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View Full Version : The shame of Core Design: Angel of Darkness



-Ng-
18th Jul 2003, 23:05
http://www.geocities.com/kerrymacangel/SaveGameInSecretLevel.zip

This is a savegame of the forst level in a place secret. This game is incomplete, I'm disappointed of Core. Now I know then this game incomplete! Why Core don't delayed the game in november!!!

Dazed
18th Jul 2003, 23:11
ownage linkage.. link not being working very well, even if it did I wouldnt download it but to react to yr post. I dont think u should point yr fury at Core for all they do is make a game to the best of their abilities, as Ive said ebfore on the forum I think Eidos is the one to blaim for shoving down a deadline into Core's throats and not giving them the opporetunity (how the hell do u spell that :rolleyes: ) to finish the game as they see fit.

TR-AOD
18th Jul 2003, 23:15
Originally posted by Dazed
I think Eidos is the one to blaim for shoving down a deadline into Core's throats and not giving them the opporetunity (how the hell do u spell that :rolleyes: ) to finish the game as they see fit.


im no expert but i dont think you can lay the blame purely on eidos and not core. surley one says to the other "ok how long do you need to make a game" then they both come to an agreement on how long it takes and when it needs to be finished??


just a thought....

Dazed
18th Jul 2003, 23:21
true, but if eidos wants the game to live up to its reputation then the only sensable thing to do is to give Core the space they need to actually finish the game.

clearly Eidos didnt care about the quality of the product but rather shipped it "on time" to meet the sales. quantity over quality.. its just to bad to see that some of them are so narrowminded that they wont understand that releasing a game like this will probably loose more "core" TR players then gain them. But im sure that this type of adventure will attract different people so basically its a vicious circle for the TR fans out there who where really disappointed for they are out in the cold now it seems.

(post is prolly full of contradictions but hell :D its late :P)

TR-AOD
18th Jul 2003, 23:30
Originally posted by Dazed
clearly Eidos didnt care about the quality of the product but rather shipped it "on time" to meet the sales. (post is prolly full of contradictions but hell :D its late :P)


i know what your saying but unless im mistaken the game was due for release last october (in the uk anyway) it eventually showed up in july..... sounds like some extra time was allowed but you can only delay a game for so long.

tbh i dont care who's fault it was, just that the game was late, full of bugs, fairly easy(too easy imo) and there be no dual pistols.
overall im just dissapointed.

Mr_Furious
19th Jul 2003, 00:45
squarely on EIDOS's shoulders.

Why is it SO important to have a game *snaps fingers*? (For those who don't know what I mean, it's right away, super rush).

I myself, and I'm sure there ARE a few of you out there that would rather wait a little bit longer so the manufacturer can finish ALL their testing. It makes for an enjoyable game all around if there weren't so many annoying bugs. One or two bugs is OK, but not the dozen or so I've logged in just the first level!

Core Design wanted to continue the testing and quality control so that Tomb Raider: Angel of Darkness would live up to the reputations of its predecessor, namely as being an enjoyable game of quality. But EIDOS wanted to release it before the new Tomb Raider movie come out.

I do believe, I'm not sure but I'll verify, that Doom III was delayed countless times so that Acivision could be very sure that there was nothing that could seriously hinder the enjoymant of Doom III.

Grave_Robber
19th Jul 2003, 01:57
I think it is quite possible the game has been forced out when its not even finished. Its possible that they had to sort some stuff out like altering things to how they wanted it done but eidos wanted the game out and pretty much forced it out. one thing i think that has messed it up quite abit could be that paris ghetto had clothes change. screen shots have her with camo gear on but was altered to denim so it lasts longer in the game, they needed to also move dual pistols then but may not have had time. also some other stuff not qutie tested and finished.

some ppl at core probably got annoyed at this. could explain for the one leaving.

well thats my theory

one thing u have to think those was they started a new engine it may have nearly been finished in october but they decided they didnt like alot of stuff so they redid it.

Rusty_DK
19th Jul 2003, 02:00
Originally posted by TR-AOD
..... sounds like some extra time was allowed but you can only delay a game for so long.

which is exactly what Eidos said, hence all the unhappy fans

Grave_Robber
19th Jul 2003, 02:08
Any one remember TF2. that was ment to be out in like 1999 or somin, cant remember was so long ago.

Elvin Presler
19th Jul 2003, 02:09
Hahaha. So there's where the other half of the training level was! "I can commando crawl" I wondered why I didn't know about that until someone here mentioned it.

It's unfathomable. They just cut half the game out! It wasn't finished, so they locked the door to get there.

MacAngel
19th Jul 2003, 03:32
Originally posted by -Ng-
http://www.geocities.com/kerrymacangel/SaveGameInSecretLevel.zip

This is a savegame of the forst level in a place secret. This game is incomplete, I'm disappointed of Core. Now I know then this game incomplete! Why Core don't delayed the game in november!!!
I think that was the original training level.... you weren't normally supposed to see it and you can only get there with cheat codes. I cheated for unlimited health and was able to get there. It would of been cool but it is obviously not finished. I feel sorry for Core cause they're kind of getting pushed around by Eidos. This game had A LOT of potential.
Well, at least its nice that someone checked out my site.:rolleyes:

maniac44
19th Jul 2003, 05:10
I would say that you can place the blame equally on both Eidos and CORE.

