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Amazon Warrior
16th Oct 2003, 22:27
Having seen a number of posts that suggest that the average age of the typical DX player is 'mature', how old are people? There seems to be a prevalent opinion that DX:IW isn't (or shouldn't be) a game for the average 13 year old shoot-em-up freak, but that Eidos are trying to capture at least some of this market. Not that I am a button-bashing, X-box-owning, kill-orientated 13 year old boy with incipient testosterone issues, but I wondered if anyone else was.

Incidentally, for the record, I'm 23. Same age as JC :cool: :D

I'm also female. No testosterone for me thanx! Tho' I wouldn't mind meeting JC in a dark alley somewhere... Rrrrrrrr! My kind of guy ;)

I suppose if you've owned the game for several years or have played it many times, it might be more appropriate to vote with the age you first played it.

Lawnboy360
16th Oct 2003, 22:41
I am a button-bashing, X-box-owning, kill-orientated 13 year old boy

Do you have something against XBox owners?
Know that [...]

;)

TheDerf
16th Oct 2003, 23:07
TEH testosterone r00lz0rz.

I'm 16.

God From Machine
16th Oct 2003, 23:30
Well i'm 18 and loved the first DX, which would have made me what, 15 or 16 when i bought it? I still love it, too much, as i still play it instead of doing my stupid first year physics assignments, damn university cutting out of my video game time.:D

So i'm sure there are lots of guys like me who were loaded with the wonderous stuff called testosterone back in the DX days. And many who still are.

What i would wonder is if there is a point to aiming the game at a 12-13 year old? could they get any enjoyment out of a game like this whose predicessor came out when they were 10?(a 10 year old could not possible play DX to its fullest or understand any of the subtleties) But as long as they buy it i suppose. Then again most people who play FPS now would have been 6 when Doom came out, but in a game as heavy in the back story as DX, could you really play DX:IW and have fun with no previous experience in the DX world.

Machinax
17th Oct 2003, 00:13
Originally posted by Amazon Warrior
Tho' I wouldn't mind meeting JC in a dark alley somewhere... Rrrrrrrr! My kind of guy ;)



Woman at the entrance of the Lucky Money Club: [to JC] I order you to stand in a corner and growl at women, like a dog who needs a master.

Damn, that woman scared me.

Amazon Warrior
17th Oct 2003, 00:21
Do you have something against XBox owners?

Actually, my first DX experience was on my mate's PS2, cos I tried the training level on it while I was staying over at his house. I found it an awkward, fiddly experience since I'm not used to using a controlpad to aim with, other than the occasional game of Perfect Dark on another mate's N64. In fact, it annoyed me sufficiently that I thought twice about buying the pc game. In the Defusing the LAMs section, all but one of them exploded and killed me.

To tell the truth, I've never been a console gamer, simply because when I was younger my parents refused to spend (vast) sums of money on what they deemed to be a waste of time, and now I'm not that bothered, since I can play games on my pc, and also use it to DO OTHER THINGS! I cut my gaming teeth on machines like the Commodore 64 and the Spectrum when I were a lass, way back when. My cousin's Acorn Archimedes was THE height of coolness! He also had an early pc too, with Civilisation on it. I had to be prised away with a crowbar...


TEH testosterone r00lz0rz.
There's nothing wrong with testosterone, in moderation. There's nothing wrong with being 16, either. I even vaguely remember being that age myself. 'Course, I'm knocking on a bit now... :p

Amazon Warrior
17th Oct 2003, 01:19
Woman at the entrance of the Lucky Money Club: [to JC] I order you to stand in a corner and growl at women, like a dog who needs a master.
'Go call a Russian sailor a nasty name. I want to see you fight!' LOL!

