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View Full Version : BOTH FACTIONS Alchemist / Sentinel Focus Testing Report



Xaragoth
2nd Nov 2013, 15:17
Alpha Test Team Edition - Balantin, Hirukaru and Xara vs Classes and the world! This time around it's Alchemist and Sentinel. Prepare for another two weeks of constant complaining and commentary! :P

Report for Play Test on the 5.11.2013



ALCHEMIST
The Issue:Healing Field isn't bad, but feels weak compared to the other burst-options in a Death Match mode - the healing is noticeable, but barely useful compared to Flamethrowering down the entire vampire team. Same with Fire Wall.
Proposed Solution:None. We'll wait for the new game modes and see if it has a better synergy with those.

The Issue:Flamethrower is pretty strong, but can not be canceled and is easy to interrupt.
Proposed Solution:Balantin needs to be taught how to read. Because it can be canceled and it even restores it's cooldown partially when interrupted as I found out on the 2nd playtest when I used it myself.

The Issue:Fire Wall is a good point defense/denial ability, but Flamethrower is much more dangerous and controllable.
Proposed Solution:Currently none, since Fire Wall might find a lot more use in other modes and as such they balance each other out. By default Fire Wall is a pretty good skill against Tyrants and Reavers though. Just wish it was throwable over a bit of a distance to make it more competitive with the Flamethrower.

The Issue:Light Bomb seems far more effective than Sunlight Vial in the current game mode. It has heavy burst and can be tossed quite far. Blind on the other hand seems to do very little.
Proposed Solution:Maybe add a small slow or disorient to it or increase the duration of blind. Might be better if it'd confuse controls when used on enemies in the middle of their grab/leap/charge. Because the blind right now doesn't seem to be doing much for those problems.



SENTINEL
The Issue:Flying is a bit unintuitive, not only for new players, but also for those who have played a while. Sometimes you fly off a crate and soar away, sometimes you fall off the roof of a building and hit the ground face-first.
Proposed Solution:It's probably best if you look at the time it takes to register that you wish to fly away. Right now it seems a bit too slow to react to the state change.

The Issue:Abduct is a straight upgrade from the usual Sentinel Kidnap. While the time to grab someone seems shorter, the damage is quite high.
Proposed Solution:There's only a few things that can do something here. One is to give Kidnap a longer time - or increase fall damage, the other to reduce damage on Abduct. Or to just find an entirely different skill for that specific Special and make Abduct the baseline ability. Overall Abduct is always the go-to pick right now and Kidnap has little over it.

The Issue:Echolocation is probably the worst skill in the game right now. Accuracy reduction in close combat wasn't really noticeable from what others said. You can see humans through walls, but you can barely make out buildings and the ground while it's active. The maps are so small right now that it makes very little sense to sacrifice the damage/mobility upgrades for that slot for this skills - because you know where they are anyways. Not to mention Divebomb and Take Off are just so much high on the usefulness level that I don't really know where this skill will ever have it's place right now.
Proposed Solution:I don't even have one, really. I can kinda get why the skill might be useful, but compared to Primal Carnage or Battlefield, the maps are extremly small. You can find anyone everywhere anyways. Even AvP had bigger maps and there it made some sense, as the maps were in some places quite dark and it gave Aliens and Predators a slight tactical advantage. But there it was baseline and didn't take away from your other skills. It could be better if it worked like a Concussion Grenade in most games, where you can barely turn your character. But that might be too much. Could only work in Close Range. Might give Sentinel a more melee-oriented setup for using Impale/Echolocation offensive.


The Issue:Impale feels like it's not really making sense in the Sentinel setup right now. It's worse then Wing Flap in the current way the game plays. Slower, shorter range, no AoE.
Proposed Solution:Test #2 showed that it's better as a defensive option against skilled players. However it must be noted that Wing Flap + Divebomb is such a powerful AoE destruction combo, that it is still very questionable to pick up.



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Tyrant clearly needs a skill called "Meat Club" where he grabs a corpse and swings it around for bonus damage. Also you can eat it for health.

Xaragoth
2nd Nov 2013, 15:18
Report for Play Test on the 7.11.2013

The Issue:
Proposed Solution:

ALCHEMIST
The Issue:Poison Cloud is pretty good to drive away vampires from a rooftop in combo with Light Bomb. However it's damage is worse than Fire Wall and the bigger area barely makes up for that. Add the absurdly long cooldown and it isn't worth it in the current TDM mode.
Proposed Solution:Lowering the cooldown for one, would help. A secondary effect for the poison would also help. Something like the Dilophosaurus in Primal Carnage, where the Vampire gets a wishy-washy screen and can't see as well for a while. Combined with a upgraded Sunlight Vial, this would basically give the Alchemist a kind of Crowd-Control related setup that'd be different from all the "pewpew" we have right now and work well in a team. Kinda like a War Bow Scout does fill a niche.

The Issue:Light Bomb + Flamethrower + Multicannon = God.
Proposed Solution:Similar to Divebomb + Wingflap this combo is quite absurd. You can easily take down most Vampires on your own if you dodge their one signatur CC. Not sure how to deal with this problem without ruining any of the skills for the combo with other skills.

The Issue:Flamethrower doesn't seem to deal damage within the current effect. Hard to tell.
Proposed Solution:Either the effect needs fixing - or my eyes - or the cone math. I often had vampires in it's firestream edge but it didn't burn them.



SENTINEL
The Issue:Echolocation is still terrible.
Proposed Solution:Wrote Details in Report #1.

