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View Full Version : Huge spoilers TR6/7/8 !!!!!!!!!!!!!



JohnnyZ
17th Jul 2003, 21:46
Warning: This interview with Adrian Smith contains spoilers for TR6, 7 and 8.

Only a handful of people know what paths lay ahead of Lara Croft. Adrian Smith, Operations Director at Core Design, talks about the creation of Lara's latest adventure and hints at her future.

"The story in The Angel of Darkness has been really important for us, it's been argued that there's maybe too much story in this game. The reason is that we decided we'd do more then one game from the get go, rather then one new game and then go 'guess what guys, you've got to do another one'."

The bigger picture
"We though we'd try to nit the story together, as the other way has always been a nightmare. From the start we assumed we were doing more then one new game, so we went away and wrote the story. The source of the inspiration has been over all theme that we wanted to run across the three games. It's just explained, almost scratched upon the surface of the first one, the second is based much more around the big thing and the third is the natural ending of it, how Lara resolves it, how she fits into it. The overall theme is the Nephilim, said to be the descendants od angels and mortals. They're mentioned in the Enochian Gospels. This was the original big theme we came up with, as it had a lot of potential and sure inspired the terrific new characters you meet in The Angel of Darkness. We looked at things like X-Files and we thought that was a great example. Because there's the big 'Are there or aren't there?' story line and each episode stands alone but they tell you a little more about the bigger story."

The Nephilim
"The overall goal for us was let's use the Nephilim theme and run it across all three games. For us it was great because the second game is going to be a belter, it's very Tomb Raider. It's set in the Nephilim realm under Turkey, Cappadocia. It's all temples and tombs and lost cities, which is all very Tomb Raideresque; full of fantasy grounded in reality. There are no aliens with big tentacle arms but it has some strange looking humans. In The Angel of Darkness we had to introduce the Nephilim and put Lara into a situation that was different to what we've' done in the passed. She's always been squeaky clean, she's gone and found artefacts and gone out and saved the world. We couldn't change Lara's character, absolutely not. We couldn't turn her into a mass murderer. We couldn't have her going around slaying small children. The end of the Last Revelation was the last game for us. Lara was missing. That was a clean start, something really important."

Continuity
"There's a whole time period between the temple collapsing and the beginning of this game that isn't covered in The Angel of Darkness but may be in the second. We call the period internally 'Lara of Arabia.' We have the whole time period mapped out, what actually happened to her, where she's been. There's also another time period of when she came back to London. She had a near death experience when she survived the temple. Causing her to hang up her guns. We seriously looked at making her an alcoholic, having Croft Manor burnt down. We wanted her life in a mess and she returns facing one catastrophe after another, she comes back and Croft Manor is burning to the floor. Then she hits the bottle, of course. Lots of things to change the situation, to really get her down. But we thought that was a little bit extreme. We also had reservations about what the movie people were doing, in so far as we burn Croft Manor down it would stick out a bit and make it difficult for them. That's as much as we've ever tied-in to the movies."

Wanted: Lara Croft
"So that the idea we came up with was let's get her accused of murder in Paris. Everything that has worked for her in the past because she's famous and well known, all these doors have been open for her. Suddenly they're all shut, because everybody does know her and everyone is trying to catch her. Lara comes in and has this argument with Von Croy, at the end of the day she's got blood on her hands, she jumps out of the window and the game starts."

Mass Murderer
"But one murder wasn't enough, because people wouldn't believed Lara did it. So we invented murders that have been happening around Europe and around the world and have been happening over a period of time, and all these murders have been given a name. That name is the Monstrum Murders. Paris is itchy and nervous because these murders have been happening. Suddenly there's another one, and it's the same. They're gratuitous murders with body parts ripped out and symbols on the walls. Lara Croft is accused of it and the whole world has just condemned her. And that's very much the start. So Lara is accused of murdering Von Croy. He's her old friend and mentor, but there is a motive. She's bitter towards Von Croy because she blames him for what happened in The Last Revelation. She for the temple collapsing and for being trapped and going missing, she emerges bitter and twisted towards him."

Killing Von Croy
"Von Croy got into something dark and mysterious and wanted out. Scared, he calls Lara to help him. She reluctantly assists, they have a massive argument, something happens, it's a bit vague in the game, you see him pull a gun, and you see Lara flying through the air. Next thing, she's getting up, he's dead and covered in blood. For a good chuck of the game you're not sure what happened. I don't think anyone will think she killed Von Croy, but then again you don't know, and we do everything we can through the story to bring doubt into your mind. Von Croy was hired to find five missing, lost paintings. Why, you don't know, but the reason becomes clear. We made it pretty obvious early on that if Lara going to clear her name then she has to find those painting. Along the way she discovers Eckhardt, a particularly nasty person that heads up an organisation called the Cabal."

