PDA

View Full Version : [SPOILER] Missing?



Baby_drew
11th Feb 2004, 19:09
Is it just me? b4 defiance came out i saw a number of screenshots of a big geezer with bones coming out of him ( looked a bit like nemeis out of RE3) but ive finished it now and i didnt see him in it ? did it just find its way onto the cutting room floor or did i miss a huge wedge of the game out!

blincoln
11th Feb 2004, 19:43
If you mean the mutated-looking monsters, they're in the game near the end.

Lär
11th Feb 2004, 19:51
Ya know, those creeps were extremely easy to beat. I expected more of them, but there were only a few in the game, unlike those other revenants. Man, there were loads and loads of those dang things!!

Later! :D

LOKFan
12th Feb 2004, 06:32
I think I only saw two of them in the game and I can't remember what they were like to fight.

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 07:15
When Raziel returns to Vorador's Mansion I encountered one of them in the room with the Ancient Statue on the west side of the place. When I first saw a Vampire Hunter mutate into the deformity I was amazed.

All you have to do is make sure there is a Hylden Spirit around and watch as it eventually possesses a Vampire Hunter and mutates him into a monster.

You can also find them at the Vampire Citadel, when Raziel goes there at the end.

These mutated Human Revenants are strong, but they have weaknesses to certain elemental reavers.

Here is a picture below of what they look like.

http://www.legacyofkain.com/screenshots/63.html

Does anybody know what is their official name?

Umah Bloodomen
12th Feb 2004, 07:25
Originally posted by Dogfight
Does anybody know what is their official name? Do we simply call them Mutated Revenants.

The Prima Strategy Guide describes those beings as "Possessed", and goes on to say that these are victims of Hylden possession. The possession levels vary by degree (light possession and heavy possession), the latter results in the physical disfiguration.

EDIT: Slight clarification, the text does actually claim these creatures are human.

Pg. 93 for anyone who may have the book and is interested. ;)

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 07:39
Thanks Umah, I appreciate your quick response.

Umah Bloodomen
12th Feb 2004, 08:17
Originally posted by Dogfight
Thanks Umah, I appreciate your quick response.

You're quite welcome, Dogfight. :)

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 08:24
If I remember correctly, they happened whenever there was a human that didn't have their soul reaved. So after the Fall of the pillars, if you didn't reave a humans soul, they became possessed. And I think Amy actually said those were examples of the Hylden being overzealous in their possession and not controlling it better. But I coul dbe wrong.

But I know they are a possession of some sort, because they only happen AFTER the soul disappears. I hit one of the victims chained up in Voradors underground tunnels, and didn't feed on her, and she turned into one of those :)

And DF, how is it you will accpet thr Prima Strategy Guides answer, but find the Official answers from Amy and CD to be wrong? As long as I live I will NEVER understand that one.

I remember early descriptions of the games mentioning this as well, if you didn't feed on the soul (not sure if they mentioned blood), then a demon/evil entity would enter the corpse and take it over.

Umah Bloodomen
12th Feb 2004, 08:28
:p

The Prima Guide also describes that "weak-willed" or "injured" individuals are susceptible to Hylden possession. ;)

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 08:29
So that means I'M safe :)

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 09:01
And DF, how is it you will accpet thr Prima Strategy Guides answer, but find the Official answers from Amy and CD to be wrong? As long as I live I will NEVER understand that one.

A few of the answers Amy and the staff gave to certain questions aren't as detailed and explicit as those given in the strategy guide. What is more when they cause misdirections and current inconsistencies in the series with some of their answers they do not explain how such things came to be. At the very least when they give an answer that seems wrong, they should say why it currently appears to be wrong without spoiling the next game. For a group that claims to want total secrecy on the storylines of their games, some of their answers have already spoiled some aspects of the story for the next game for us all. If they had for a few questions slightly longer more descriptive answers as in the strategy guide, without spoiling anything for the next game, I'm sure they would have stopped me in my tracks long before I started. Nonetheless, I'm appreciative of them just giving us the answers that they did to our questions.

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 09:10
A few of the answers Amy and the staff gave to certain questions aren't as detailed and explicit as those given in the strategy guide
You're kidding right? This is Prima, the company KNOWN for it's typing errors. They're so bad you would think they just mash the keys and pray they get what they intended to say.

What is more when they cause misdirections and current inconsistencies in the series with some of their answers they do not explain how such things came to be
Like I said, it's because they don't want to give everything away. They don't want to show their hand, or play all their cards. They want to dangle the carrot, drop subtle hints.