That place was jam-packed with comedy moments! :D

Seriously, I'm not saying that I agreed with the opinions that were going round, just that there were a lot of them. I'm quite happy for 13 year olds (or anyone, for that matter) to play DX:IW, and if it makes them go and play DX too, so much the better. And it can't be denied that the general target audience of games like this is male (or assumed to be so). I will admit, I'm lacking certain essential gonads, and I came to DX fairly late in life (I only bought it in May- nearly ruined my university library project! *note to self- don't buy exceptionally addictive game four days before deadline, and then load it up 'just see what it looks like...'*). :cool:

I certainly didn't mean to offend any younger players. I was just pointing out that there was this opinion, and wondered how the age range of players on this forum compared to this. As far as I'm concerned, the more people who play DX and DX:IW, the better. I lent my entire system to my flatmate so he could try it after I'd finished playing it (partly 'cos I had exams, and didn't need the temptation, and partly so's I had someone to discuss it with). He went in trigger-happy, and totally failed to grasp the missions system. I kept saying things like 'so... you resuced so-and-so, then?' 'no', 'but you did this?' 'no', 'surely you talked to these people?' 'no'. It was hilarious! :D Another friend I spoke to also said he had problems initially with the exploration and missions concept, then went on to say he didn't tend to complete FPS games as a rule, and much preferred RPGs. I was confused by that.

The prevailing image of gamers is that we're all brainless idiots who destroy everything in sight. Whenever I try to explain a game to my mum, for instance, she looks slightly alarmed. I think she thinks I'm a closet psycopath or something. :D Admittedly, I do like games in which there are elements of running round, with the option of shooting people (or aliens. Or robots). But it is quite hard for a non-gamer to appreciate that computer games can have a lot of hidden depths. Not all of them, admittedly, and not all gamers want something other than a blood bath. Sometimes its fun to paint the walls red. Other times something more cerebral is called for.

Ironically, I'll probably play DX:IW as the male Alex first, because female characters often irritate me (never could get on with Lara Croft, for example, tho the lass in NOLF is ok).

Lawnboy360
17th Oct 2003, 01:30
But it is quite hard for a non-gamer to appreciate that computer games can have a lot of hidden depths.


My mother is especially funny. Often, when we're talking about games for a reason or another, she ends up saying "Yeah, your stupid games!" and then pretends to fire a gun like a kid, with a stupid look on her face : "BANG! BANG! You're dead!". Really sad ;) .

Someday I should tell her about Warcraft 3's tech threes, or adventure games' puzzles and non-violence, or the way you can complete DXIW without killing anyone...
But I fear this would cause a total mental lockdown...


I dislike consoles too...I like games to be immersive, and being in front of a monitor is more involving to me than to seat on the couch. :) I played for hours on my friend's XBox and PS2, and never got used to the controller.

Amazon Warrior
17th Oct 2003, 01:49
My mother has a limited grasp of technology at the best of times. She's the kind of person who takes ages deciding what to type, looks at the monitor, then has to come and find me and say something along the lines of 'look! I just did this, and the screens gone all blank!' Leaving me to explain about screen savers...:p

I luv my mum! :)

I did try and explain to her how I was trying to avoid killing people in games like DX and Thief, but she missed the point I think. For example, if you play Thief 2 on expert, you're basically not allowed to kill ANYTHING. And on some levels you can't even score K/Os. I haven't played DX to such a hard-core degree yet, but I'd like to think that I'm reasonably moral. Strict policy of non-violence to civilians (I'd K/O them if I had to, but I preferred not to), and I'd stun instead of kill troopers if I could. Having said that, happiness is a nice cosy roof, a well-modded sniper rifle, and a lot of little tiny targets running around! :D

It's surprising how many people think that computer games involve all of 6 brain cells. Dunno if anyone else has heard of this study (probably), but a gang of pyschologist types looked into the effect of different kinds of computer games on the brain. Apparently, FPS and RPG types improve observational skills, targeting and other information-processing abilities (can't remember them all now, I saw this a few months ago). Apparently all you get from playing Tetris type games is extra motor neurones!:p

Yeah, there's something very intimate about only being a few inches away from the environment you're interacting with. I was sucked in by DX the first time I played it on PC in a way that never happened on the PS2. Tho my mate has completed it on PS2. I called him after I'd finished the first time, 'cos he was the only person I knew who'd played it (this was before I discovered this forum, obviously!). He hadn't finished it, so I ordered him to, and then we spent hours on the phone disucssing the various endings etc.

Machinax
17th Oct 2003, 02:17
Originally posted by Amazon Warrior
never could get on with Lara Croft, for example, tho the lass in NOLF is ok.

Aw yea. Planning on getting NOLF soon.

