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View Full Version : Warren Spector leaves Ion Storm.



Beagle Boy
9th Nov 2004, 00:28
Link (http://www.gamespot.com/news/2004/11/08/news_6112661.html)

I dont like this.

theBlackman
9th Nov 2004, 00:43
For my money, if the THIEF 3 is the direct result of his management and guidance, I won't miss him.

I do feel sorry for any TR fans if he gets his hands on that.

Quillan
9th Nov 2004, 02:34
Blackman, it will be very hard for anyone to mess it up worse than what happened with Angel of Darkness.

Tin Star
9th Nov 2004, 04:49
Originally posted by theBlackman
For my money, if the THIEF 3 is the direct result of his management and guidance, I won't miss him.

I do feel sorry for any TR fans if he gets his hands on that.

Lets not forget his results on the last Deus EX game as well,maybe if they do make more Thief and Deus EX games they will return to what both games should have been like.

Tin Star

Mr. Perfect
9th Nov 2004, 05:23
Originally posted by Tin Star
Lets not forget his results on the last Deus EX game as well,maybe if they do make more Thief and Deus EX games they will return to what both games should have been like.

My thoughts exactly. I spent the last week replaying Invisible War, and I don't feal "conected" with the game this time around either. I'm sitting on Liberty Island wondering which ending sucks less...

Theif 3 was a pretty good game though.

BTW, wheren't there already press relases where Ion/Eidos/whoever pretty much confirmed DX3 and Thief 4 where planned?

Guineapiggy
9th Nov 2004, 11:57
There is a god!

Tin Star
9th Nov 2004, 14:01
Originally posted by Mr. Perfect
My thoughts exactly. I spent the last week replaying Invisible War, and I don't feal "conected" with the game this time around either. I'm sitting on Liberty Island wondering which ending sucks less...

Theif 3 was a pretty good game though.

BTW, wheren't there already press relases where Ion/Eidos/whoever pretty much confirmed DX3 and Thief 4 where planned?

They did say that they planed to make another DX and Thief game but I would wait and see and not count on what was said,in fact I think it was Warren who had said it.
I would wait until I have seen something official from Ion or Eidos before I would count on another one of either game being made at this point.

Tin Star

Guineapiggy
9th Nov 2004, 18:56
http://www.rockbrasil8089.hpg.ig.com.br/Abertura%2023%20rock%20in%20rio.jpg
Party! Woooo! God riddance you overstuffed, clueless hack!

Beagle Boy
9th Nov 2004, 21:49
Come on if Thief 3 and DeusEx 2 would have been much worse if Spector did not do it. The gameplay was very good.

Guineapiggy
9th Nov 2004, 22:14
Erm... excuse me? Did you *see* the incomplete state of Thief DS? Spector wanted to release it even earlier, and it just so happens that the prequels to said games were much better so no, I don't think he did them any good. The one thing DS was lacking most was gameplay, no traps, too easy, dodgy interface, clumsy feeling. All he did was introduce a 'loved by the masses' style of control, stupid waste-of-time novelties like the oil and overdone ragdoll physics and made every attempt to force his own ideas of a good game on it. Thief *had* good gameplay, all he needed to do was get his devs to think up a new scenario and better graphics but no, he just couldn't do it could he?

theBlackman
9th Nov 2004, 22:22
Originally posted by Guineapiggy
All he did was introduce a 'loved by the masses' style of control, stupid waste-of-time novelties like the oil and overdone ragdoll physics and made every attempt to force his own ideas of a good game on it. Thief *had* good gameplay, all he needed to do was get his devs to think up a new scenario and better graphics but no, he just couldn't do it could he?

<marquee direction=right>WORD</marquee>

Mr. Perfect
10th Nov 2004, 00:27
Agreed.

But just out of curiosity, what are your guy's opinions of T3's storyline? Personally I had a lot of fun with the game, so it's the other things(level size, swimming, etc) that I'm disapointed with.

Guineapiggy
10th Nov 2004, 00:41
Confused on a few small fronts:
If Gamall could just get the artifacts herself why didn't she?
If the keepers knew that a 'Bretheren and Betrayer' would come then surely they would have known these artifacts wouldn't be safe with them?

Other than that it wasn't bad but a wee bit lacking in development

Tin Star
10th Nov 2004, 01:11
Originally posted by Beagle Boy
Come on if Thief 3 and DeusEx 2 would have been much worse if Spector did not do it. The gameplay was very good.

The first two games of Thief were better then then the last one as was the first game of Deus EX and they were done without his help.

