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xarax
20th Feb 2004, 05:12
go into the spectral realm when Raziel took his heart, then he was able to come back to the material realm through a wormhole?

ziada
20th Feb 2004, 05:55
He didnt go in the spectral realm. He went into the demon realm that Raziel(under the influence of the Hylden) sent him to. I think the portal opened because Raziel purified the reaver and it was Kains destiny as the Scion of Balance to go to the spirit forge at that time.

Camus Audron
20th Feb 2004, 06:14
That is all only your speculation Ziada......he did go into demon realm, but that has nothing to do with Raziel's purified reaver (it isnt even purified by then) and nobody really knows how much the Hylden's manipulation or Kain's Role have to do with the opening of the portal.

But I like to think that Kain (for either reason) has his soul linked to the Demon dimension instead of the Spectral realm, and every time the Scion of balance is close to death or his soul leaves his body, he is drawn back to the demon dimension. This would also explain why mortanius had to recover Kain's soul from "Hell", and why Eldergod requires Raziel to devour Kain's soul.


I like this explanation because it ties well many loose ends in the series.

Trelela
20th Feb 2004, 11:21
I knew that Kain will survive because: Raziel didn't devour his soul and in SR it was too hard to kill a vampire - to really kill him, you needed to devour his soul. In other way : When Raziel ripped his heart out - the power of still standing Pillar of Balance kept Kain alive.

ziada
20th Feb 2004, 16:50
by the "portal" i meant when he came out of the demon realm, the portal that lets him out of there.

xarax
21st Feb 2004, 02:11
Raziel had green glowing eyes when he expelled Kain to the demon realm. Raziel was temporarily possessed by the Hylden Lord, and so had the power to open a portal to the demon realm to banish Kain there. I am unsure why Kain had the power to open another portal to return from the demon realm. I also don't understand why Kain can live without the Heart of Darkness.

TheWatcher
21st Feb 2004, 03:18
Originally posted by xarax
Raziel was temporarily possessed by the Hylden Lord, and so had the power to open a portal to the demon realm to banish Kain there.

Well first, it's been established in various other threads that Turel (whom Raziel absorbed) wasn't possessed by the Hylden Lord, just various lower Hylden (Remember, the HL wasn't able to escape the demon realm and possess Janos until after the Pillars' destruction).
Which got me to thinking, why were there no Hylden in the demon dimension? The pillars were only just corrupted then, no? I think it would have been nice bonus for Kain to fight a few of them there.

Omni_Sephiroth
21st Feb 2004, 04:48
Raziel was not possed by ANY hilden he was just influenced by them, and the fact that kain in the Scion of balance is what sustained him it says so in Q&A with amy henning on www.thelostworlds.net

Darkmaster
21st Feb 2004, 10:23
Kain himself said that only Raziel's Soul Reaver could kill him but Raziel didn't use the blade he just ripped out Kain's heart and the heart was still beating.That's probably why he lived.

Kainster
21st Feb 2004, 12:16
Omni_Sephiroth, youre wrong about Raziel being "just under the Hyldens influence". He was possessed by the Hylden who had possessed Turel. Watch the cutscene with the death of Turel. As Raz absorbs his soul, he also absorbs the souls of the Hylden from Turels body.

TheWatcher
21st Feb 2004, 17:12
I just replayed the bit with Kain in the demon dimension and something occurred to me. At the start, Kain gets a speech from the Hylden telling him he's still 'fair of form' which suggests the Hylden have been mutated physically by their time in the dimension. Immediately following this speech, the demons Kain fights fall (from somewhere) and he turns to face them. Could this mean that the creatures we call demons are actually just mutated Hylden, and that the 'demon dimension' was actually uninhabited before their banishment? Or has all this already been established and I've just been asleep?

van_HellSing PL
21st Feb 2004, 17:38
The Hylden and the Demons are different species. It has been covered in the Q&A.

DJpick
21st Feb 2004, 18:27
He was possessed by the Hylden who had possessed Turel
Actually I think "influenced" is still a better word because Raziel fed on those souls, but they altered his perceptions some and turned him a little deranged. But they didnt directly posess him.