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[WZ]divine
21st Aug 2003, 17:54
for Deus ex: invisible war i would like realistic weapon clips.
- in most shooting games (+origional deus ex) there are say 30 bulets in a rifle that come out of your "store" of say 90 bullets. This means you could say fire 5 bullets, reload and then have 85 bullets in your store.
- realisticly when you reload you should loose all the bullets in the clip you are reloading. ie if you fire 5 bullets and then reload you would be wasting 25 bullets.

I think this would make the game more playable as it would stop players reloading after every kill even when they still have half a clip left.

agent008
21st Aug 2003, 18:11
well the only game that i seen a realistic reload was the hl mod firearms.

when you shoot and the clip and it is not empty and you keep reloading even when your clip is full and you did not shoot any and keep reloading you will eventually keep switching from clip to clip and you can end up with the clip that had been used first i hope you know what im talking about


clip 1- full clip and 5 shots wasted
clip2-full clip
clip3-full clip
clip4-full clip

its like math but im not gonna get into that stuff you know like shuffling around

chaos_Kn
21st Aug 2003, 18:17
I have though about this before and i agree to a certain extent.
It is unrealistic to magically re-cycle discarded bullets, however, real forces do not discard clips, empty or otherwise. They keep them. So you wouldn't actually loose bullets, but you would have a bunch of half empty clips. (e.g. The SAS supsedly carry 4 clips and count they're bullets out leaving one in each clip when they reload, one for each member of the squad).
How you would simulate this in a game I can't say, perhaps having you clips (say 4) in the corner with the loaded one at the bottom. Then when you re-load it picks the one with most bullets left.
But then if you have a free minuet wouldn't you be able to swap bullets to make a full clip. You can't get very complicated about it all and take it too far.
I would like to see the character not throw away the clip though and look like he/she knows what they are doing when they change ammo.

- Chaos

[edit - agent008 just described what i was thinking above]

agent008
25th Aug 2003, 15:45
well its good to see that someone knows what im talking about

Ductonius
25th Aug 2003, 20:22
I prefer to think of it this way:

The character has a few magazines and carries all the rest of the ammo in stripper clips (http://images.google.com/images?q=stripper+clip&svnum=10&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=utf-8&start=20&sa=N).

When reloading, they just quickly top off the magazine from the stripper clip, which is as quick and easy as putting the end of the clip to the mouth of the magazine and pressing down.



Note: For those of you who don't know, This is a clip, AKA, stripper clip.
http://www.swissrifles.com/ammo/comparison.jpg


And this is a magazine.
http://www.beretta.com/images_2002/ps_9000_9x19_maxi.jpg

May none of you ever confuse the two again.

That thing above the left-hand magazine is a quick loader.

And if the developer were really serious about doing realistic reloads, they would have the character do it like this (http://idpa.gunsnet.net/tacload.html)

exo
25th Aug 2003, 21:32
I'd prefer futuristic stuff since this is a futuristic game.

Reloading should take no more than 3 seconds. Cept for the rocket launcher or uber gun.

Realistic stuff is so narrow minded since it makes you believe than armory doesn't change in a world where nano tech can make you be god-like.

PDenton
26th Aug 2003, 08:16
What so you get little nanites to reload one magazine whilst you've got another in your gun. That way you will always have a full magazine! :D

exo
26th Aug 2003, 08:54
No, actually have you ever seen equilibrium?

You see how he reloads his gun in the last battle, and then jamming an extended clip on top of that?

yeah. That's definitely gotta be the coolest way to reload. :)

agent008
26th Aug 2003, 13:41
those old time pistols like in hl the revolver you can reload fast

mikepayne666
26th Aug 2003, 19:26
yeah but rember its the future!!!

agent008
27th Aug 2003, 14:24
ok ok but the game dx had some old time weapons

Bio Denton
30th Aug 2003, 21:14
Originally posted by exo
No, actually have you ever seen equilibrium?

You see how he reloads his gun in the last battle, and then jamming an extended clip on top of that?

yeah. That's definitely gotta be the coolest way to reload. :)

I saw that film for the first time last week. I love it. The final scene was fantastic. I would descibe it as, a real-life matrix.

Skul-Gun
30th Aug 2003, 22:28
Mafia had realistic reload. You lots any bullets that were in the previous magazine and you can't regain them. This was annoying if you accidentally reloaded a gun with full ammo. The full clip would get discarded regardless.

One good way of implementing realistic reload in DX2, and it would be easy to do so, would be to have a 'quick' reload and a 'slow' reload

Quick reload:

The agent ejects his magazine out of the gun and puts a completely fresh one in. The magazine falls to the floor along with any of the rounds it was still carrying. The magazine can be picked up later after the battle, but only if it had rounds left in it, otherwise it would be an empty clip and would probably just fade away when it hits the ground.

Slow Reload:

The agent takes out the old clip, puts in a new clip, and either keeps the clip, or uses the remaining rounds in the clip to 'refill' any other half-empty clips. empty clips are discarded.

But I'm sure nano technololgy would've gotten rid of reloading altogether i presume

Lawnboy360
30th Aug 2003, 22:53
I think having two different reload would detract from the game, not add to it. :p

Skul-Gun
30th Aug 2003, 23:24
how so? i think it would fluidise gun fights more efficiently.

(picture Equilibrium in your head then read the next paragraph)

An agent would be running around taking hits, and he finds out his clip is running out (what do you mean 'how'? it says so on the hud you n00bie) he will then perform a quick reload so he can continue fighting as soon as possible. after the battle is finished, he will pick up his half-full magazines (not 'half-empty', I'm an optimist :p ) then do a slow reload to maintain maximum ammo-count. I think it would be pretty cool.

exo
31st Aug 2003, 07:43
I mean geez, it's an age where nanotechnology is so advanced that it allows you to jump higher, see better, breathe underwater.

You'd think they'd have developed a much much much better type of ammunition that works 100x more efficient than mundane uranium shells.

Hell, concentrated pockets of nano machines as ammunition that can take over machines or cause blindness or loss of the use of ones legs, if nano's can enhance or possibly give you abilities, who says they can't take away?

And yes, I am bucking for a QA position and possibly going for that designer job. ;d

Prohass
7th Sep 2003, 08:51
If you take into consideration how annoying it would be to have realistic reloading then you'll understand why nobody would want it in DX2, or in any shooter, except for weirdo gun enthusiasts.

Dargish
13th Sep 2003, 22:48
Americas Army uses the realistic method mentioned above where you cycle through mags and never drop them. for example you start with 7 full clips one in the gun. you usually would reload when you get down to around 10 bullets so quite often you end up with 7 clips all with around 10 bullets left if you're not careful.

That combined with a way of reloading the clips after a battle should be good.

However i think DX2 may use some sort of electronic or nanite ammo. This would explain why there will be only 1 generic ammo type and also in any screenshots ive seen all weopons have a blueish chamber in them. this could then just be reloaded from a pack of goo on your back or wherever.

Godwin
14th Sep 2003, 10:52
i dont remember army ops having that??? maybe i havent fired that many shots before...

bah, my v1.9 refuses to work anyway...