The Issue:Divebomb + Wingflap is THE ultra cheese combo. It's like a noobtube. No skill required, just do it over and over.
Proposed Solution:Similar problems with Alchemist were noticed. The burst is just too much and with the climb-speed perk, you are back in a safe spot and then in the air before you can even be attacked again after Wingflap. There needs to be a noobtube for new players, I get that, but with two GOOD Sentinels doing this, you wipe the human team out in one double AoE.


The Issue:Abduct + Take Off in the right hands is beast mode.
Proposed Solution:Nothing wrong with that per-se. More the problem that Abduct is as mentioned in #1 still far better than Kidnap. Will keep an eye on this.

Xaragoth
2nd Nov 2013, 15:18
Report for Play Test on the 12.11.2013

CANCELED - 3 PEOPLE TEST FASTER THAN ONE

Xaragoth
2nd Nov 2013, 15:19
Report for Play Test on the 14.11.2013

CANCELED - 3 PEOPLE TEST FASTER THAN ONE

Balantin
8th Nov 2013, 16:23
Impale (or Puncture) is based off of my opinion, which has changed since yesterdays session against the devs.
The fact that I had to run away alot as a Sentinel (because the devs are pretty damn good at their game) meant I was using Puncture defensively more, and it gave me a very strong attack to use while I was grounded.

My older opinion of it was based on matches where we were mostly just stomping our opposition, and I couldnt use Puncture on an enemy that was running from me, because of its slow charge up time.

Dive Bomb and Wing Flap is indeed a damn annoying combo and we both feel it might even be overpowered because of its high damage and AoE.
Have 2 Sentinels doing that combo and they pretty much just 1 shot the entire human team.

A question to the devs about Dive Bomb though, since we recently found out Pounce does more damage the further you jump, does Dive Bomb do more damage with distance covered as well?

Xaragoth
10th Nov 2013, 15:14
Updated Reports yesterday, forgot to highlight that so the thread is up and visible :)

Strike5150
11th Nov 2013, 10:39
I think something that would balance dive bomb is making it more of a skillshot by not allowing you to adjust your aim after you trigger the ability. This will really make it much harder to use effectively and Humans will have a chance to roll away and minimize damage.

Perhaps you could hold the dive bomb key adjust your aim and then start the bombing animation. The upside is that if you allow the player to "hang" in the air while they choose a target for the spell it will be easier for new players to use but not take away from veterans getting better with the skill. Hanging in the air is actually a disadvantage as you become an easier target to kill so I think its ok to add this "feature".

I have to agree with Xaragoth, Abduct is kind of a must have skill. Kidnap doesn't damage the target or do anything Abduct doesn't. I'm basically saving gold to buy a permanent version, currently I would have no reason to use a different skill.

Edit: PS I hate warbow scouts...... God I hate warbow scouts. So easy to hit and takes you out of the fight with half HP. You now get to climb up a roof and try again, most likely though you will die to the second shot, if not outright cause the warbow dropped you right in their midst.

Balantin
11th Nov 2013, 15:01
That might be a good solution Strike, but still, if damage doesn't scale with distance then you can still just use it up close very easily.

Abduct does seem like just an upgraded kidnap, though i felt it was a bit harder to grab someone with it, might just have been my imagination though :P

About the Warbow, it doesnt knock you out of the air completely, you can keep on flying if you are high up and get out of the "stunned" animation in time.

Another thing I would like to mention about the Sentinel, i dont know if its a bug, but when you grab someone and then bump into the ground while carrying them, it bounces you up into the air pretty high :S

Xaragoth
11th Nov 2013, 15:22
Hrm, that might work Strike. Or the cooldown needs to be increased a bit.

Regarding the Abduct/Kidnap problem I'd propose the following idea: Make Abduct the default ability and remove Kidnap. They really can't co-exist as is. To replace Abduct, create the a new ability named Razor Wings. This one works similar to Abduct/Kidnap, but damages everyone near the flight path of the Sentinel for a few seconds.

It fills the same kind of behavior, but is a lot more mobile and more oriented to just dive down and through the human group for damage. It'd serve as a high damage mobile aoe, but at the same time bears the risk of being Bola'd or War Bow'd.


War Bow thus far has been annoying, but fair. It's direct counter is a close-range attack by your team to distract the War Bow user. It just gets a bit too op in certain spots on the maps.

Strike5150
11th Nov 2013, 18:02
I never noticed you could recover from being hit. I'll have to try and remember see if I can make it work. I do remember though that if I was flying that high I was a target anyway, and the most annoying time to get hit was during my dive because I needed to get close to the ground.

Perhaps make the sentinal immune to stuns once the kidnap maneuver begins until he has grabbed his victim. Ofcourse if your a sentinal you should be dodging more but the dodging has a cooldown and it messes with my timing because I don't know when its back off cooldown, so I basically don't end up using it. The dodge is a little weak, maybe we could increase the dodge distance or decrease its cooldown a bit.

Xaragoth
11th Nov 2013, 19:13
I never noticed you could recover from being hit. I'll have to try and remember see if I can make it work. I do remember though that if I was flying that high I was a target anyway, and the most annoying time to get hit was during my dive because I needed to get close to the ground.

Perhaps make the sentinal immune to stuns once the kidnap maneuver begins until he has grabbed his victim. Ofcourse if your a sentinal you should be dodging more but the dodging has a cooldown and it messes with my timing because I don't know when its back off cooldown, so I basically don't end up using it. The dodge is a little weak, maybe we could increase the dodge distance or decrease its cooldown a bit.

Immunity would make Sentinels utterly overpowered in the current system. You just gotta wait until your team attacks really. Or find a good angle to get close.

Xaragoth
12th Nov 2013, 18:27
We canceled the other two tests. We pretty much finished up with the classes.