It's like the Buddhists when they ask "What is the sound of one hand clapping?" They don't ACTUALLY give you the answer because they want you to figure it out yourself.

At the very least when they give an answer that seems wrong, they should say why it currently appears to be wrong without spoiling the next game
This is just a hunch, but maybe it's because they aren't wrong? You just want them to be cause they contradict your theories?

But like I said, I don't count the Prima Strategy guide as the definitive guru of LoK.

Maybe it's just me, but most of the stuff they have given away isnt' a spoiler, because it's info that HAS to be answered. Like Turel, and now with Voradors survival into BO2. These are questions that we KNOW will be answered eventually, so they aren't really able to be spoiled. It's not a matter of will they, but just when will they.

The rest of the stuff, they haven't spoiled anything, because you're the only one who believes your theories :)

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 09:21
This is just a hunch, but maybe it's because they aren't wrong? You just want them to be cause they contradict your theories?

If only that were it, I would never have started in the first place.


Maybe it's just me, but most of the stuff they have given away isnt' a spoiler, because it's info that HAS to be answered. Like Turel, and now with Voradors survival into BO2. These are questions that we KNOW will be answered eventually, so they aren't really able to be spoiled. It's not a matter of will they, but just when will they.

Yes, what you said doesn't need to be spoiled just yet, but the staff has given big spoilers, although it is relative.


The Hylden have the ability to see into Nosgoth's timestream, but how they do so hasn't been revealed yet. The Seer is "an extremely powerful and mysterious Hylden."

Again I said it is relative, thus for some these spoilers may be big but for others their significance may be small.

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 09:27
If only that were it, I would never have started in the first place
I don't want to be an arse, but haven't you naticed that you are pretty much the ONLY person to question Amy and CD's answers? That right there shoudl say something.

Again I said it is relative, thus for some these spoilers may be big but for others their significance may be small
Big deal. It's like a trailer to a movie, giving JUST enough to make us say "Hmmm, now THAT sounds interesting!!!" If they don't tell us what they plan on doing, we won't be interested. They have to give just enough to keep us interested. I for one had a feeling the Seer would play a part in the series after BO2, because her importance was too much to be a random unnecessary character. Unlike Umah who just was made after BO1. And then died. The Seer was there for one scene, and then disappeared. It was pretty obvious they were going to use her again.

not too mention with all the talk about Ancients, eventually the Hylden would be explained. You can't have a decent villian if you don't explain the villian. They're mirroring the murals, one side sees it one way, but I'm sure once we see the Hylden side a LOT of people will be saying "you know what, I don't think I like the Ancients anymore".

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 09:42
I don't want to be an arse, but haven't you naticed that you are pretty much the ONLY person to question Amy and CD's answers? That right there shoudl say something.

There have been others, but I have been the most vocal.


Big deal. It's like a trailer to a movie, giving JUST enough to make us say "Hmmm, now THAT sounds interesting!!!" If they don't tell us what they plan on doing, we won't be interested.

Its a relative thing, to you their answers might not be a bid deal, but to others their answers could count as big spoilers.


I for one had a feeling the Seer would play a part in the series after BO2, because her importance was too much to be a random unnecessary character. Unlike Umah who just was made after BO1. And then died. The Seer was there for one scene, and then disappeared. It was pretty obvious they were going to use her again.

It was somewhat obvious from Blood Omen 2, that the Seer would return, after all she said she knew Kain better than he knows himself but she didn't say what she knew. An indication that she would have to return to reveal what she knows.

Still, to me that answer the staff gave does tell me more than I wanted to know at this time about the Seer, even so it does wet ones appetite for the next game.

You know the answer the staff gave about the Seer, gives me the image of the older Kain having to fight the Seer as one of the bosses in the next game.

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 10:16
But if he fights her in the future, that means she can see in time, but if he fights her in the past, that means she won.

Also, what if she just knew of Kain, because she is one of the few people who read the signs correctly, ie she made the prophecy?

PS. It's whet, not wet :D

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 10:40
You know you have given me something quite incredible to ponder, I never thought that the Seer could be the key to the Hylden's seeing the timestream, until your last post.
Hey, when you post as much as I do, eventually you come up with something good :D

besides, I can't think of any other reason why she is called "The Seer".

I just had another epiphany, what if the devolved form that Janos had in Blood Omen 2 as the Beast, is the nearly identical form to the ancestral form of both the Ancients and the Hylden before they split off into two seperate races.
As much as I appreciate your theories and ability to think. You shouldn't post your ideas as if they are fact, no matter what the voice in the game is saying to you. Because they arent fact yet.

