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View Full Version : Camera work in DX3. music, story line



amk84
26th Jan 2008, 13:28
I think tahat DX3 should have third person view, like in thief deadly shadows. Very important is also work of this camera, such great camera is in Splinter cell: chaos Theory e.g. work of it changes when we use pistol or other weapon and gives feeling that we are relly in action. Morover such view show us our hero and then is more to see, how he jumps and so on, so we.ve got more effect which are unseen in FPP but that gives interesting feeling when you see how your hero innteract with the world.
Other thing is music, it was great in DX1, sutable to the sytuation in game but this music dissaperd in DX:IW , check splinter cell: chaos theory, there is great music, when you are spot music is changing and when you are firing or someone is shooting to you music is dynamic and you feel tahat this is action
Another thing is sci-fi elemnets, in DX:IW great idea was with the OMAR cyborgs and we want more such things, cyborgs, mistic things with our humanity, beginnings of our cywilization and so on. I was a litte bit dissaperd playeing DX:IW becouse when i saw omar cyborgs ,during the game I expected more such elemts, maybe missions on OMAR space ship, I don't know but something big, big sci-fi and there wasn't such thing
And now the story line in DX3.
I thing tahat game should be after what happened in DX:IW in complitly new cywil;ization, after reborn of humanity on earth. And during the game it should appear what happend, that the cyborg structure of new cywilization has beginnings from ancestors who almost destroyed earth. it should also appear that omar cyborgs still live underground and the others one are on the other planet and whant to return to earth, but what for???? imagin big space ship above the city, and the commander of the space ship can be one of the immortal dentons. the public will panic, and the other one will say taht on earth goods returned. ofcouse tehere should be posibil;ity to become one of the omar's soldiers with more body modifications avaible, no weapon use but with possibility to change body structure.

Very important elemt witch help to feel game are vechicles in DX1 there were military chopters and there were very suitable to world in DX1, but DX:IW choopter and jet plane were terrible, grey peace of.... jest plane was similar to harier -world in DX is in future not past!!!!! in DX3 shold be possibility to order flying taxi to move to other place and we shold be enable to view from inside of flying car(work of camera) city and passing streets and so on (maybe something like in blade runner). Cities or one city shold have such places like in DX:IW there were graat but also districts like cario archology, clean futuristic with apartaments makeing feeleing that this cywilization live in happines, and ofcouse there should be oposit to it very dark places- maybe also there should be sanctuary of JC with is still on earth and thanks to it new reobone humanity discovers the truth about its beginnings.

gamer0004
26th Jan 2008, 13:52
Please check your spelling...
And I don't agree with you - why have third person view? In first person you get more drawn into the story and you can control your character more precicely.
And flying taxi's? What's the use of that? It has to be believable...

jd10013
26th Jan 2008, 14:00
1st person would be much better. why 3rd? as for the story, I'd like them to make it as though IW never happened. go back to the original and take one of the endings and continue from there. Perhaps the illuminati or tong ending.

Xcom
26th Jan 2008, 14:51
If 3rd person is optional, I don't see how it can harm anything. Sometimes it's cool to look at your character in full glory. :D

jd10013
26th Jan 2008, 15:08
as long as its optional. It worked pretty good that way in VTMB.

Tracer Tong
26th Jan 2008, 15:14
as long as its optional. It worked pretty good that way in VTMB.

I don't remember VTMB having 3rd person mode. EDIT: Wait... Yes I do, when dancing.

3rd person is for games like Tomb Raider :P Not for games with the philosophical depth of DX1, which you'd play AS Denton (similar to Bioshock, I(!) felt deceived when the main character was deceived). I remember my first playing experience at Lebedev's, it wouldn't be anywhere near to what it would've been if it was in third person view, or TPV/Behindview for short

jd10013
26th Jan 2008, 15:29
I don't remember VTMB having 3rd person mode. EDIT: Wait... Yes I do, when dancing.



you could switch out whenever you wanted.

maddermadcat
26th Jan 2008, 16:48
Make more references to splinter cell and I break your neck.

