weapon size, but rather amount, when deciding how much you can carry.

Boiny Bunny
11th Feb 2008, 10:42
DX's Dragon Tooth rocked my world - one of my favorite melee weapons in any game ever (right up there with Halo's sword and hammer).

In DX2 the damage sucked, the appearence SUCKED, the sound effects SUCKED, it was basically a completely useless weapon - even if you found the special version called the real 'Dragon Tooth'!!!

carldavid1887
11th Feb 2008, 16:18
I agree with you guys on that topic. And as Bob_p@ge mentioned, it is very useful, like smashing desks and drawers and enlighting your path :)

Frog
11th Feb 2008, 19:33
I liked using stealth, emp-damage, and the katana in IW to take down droids!

Was it necessary? No. Was it fun? Yes!

:cool:

Unstoppable
11th Feb 2008, 20:43
I know what you mean. However this time Eidos Montreal is loaded with talent. So expect to have many of the issues people are bringing up to be resolved. :)

Lo Bruto
11th Feb 2008, 23:29
One thing I never figured out is why the Sword (the normal one, not de DTS) we find in Hong Kong has European and not chinese looking.

And why they turned it into a Katana in IW? To look super-cool for the average console gamer? (read as under 18 years old)

Kneo24
11th Feb 2008, 23:54
You guys are a bunch of nubs. The DTS is in IW as one of the secret weapons. Granted you only find it near the end of the game, but it's in there!

Lo Bruto
12th Feb 2008, 00:06
You guys are a bunch of nubs. The DTS is in IW as one of the secret weapons. Granted you only find it near the end of the game, but it's in there!

But it still is the same IW sword... nothing different, only doing more damage.

GruntOwner
16th Feb 2008, 17:14
Anyone who didn't collect the dragon tooth sword in DX didn't deserve to complete the game. In IW, it was just another melee weapon.

Lo Bruto
17th Feb 2008, 00:30
Anyone who didn't collect the dragon tooth sword in DX didn't deserve to complete the game.

By "collect" you mean using it in the rest of the game? I used it in my first three runs trough the game only... it takes too much inventory space... For a melee takedown, nothing like the old crowbar to the back of the head :p

In fact, I prefered the common Sword... Guess I thought the DTS was just Overpowered...

GruntOwner
17th Feb 2008, 16:31
Personally, I found the space was worth the trade off, though I always found myself running for a terminal as soon as a bot showed up, so my inventory was a tad limited. With me, most combat was either avoided, done at point black or with the generous application of 30-06.

B0b_P@ge
18th Feb 2008, 21:17
You guys are a bunch of nubs. The DTS is in IW as one of the secret weapons. Granted you only find it near the end of the game, but it's in there!

I think it would of been better if they placed it during the middle or a lot earlier on. Struggling through the whole game with a weak 'ninja sword' with poor level design (Little sneak attack locations) doesn't make for a very fun experience, in fact it makes for a very frustrating experience...granted going through a game with an overpower sword isn't fun either... which is why I think DX1 did it properly: the DTS was powerful but you couldn't clear rooms or engage from a distance as the enemies become better equipped and numerous... so you (player) had to use a combination of complex strategies according to the environment and resources you have available (tear gas grenades, LAMS, throwing knifes,etc) to kill them. Most importantly, it was fun and a very rewarding experience!!! The earlier enemies where tough but could be killed with a knife/crowbar and proper attack strategies but as you faced MJ12 and their nano-augmented commandos they became incredibly difficult, requiring one-hit-wonders or you'll be instantly killed with an automatic gun headshot; the DTS solved that problem with fully upgraded melee augs , but the next problem was how to attack and that part lead to a very memorable and fun playing style as some of us know from experience... :D

Lo Bruto
19th Feb 2008, 19:15
The earlier enemies where tough but could be killed with a knife/crowbar and proper attack strategies but as you faced MJ12 and their nano-augmented commandos they became incredibly difficult

Ballistic Protection Level 4 and Regeneration, Crowbar to the Head and BANG!

Blade_hunter
19th Feb 2008, 22:11
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jian

I found a chinese saber and i think it can be the insparator of the dragon's tooth, but the energy blade of DX 2 looks like a katana, a japanese saber but most of old civilisations uses some curved blades

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dao_%28sword%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dadao
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cutlass
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katana

For the games swords I think The variety is better for the melee weapons we can use:

A machete, a combat knife, the crow bar, batons, a pipe ?, riot prod, plasma sword, a saber, an heat sword, the dragons tooth and more ... If the players can choose their prefered weapons most players are happy :D

rokstrombo
21st Feb 2008, 13:51
I don't think the next game necessarily needs a sword weapon. It was significant in the original game because it was unique, and some kind of artifact to the triads. Just putting a sword in the next game because people thought it was cool would be lame, IMO. I would prefer a new weapon, based on the traditions of some other faction, even if it wasn't as nice as the Dragon Tooth sword.