AlteredGlyph
17th Oct 2003, 03:49
Originally posted by God From Machine
What i would wonder is if there is a point to aiming the game at a 12-13 year old? could they get any enjoyment out of a game like this whose predicessor came out when they were 10?(a 10 year old could not possible play DX to its fullest or understand any of the subtleties) But as long as they buy it i suppose. Then again most people who play FPS now would have been 6 when Doom came out, but in a game as heavy in the back story as DX, could you really play DX:IW and have fun with no previous experience in the DX world.

I'm 13. I've played DX through 3 times. Just because the game came out 3 years ago doesn't mean it's not still the best fps on the market. I may be an unusually smart and deep 13 yearold, but don't just make assumptions on the age. Not ALL 13 yeaar olds are idiots, or lam3rs. I stand as proof of that.

Random
17th Oct 2003, 06:28
Yeah, maybe we shouldn't be restricting the game to 'mature' people, but using it to get younger people to think about the world. I don't want to get all arty, but Deus Ex does this better than most games.

I played Deus Ex when I was 17-18 and I missed a lot of the scientific stuff and the deeper allusions in the game -- but I definately knew it was something special. I can play it now and understand a lot more of it; I'll understand even more in five years' time. We all mature as we grow older, at different speeds, and there's no specific age when we suddenly become wise. At every age, we think we're wise. ;)

Deus Ex should be played by everyone. :cool: Except those under the age recommendation ... of course.

Fuzz
17th Oct 2003, 09:48
um Random since when did you become a mod :D

Random
17th Oct 2003, 10:15
Originally posted by Fuzz
um Random since when did you become a mod :D

I'm a mod? :confused:

Fuzz
17th Oct 2003, 13:03
Originally posted by Random
I'm a mod? :confused:

lmao :D

Amazon Warrior
17th Oct 2003, 14:41
I may be an unusually smart and deep 13 yearold, but don't just make assumptions on the age. Not ALL 13 yeaar olds are idiots, or lam3rs. I stand as proof of that.

'Tis true. Good for you. :)

Amazon Warrior
17th Oct 2003, 14:44
At every age, we think we're wise. ;)

*Nods wisely*
:D

God From Machine
17th Oct 2003, 16:20
Not ALL 13 yeaar olds are idiots, or lam3rs. I stand as proof of that.

Sorry, i did not mean to be rude. just from my own experience with the game, i dout that when i was 10-13 i would understand any of the mythological refferences. Not that i wouldn't enjoy the game i just wouldn't have gotten any of the deeper meaning.


In general though when i envision a 12 year old playing a game i see the kids who i have to watch at work running around going "pow pow" irritating me to no end as they do this, not that they are all like that of course, everyone is different.;)

More power to the younglings if they want to play the game, and great for them if they understand what it means.

James Warren
17th Oct 2003, 19:26
Amazon Warrior{
Having seen a number of posts that suggest that the average age of the typical DX player is 'mature', how old are people?
}
Mature is as mature does. That's what Momma always said (loved that movie.) I am 60 and being "mature" in a vehicle on a California freeway is STILL a struggle and a profound kind of meditation for me.

Thanks for starting this thread. This kind of pleasant social variety is why I am always drawn more to the Eidos forums than the "20 something mod maker I know more about making sky boxes than you do and my thing is bigger too" dominated Ion Storm forums.


AlteredGlyph{
I'm 13. I've played DX through 3 times. Just because the game came out 3 years ago doesn't mean it's not still the best fps on the market. I may be an unusually smart and deep 13 year old, but don't just make assumptions on the age. Not ALL 13 year olds are idiots, or lam3rs. I stand as proof of that.
}
Being 13 is a GOOD thing! I remember that particular year vividly. It was the year I developed an INTENSE interest in my 13 year old neighbor who, in my overheated imagination, was built like Laura Croft to the googleth. It was also the same year I began building goofy machines in my parents' garage which had my otherwise calm and beloved father storming through the suddenly darkened house yelling "Sweet (deleted) Jesus, what has he done now?"

Other than that I'm sure I was neither lame or idiotic. Now, I did have an interest in science fiction which had, with the academicians in my high school, a literary value somewhere between comic books and ink smudged toilet paper. They were NEVER accepted as valid book reports. I was not put off by their opinion of my ability to judge the value of literature any more than you are put off of your appreciation of this new form of INTERACTIVE science fiction literature. I valued and understood that literature as a form of social commentary that could not be done in any other format.
So, apparently, do you. Deus Ex takes me back to my 13th year. Being 13 is and was a GOOD thing.