Deus Ex is meant to be very immersive, which is why first person was used. Third person in TDS was a way of cheating, as you could see around corners and such without being seen yourself.

With that said, I don't want third person to be in this game. It's just not Deus Ex.

v.dog
26th Jan 2008, 19:00
Dx did have TP moments during dialogue. Personally, I don't like them (and haven't since HL1) as it breaks the immersion, but I can understand the design philosophy for them being there.

amk84, try the firefox browser (http://http://www.mozilla.com/en-US/firefox). Its built in spell-checker is fantastic.

humbug
26th Jan 2008, 19:13
I don't think DX is right for a 3rd person. Some games such as tomb raider and POP are suitable for a 3rd person veiw, but not DX.

Unstoppable
26th Jan 2008, 20:00
There shouldn't be third person because then you can cheat to peek around corners. Thus the surprise/suspense of what's around the bend is totally gone.

Deus Ex is an FPS not a third person game. A dramatic change like this could prove to turn people away that are already fans of the series.

That's why my vote is no. Keep what worked in the first game, FPS.

gamer0004
26th Jan 2008, 20:07
I like TP in the dialogs. Nice to see yourself, I think that adds to the immersion. In FEAR everything is in FP. I like that but I miss third person view at the dialogs.

humbug
26th Jan 2008, 20:40
I like TP in the dialogs. Nice to see yourself, I think that adds to the immersion. In FEAR everything is in FP. I like that but I miss third person view at the dialogs.

I agree with you there, its nice to see your character in dialogue. :)

amk84
27th Jan 2008, 14:44
[QUOTE=maddermadcat;725065]Make more references to splinter cell and I break your neck.

I wrote about 2 things which are in Splinter Cell but those things are also in DX1 and thief deadly shadows and propably other games, first was music which in DX1 and in SC is suitable to the sytuation and second is third person view which is in SC in Thief Deadly Shadows, and in SC they have great idea what happens with camera when you use weapon but also in thief when you use bow camera is changing but in a little bit diffrent way. Maybe not all of us has played DX1 and thief and that's way I wrote about SC.

And I think that in DX3 should be possibility to switch view.

Remember, in Thief 1 and 2 also was first person view but in deadly shadows you could choose and I was sceptic abot 3rd person view in thief, but now I like it.

Reaktor
27th Jan 2008, 16:09
From a narrative perspective, I think having a third person view in DX makes little sense. It works in games such as Metal Gear Solid and Splinter Cell, because the main character is someone else, but in DX, the main character is YOU. That's the beauty of it. And to watch oneself run around in third person, well, that would ruin the immersion, at least for me.

As to making 'third person view' an optional feature, I have to say that, at least from my experience, the games that give the option to choose between first-person and third-person view modes more often than not lack in both departments.

Draco1979
4th Feb 2008, 00:23
Well like some said if it was an option it would be hella cool because in Elder scrolls it was an option that i benefited from as in jumping. But i really think it should be the players choice because while in third person I tend to get a head ache from the camera moving all around and such.

rhalibus
4th Feb 2008, 00:42
Deus Ex should be FPS; it fits in with the "you are there" feeling of immersion. I loved watching the dramatic excitement of Max Payne and DreamFall but I didn't get the same total immersion as when I was playing System Shock 2, STALKER or DX.

JoeGreensKiller
23rd Feb 2008, 19:59
Iv always thought a Third Person view would be interesting, with some MATRIX type moves i.e the martial art aspect. Any thoughts?

minus0ne
23rd Feb 2008, 23:18
I'm all for first-person, it's much more immersing than third person. As for your other ideas, they don't make much sense to me.

Gary_Savage
23rd Feb 2008, 23:49
I prefer first person, myself. Sure, this way I will not be able to watch my character doing any fancy moves (if the devs incorporate them; such moves could include rolling to dodge an enemy's aim), but I am yet to see a view that is more immersive than the first person view.

pauldenton
24th Feb 2008, 02:08
the original game worked great as it was in fp when gaming complete with mirrors and tp for cut scenes, if it aint broke dont fix it!

leave well alone!