B0b_P@ge
24th Feb 2008, 04:16
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jian

I found a chinese saber and i think it can be the insparator of the dragon's tooth, but the energy blade of DX 2 looks like a katana, a japanese saber but most of old civilisations uses some curved blades

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dao_%28sword%29
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dadao
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cutlass
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katana

For the games swords I think The variety is better for the melee weapons we can use:

A machete, a combat knife, the crow bar, batons, a pipe ?, riot prod, plasma sword, a saber, an heat sword, the dragons tooth and more ... If the players can choose their prefered weapons most players are happy :D

I like you're style of thinking my friend! :D

GruntOwner
24th Feb 2008, 04:35
I don't think the next game necessarily needs a sword weapon. It was significant in the original game because it was unique, and some kind of artifact to the triads. Just putting a sword in the next game because people thought it was cool would be lame, IMO. I would prefer a new weapon, based on the traditions of some other faction, even if it wasn't as nice as the Dragon Tooth sword.

I wanna see a western sword, like a bastard sword or something, just because I always thought the beefy approach to weapons was better than a katana, in all it's flimsy, brittle, blandness. There's more oppurtunity to gild a western sword, plus it would look pretty awesome if they could project plasma bursts along the blade, so it still fit the role of ubersword, perhaps the tamplars got bored, or someone just had too much time on their hands.

mouse
9th Mar 2008, 13:04
Who needs flashy swords when there're combat knives and machetes? I always disliked the bright aura of the Dragon Tooth, although the general idea is great. But instead of having big arkward shining swords -> stealth!, I'd prefer those nice thingies:

KM2000, combat knife of the german army
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/ac/KM2000_mit_Scheide.jpeg


a machete
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/86/Machete_knife_blade.jpg

GruntOwner
9th Mar 2008, 16:19
I never really saw the point of machettes. they were just the pop culture equivelelant of the falchion, which was too unwieldy and weighted to ever be used effectively in combat. A combat knife of pimpishness I can understanc, but machettes aren't at all practical in urban battlefields. Now if the were to use nano tech to have nano wide edges that could cut through almost anything with remarkable ease, but still be as durable as the common counterpart, that would be a worth while knife IMO.

Edx
9th Mar 2008, 18:13
Dx1 did it right with making the Dragons Tooth powerful only if you heavily invested in your characters melee abilities. !


Or are playing on easy mode :rasp:

IcarusIsLookingForYou
9th Mar 2008, 18:57
I concur with GruntOwner on machetes. They're very impractical when compared to combat knives. I think the reason we associate machetes with military combat and not sugar cane fields is due to its usage in a lot of action flicks, although I do realize that some southeastern Asian nations, like the Philippines, do use machetes in military combat.

For a game which emphasizes stealth, a concealable knife, or even cooler, something like the hidden blade from Assassin's Creed makes much more sense. I'd love to go through DX3 without firing a single bullet, stalking and silently assassinating each guard. Of course, this could be made a little easier if there was a way to muffle the guards' screams after knifing them (I always hated that you couldn't do so in the first one).

mouse
9th Mar 2008, 19:04
I just mentioned the machete as a modern replacement for a broadsword or katana. I know that they're impractical for stealthy approaches. But if DX3 keeps swords as an option for close range combat, I'd rather have a machete instead of a flashy medieval sword.

IcarusIsLookingForYou
9th Mar 2008, 19:30
I just mentioned the machete as a modern replacement for a broadsword or katana. I know that they're impractical for stealthy approaches. But if DX3 keeps swords as an option for close range combat, I'd rather have a machete instead of a flashy medieval sword.

I see what you're saying. That makes way more sense than running around with a claymore like Mel Gibson (this is DX, not Elder Scrolls). Katanas are a really tired cliche as well. Although I'm more of a stealth guy, who'd love something like a hidden blade and stealth kill animations (if anyone important is reading!), your suggestion is perhaps the most practical one, stylistically, for those who love to get in a guard's face and hack away at him.

GruntOwner
10th Mar 2008, 07:13
Stealth kill animations would be great if done properly, but the number of times I've sat in horror staring at a screen in which I'm being pumped with more lead than Queen Elizebeth's make up cabinet just because there's a spot on their shins I've neglected makes me caytious about such an idea. As for the claymore, I'm thinking anyone who wastes that much inventory space on such a dated weapon deserves what they get, and as far as katanas are concerned, I couldn't agree more. Now that I think about it a machette could be a welcome feature as a knife is quite deoendant on stealth, whereas their balance issue kinda makes a swing from them nigh unstoppable. I wouldn't take it, but that's just me, they could probably be the worth while equivelant of a crowbar.

EpeSeta
16th Mar 2008, 18:33
:D I remember the time I first played IW and found the energy blade. I think the description read "The blade glows blue when activated", or something along those lines. I equip, and think: "Not much of a glow. I probably still have to activate it." That thought was reinforced when I took a swing at something. "Pathetic damage! Ok, now I'm CERTAIN it has to be activated somehow." Needless to say, I spent a good few minutes trying to do so in vain.

frattaro
18th Mar 2008, 10:08
I thought the blade looked cooler in DX1, and had a better story behind it (3 types of nanobots continually hardening and sharpening it). As for the power of the blade, I think this whole thread may be confused.

The "Dragon's Tooth" is in Invisible War, its in JC's sanctuary, on top of a bookcase. All the other ones are called "Energy Blade". The Dragon Tooth Sword is more powerful than the Energy Blade.

If DX3 is a prequel, you can't rightly have a prototype sword. If its during the collapse or after invisible war I hope they have it, and make it more like how it looked from DX1.

(In DX2) I loved sneaking up behind a mil bot and scrambling it, just to watch the havok ensue.