Just be sure to pull up your pants. That style has limited appeal among the vaunted "mature."

gamergirl
18th Oct 2003, 03:19
LOL James! Just the other day I was asking a friend of mine (we are both 40+) how people can think that "hey everyone - look at my underwear" style is attractive. Maybe I'm just getting old. :)

If computer games were available when I was 13, I'd have been all over them. The one computer game I knew back then, to which I had very limited access, was a lunar landing game.

Denethor
18th Oct 2003, 10:23
Im 14 and i love deus ex and i understand the story, its a great game and im eagarly awaiting deus ex 2.

When i played deus ex 1st i was about 12 and i understood the story perfectly.

I may be 14 but 14 is the time when your growing up, its not like your a 10 year old ,10 year olds wouldn't understand deus ex agreed but 10 to 14 is a big step in terms of mental age.

I know 12 year olds and 13 year olds who post on forums and i swear you wouldnt be able to tell thier age. Not all teenagers like "button bashing" games, i like games like deus ex and knights of the old republic , rpgs are my kinda game cause i love the interaction and storylines.

One more thing: ive been playing games since i was six(not alot compared to some of you) games like fallout 2 and bauldurs(sp?) gate games that require you to think...

So please dont steriotype us, we aren't all mindless button bashing freaks!

cball05
18th Oct 2003, 14:01
Personally I think that if you're enjoying Deus Ex then you must have at least some level of maturity. When I got it the first time, my younger brother tried to play it for a few levels and then got bored, since he usually elected to whip out the assault rifle instead of having conversations. Deus Ex has a deep storyline and raises many questions about the world that younger audiences would probably not understand.
As far as blood and gore goes, kids see plenty of that already and personally its never really bothered me. Of course, Edios doesn't feel that way and pushes the rating up - although I can understand where they're coming form in terms of informing parents.

The_Illuminated
18th Oct 2003, 16:52
I got the game (Deus Ex - duh) for my birthday in 1999 and played through. then i missunderstood some of the mythalogical referances, but I still loved the depth of the story and and loved the game.
I also don't play on any console excpt an original Nintendo and a N64. No button mashing for me.
P.S -i was 10 when I got the game and am 14 now

sackme
20th Oct 2003, 12:12
I've been playin DX for a year now n ive seen all the tricks on the net n done them in the game (feel sorry for XB users theyll never experience net gaming:D ) but im only 16 so i shouldnt understand the depth of some moral questiions:confused: (what do government researchers know:rolleyes: )

FPS r fun but not if they dont have a point or any depth (DX had alot of both thank god (if there is such a being) praise DX)

I hate myslef but as long as someone likes me I wouldnt want to see me incharge of subatomic particles:D .

WHERE THERES A WILL THERES A WAY, BUT WHERE THERE ISNT A WILL THERES A WAY IF YOUVE GOT A GUN (RAMPAGING PHYCOPATHS):D

Has the whole world gone mad:confused:

Frost Giant
20th Oct 2003, 12:32
Originally posted by God From Machine
So i'm sure there are lots of guys like me who were loaded with the wonderous stuff called testosterone back in the DX days.

Don't get me wrong because I am also male, however testosterone is not very wonderous at all. Because of it men are more likley to make rash decissions and in the long run it shortens our lifespan by about ten years compared to the average female who will most likely live much longer. I watch TLC a lot because it is a very interesting and educational TV channel that is where I got my info. I think the show was called Man vs. Woman: different but equal. Their studies show that testosterone actually increases our chances of getting many kinds of cancers as well as the dreaded heart attack. It also causes our body lots of stress which is why our lifespan on average is much shorter than that of females. To top (or bottom) that off it is molecularly less complex than estrogen. So in conclusion, I think estrogen is the truly wonderous one of the two major sexual hormones. Yep, it's true, so when you hear a man talk about his wife as his better half, please think about it, he may be right. Just pointing that out.:D what the heck am I thinking? it shouldn't be this::D it should be this::( Why am I made to suffer!!!!???????!!!!!!!!!:(

Lawnboy360
20th Oct 2003, 16:38
Funny, I've watched the same show myself without looking for it.