PD182
25th Feb 2008, 13:33
NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!! def not in 3rd person it would not be DX, dX3 Should have an Oblivion like style of view but you ever try playing oblivion in 3rd person? its majorly sucky.

jd10013
25th Feb 2008, 14:35
Like I said in the other thread, It seemed to work pretty well in VTMB where you could swithch camera angles to suit your style, or the situation.

lightbringerrr
26th Feb 2008, 01:53
I think tahat DX3 should have third person view, like in thief deadly shadows. Very important is also work of this camera, such great camera is in Splinter cell: chaos Theory e.g. work of it changes when we use pistol or other weapon and gives feeling that we are relly in action. Morover such view show us our hero and then is more to see, how he jumps and so on, so we.ve got more effect which are unseen in FPP but that gives interesting feeling when you see how your hero innteract with the world.
Other thing is music, it was great in DX1, sutable to the sytuation in game but this music dissaperd in DX:IW , check splinter cell: chaos theory, there is great music, when you are spot music is changing and when you are firing or someone is shooting to you music is dynamic and you feel tahat this is action
Another thing is sci-fi elemnets, in DX:IW great idea was with the OMAR cyborgs and we want more such things, cyborgs, mistic things with our humanity, beginnings of our cywilization and so on. I was a litte bit dissaperd playeing DX:IW becouse when i saw omar cyborgs ,during the game I expected more such elemts, maybe missions on OMAR space ship, I don't know but something big, big sci-fi and there wasn't such thing
And now the story line in DX3.
I thing tahat game should be after what happened in DX:IW in complitly new cywil;ization, after reborn of humanity on earth. And during the game it should appear what happend, that the cyborg structure of new cywilization has beginnings from ancestors who almost destroyed earth. it should also appear that omar cyborgs still live underground and the others one are on the other planet and whant to return to earth, but what for???? imagin big space ship above the city, and the commander of the space ship can be one of the immortal dentons. the public will panic, and the other one will say taht on earth goods returned. ofcouse tehere should be posibil;ity to become one of the omar's soldiers with more body modifications avaible, no weapon use but with possibility to change body structure.

Very important elemt witch help to feel game are vechicles in DX1 there were military chopters and there were very suitable to world in DX1, but DX:IW choopter and jet plane were terrible, grey peace of.... jest plane was similar to harier -world in DX is in future not past!!!!! in DX3 shold be possibility to order flying taxi to move to other place and we shold be enable to view from inside of flying car(work of camera) city and passing streets and so on (maybe something like in blade runner). Cities or one city shold have such places like in DX:IW there were graat but also districts like cario archology, clean futuristic with apartaments makeing feeleing that this cywilization live in happines, and ofcouse there should be oposit to it very dark places- maybe also there should be sanctuary of JC with is still on earth and thanks to it new reobone humanity discovers the truth about its beginnings.

Third Person as an OPTION ONLY!
Like JK Outcast and Academy.
Third person works better with vehicles than people in this type of game. Example: Battlefront 1. Cloud City. Much easier to get a real feel for what's going on around you in third-person.

Mindmute
26th Feb 2008, 15:04
I'd cry if there'd be a 3rd person view and if it was not optional, that would completely hurt the immersion in my opinion.

As for the music, I'll agree, the music in DX was just amazing, it completely fit the mood of the game and each individual area, though my favourite one would have to be when you entered combat in NY after the martial law.

As for the storyline, I'll have to admit I completely hated the one in IW. It was just too straight forward and predictable for me and lacked a fine balance that DX had: you felt like you affected the world on a small scale with every action you took but at the same time you felt lost in it. This was like a wonderful paradox for me. The only time I felt that in IW was when I killed the smuggler in lower seattle and even then I could see absolutely no effect to my actions.

B0b_P@ge
29th Feb 2008, 00:17
Third personal view is a bad idea, I didn't mind it during the cut scenes but that's it.

I also think it's a bad idea for having it optional as well; it would:
1) Cheapen the experience by making it feel arcade/console-like.
2) Divert development resources from actually making a good game.

I think this quote sums its up very nicely as well:


As to making 'third person view' an optional feature, I have to say that, at least from my experience, the games that give the option to choose between first-person and third-person view modes more often than not lack in both departments.