Tin Star

tealsmith
10th Nov 2004, 01:33
Originally posted by Guineapiggy
Confused on a few small fronts:
If Gamall could just get the artifacts herself why didn't she?
If the keepers knew that a 'Bretheren and Betrayer' would come then surely they would have known these artifacts wouldn't be safe with them?

Other than that it wasn't bad but a wee bit lacking in development

The Keepers had become corrupted, and weren't thinking straight, quite obviously. As for why Gamall didn't get the artifacts herself, she probably brlieved it to be easier to just let Garrett get them, then murder him and take them from his corpse. If Orland hadn't shown up, she probably would have done it too.

Quillan
10th Nov 2004, 15:15
Originally posted by Tin Star
The first two games of Thief were better then then the last one as was the first game of Deus EX and they were done without his help.

Tin Star

I'm not at home where my copy of Deus Ex is to confirm, but I am pretty sure the original Deus Ex WAS his work. It was definitely done by Ion Storm (Austin, since at the time there was another in Dallas).

Tin Star
10th Nov 2004, 15:46
Originally posted by Quillan
I'm not at home where my copy of Deus Ex is to confirm, but I am pretty sure the original Deus Ex WAS his work. It was definitely done by Ion Storm (Austin, since at the time there was another in Dallas).

Even if he was he still didn't do nearly as good a job on the second one which left a sour taste in most peoples mouths who have played the game,and left a lot of people with a feeling about what Thief III would be like.
No matter what is said both Thief III and Deus EX II could have and should have been better then they were.

Tin Star

Mr. Perfect
10th Nov 2004, 22:17
Out of the two he definetly had a worse time with Invisible War. Not only did you get all the annoyances from the Xbox developemnt like miniscule levels, but he also made huge changes to the fundemental game play. Skills system? Gone, taking something near half of your character personalization with it. Augmentations? Half the slots got axed, further decreasing your personalization. Inventory? No longer part of your strategy, since there's no balancing your load. Then throw on a very wishy washy plot and plot choices that have absolutly no effect on the end of the game, and it was just.... meh....

Beagle Boy
11th Nov 2004, 23:10
Originally posted by Tin Star
The first two games of Thief were better then then the last one as was the first game of Deus EX and they were done without his help. Tin Star

Deus Ex is his game, Thief was a looking glass game but was his idea. I agree the previous games were better, but it is because of Spector that Thief 3 and Deus Ex2 turned out atleast this good.

T3 and DX 2 were consolised, Was he the one who wanted the games to be made for the console and the pc.

Guineapiggy
11th Nov 2004, 23:55
Originally posted by Beagle Boy
Deus Ex is his game, Thief was a looking glass game but was his idea. I agree the previous games were better, but it is because of Spector that Thief 3 and Deus Ex2 turned out atleast this good.

T3 and DX 2 were consolised, Was he the one who wanted the games to be made for the console and the pc.
I can't find a coherent argument anywhere there...

Tin Star
12th Nov 2004, 00:32
Originally posted by Beagle Boy
Deus Ex is his game, Thief was a looking glass game but was his idea. I agree the previous games were better, but it is because of Spector that Thief 3 and Deus Ex2 turned out atleast this good.

T3 and DX 2 were consolised, Was he the one who wanted the games to be made for the console and the pc.

You don't know that for sure,someone else may have been able to have done just as good a job or even a better job.That is a question that will remain unanswered.The whole idea is that both follow up games could have been better then they were.

Tin Star

tealsmith
12th Nov 2004, 00:32
Originally posted by Guineapiggy
I can't find a coherent argument anywhere there...

Agreed.

ZFGokuSSJ1
13th Nov 2004, 14:58
I e-mail Warren frequently, and asked him about the console thing. It wasn't his decision.

tealsmith
13th Nov 2004, 18:19
Originally posted by ZFGokuSSJ1
I e-mail Warren frequently, and asked him about the console thing. It wasn't his decision.

Yeah right. Warren's stated in the past he cares more about his games selling big then being big critical successes. That was the whole reasoning behind having the game on XBOX as well - more sales. And it worked too, but at a price - the quality of the game wasn't nearly as high as it could have, or SHOULD HAVE been.

Tin Star
13th Nov 2004, 18:51
Originally posted by ZFGokuSSJ1
I e-mail Warren frequently, and asked him about the console thing. It wasn't his decision.

And if you believe that I have some swampland on the moon I would like to sell to you.

Tin Star

Gilbarblo
12th Dec 2004, 17:21
ok by the sounds of it he sucked. but what i read in that thing that i didnt like is that their making another tomb raider game. but anyway, maybe they'll hire someone better? that would be greats