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AgnosticJive
28th Dec 2007, 00:48
I'm getting really sick of seeing all these unoriginal people just whining about wanting the dentons back...just stop. It's unoriginal and it seems that about 80% of the threads get blasted with everyone wanting one or both of them back in the prequel game that isn't likely to happen or in the sequel game in which they would either be dead,decrepit,or just boring.

mr_cyberpunk
28th Dec 2007, 04:31
I want a custom character for a change :D Let us provide the hero/villian of the story.

Smoke Screen
28th Dec 2007, 04:54
AgnosticJive,i 2nd that. I also hope DX3 has something better to offer than
a Denton-Revival.

v.dog
28th Dec 2007, 08:30
I'd like to see the Dentons back, but not out of fanboi-driven nostalgia. I want them back because Deus Ex isn't just about a dystopian cyberpunk universe; it's the story of their line.

What I'm saying is that we don't need JC, Paul, or Alex per se, but to not have the Dentons at all would mean this game isn't truly Deus Ex.

If the game is a prequel (has that been stated concretely yet?), playing as JC wouldn't work as they'd have to come up with come contrived reason for his low stats at the beginning of DX. Playing as Paul is probably a poor choice, as ultimately, all his actions have to lead him to working for the NSF. He could however, play a strong NPC role- given that we currently know so little about him.

gamer0004
28th Dec 2007, 09:55
Deus Ex isn't all about the Dentons...

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 10:26
Maybe a lil' sister would be cool... :D

mr_cyberpunk
28th Dec 2007, 10:31
they already did that.. or did you not play Iwar.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 10:43
Yeah, I did play IW, sorry.... a while ago now, I completely forgot you could play his sister. :nut:

But IW didn't capture me as much as the original so maybe I can be forgiven, hehe. :D

Harakiribert
28th Dec 2007, 10:48
If the player character is a Denton and it's not JC, Paul or Alex, then they better have a damn good explanation for that.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 10:50
A son or daughter then, maybe, lol. :D

mr_cyberpunk
28th Dec 2007, 11:10
That doesn't make any sense for a son/daughter..

1. Nicolette is with Chad.. NOT JC!
2. Maggie Chow died so thats Paul out!
3. I doubt Alex male/female would go anywhere near the other students of Tarsus after they tried to kill him/her. Plus Alex didn't come off as the marrying type.

This eliminates the possibility of an offspring from any of the dentons.. the exception is that this Emile is the 4th sibling as outragous as that might seem. I'm just throwing it out there.. But I completely doubt it.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 11:12
Yeah, but there is such a thing as artificial insemination. ;) :p

mr_cyberpunk
28th Dec 2007, 11:20
And again we are back to the denton sibling thing. Further to the point I don't think it would be possible for the denton's to reproduce since they were engineered from scratch and their DNA would be very fragile, resulting in any mating would most likely cause deformation because the denton DNA as established in IWar was able to resist the rejection effects of Nano-Augementation due to them being engineered.

The only way to create a new denton would be Cloning direct from the cell.. JC was a clone of Paul and Alex a clone of JC I think, because their cells were passed to one another.

The denton DNA can only be reproduced via cloning I think.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 11:28
Yes, indeed, thank you. :)
Well, a cloned offspring it is then. The concept is within the realms of possibility. :cool:

mr_cyberpunk
28th Dec 2007, 11:37
Obviously Emile will be cloned. Last time I checked natural born children don't have big exhaust ports sticking out of their shoulder :D He won't be a denton though since to do that would be un-canon to the story.. Deus Ex 3 is a prequel.

Red
28th Dec 2007, 11:48
A creation of custom character at the beginning would be great. Something like what Oblivion has.

Harakiribert
28th Dec 2007, 11:49
Obviously Emile will be cloned.
Emile does not seem to have any human tissue or bones, so I think it's completely artificial.


Deus Ex 3 is a prequel.
That is yet unknown.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Dec 2007, 12:28
Obviously Emile will be cloned. Last time I checked natural born children don't have big exhaust ports sticking out of their shoulder :D He won't be a denton though since to do that would be un-canon to the story.. Deus Ex 3 is a prequel.

Hehe, love the exhaust port visualisation. :D

You don't know Deus Ex 3 is a "prequel"... and I don't think it will be. :p

mr_cyberpunk
29th Dec 2007, 02:03
That is somewhat true.. I have said it could be a sequel/prequel both in the same game.


