PDA

View Full Version : anyone wanna guess?



solidsnake
13th Oct 2003, 00:50
I was just thinking about Defiance recently... and I just started wondering how Raziel and Kain came across their telekenesis powers in LOKD. Maybe Kain's had them all along and we haven't known it but Raz? Any speculation on how they get the power or who they maybe take/earn it from?

blincoln
13th Oct 2003, 01:07
Kain's had his all along. Raziel will probably get it from a boss. I suspect that:

the first boss will be a Hylden who Raziel gets the possession ability from in order to shift to the Material plane, and the second will be the one where he gets TK.

warpsavant
13th Oct 2003, 01:26
Raziel has always had TK too. Maybe he starts out with it. I like Bens idea though.

first-born
13th Oct 2003, 02:01
remember when he got tk from that turelim who's name sounds like morlock or something? well now it's just stronger, and blinc, i like your idea but i think it will be the ancient pillar guardians, because remember the screenshot on gamestop or wherever with the enemies in spectral who look like long dead ancients? i think he'll get it from them, the elder raises their spirits to kill him but they just give him power of possession

blincoln
13th Oct 2003, 02:22
That picture is the one I'm talking about. I would be willing to bet money that those are Hylden. Look at their robes - the same as the Hylden in BO2. The spines on their backs are also the same as on the Hylden spirits that possess enemies in the game - which is why I think Raziel will get the possession ability from them.

Warp: I think it could go either way. It might be explained as an extension of his force projectile power, or a new one entirely.

warpsavant
13th Oct 2003, 02:38
I think those guys in that picture are Hylden, too.

Camus Audron
13th Oct 2003, 03:22
isnt this topic old as hell and revived? because I got the most overwhelming sense of deja-vu with that last post there....if it's not....well it's either a glitch in the matrix, or this has been talked about before :p

Anyway, I think both vamps and Hylden will be possesing this time around, I mean we've seen green eyed creatures, and red-eyed creatures....it couldnt be any more obvious...maybe we'll learn Ancients werent all that different from Hylden, and we'll see a bit more of their evil side.And if possesing is dealed with, it's gonna be an hability, they had that one coming from SR1.Maybe you even get the ability from both, For example you get the revival ability from hylden, and the actual possesing hability from Ancients

Whoa...what if Hash-ah-gik is an ancient? =O....did morty's eyes have any color when he was possesed?

first-born
13th Oct 2003, 03:44
i think the ancients are real because amy is pulling all the characters from religious myth, rahab, a fallen angel that was revived to rescue some book from under the sea, they all have religious origions like raziel the saviour, if the bible is read, they're all in there, and blinc's sight has some translations of their names like zephon the spider-like one or raziel, god's secret, the ancients are amy's version of angels and the hylden of demons, plus the ancients create the pillars, the pillars health = nosgoth's health, the ancients are good and that's final, defiance will show you...im right...either that or i am too psycho to admit im wrong

hippiechk
13th Oct 2003, 11:33
This is all very interesting. But I'm afraid I think it may be different. I mean, I don't think Raziel will get the power to inhabit enemy bodies from a Hylden. Who knows? I could be wrong. But here goes (copied from my post on gfaqs)…

I found this juicy tid-bit at the Dark Chronicle which makes me think the Priestess will be in this game.

Raziel was supposed to confront her and gain a new gift as a result of her defeat. This would have been the ability to possess enemies. The Elder God describes it in this piece of unused dialogue:

"In her long service to her vampire masters, the Priestess had learned a measure of sorcery. In devouring her soul, this power is conferred on you. You may project your spirit, and in so doing, take possession of your victim's body."

We already know that Raziel will have this ability in Defiance. So, perhaps the Priestess is the first one he encounters?

And yes, I know this is deleted material, but it would make a perfect connection in this sense.

blincoln
13th Oct 2003, 16:21
I thought that too, at first, but after I saw the screenshot of the two Hylden in the Spectral plane, I changed my mind. I think it makes more sense for him to get it from them, since their ability to inhabit the bodies of others is some kind of key plot point.

Soul Reaver
13th Oct 2003, 18:27
http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2003/screen0/914777_20031003_screen003.jpg Although I maybe wrong I must admit that I DON'T think they're Hylden (the two skeletal guys in spectral, which I doubt because look at Raziel's 'boots' and the pieces of cloth wrapped around his arm and the skeletons' hats and wings are yellow... AND more importantly look at the Reaver it's blue/white (!) (maybe water/ice enchantment?)) Look at the Reaver here: http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2003/ps2/legendofkain/0711/kain_screen004.jpg I think they are Ancients (maybe their beautiful nature and looks were a hoax?) or Ancients' skeletons raised with some necromantic powers... My proof is (not in importance order):

1. They have cloven hands Note: three claws
2. Look at their skulls... they don't look like Hylden to me...
3. Their 'wings', or the skeletal remnants of their wings, are pointed backwards (like Janos's) Besides... I haven't seen Hylden with wings before...
4. Their clothing doesn't look like Hylden.

NOTE: I presume that those final screenshots have been slightly edited ( the movement or something has been tampered so that it leaves extra long trails)... IF it's because of the Spectral Realm why can it be seen here: http://image.com.com/gamespot/images/2003/screen0/914777_20031003_screen002.jpg

I must say that I'm suspicious about the other guy (the right one with the protective ((?) Pretty sure of it) layer, but I'm totally 99.99% sure that the oother one (left one) is an Ancient or an Ancient's skeleton.


