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View Full Version : VAMPIRES Is it just me, are Vampires heavily overpowered?



Babaganouj
19th Nov 2013, 18:04
I was able to play 4 games last night and I noticed rather quickly that the Vampire side seams heavily overpowered. Anyone else feel the same??

I was 100% new to the game and was able to quickly wreck havoc on the humans, but as a human it seemed near impossible to even take down a vampire. Is the learning curve for Humans a little higher then for Vampires or are the Vampires a little overpowered at the moment?

I did have quite a bit of success as an Alchemist, but the Hunter and Scout seemed rather gimp :nut:

Cloudious
19th Nov 2013, 18:33
Not going to lie, I do actually think that the vampires are a bit OP atm, maybe they could try and balance it by making the humans a bit more powerful.

OneViolence
19th Nov 2013, 18:39
I've played quite a bit, IMO humans and vamps are pretty balanced, but humans need to stay grouped up, if youre alone as human, youll die instantly, but thats ´what i like, it promotes team play, ive won several matches as human last night, and i also won as vamps.

I feel they're pretty balanced once you figure out a class and work with your team.

Verling
19th Nov 2013, 20:40
I agree, I've only played a few matches so far, but it seems like it's not a matter of one being more powerful, but of simple game play differences. Humans need to stay together and coordinate, while vampires seem to be more about picking their prey off one at a time.

hirukaru
20th Nov 2013, 01:01
Oké i notice some of you joined after the Auto aim has been turned on.

The vampires are at the moment overpowered cause the auto aim on the melee is set to high.
This will be changed later.

Next to that the game play of both vampires and humans can differ.
Vampires when worked in a team can deal a lot of dmg at ones, but working as a team does not mean go in and ram everyone this can cause the humans to create a nice little vampire stew.

Humans can also split up into 2 groups and ambuse the vampires in a pincher movement.
You just have to coordinate the movement.

Most of the "older" alpha testers thing the vampires are harder in the start. You have to figure out so much
Where the human alchemist and hunter are just spray and pray.

It takes a little while to get used to both. Keep playing (not against me please) and have fun and learn all kind of tactics.

Cypherdiaz
20th Nov 2013, 03:48
The reason...vamps seem OP seems to be the fact that most people now a days don't do teamwork. They are Rambo, the Lone Wolf, they will carry the team to victory.
That mentality gets you dead..very fast in this game and I am 100% ok with that.
I have gone to victory as humans and as vamps pretty equally. It comes down to which team has better teamwork.

If humans stay grouped up..any lonewolf vamp is going to die very fast for nothing. Yet vamps have the abilities to 'bust in' on their little tea party. But this is only the case if the rest of their team supports their initiation. Otherwise..vamp-stew.

As for Hirukaru's thing about Auto Aim.
Dahell? Seriously? I sorta noticed it a bit but..err. Why did they do that. I want more skill ability (Player skill being earned through experience). Hope they fix that.

-NightKid-
20th Nov 2013, 03:58
Speaking of Auto Aim, is it just me or does anyone else thinks the Sentinel's Kidnap could use it? Everytime I attempt it, more often than not I end up whiffing and landing on the ground, right next to my target.

I'm not saying that it should automatically swoop from the sky 10 miles away & successfully make the grab, but an icon/targeting reticule similar to the Reaver's Pounce when it's locked on would help a lot ... especially when I'm already having to deal with spatial awareness & evading shots while flying.

Xaragoth
20th Nov 2013, 03:59
Getting teamwork into a random public game never happened. Ever. Not even in the days of UT. It just doesn't work.

Regarding Vampire auto-aim: We had it off one test and Vampires were ridiculously weak against humans. Because of the dodge roll. It's there for a reason, really, but it's a bit overtuned right now. So much in fact that they jump over 2-3 meters at your face sometimes, because they semi-charged their melee hits :P

LtGiuberia
20th Nov 2013, 05:33
Well I think is just skill. Lets say the vamps got two tyrants then I think the humans should have two hunters, and one alch. Cause of the hunters rapid attack can give lots of damage to the Tyrant

kodokai
20th Nov 2013, 16:40
Hardened skin ability, forget the name. Lol'd you can't activate it and charge, tyrant should be a disruption class not to mention the long delays on abilities. Amount of time's i've spammed Q for the slam & it refused to go off.

Meh

Crusader_bin
20th Nov 2013, 20:38
I think vamps have an edge now. But overall, it's much closer to balance, than when humans were always winning before :P


Getting teamwork into a random public game never happened. Ever. Not even in the days of UT. It just doesn't work.