Brother Obscura
"There are five Obscura paintings, they aren't the sort of thing you'd want to put up on your wall. The Cabal hold three of them, you find one under the Louvre. And there's but you actually don't get to see all of them, which I never even thought of until the other day, it's a bit of a mistake! The Cabal are a very powerful organisation shrouded in mystery, with a strange dark side. Though history they're always been there and there's been a religious war fought against them since the 1300's. That time frame for us is really important we do make reference to it. Potentially we will make reference to it outside of this game. What I mean by that is that you find out that Eckhardt has been around since 1300's, so he's obviously got some pact and some way of adding form of longevity to his life. Ultimately Lara finds out that the Cabal want to bring back the Nephilim race. For what means she doesn't know."

Enter Kurtis
"We introduce Kurtis quite early on and he's very much the protagonist at the beginning on the game. He's always one step ahead of Lara, he's in the cafe when Lara walks in, or he's on the other side of the river. Eventually they get together and they work together and you get to play as Kurtis. At this point, you get all the pieces of the jigsaw. You discover is the last descendent of an organisation called the Lux Veritatis, which translates as 'light of truth,' were a religious group that have been the Cabal through history. The Lux Veritatis new what the Cabal wanted. They all have a special abilities and have chosen to wage this war against the Cabal because ultimately the Cabal wants to bring back the Nephilim. They want to put themselves into higher order, a new race if you like, that is going to rule the world and we've all going to be doomed. Kurtis has turned his back on all this. Then his conscious *****s him. He's the only one in the world that knows the secret history. He takes it upon himself to take on the Cabal and Eckhardt."

Hidden History
"The war between the Cabal and Lux Veritatis has been going on for ages, so we might make use of this. It might be that every major event in history has happened for a reason. It might be that the Great Fire of London in 1666 didn't start in a baker's shop, maybe the Cabal and Lux Veritatis had a bit of a tiff at that point and that's what started it. Maybe Richard Karel introduced the plague, because he's been doing everything he can to get rid of the human race. Maybe Adolf Hitler was just a manufactured person. It's something that we're going to play on. Not in this game, but maybe a spin-off for The Angel of Darkness, because Eckhardt is such a great baddie. Eckhardt is such a horrible person who's been around since the 1300's. He has to cut people up and take there body parts to give himself longevity. Maybe Jack the Ripper was based on Eckhardt? We've got a lot of these parallel stories that are written. It's something that we will call on and use in other games."

The Sting
"There's a massive sting in that tail to the game. Eckhardt met the last Nephilim in the 1300's, who told him that we need somebody to go out, we've dying and they have put themselves into an ark that's hidden - and that's the second game - we need somebody to go out and bring back our race. The Nephilim did a deal with Eckhardt, the deal was that they'd give him longevity of life if he went on a took the cause and carry on what they were trying to do. So Eckhardt actually met a Nephilim back then. He actually double-crossed them in 1442; he tried to stitch them up, and they hadn't fully gone, they were still here, so they threw him into a pit that was hell like. That's ware he stayed until 1945 which was a castle in Germany called Castle Kriegler, the castle was bombed and he escaped. So he's been back among the population since 1945. He has now abandoned the idea of bringing back the Nephilim and getting a pat on the head. He now wants to be the head honcho of the Cabal and the Nephilim and become like them. The Cabal as an organisation have what's known as the Sleeper, a sleeping Nephilim. They realise that if they get the Obscura painting and perform a ceremony they'll bring Nephilim back. What you don't realise is a twist right at the end of The Angel of Darkness, when Lara confronts Eckhardt and they have a bit of a showdown. Lara is about to kill him by putting some shards into him. Karel, Eckhardt's right-hand man who runs the Cabal organisation, will then jump out of the shadows and actually kill Eckhardt. Lara talks to Karel, questioning what he's just done. Then he shows himself to Lara, showing that his the Nephilim. He says you're all in trouble because I've been manipulating the whole system. All the way through I've been manipulating Eckhardt, and the Cabal, I've been manipulating you. And in actual fact, you all believe Eckhardt killed Von Croy. It wasn't, it was Karel that killed him."