Thank you for your attention!
P.S. I said I could be wrong...

EDIT: One of the links didn't work...
EDIT #2: Strange but I just noticed that Raziel has yellow 'boots' and wrapped pieces of cloth on the Spectral plane picture too (but still less than the skeletal-duo picture)... As I said... Strange.

Alastor
14th Oct 2003, 00:21
Soul Reaver spoiler: http://image.com.com/gamespot/image...3_screen003.jpg Although I maybe wrong I must admit that I DON'T think they're Hylden (the two skeletal guys in spectral, which I doubt because look at Raziel's 'boots' and the pieces of cloth wrapped around his arm and the skeletons' hats and wings are yellow... AND more importantly look at the Reaver it's blue/white (!) (maybe water/ice enchantment?)) Look at the Reaver here: http://image.com.com/gamespot/image...n_screen004.jpg I think they are Ancients (maybe their beautiful nature and looks were a hoax?) or Ancients' skeletons raised with some necromantic powers... My proof is (not in importance order):

1. They have cloven hands Note: three claws
2. Look at their skulls... they don't look like Hylden to me...
3. Their 'wings', or the skeletal remnants of their wings, are pointed backwards (like Janos's) Besides... I haven't seen Hylden with wings before...
4. Their clothing doesn't look like Hylden.

NOTE: I presume that those final screenshots have been slightly edited ( the movement or something has been tampered so that it leaves extra long trails)... IF it's because of the Spectral Realm why can it be seen here: http://image.com.com/gamespot/image...3_screen002.jpg

I must say that I'm suspicious about the other guy (the right one with the protective ((?) Pretty sure of it) layer, but I'm totally 99.99% sure that the oother one (left one) is an Ancient or an Ancient's skeleton.



I agree.

blincoln
14th Oct 2003, 01:48
$5 says I'm right =P. We'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

darien_specter
14th Oct 2003, 05:24
Raziel has ALWAYS had the wraps and the leg bracers in both planes. Remember, his material 'body' is merely matter that he has gathered together into the form of a body by force of will, with the aid of the portals. So all his material body is is a mirror of his spectral self...

I think I'll have to go with Blinc on this one... Remember, the Hylden of BO2 are the product of a different designer's vision... Amy's concept of them may have differed somewhat, and that is what we see here. I'd say it'd be more accurate to go by the murals in SR2 for what we can expect to see as Hylden in Defiance. I don't remember them exactly just at the moment, but it seems to me that they had more elaborate structures on their backs than we saw in BO2. The one on the right especially - it has green eyes, and a strange jawline. The bony head structures could easily be contained in their stylish headwear... I can see the arguments for "wraith" Ancients or somesuch, but they look more Hylden-y to me.

Remember: just because some have assumed that the Ancients and everyone else under the sun will turn out evil doesn't mean they will! We just have to wait and see.

Also - I'm betting that the sort of 'motion trail' effect is an indicator of a different plane, regardless of which one. We see it in what is obviously the Spectral Realm; given the presence of that, the big ugly demon, and lots of red/fire round about, I wonder if that shot of Kain is in the Demon Realm?

Blinc, where did you find out about Hylden spirits possessing bodies? That sounds interesting...

Camus Audron
14th Oct 2003, 06:08
well darien, nobody really knows for sure, but I agree with him as most of the material we've seen points in that direction

First, there's the wallpapers, they show all kinds of creatures with green eyes, and remember the post SR LOK wallpapers always show key plot points, also remember Sarafan Lord/Hylden general had green eyes.

I bet when he saw the same back appendages on both the green souls and the hylden clothed spectral creature it all fell in place for him, and that's how he came up with the hylden posesion thing.

after playing trough the Air Forge again, I found something that backs up his idea too (you might want to check -·THIS·- (http://pub6.ezboard.com/fnosgothfrm13.showMessage?topicID=550.topic ) related thread in Nosgothic Realm Forums) in the all famous mural where you see the ancients suffering of blood hunger, you can see translucent flying skulls around the triumphant Hylden, as if they were controling souls, maybe this is a depiction of their possesing habilities?

Soul Reaver
14th Oct 2003, 16:21
Umm yes... I didn't say that you're wrong Blinc... I just doubted your theory...:p

Aimed at darien_specter: I'll correct myself then... The wraps weren't like other things in spectral (they weren't greenish-blue)... And that's what I thought to be strange.

And yeah... I agree... Time will tell...

first-born
25th Oct 2003, 17:03
remember the reviving bodies in SR? don't eat their souls and their body stays there, pull out the impaling item and they come back. They stay in spectral but they can return to their body if the item that caused their death is removed, it appers that all vampires have the possession ability(at least all the ones coming down from kain) kains vampires are created by manipulation of the soul, when they die they stay in spectral unless a slaugh eats them, if their bodies are capable of function, they can return to it through this possession ability Raz clearly has in defiance, i think he just has to learn how to use it, as far as the hylden creatures, the reaver is the dimension reaver allowing the travel between realms so maybe these are banished hylden in the hylden realm, and perhaps kain gets into the demon realm using this same reaver. and darien, it says on the official site that the revenants are long time enemies of the vampires who broke through the barrier and are possessing bodies, maybe the revenants and hylden are working together or are related, who knows, time will tell

Darkmaiden
26th Oct 2003, 03:25
About the revenants are the Hylden, but in forms off dead coprses which they come to life by the power of the Hylden. HINT: look at the eyes they are green. Hylden are not physically their because they are still in the demon diminsion.