Dr Strangelove
20th Oct 2003, 19:02
I'm 14, was 14 when I first played Deus Ex. I like to think I'm fairly mature, but I'm probably kidding myself to a large extent.

I feel as if I have a fair grasp on what Deus Ex is about, but I'm sure there were tons of references and symbolism that I missed - I'm not too good at symbolism.

I'm not particularely a player of FPSs by and large, but I think story is mostly what attracts me to games. Thinking about it, though my other favourite game, Baldur's Gate 2 has a fairly cliched story - I think what wins it for BG2 is the sidequests. It does have good characters.

On a largely unrelated note, I think one weakness Deus Ex does have is that it is very linear, however many ways there are to achieve the objectives in an area.

Amazon Warrior
20th Oct 2003, 19:56
Hmm... I suppose that DX is like a fairly complex book. The first time you read it, it was very new and exciting, and you read fast to find out what the end is (well, I do anyway!). The next time you read it you know how the story goes, but if its good enough, you don't mind knowing how it ends and can concentrate on information you might have missed the first time round. Plus every time you read the book, you change and become a slightly different person. Your perspective changes with each re-read. DX is lucky in that although it can be a bit linear in places, the story is good enough and the level of detail high enough that it can be played over and over again, with new things being learnt each time, both about the game and yourself.

I've played it three or four times now, and I think I've got something different out of each game. I could quite happily play it again, too, which is not true of many other FPS/RPG games that I own.


Thanks for starting this thread. This kind of pleasant social variety is why I am always drawn more to the Eidos forums than the "20 something mod maker I know more about making sky boxes than you do and my thing is bigger too" dominated Ion Storm forums.

Thats OK! :D Its been interesting, mostly b'cos this is my first poll, and having posted it, I realised that it could have got quite controversial and I fully expected to come back from a weekend in Snowdonia to find myself going down in flames! Having said that, I've (almost) always been impressed by the people who post to this forum; their general attitude toward both the game and each other has made for some very entertaining and thought-provoking reading, and I wish I'd found it sooner!:)

Huntress
22nd Oct 2003, 20:21
I post mostly on T2 boards and sometimes here and the Original DX game...so for those who recognize my nick...they know already about how old I am (age wise that is) :) I turned 66 this last July...how bout that one folks! ;)

Tis true, I'm a late bloomer in PC gaming but ever since I'm fully addicted. My oldest Son (who is a professional programmer) built my first machine and gave it to me as a Christmas present. Now he knows he created a monster! :D

I mainly got started in the early 3D days of games and progressed through some of the best FPS's but my fav's are mostly RTS's...until I got hooked with Thief II and DX :) It was the most fullfilling/exciting/engrossing/new genre gaming I had ever played. Now I thourghly enjoyed Unreal (also have and really liked Unreal II as well, contrary some others) but this game was something special and I just loved it for it's complexity of story/characters, etc.

Just as in any game or gamer, there's a wide variety of preferences as to what they like or not...but I also believe that the majority of the players of this game (who get it) are more on the mature side of age. It's fine if younger folks want to play it and can get something more out of it than just shooting up everything (and like was said, I think most of those folks wouldn't have enjoyed it as much since it was not a true FPS such as Quake, etc. types) and would not hold the same interest for them as other ppl did and do. The only thing I fear as that they are making the game more "easy" for those younger ppl so they will buy it...ie the Xbox folks :( Who's the majority of players...younger ppl as a whole IMHO. We're not talking the exceptions here...but the general population. Older ppl are more inclinded to play and have PC's so consequently the PC market has declined some due to all the console makers who are appealing to the younger generations...why? Because they're easier to use, visa vie the PC, and have made mostly games for the younger person. Therefore, the games are made easier for them to play. Again not the exception but the general rule of things.

Now they say they still have made a good game for the PC player that is engrossing and complex as the first one. Well I hope so! Only time will tell that tale but I also feel some of the first things that made the original so good will be lost because of some of the things I've commented about above.

Ok, I'll get off my soap box and wait in anticipation of this next exploration into the world of Deus Ex! Ta and Good Hunting!

sneelock
23rd Oct 2003, 23:24
my friends brother who is 10 has yet to finish the last 4 missions. i dont know if he totally grasps the game.

