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Oroibahazopi
28th Nov 2013, 16:32
Loadouts I currently use are:

Marathon, Shockwave, Ignore Pain
Jump, Shockwave, Ignore Pain

The choice between marathon and charge is a tough one but the extra travel distance is probably worth the damage nerf.

Jump is useful 90% of the time, you just have to learn the maps and where you need to jump from to land inside buildings.

Changed to Shockwave because it's impossible to chain a Jump/Charge into another ability without dying 99% of the time against a decent team. You Jump, pop ignore pain, escape out of los then circle back to use Shockwave.

Enrage is probably OP but you 100% need at least one vampire who can tank 1200+ dps.

Quoted stuff below still has some relevant info.


-e-

Two loadouts I use now are (I use the loadout tabs to quick switch between them):

Charge, Groundslam, Ignore Pain, Frenzy
Jump, Groundslam, Ignore Pain, Frenzy

Use Charge when humans are camping inside a building and Jump when they're out in the open with a lot of visibility. You can try to immediately use Groundslam after a Charge or Jump but you'll often find you're chain stunned or bola'd and then blasted, just use Ignore Pain unless you're really confident the humans are blind.

Groundslam over Shockwave because the stun is a lot more useful to your team, reaver and sentinel pounce/abduct, than the knockdown. Also it's synergises well with the Charge and Jump ability, especially Jump. Also it stops the humans from getting too scattered, they'll often escape which is bad.

Ignore pain is a no brainer, you have to get right into the humans to use your abilities and you're slow. You wont survive at all if you're the alpha strike which you often will be if you're the only tyrant. Maybe if there were multiple tyrants Enrage would be better to get the extra dps in after the tank tyrant attacks. But for now in this PUB environment it's just safer for your team to run Ignore Pain imo.

Frenzy because nothing else stands out and it really helps when chasing humans who're trying to get away. Maybe cooldown would be nice but it's not often needed with a good team.

General Tips: Stay on the ground as much as possible, it's incredibly easy for scouts and hunters to hit you if you climb all over the place. Just think tactical shooter in general, you're massive and an easy target.
Use your 3rd person cam to spot the human blobs without breaking cover so you can aim, you can do this around corners and over rooftops. It's incredibly powerful to launch a well aimed attack from total cover.

hirukaru
28th Nov 2013, 17:32
I literally have no clue here.

Special: Is it worth getting the longer charge? The jump doesn't seem to have any knockdown so seems less useful.

Ability: Ignore pain seems way more useful than Enrage, assuming the humans bunch up properly. Shockwave is twice as good as ground slam? Or is there something about stuns that makes ground slam better?

The marathon charge is usefull if you want to start charging from far away, I rather use the normal one.
The jump is very usefull if used correctly. 2 tyrants combining a jump and a shockwave or groudn slam can take out a whole party.

The shockwave is an aimed attack only in one direction where the ground slam will hit around you.
The shockwave will also make the enemy fly away (backwards) and it will stun during the flight time.
The ground slam won't let them fly away does less damage and also does stun them.

Oroibahazopi
28th Nov 2013, 17:48
Yeah I noticed after my post that shockwave was directional. Seems that ground slam is more useful for team synergy also.

But basically what I'm getting is the default Tyrant is good to go.

hirukaru
28th Nov 2013, 18:29
Yes default at start is good.
Ones you get the hang of it you want to go jump + shockwave or Jump + ground slam

Depends on team and map

Oroibahazopi
28th Nov 2013, 20:23
The thing with jump though is you are Scout bait like Sents, plus I see the Tyrant as a hard CC tank. Bulldozing though the human turtle so the other classes can pick them off. Using jump over the charge means you drop one of your CCs.

Psyonix_Corey
28th Nov 2013, 20:41
Some of our internal testers like Marathon because they will actually Charge through the humans and continue on around a corner out of line of sight, turning it into a literal hit and run ability.

RainaAudron
28th Nov 2013, 20:44
I like Marathon as well, always play with it unless I need to switch to Jump.

Oroibahazopi
29th Nov 2013, 01:20
After playing Tyrant a bit more I see how Jump is often so much more useful. In fact depending on where the humans camp one is unusable and the other is going to be what you have to use.

Also I see why enrage come in handy, I cannot catch humans running away from me most of the time at default speed sigh.

I can't decide what perk to go for though, the cooldown one seems ok, possibly frenzy for the extra dps. But at 10k gold that's in the far future.

Strike5150
29th Nov 2013, 11:32
Yea the normal charge really just gets you killed if you try to use it as an opener. Most players now just focus you down when you do that. I like jump a lot because humans have no time to set up and shoot you until you land, survivability is way higher.