The way I see it, Janos, and HL BOTH got it wrong, kind of like each of them could ALSO represent what would happen if the Hylden, or Ancient, Champion had one over the other. While the Seer represents the merged destiny to create Kain. She is the correct one, the outside, unbiased actor of the game.

I think the Seer just wants to correct what went wrong, and isn't out for any side, she just wants the compromise, the merging of the destinies to create the TRUE redemption.

Dogfight
12th Feb 2004, 10:50
The way I see it, Janos, and HL BOTH got it wrong, kind of like each of them could ALSO represent what would happen if the Hylden, or Ancient, Champion had one over the other. While the Seer represents the merged destiny to create Kain. She is the correct one, the outside, unbiased actor of the game. I think the Seer just wants to correct what went wrong, and isn't out for any side, she just wants the compromise, the merging of the destinies to create the TRUE redemption.

I am skeptical of that, before the quote below I would have agreed with you.



A: Most of the history of the Hylden has not been revealed yet, but it will be eventually. The Seer is “an extremely powerful and mysterious Hylden.” More of her story may appear in a future game. She *appears* to have escaped the binding.

The part of her appearing to escape the binding, makes me question her motives.

DJpick
12th Feb 2004, 10:58
I must have subsconsciously totally ignored the meaning of her name
Didn't you think it was funny that "The Seer's" gift was TK? I did.

Maybe her blood gave Kain another gift over time, that eventually came to fruition beofre Raziel grew wings, and drew him to explore timelines and seek the truth? Maybe he got images he couldn't understand but knew lie in the past, and had to see them for real because he couldn't make sense of the images like she could?

Maybe :) Man, it hurts to come up with such great ideas :)

I am skeptical of that, before the quote below I would have agreed with you
How did she escape though? Me thinks it was because she didn't agree with what the Hylden did. Or she was more powerful than all of them, something greater. Maybe she is the Ancient form of the ancestor race you talk about. Maybe because she came up with the prophecies, the Ancients spared her incase they needed her again?

Who knows.

Lär
12th Feb 2004, 12:00
Originally posted by Dogfight
When Raziel returns to Vorador's Mansion I encountered one of them in the room with the Ancient Statue on the west side of the place.

HOW in the heck can you tell what is north, south, east, or west?? There is no map, and no compass, like in SR2. :p

Anyway, here's how you can fight more of those big mutated dudes: During Raz's second trip through Vorador's mansion, stop in the room where the entrance to the third spear is at. You'll notice two humans chained to the wall near the door. Walk up to them and give 'em a few whacks, and see what happens. hehe ;) :cool:

Later! :D

Protector_Malek
12th Feb 2004, 13:31
DOGFIGHT, one of your problems here is that you want to explain everything and have the final answers out of your theories when the serie is not over yet. You have to be humble and accept that there will be lots of unanswered questions and things you won't understand or that seemengly won't fit until the next game is released. They have all the answer!! they invented the game! be patiente! I imagine they see your allegations and laugh at the way you complicate the whole story and plot.
Dude, if I invented a story and I say a dog is blue, no matter how bad you believe and have theories of your own proving that the dog is green.... you accept the darn dog is blue!

Chubben
12th Feb 2004, 13:38
What ever happend to the pic we saw that we all believed to be Turel or Turelism??

van_HellSing PL
12th Feb 2004, 13:43
What pic was that? Can you provide a link?

Chubben
12th Feb 2004, 14:06
Now that i look at it, i think it is Turel. But he looks a bit smaller and different, don't you think?

http://www.nosgoth2.net/Defiance/Screenshots/SoulDeceaver3.jpg

van_HellSing PL
12th Feb 2004, 14:11
Maybe it's another version of Turel that didn't make it into the game...

HolyMoses
12th Feb 2004, 14:19
Originally posted by Umah Bloodomen
:p

The Prima Guide also describes that "weak-willed" or "injured" individuals are susceptible to Hylden possession. ;)



The force has a strong effect on the weak minded.

Chubben
12th Feb 2004, 14:31
And now were ad it.I Also rember seeing in one of the promo movies that when Kain uses his impaling technique, the enemy exploded.( Well, he fell apart,something like that.)

Oh well, mabey it's just something for Blincoln's site Thelostworlds in the future. Can't wait till the Defaince section is really updated!!

moose562
12th Feb 2004, 22:09
Originally posted by Umah Bloodomen
:p

The Prima Guide also describes that "weak-willed" or "injured" individuals are susceptible to Hylden possession. ;)



this makes sense with janos being the perfect vessel and also raziels remarks about his form of conduit not being so original