But he plays both of the new jedi knights(outcast & academy) as well as he is a pretty decent unreal tournament player; and is ok at quake 3.

but i dont think he really understands the pollitical ideoligies of the game.

The Glome
25th Oct 2003, 18:20
I was 12 when I first played Thief; it was my first "Mature" game. I loved it, and it's still one of my favorite games.. I got DX when it came out - and I'm still loving it. I'm 16 now.

I like to think of myself as a mature person - the problem is that I don't fit into any age groups. I don't want to hang out with the typical 16 year olds and talk about sex and cars all day.. And the adults don't like talking to "kids like me" either.

I remember when I asked some 15 year old if he had ever heard of Deus Ex. He looked at me strangely, and said "Isn't it that new Quake mod?"

gareis
25th Oct 2003, 18:27
Blasphemy, to equate Deus Ex with Quake!

So instead of talking about cars and sex, you talk about video games. A simulacrum of real life, an imitation that's sometimes more real than the original. Well, at least you get to work some philosophy into it :D

I thought I was mature, but now I sit around all day talking about games and comics. On the other hand, when I went on about linguistics and philosophy, I lost friends :D

The Glome
25th Oct 2003, 18:31
Video games aren't the only thing I talk about - In fact, I don't talk much at all. I'm more of a listener. "social" situations are not things I enjoy. I still have plenty of friends, though. And a girlfriend.

gareis
25th Oct 2003, 22:00
So you're me, but more social. :D Much more social :D

Sylvester Ink
30th Oct 2003, 01:55
I'm 21. I played DX when I was . . . um . . . 18? Well, on the day it came out. You do the math.

I loved the immersion, the strategy, the philosophy, the backstory, the realism, the story, the everything. And I understood it all. (Of course!)

I have a friend who is about 30. He played DX at around 27. When we found out that we both liked DX, we sat and talked about everything mentioned in paragraph 2 for over 3 hours. So I guess he understood it all. Oh, and he's married and lives a successful life, so he isn't one of those old gamer/loners either.

I also have a buddy who is in his 50's. Loves DX for all the same reasons the rest of us do.

So DX is a game that can appeal to any mature age, because it's fun and deep at the same time. As long as the player is intelligent and patient, they will enjoy it.

Amazon Warrior
30th Oct 2003, 18:17
So DX is a game that can appeal to any mature age, because it's fun and deep at the same time. As long as the player is intelligent and patient, they will enjoy it.

Yeah. I think it's been shown here that what matters is your mental age, not necessarily your biological one. People who've played DX, and enjoyed it, and have found their way here, are obviously of a superior nature to normal human beings! :p And it's nice to see that every age group has a representation here.

MR X
30th Oct 2003, 19:01
played Deus Ex when I was 17-18 and I missed a lot of the scientific stuff and the deeper allusions in the game -- but I definately knew it was something special. I can play it now and understand a lot more of it; I'll understand even more in five years' time. We all mature as we grow older, at different speeds, and there's no specific age when we suddenly become wise. At every age, we think we're wise.

I know what you mean. I first played it, oh, 2 or 3 years ago, I must have been 13 or so (shortly after it's release). I didn't even realize what "nano augmentation" meant or anything. I *thought* I understood the game. But now, after playing through the game again, and visiting these forums, I find myself constantly going "ooooooohhhh, grey death used nanites!" Just the same, I greatly enjoyed the game for its storyline, gameplay, etc. You don't have to understand the science and greater complexities of the story to still realize its the best fps on the market ;) I mean, if the game ONLY had theoretical science and complex subtleties, without a great gameplay experience ANYONE could enjoy, would it be worth bothering to play it?

Hell Knight
31st Oct 2003, 03:59
(feel sorry for XB users theyll never experience net gaming )

Sackme i know you posted this a while ago, but you haven't heard of X-box Live have you?

Lawnboy360
31st Oct 2003, 14:04
Let's keep this on topic. ;)

[SYN] Nexus
31st Oct 2003, 14:57
Im 17 (18 in january), I think it takes a mature player to play a game like Deus Ex since its not the easiest game to play.I think its just that good because of it story and I know a lot of players of my age and younger who dont care about stories they just want action

AlteredGlyph
31st Oct 2003, 16:36
Hmmm... It seems like everybody agrees on one point in here: Age is unimportant, it is the maturity of the mind. It's nice to find a group that doesn't immediately fall on the 13 year-olds and devour them(It's happened to me.)