Emile does not seem to have any human tissue or bones, so I think it's completely artificial.

That is a really cool theory.. however do you have any proof? from the look of him I was thinking it was a organic mech. But we have no idea since the developers haven't explained **** all :D

v.dog
29th Dec 2007, 07:56
The denton DNA can only be reproduced via cloning I think.
Yes, indeed, thank you. :)
Well, a cloned offspring it is then. The concept is within the realms of possibility. :cool:What about the source of the DNA? The Denton's "parents", as it were.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
29th Dec 2007, 17:32
Oh yes, forgot about mum and dad! :eek:

:D

Harakiribert
29th Dec 2007, 18:40
Oh yes, forgot about mum and dad! :eek:

:D

Hmm, they were killed by MJ12 in 2035.

Harakiribert
29th Dec 2007, 21:46
And the game is set in 2027, no?

That is yet unknown.

v.dog
29th Dec 2007, 21:52
I thought I saw that in the trailer, but I was wrong. If you hadn't quoted me, no-one would have been any the wiser. :o

Harakiribert
29th Dec 2007, 22:07
I thought I saw that in the trailer, but I was wrong. If you hadn't quoted me, no-one would have been any the wiser. :o

One of the flashing images in the teaser shows a ballot box with the inscription "biopolitic vote 2027". But that doesn't necessarily mean that DX3 is set in 2027.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
30th Dec 2007, 00:54
Hmm, they were killed by MJ12 in 2035.

Yes, but DNA can be retrieved (dead or alive). ;)

Harakiribert
30th Dec 2007, 01:09
Yes, but DNA can be retrieved (dead or alive). ;)

And then?

mr_cyberpunk
30th Dec 2007, 08:24
What about the source of the DNA? The Denton's "parents", as it were.

Quote: Paul Denton "I'm not even sure they were our actual parents!" - says this after discovering the truth about how they were born.

v.dog
30th Dec 2007, 11:09
So it could go either way. Their 'parents' could be those who supplied the DNA, those who raised them, or both.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
30th Dec 2007, 12:18
One of the flashing images in the teaser shows a ballot box with the inscription "biopolitic vote 2027". But that doesn't necessarily mean that DX3 is set in 2027.

Agreed, I think the images are showing history 'then' and DX3 will be set further into the future.

gamer0004
30th Dec 2007, 14:58
Hmm. I still think (or hope, or both :P) it's going to be a prequel. Not because of "2027", but because of all the mech hints in the teaser.
Anyway, we'll know next summer.

SageSavage
30th Dec 2007, 15:16
Anyway, we'll know next summer.I doubt it... It's scheduled for 2009 and even that isn't anything we can rely on.

gamer0004
30th Dec 2007, 16:31
I know, but they say they'll release some new info next summer.

Harakiribert
30th Dec 2007, 16:39
I doubt it... It's scheduled for 2009 and even that isn't anything we can rely on.

I'm sure Eidos will provide more and more information about the scenario and the features of DX3 over the months before the release.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
30th Dec 2007, 19:57
I doubt it... It's scheduled for 2009 and even that isn't anything we can rely on.

2009 :eek:

Yikes, I hope I live that long. I'll be a restless haunt if I don't get to play it. :D

minus0ne
30th Dec 2007, 20:20
Quote: Paul Denton "I'm not even sure they were our actual parents!" - says this after discovering the truth about how they were born.
Also, there's a mention about the Denton's biological parents being UNATCO or MJ12 lab employees who used their own DNA and engineered it further (also modifying it for tolerance to nano augmentation). Paul's referring to their adopted parents I think.

Harakiribert
30th Dec 2007, 21:00
Also, there's a mention about the Denton's biological parents being UNATCO or MJ12 lab employees who used their own DNA and engineered it further (also modifying it for tolerance to nano augmentation). Paul's referring to their adopted parents I think.