Edx
8th Mar 2008, 12:17
3rd Person Deus Ex?


WORST IDEA EVAAR

**** **** ****

IcarusIsLookingForYou
8th Mar 2008, 14:32
These days any game that uses a third person perspective ends up looking like Resident Evil 4 or Gears of War. I happen to think both of those games are great, but the devs have to let DX be DX and not some other game because it sold a bazillion copies.

As for having an optional 3rd person view, I don't see how it could hurt. However, almost every game that's ever had an optional 3rd person mode has had a pretty crappy one. It's probably best to just leave the camera alone in this case.

IceBallz
10th Apr 2008, 15:40
3rd person views is almost always set in clean shoot'em up FPS-games and i see 3rd person view as a legal cheat for games like Deus Ex is. Like you can see behind corners, without exposing your self for the enemy. So there is huge amount of lack in 3rd person view in my point of view. Like Splinter Cell is a graphical wonderpiece and really hard for real assasins to make throw. So the devs gave them 3rd person view only becurse this would make the camera view much larger for the player. Just to give the player more easy to find all the hidden paths in maps and sometime expose the enemies to them too easy. If Splinter Cell have been done in 1st person view, the game would been to damn hard to avrage player to come throw so easy, like it's done now. Like a legal cheat in game.

So i shout out, loud and clear. - NO 3RD PERSON VIEW IN DEUS EX 3 !!! SAY NO TO DRUGS AND CHEATS !!!

Vasarto
10th Apr 2008, 18:46
I guess as long as its an option. Although I believe you can immerse yourself
much more in first person. In first person view only you are not just playing a video game as Paul or Jc or whom ever..you ARE that person.

IceBallz
10th Apr 2008, 20:29
I guess as long as its an option. Although I believe you can immerse yourself
much more in first person. In first person view only you are not just playing a video game as Paul or Jc or whom ever..you ARE that person.

No 3rd person view at all. Maybe in easy level gaming mode only, but not in normal mode or harder. Multiplay is out of question.

IceBallz
10th Apr 2008, 20:47
Even a optinal 3rd person view always make the feeling into 1st person view to more worse. Like as reload animations, movement animations on weapons and other weapon handling animations. This just make more lack to resources to make a really realistic 1st person view into game. So ones more. No 3rd person view at all cost. Set all resourses to get really sweet and realistic 1st person view only and forget the arcade style of games. Deus Ex is not a shoot'em up game or copy of Tomb Raider and Splinter Cell. It's a involving adventure game where gamers are to come into the characters world and great story in that world of his. If you see him in 3rd person you will loose every aspect of the feeling to be that character. Even if it's only just a option. I say NO NO NO to 3rd person view.

Deadelus
30th Apr 2008, 10:29
Some people like the 3rd, whereas some like the 1st. I myself prefer the 1st person feel. Make it so the player can choose. And, also, maybe even make it so you can choose 'how it went down' in the first DX so the game can go from there.

serene_chaos
30th Apr 2008, 11:53
Oh, you guys mean that the topic starter WASN'T joking?

Voltaire
30th Apr 2008, 14:44
IMO, 1st person view is a must in a DX game. Immersion and all that.

3rd person view would allow stupid advantages in terms of seeing over/around stuff. DX is all about what a man can and can't do, and I know for a fact that I can't see over the top of a head high wall when I have my nose to it.

Gary_Savage
30th Apr 2008, 14:51
Agreed. I also agree with a lot of other posters that enabling 3rd person view would waste valuable resources that would be better spent on making a good storyline. If seeing over walls/around corners is really important, and if resources allow, then perhaps the player character can carry a mirror (or a periscope), the same way that some SWAT team members carry, just for this purpose. Such a primitive tool could allow the player to scope a place out (and perhaps give himself/herself away to an observant enemy) without exposing himself/herself to gunfire.

I would like to see a mirror, or a periscope, with an extensible 'neck,' like the baton in DX1.

AndrewReyna
10th Jun 2008, 18:27
3rd person would ruin the game in my view.