Was always a huge UT fanatic.
It never WAS about teamwork, aside for CTF :P

It was about going into a room full of enemies, and going out when everyone was dead. And obviously shock rifle combos done from 5 km away (or 1 head shoot a second with sniper rifle with no-scoping) :)
Then there were artists. Aiming a slow rocket so it hits an enemy falling from the sky in the air.

hirukaru
20th Nov 2013, 20:38
Speaking of Auto Aim, is it just me or does anyone else thinks the Sentinel's Kidnap could use it? Everytime I attempt it, more often than not I end up whiffing and landing on the ground, right next to my target.

I'm not saying that it should automatically swoop from the sky 10 miles away & successfully make the grab, but an icon/targeting reticule similar to the Reaver's Pounce when it's locked on would help a lot ... especially when I'm already having to deal with spatial awareness & evading shots while flying.

Nightkid,

Using the sentinel kidnap or abduct skill requires a bit of training.
Ones you get used to how the system works and calculates its easy and you can pick up from a straight dive.

Xaragoth
20th Nov 2013, 23:02
It never WAS about teamwork, aside for CTF :P


That was the only mode that mattered! :P

Germaximus
21st Nov 2013, 03:19
I just played a match and first we got completely destroyed by the players that were playing as vampires. But then we were also dominated by them as humans. As a first impression I cannot agree with vampires being overpowered. =p
I get the idea it depends on how experienced the players are.

The_Hylden
21st Nov 2013, 03:56
Indeed.

And I noticed that a specific spot in Freeport, mentioned before in threads here, which is still almost a complete guarantee for the humans to win. Hide there on the docks and the vampires are easy pickings, coming to the slaughter. The buildings and structures simply aren't high enough, nor complex enough, so they can see everything coming. I witnessed this as a vampire, not as a human :p We died a lot. No-one could get close.

Edit: I have to also say that the Sentinel adjustment in flight works infinitely better now. The camera moves out more and it feels far more intuitive. I think you did it. You made it work :thumb:


(The only thing left I can say about them is every single skin they have is nothing I can warm up to. The Turelim one with the dark gray/brownish skin reminds me so much more of the Turelim and the Dumahim's armors are very well done.)

-NightKid-
21st Nov 2013, 14:15
Nightkid,

Using the sentinel kidnap or abduct skill requires a bit of training.
Ones you get used to how the system works and calculates its easy and you can pick up from a straight dive.

Yeah, I've just figured out the trick. Also, it turns out the silly mistake I was making was that I tapped RMB instead of holding it when next to a target. *facepalm*

That said, Pounce is still infinitely easier to land vs any other special abilities so I think we should still get a lock on/targeting mechanism ... they could remove the lock-on for the Abduct upgrade, similar to Savage Pounce which has it disabled.

Lastly, I think I haven't contributed to the thread topic per se so here goes ... as of the 20th Nov session:

1) I believe the melee auto-aim was removed again (or perhaps had its lock-on radius reduced) but it still seems relatively easy for Vampires to win, i.e. OP, so I would suggest a buff to Humans instead of further nerfing Vamps. Perhaps restore the blinding component to Light Bomb? I haven't tested Poison Bola yet but I'm guessing it doesn't prevent all actions sans moving either.

2) Choking Haze & Healing Mist seriously needs to have differing graphics ... lost count of how many times I've accidentally stepped into the wrong one by mistake at critical times. Also, speaking of graphics, 9/10 games I played today were displaying Health Station icons as my Player Icons so that was confusing.

3) Vampire charged melee attacks are quite hard to land =(

Smeesh
21st Nov 2013, 23:00
I think what stands out to me the most from my limited experience is the feeling that vampires simply have too much health. If all four vampires engage the four humans, the humans simply can't throw enough damage down to win. Even without factoring in abilities like tyrant/sentinel aoe stuns, it just feels like the vampires can go all in and win a bit too easily. Arrows raining from the sky, flame walls on the ground, flash bombs going off... nothing really deters them from simply jumping in and left clicking constantly.

Germaximus
22nd Nov 2013, 03:25
Played another couple of full matches tonight and I still think it's nicely balanced so far. Sometimes I feel like there's nothing I can do but most of the time I can't help but think either side can have an easy time. It really just depends on working as a team on both sides. Being alone does no good. Definitely need to play more but I'm impressed by how well either side can do working as a team.

I do think vampires have an easier time escaping their enemies. Just hit an invincibility button and take off while humans are basically screwed once a vampire is closed in on them.

Tagexx
22nd Nov 2013, 06:46
I'd say that vampire are definitely stronger if neither team is cooperating, but that's how it should be. On the other hand, basic teamwork with humans will get you quite good results, and you'll need well executed tactics to win with vampires against organized human team.