Oroibahazopi
29th Nov 2013, 14:15
I find it's heavily dependant on the positioning of the humans. If they turtle inside a room you can charge in around corners and surprise them 90% of the time and obviously jump doesn't work well. But as you say when they're in the open you can't charge because you get insta gibbed.

I still can't see enrage being as useful as endure pain though, just being able to tank the massive aoe spam makes it pretty much a requirement.

hirukaru
29th Nov 2013, 17:25
Some of our internal testers like Marathon because they will actually Charge through the humans and continue on around a corner out of line of sight, turning it into a literal hit and run ability.

Realy Hit and Run.
Pff booring. :P

But best defense against scout trap.

But If the team works together and notice the tyrant, it is just 1 big aim sign, saying: AIM AT ME I AM LARGE :D

But indeed for this tactic it is nice, but also depends on the game style of your self and of the team.
(Thanks for letting me know what we can expect when we fight against you guys again)

Oroibahazopi
4th Dec 2013, 14:52
Right now I don't see marathon being useful at all. The default charge has all the range you need to get out of the way and in to cover and obviously the lower cooldown makes it much more useful to keep the cc pressure up.

I often find myself having to cancel the default charge too so....

But don't the charges have a variable cooldown depending on how long you use them? Does the marathon have the same cooldown as the default if you cancel it early, as in when the default would normally end?

Oroibahazopi
5th Dec 2013, 17:16
Default charge: 12s cd 3.75s dur 3.2 seconds cooldown per second active
Marathon charge: 20s cd 5.5s dur 3.6 seconds cooldown per second active

This seems silly and makes marathon a straight upgrade from the default. Unless the marathon doesn't work how the default charge does.

Psyonix_Corey
5th Dec 2013, 23:35
I raised the default Charge CD but didn't touch Marathon, we can look at its cooldown if it's being used as a strict upgrade. It's supposed to be a tradeoff of being able to go much further half as often.

Oroibahazopi
6th Dec 2013, 06:47
As it stands if you use marathon and end it early, as in when the default charge ends, the cd is 13.5 seconds. Honestly difficult to say how much that 1.5 seconds matter, but it's a relatively small tradeoff for the potential of added duration if you needed it.

Oroibahazopi
7th Dec 2013, 16:49
OP edited.

Scion_of_Balance
11th Dec 2013, 04:22
Well here's the thing, if you use marathon charge as a hit and run tactic, Frenzy becomes viable to take on one or *maybe* two guys. But yea... no WAY would I use it if I was in the middle of 4 humans.

Frenzy is an extremely cool idea, but I also feel it needs a buff. Maybe take less damage as your health goes down?

Oroibahazopi
11th Dec 2013, 04:42
Frenzy is probably OP tbh, Reavers with their Haste are very strong if played right and the bonus for Frenzy is potentially higher.

You just need to follow in a "CC tank" Tyrant or get reavers to smoke the area up first. Requires coordination.

-e- You mean enrage not frenzy, I just noticed. Frenzy is a perk that gives 5% attack speed.

Strike5150
12th Dec 2013, 14:22
Enrage won't be useful until it breaks cc. Enrage bola = dead. Especially with the new bola ye gads way to powerful. Enrage is great against an unorganized human group but if they are playing together it doesn't net you anything.

Also I found out yesterday how powerful hunter is vs tyrant. I charged in and hit a few people ended the charge in the middle, and started to cast shockwave, in the time it took me to end charge animation and cast shockwave a hunter did 1100 damage with a siege bow. One hunter I checked the numbers after my obvious death in this situation. Thats way to0 much damage from one source in the time it takes to cast shockwave. I think shockwave needs a reduction in cast time.

Oroibahazopi
12th Dec 2013, 14:44
It's the same as haste on reaver, you just can't tank with it. But yeah I would almost always use the escape at the moment.

Oroibahazopi
14th Dec 2013, 17:10
Since I just got linked back here I'll reiterate. You cannot chain charge/groundslam and hope to survive vs a good team, you'll 90% of the time have to use endure pain as soon as the charge or jump is over. Move away while you're team takes advantage of the disruption, then come back to finish people off or support with your slam or use a charge/jump again.

I'm moving towards the idea of shockwave being better for the tank tyrant now because of this, since you can disrupt from cover more easily while your other skills are on cooldown. It's seems not bad for chasing also.

Oroibahazopi
19th Dec 2013, 00:49
News just in: Shockwave is superior to groundslam for the Tank Tyrant in the OP