From the DX Continuity Bible (http://archive.gamespy.com/articles/april02/dxbible/dx1/):

The conspirators' agents, posing as nurses and doctors, in pediatricians' offices and elementary schools across the nation, used the smallpox census data, to keep track of high potential candidates. The specialists in charge of the project were updated regularly on the progress of potential candidates. All the conspirators had to do was wait. Ma and Pa Denton -- two such potential candidates -- fell in love (perhaps even with some help from the conspirators!) and produced young Paul under the watchful, albeit covert eye of Majestic 12 operatives who played the parts of friends, family doctors, neighbors, school teachers and so on...

imported_van_HellSing
30th Dec 2007, 21:54
In the game itself, (which overrides the continuity bible,) there are two conflicting threads of evidence. One is that JC was normally born, had (adoptive?) parents and went to school in Switzerland, the other is that he's just a couple of years old, and has been growth-accelerated and has implanted memories.

mr_cyberpunk
30th Dec 2007, 23:27
I would go with description 2 since the evidence with Alex Denton proves that to be true, Nano-agents are grown to full adult state and then given memories similar to the Nexus 6 from Blade Runner.. thats at least how I saw it.

The other description is a bit lame since JC was government money.. its not like they are going to put a child through years of learning ect, they would opt for the cheaper method and just implant the education as well as memories to stop the poor bastard from going insane :D This may also explain why JC is somewhat emotionless, since they would have no doubt left the emotional development out of his "programming" ("because I good soldier shows no emotion")

What MJ12 didn't expect was that both Paul and JC would eventually become self aware and ultimately betray their original programming. It was Daedalus I think that encouraged Paul to achieve self awareness and ultimately this lead to JC becoming self aware (of course that only happened after he had betrayed Unatco, got those notes from the NSF base and ultimately learns the truth about Liberty Island)

Harakiribert
30th Dec 2007, 23:40
In the game itself, (which overrides the continuity bible,) there are two conflicting threads of evidence. One is that JC was normally born, had (adoptive?) parents and went to school in Switzerland, the other is that he's just a couple of years old, and has been growth-accelerated and has implanted memories.

One of the last emails you can read in the game (from Page to Simons):

I've come to believe that <PLAYERFIRSTNAME> should be brought up in a more supervised environment than his brother; I have serious doubts as to his brother's usefulness as our primary unit, and would rather that at least one of the secondary units was under our direct control.

Terminate the parents, but see that <PLAYERFIRSTNAME> is not harmed. We'll move him to our school in Switzerland where we can oversee his development. If it becomes necessary, his brother is expendable.

Page

imported_van_HellSing
31st Dec 2007, 17:22
Well then, how does that mesh with this:


SUBJECT MJID-0003JC0189
INCEPT DATE: 3/17/54
ASSIGNED BIRTH DATE: 3/17/29
ASSIGNED BIRTH NAME: <PLAYERNAME>
BASE GENETIC SAMPLE: XXXXXXXXXXX7V
PROFILE: AAAAAAB
VITALS: 50/75/0.98/25/1.4

[[[[[EXPUNGED]]]]]

Which means JC is about two years old, and was assigned a false birth date.

DeepSeaDiver
31st Dec 2007, 17:34
Well then, how does that mesh with this:



Which means JC is about two years old, and was assigned a false birth date.

Incept may mean when he was taken and was worked on. He may of still been born before his incept which may mean his Assigned Birth Date is correct. Either way its all guessing at this point so unless they come out and say it we can't say for sure.

I just wanted to point out it could still go both ways.

mr_cyberpunk
2nd Jan 2008, 02:01
This is also interesting because it never states that JC was released from incubation.. Transferring to the school could be for research purposes. The parents thing may refer to the genetic designers (similar to Blade Runner where a replicant has many parents but never has an actual family "Replicants don't have scales... Or families for that matter" - Richard Deckard). I'm still siding with the point that JC and Paul are the Deus Ex equivalents to replicants. I'm just waiting for Deus Ex 3 to prove me wrong, assuming the story touches on this.

CJ Denton
3rd Jan 2008, 11:24
If we assume for a second that this is a prequel, and one set almost two decades before the first game, then I would say the most obvious option towards including the Denton line is that it is one of the parents of Paul.

It cant be JC, because he was a new recruit in the liberty incident in DX1, frest out of training and in truth an advanced growth clone of Paul.

It cant be Paul, because even discounting his age he and JC were the first fully nano augmented agents, whereas the teaser trailer shows a mechanised transhuman.

However one of Pauls parents makes sense (being able to pick which allowing gender choice, as well as feature diversity as whatever made the denton brothers look as they did could always come from the other parent), especially since as they were supposedly assasinated by MJ12 they were definitely agents in the thick of it, in my opinion.

I would like a continuation of the Denton line (a precontinuation?) because it does add a nice continuity. Resurrecting the Dentons can only add strength to the series, AS LONG AS some silly attempt is not made to squeeze in Paul or JC anywhere.