Xaragoth
22nd Nov 2013, 08:54
There's a few item combinations for each class that make them a teeny bit ridiculous - they are all pretty well known to the experienced crowd by now. The problem arises when these combos come into play and you yourself do not have them. The damage output of a team with them is far higher than a team without them (Grenades are the prime example of this - I mean seriously, 600 AoE & Damage - even with the falloff that is a bit ridiculous considering the humans prefer two types of camp spots - wide open with shooting angles over the entire friggin' map or small roomes to utilize their AoE to the fullest when Vampires assault).

Overall both sides can go out of control quickly right now with some Upgrades and basic teamwork. It's a bit weird. Especially since the amount of AoE and CC is so high.

Razaiim
25th Nov 2013, 21:03
I'd have to say that I find it very hard as a vampire against humans that are organized or found that campy sweet spot. As a human, I've seen vampires walk all over us as a group or individually, or we dominate, again in a group or alone. I definitely feel its more skill and communication then imbalance right now. I also find working together as humans is easier... avoid and focus down vampires with aoe or cc or straight damage. Vampire teams might be much better when voice chat starts working, and we can quickly say "don't pounce that one guy inside that one door, the rest of the team is there too." Or even better: "kidnap that one dude and drop him by the rest of us dudes, so we can maul him together."

Strike5150
26th Nov 2013, 09:38
It is definitely turning out in such a way that vampires are stronger than Humans. When two experienced groups go head to head, if you manage to stay even as humans you win as vampires.

This happened in 3 matches last night and was a clear indicator that you would lose. If you couldn't hold your own as humans you would lose the game. The magic number seemed to be about 20 kills. If you could get too 20 kills as humans before the match ended you could barely scrape out a win if you played your heart out.

Now I remember a few games where we had a very even match going both ways. That is not the norm though and you can usually expect to win as vampires and then just try not to die too much as humans. There are certain areas where humans have an advantage, and at higher lvl play some of the items give too big of an advantage, so this won't always be true. It still depends on how your team is itemized and their skill level with the class they are playing.

ChuckNoriis
27th Nov 2013, 11:39
i don't know why should we take off auto aim for vampire it's already hard to aim with sentinel when you are above an enemy , and this help a lot , ... the only probleme i got it's the skills delay are too long :s

lucinvampire
27th Nov 2013, 11:59
@Chuck – do you have real problems with being Sentinel and find it hard to aim and use abilities?

I thought it was just me in that I find him too awkward to play – I don’t even bother with him any more which is really sad as the flying is awesome – I think he is definitely an acquired skill set – but once you master him he’d be fantastic to play.

RainaAudron
27th Nov 2013, 12:26
You´re not the only one, I just can´t seem to abduct anyone, I always miss... yet when some skilled player was playing Razielim, they succeeded many times in targeting me..

hirukaru
27th Nov 2013, 12:59
You´re not the only one, I just can´t seem to abduct anyone, I always miss... yet when some skilled player was playing Razielim, they succeeded many times in targeting me..

You are not reffering to me I hope.

Abduct and Kidnap (Prefer Kidnap over abduct) is a matter of training, training and training.

If Lucy is aiming at the Dive bomb skill this skill now has a angle it has to be aimed at. It used to be a wider one what made it possible to aim almost straight down.

(oow and as a sentinel be wary of the WARBOW its painfull)

(BTW: auto aim is still there, but they nerfed it to fit better, it used to be really strong. No need to aim with the mouse you could just slam your button and you got a kill)

RainaAudron
27th Nov 2013, 13:48
Uuuhm, yes, I think it was you :D well, you´re good, can´t help it :D I do not want to play Razielim for a while now, can´t really do too much damage with him. I prefer my Reaver running on all fours, I really enjoy running around the level like that lol :D

Razaiim
28th Nov 2013, 15:11
Uuuhm, yes, I think it was you :D well, you´re good, can´t help it :D I do not want to play Razielim for a while now, can´t really do too much damage with him. I prefer my Reaver running on all fours, I really enjoy running around the level like that lol :D
I love watching him scurry along the ground, really the main reason I use leap attack as opposed to any "good" pounces.
And I also know what you mean about the razielim, flying around getting shot and missing that one guy that you thought for sure you had but nope chuck testa its only air, or even worse, automatically landing. The thing is you don't get good with him unless you play him. After a few matches trying it out, though you will get the hang of it.
Now I can swoop in catch a guy, turn around dive-bomb his group, wing flap everyone into a wall so my team can clean up (if they're around) and be out before i get turned into juicy vampire giblets. Gets kinda exciting when you manage to pull it off :D

I still go whooo in my seat when I hit with kidnap :D