Lawnboy360
31st Oct 2003, 17:49
It seems like everybody agrees on one point in here: Age is unimportant, it is the maturity of the mind.

It's only that older people tend to be more mature... in theory.
And therefore, for older gamers, DX could be more attractive than pure action-orientated games.


I know a lot of players of my age and younger who dont care about stories they just want action.

Reminds me of someone who played No One Lives Forever... and skipped all the cut-scenes. :eek:

Tinuz
3rd Nov 2003, 08:54
I am 19.

When i played DX for the first time i though it to be nice, but i had a very short attetntion span back then, so i never finished it.

And, Amzonwarrior, you have testosteron too. If you start drinking enough alcohol, you liver doesn't have enough spare capacity to supress those hormons and you grow breasts. Oh no, wait, thats for males. :p You'd probably grow a beard. ;)

Sup
4th Nov 2003, 16:01
... (like was said, I think most of those folks wouldn't have enjoyed it as much since it was not a true FPS such as Quake, etc. types) and would not hold the same interest for them as other ppl did and do. The only thing I fear as that they are making the game more "easy" for those younger ppl so they will buy it...ie the Xbox folks :( Who's the majority of players...younger ppl as a whole IMHO....

I find that steryotype of Xbox gamers and younger gamers a bit offensive. As younger gamer who owns an xbox, I find what you say untrue. I don't own one because It's the mindless 'kiddy' system, or because it's a 'cool' System. I own it because it has good games, and many more games that, like DX, require actual thought.

I guess I'm not the normal 13 year old gamer, But the games I'm playing are Ghost Recon, Commandos 3, Splinter cell.
And, I hope to soon add legacy of kain: defiance, DX2, and DX1 to my collection.

Roughly half the above mentioned games are on the XBOX, which I don't feel should be considered a 'D00d! k1lz0rz t3h t3rr0rists' kind of game system.

I apologize for the rant, and I'm sure you likely didn't mean it that way, huntress, but That was how I interpereted it.

Le`Sauveur`De`Ces`Dames
4th Nov 2003, 16:09
oh nooooo, please not another threads that ends in a PC/XBox flamewar!

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 16:27
[Slightly reproving]

Umm...

I think the point I was making in this thread was that DX was a game enjoyed by many 'non-typical' gamers, of many ages and preferences. If you want to start a slanging match over the relative merits of X-boxes vs PCs, theres a really good flame war going on now on one of the other threads. (I should know, its kept me entertained through 32 Least Squares crystal structure refinements!)

[/Slightly reproving]


And, I hope to soon add legacy of kain: defiance, DX2, and DX1 to my collection.

Do I take this to mean that you haven't actually played DX, then?

Le`Sauveur`De`Ces`Dames
4th Nov 2003, 16:41
Originally posted by Amazon Warrior
(I should know, its kept me entertained through 32 Least Squares crystal structure refinements!)


and what would that be?

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 16:59
That would be when you collect a load of reflection data from a crystal using and X-ray diffractometer, then use software to approximate a proposed structure for the unit cell of the crystal. Refinement attempts to match your best guess to the observed data. If you've guessed wrong, or the data is a bit pants (as in my case), it'll fuss. It takes a while if you use least squares refinement, but you get better convergence, whereas if you use conjugate least squares refinement, its quicker but takes longer to converge. Its very boring! (Akin to watching paint dry!) The object is to end up with a structure that has a low R1 value (ie reasonably good correlation between observed and calculated) and small(ish) thermal parameters for its atoms (ie they're not moving around too much).

Well, to be fair, its not really that boring, and the problem I was having with my last structure hinged not on the main molecule, which behaved itself nicely and refined quite well, but was due to poorly resolved solvent molecules within the crystal structure that were thrashing around like beasts. If you cheat, and take the solvents out completely, you get a nice but completely fake result. We were trying to avoid having to do that, 'cos we are honest, truthful types!