What next?
"So you've given Karel all the pieces he wants and now he's gone. That then becomes the beginning of the second game. And there's a bit of a twist. I don't think people will see the Karel thing coming from anywhere because there's no reason for it. But he shows himself at the end and to just really confuse everybody we've said that the Nephilim are shapeshifters. So the way he shows himself to Lara is by changing through the various people who have come up to Lara throughout the game and have told her what to do. Throughout the game, that was Karel manipulating her path. The reason he was doing that was because he wants the painting. No one has been able to find them other then Lara, so he manipulated the whole situation. He Lara at the beginning so she was accused of murder, he wanted the painting so he got Lara to look for them. Eckhardt's a great baddy, but at the end of The Angel of Darkness to all intents and purposes he's killed. So he's actually gone. Karel isn't, he shows himself to be a Nephilim, he escapes and there's no way of killing him."

Kurtis Doomed
"The last time you see Kurtis he's collapsed on the floor, injured. He's being considered for the second game and could be a really big part of it, but ... if he stiffs and people really hate him, potentially he could be dead. I hope not though, because there's already a part written for him in the second and third games. That's why Lara collects Kurtis' Chirugai weapon at the end of The Angel of Darkness. The give-away is that it glows, showing that he still has power and so that Kurtis could be alive. Will Lara get to him in time? You'll have to wait and find out! In the second game Lara goes to the Nephilim stronghold under Cappadocia. The whole game is under Turkey in Cappadocia. Lara finds some secret passage and that's where the Nephilim race were, that was their stronghold. She's given Karel everything he needs, so he's gone back there and is starting something that Lara has to stop. We never really wanted to reveal the Nephilim in their true form. We showed the Sleeper, but that's as much as we ever wanted to show of them. What we're actually doing now for the second game is designing the whole Nephilim race: what do Nephilim look like? You'll have to wait and see..."

LaraCroft_TombRaider
17th Jul 2003, 22:08
That cleared so much up for me. I finally understand it! I hope Lara gets to Kurtis in time and saves him. I liked him.:(

salvestrom
18th Jul 2003, 00:31
You know what. I think that one of the things I like least is the presentation of AoD.

He says here that its the start of a triology, with a lot of story that goes unresolved as it sets up the second game.

So why no "Angel of Darkness: Part 1: The Sleeper", which would have helped me get into the game more (instead of thinking I was going to be playing something self contained).

And why no: "To be continued..." at the end. Sure it was obvious there's more. But the statement is a type of ending that says "there's more to come", as where the blank screen and then cut to the pointless "press a key screen" made me feel cheated of a porper game - there wasn't even an end game credits.

And end game stats are a summation of what you've been doing with your life for the last 5 days. (Just thought I'd stick that in completely the wrong thread for the fun of it :))

Sal.

total_inferno
18th Jul 2003, 01:13
old news bud ;)

owen10
18th Jul 2003, 01:21
Originally posted by JohnnyZ
For us it was great because the second game is going to be a belter, it's very Tomb Raider. It's set in the Nephilim realm under Turkey, Cappadocia. It's all temples and tombs and lost cities, which is all very Tomb Raideresque; full of fantasy grounded in reality.

.....

In the second game Lara goes to the Nephilim stronghold under Cappadocia. The whole game is under Turkey in Cappadocia. Lara finds some secret passage and that's where the Nephilim race were, that was their stronghold.
*Faith in Tomb Raider slightly restored* :)

Ta for the interview. When was this written?

owen10
18th Jul 2003, 01:32
Originally posted by JohnnyZ
Eckhardt's a great baddy, but at the end of The Angel of Darkness to all intents and purposes he's killed. So he's actually gone. Karel isn't, he shows himself to be a Nephilim, he escapes and there's no way of killing him."
This confuses me though. I thought Karel had been killed, by the power of the Sanglyph and the Cubiculum Nephili? I certainly didn't see Karel escaping, just screaming in agony as the building blew up.

That bit about Kurtis is odd too, indicating his fate is in the public's hands. I'd prefer him to return than not, simply to give the story some weight and meaning.

Mgardiner
18th Jul 2003, 05:52
Oh god let him die...please let him die...

CoolBlueX
18th Jul 2003, 07:32
They should keep Kurtis. he is really cool but i think he should be a cutscene person. you shouldnt be able to play with him just lara.

The Godfather
18th Jul 2003, 08:03
Originally posted by CoolBlueX
They should keep Kurtis. he is really cool but i think he should be a cutscene person. you shouldnt be able to play with him just lara.

Nooo!! Are you crazy or something! I will always love playing with Lara Croft more than with any other animation character, but playing with Kurtis Trent is something soo completely different that it's nothing but a refreshing new start for the Tomb Raider-saga.

XanderD2
18th Jul 2003, 08:09
I don't like Kurtis with all those fake Jedi abilities (far-seeing, telekinetic powers); mind you, I'm not against putting him into the game as an FMV character or an NPC, but let's keep tomb raiding as Lara's exclusive domain. Considering his fan base, a game called 'Kurtis, the Demon Hunter' may be a hit, though.