Eidos for pushing it out the door to meet a financial deadline (which they missed). I understand that they have to put the game out eventually, but they could have let CORE have enough time (a month or two) to fix the bugs before the release.
CORE for bitting off more than they could chew. They had many extensions to their deadlines but still couldn't get the program working right.

Elvin Presler
19th Jul 2003, 18:02
Originally posted by maniac44
I understand that they have to put the game out eventually, but they could have let CORE have enough time (a month or two) to fix the bugs before the release.

They did! They gave them at least 8 months extra. Still, Core was nowhere even close to being finished so they simply "walled off" half the game and sold it anyway.

What a blatant rip off!

TRWad
19th Jul 2003, 18:58
You are shocked when you see how much of unfinished stuff aod has. If you see the string table, there are more then 2000 strings here. A lot of them are not used. I never heard lara saying this:

I want to buy a handgun. And shells.

And then the unused guns:
- Dual Vector
- Dual Scorpion
- Harpoon Gun
- Limpet Mine
- Silencer (also left out at last stage in TRC)
- Laser Sight

Grave_Robber
19th Jul 2003, 20:20
yeah the cash does nothing, u can make cash from selling stuff at the begining of the game but only spend somin like 200 in the game for info off ppl.

i think the laser sight was ment for kurtis, im sure i read an old interview saying he had one. same as saying u could lock onto multiple enemys with the disc and take em all out.

Stormgard
19th Jul 2003, 20:30
I sold off a bunch of stuff thinking: "Yeah I can get me some new guns heheh" & when I got to the pawnshop...NOTHIN! What a rip! But still, it's a great game, it's just half finished.

TRWad
20th Jul 2003, 10:29
I once played the Monstrum Crimescene level without any cash (using level select) and finished it. No cash at all, and she still pays money to Mr Reporter.

Another thing: I collected the box from the serpent rouge and wanted to bring it to pierre. But I took another route to the cafe metro and passed the Doorman. I talked to him and guess what: He asked if Lara had the box and 800 euros and let her go in! I never talked to him b4 so he didn't knew I was going to get the box. Strange.....

jodman3
20th Jul 2003, 13:49
You know, i hate to sound...er... computer geekish but i really think this games was supose to stream data of the disk, or have no load times. If you go into training level, and then go to the unfinish area, it looks like you would have had the ablity to go into the next level without it loading. But i guess they didn't have enough time to add it in and cut it out of the engine, and broke the game in levels.

numb
20th Jul 2003, 14:28
CORE for bitting off more than they could chew. They had many extensions to their deadlines but still couldn't get the program working right.

absolutely - all who feels that eidos is solely responsible for the condition of the game are seriously deluding themselves, & need to ask themselves how they'd feel if they'd contracted with someone to remodel their kitchen & a similar situation had evolved...


my pet theory has been that, come the missed deadline last november, eidos instructed core to discontinue any new/ongoing development, & simply string together everything already completed in such a way that someone could play thru the game from beginning to end, & all this hidden, half-finished code would seem to confirm that...

Stormgard
20th Jul 2003, 14:28
Sounds like a good theory to me. The levels seem to be interrupted & that interruption doesn't look like it was originally meant to be there.

dhama
20th Jul 2003, 14:42
Hey stop the whining guys, the controls system is dubious but the game is beautiful. :cool:

jodman3
20th Jul 2003, 14:45
Originally posted by Stormgard
Sounds like a good theory to me. The levels seem to be interrupted & that interruption doesn't look like it was originally meant to be there.
RIGHT! I posted something like this in another thread. I really think that the game was not supose to have load times. It's just too much loading in this game, and for no reason too. I mean, just for that small areas it has to load, it clearly screams out that something was there and it got cut out. Also i bought a demo and it had a preview of AOD on it. The developers were saying that they would have shadow maps for enemies and lara and objects, where the hell are they? There's a shadow for lara and these fake-ass shadows for some objects, but none for the enemies. What gives? They made promises, that they could not keep, they did bite off more than they could chew, and someone got fired because of it too. I hope his brother does not go too.

Stormgard
20th Jul 2003, 16:35
I'm not whining, I love the game. It's probably the best purchace I made this year. I am however saying that it seems as though they didn't finish up what they were going to do with the game.

snake
22nd Jul 2003, 20:32
It s not only the deadline which made this game look like that. Creators made many bad decisions about AOD. As I have mentioned in this forum, programmers changed the game a lot, which made it lose its original identity.

dhama
22nd Jul 2003, 20:41
Originally posted by Stormgard
I'm not whining......................

If I said, "Hey you with the blue shirt" when you were one of a few that were'nt wearing a blue shirt, would you still think I was talking to you? :p

Stormgard
22nd Jul 2003, 21:48
I didn't think you were, I was just saying that in general I'm not whining.