(This is what I understand to be happening, anyway. I'm still a bit new to it all, to be honest! :) )

Edit: I bet you're glad you asked that now, aren't you! ;)

Tinuz
4th Nov 2003, 17:20
Isn't it lovely? You take a chemists dictionary ( I think it has something to do with chemistry ) and you taek every single word out of it, chain em together in some hard to get sentence et voila, everybody is impressed. ;)

My problem is that i cant impress people with wath i study. Latin plant names aren't that spectacular. And the rejuvenation methods of the Psuedostuga menziesii ( Douglas fir ) oren't that interesting.
Ah well, when i am done i am sure to leave my mark on the landscape. ( Nature and landscape technology is what i study )

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 17:26
Well, he _did_ ask! All I did was answer...

Yep, chemistry all the way. No dictionaries were involved either, I'll have you know! That was all the product of my fertile, active and well-educated brain.

Did I just say that out loud? Oooops... :p


Latin plant names aren't that spectacular.

They are if you can pronounce them properly!

Tinuz
4th Nov 2003, 17:28
Sorry, accidental doubel post

And pronouncing them properly is easy as hell.

Tinuz
4th Nov 2003, 17:29
Originally posted by Amazon Warrior
Well, he _did_ ask! All I did was answer...

Yep, chemistry all the way. No dictionaries were involved either, I'll have you know! That was all the product of my fertile, active and well-educated brain.

Did I just say that out loud? Oooops... :p

How did it sound to me?
Well, one pic says more than a thousand words.

This image violated forum rules regarding the language filter. -- Catman

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 17:33
Uh... Did you mean to post that twice? *s******s*

I understood what I meant, anyway. It was all perfectly clear! (It damn' well should be, I'm doing an MSci in Chemistry!)

Heh heh! I now have control of the subatomic particles, and I plan to use them to create fascinating new materials, the like of which has only hitherto been seen in DX!

Tinuz
4th Nov 2003, 17:42
Well well, your educated. Hope your not like my sister who does an Msc too but sets her nose on fire.

And no fretting at my l33t typo skillz.

;)

Well, i am doing Bsc Forestry and agriculture ( With a specialization in Nature and lanscape technology ). Very nice, normally it is very theoretical, but a few weeks ago i had a chainsaw course, makes all those subatomical parts blurr into nothingness. :p ( Was seriously cool )

( Used to do Environemental technology( Quit because of the huge amounts of laws involved with the chemistry ), but will you be the first person who actually gets what i mean when i say when i say Khjeldal? )

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 17:52
Nope, so far I haven't set any part of my body on fire! (Thankfully) And I didn't mention your typos once cos if I did, someone would probably take me out for mine!

Your course sounds a bit similar to the one my sister's boyfriend is doing at Aberyswyth Uni. Dunno if he gets to play with chainsaws tho. Sounds cool! The only way it's possible to hurt someone with an X-ray diffractometer is if they voluntarily climb inside (there would be room for a smallish, flexible person) and stay there while I close the doors and open the shutter for the X-rays. And frankly, there are better ways of damaging someone than gently frying them with X-rays. ;)

James Warren
4th Nov 2003, 17:55
Now if someone will kindly explain to the rube colonists among us (me) who think that a feather in their hat is "macaroni" how "pants" is used when it doesn't refer to clothing I might be able to follow this increasingly sophisticated thread:D

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 18:24
[Brit raving]

"pants" = bad, not good, poor, a bit wrong, duff.

But also "cool as pants" = very cool.

See also "pants" = item of underwear, NOT trousers!

[/Brit raving]

This from a nation who thinks that calling a toilets a bathroom is a sensible, logical thing to do? And who gets deeply offended if an unsuspecting foreigner asks for directions to the lavatories?

Tenkahubu
4th Nov 2003, 19:04
Who says 'cool as pants'? I think you made that up.
(totally off topic, sorry)

Amazon Warrior
4th Nov 2003, 19:38
Many people I know say it. Perhaps its a Welsh thing...

As in "Have you seen such-and-such?"
Reply: "Yeah, it's cool as pants, man!"

Topic? What topic? I think it got lost quite a while ago! If I'm not careful, Random or Catman will close this thread down... Though am I allowed to change the topic of my own thread?

Catman
4th Nov 2003, 19:46
Too late. It had a good life but died before its time. RIP.