Also, tentatively I give this return to tomb raiding in TR7 the thumbs-up, but I don't like the idea that TR7 will be confined to a single location. OK, Lara has changed a lot, but no more globe-trotting? No open door environments? Ouch! (Maybe I should blame it on the limited abilities of the new engine, but the developers should be able to eliminate such shortcomings while the level designers are working on the new levels).

By and large I think it is a well-conceived storyline but I have misgivings about dealing with the bloody Nephilim race through the next two instalments.

SnAcKeR
18th Jul 2003, 09:15
i hope they don't bring kurtis back, that was the worst part of AOD controlling him. i wanna control lara croft, that's why i bought tomb raider :mad:

Laras_BF
18th Jul 2003, 09:32
Originally posted by SnAcKeR
i hope they don't bring kurtis back, that was the worst part of AOD controlling him. i wanna control lara croft, that's why i bought tomb raider :mad:

:mad: DIE KURTIS DIE :mad:

wgell
18th Jul 2003, 12:07
Plot shmot.

Who gives a..?

I want a decent TR game not some half arsed soap opera based around Lara Croft.

GAME first, character second, plot third.

I despair...

:(

tomb_raiding
18th Jul 2003, 13:12
Originally posted by Laras_BF
:mad: DIE KURTIS DIE :mad:

:DDON'T DIE KURTIS DON'T DIE:D

Stormgard
18th Jul 2003, 21:18
Originally posted by wgell
Plot shmot.

Who gives a..?

I want a decent TR game not some half arsed soap opera based around Lara Croft.

GAME first, character second, plot third.

I despair...

:(

Plot is the most important thing in ANY game! Be it an RPG or an FPS

YoungLara_TR3
19th Jul 2003, 00:58
I like Kurtis..... I hope they bring him back. I think they should do a two player level with Lara & Kurtis. That would be interesting. Then my sister and I could play at the same time. We always have to rotate levels........it kinda sucks.( If the level she gets looks really cool)

MacAngel
19th Jul 2003, 04:59
I liked Kurtis, but some people don't so it would be best if you got a choice to play him or not. That way everyone's happy (uh, sort of).:p

TRWad
19th Jul 2003, 18:21
Originally posted by MacAngel
I liked Kurtis, but some people don't so it would be best if you got a choice to play him or not. That way everyone's happy (uh, sort of).:p

NO. He must DIE

DIE DIE DIE DIE DIE




But if you really want to see him, Lara can cut off his head and put it in her secret museum (Next to the T-Rex head). Then they have a reason to make the Lara's Home level be back. To visit kurtis. And Winston will put some flowers under his head every day.

wgell
19th Jul 2003, 18:31
Originally posted by Stormgard
Plot is the most important thing in ANY game! Be it an RPG or an FPS

You`re confusing plot with scenario. A game doesn`t need a good plot but it needs a good setting, premise, scenario, situation or whatever you want to call it. TR simply needs a Tomb to raid and it works. It doesn`t need a pathetic on going Lara Croft life story to get in the way which is what is happening.

RPG, FPS etc very seldom have what could be termed a "good plot".

If you want plot read a book or watch a film.

TS16
19th Jul 2003, 20:03
NO NO NO ! Croft Manor cant be burned down. :( i was looking foward being able to play in Lara's house for the next game.

LittleSpender
20th Jul 2003, 21:37
I do have to ask, what is the source of this supposed interview, because it doesn't look totally authentic to me.

I'm a natural sceptic, and er don't trust anybody but am willing to believe it if you can point me in the direction of the source.

Or have it confirmed by a forum admin...

Raven
20th Jul 2003, 22:25
That interview was published, exactly as it appears above, in the TR:AoD official companion, which I have next to me as I type. It's definitely authentic.




( LIVE, KURTIS!! LIVE!!!! :D )

LittleSpender
20th Jul 2003, 22:34
Then I stand corrected. My apologies for doubting. Actually, I've just read another interview with him on another site, and the tone of that interview is exactly the same.

arwen59
23rd Jul 2003, 17:24
DON'T DIE KURTIS!!!!!!!!!!!!Lara will save you!!!!!!:D ;)

snake
24th Jul 2003, 00:54
The story was something I liked in AOD. I leave it to you and to CORE to decide what to do with the story and with Kurtis, as long as I can play with Lara all the game and have back:
1 The old good moves plus the new stealthy and beaty ones
2 The old huge enviroments
3 Those good puzzles and my dual pistols please!