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Sentient Cheese
15th Mar 2003, 09:19
First off, lemme just go ahead and say that I am highly irritated right now, and may be reflected in my words. Don't take it personally. Alright, just wanted to go ahead and get that out of the way.



WELL, where to start. So far, I I have loved this game. In fact, I thought it was a bit too easy on Normal difficulty. I very rarely lost any units (not troops, single units). I've been playing on Hard to make things more interesting.

And so then I came to this dandy little fiasco, this fort defense mission.

Yeah, well, I can never make it past the second or third wave (whichever one has two battering rams instead of just one). Every single freaking time the FIRST ram destroys my gates. I don't even get to the second. I've reloaded more times than I can count. It never works, the gates always break.


And before you give my a bunch of basic advice, lemme just go ahead and tell you what I AM doing. Yes, I have a full troop of aux's constantly repairing the gates. Yes, I have many troops of archers on the walls and as many as possible in the towers. And etc., etc., so forth. In every single other aspect of the fight, I am doing fine. I just can't get those damnnable, overpowered, ridiculously tough rams to go down.


So, at about 5 minutes into the mission, I always lose. It's really making my angry in a big way.


I can't rush the rams with a sortie of infantry/cavalry. The rams are too well protected with a massive escort of troops to ever get close enough to destroy them. Yes, I am using catapults within my own walls, but they can never hit the rams, the catapults never lead their shots and they always miss, the ram rolls right on by.

YES I AM HAVING EVERY SINGLE GOD DAMN ARCHER I HAVE SHOOT AT THE RAM. Or at least I tell them too. Heh, this is what makes me the most angry. I order the stupid ass archers to attack the ram, but only a few of them do. The rest just freaking ignore me and continue to attack other units. This part especially infuriates me. They ARE in range, but they just keep on attacking whoever they feel like, while only one or two of the archer troops actually shoot at the ram like I order them too.

As a result, the ram (and this is STILL just the first one, mind you) catches on fire right about the same time it destroys my gates. Just a bit too late then, eh?


Oh, and what's Prima's brilliant strategy? Have your archers shoot the rams. Well gee, Prima, that doesn't seem to be working to well, is it now? Stupid twits.


I've already tried to do the mission on Easy difficulty. It doesn't matter, that second or third rush, whichever one it is that has the two batterings rams, always gets me by destroying my gates.



I'm about to just find a cheat code and blow this god awful mission to hell and move on to the next. Really pisses me off, though.

Sentient Cheese
15th Mar 2003, 09:23
One last thing.........




I find it amusing that the Gauls have siege weapons in this game, since that is grossly historically inaccurate. Yeah yeah, I know, game balance. But still, in light of my current situation, that little fact is a bit peeving to me right now.

Gatt
15th Mar 2003, 14:38
First, put all your archers on walls and towers ASAP. Remember to set all them as "aggressive".

Then, use the cavalry outside the fort to slow down the first attack.

Begin to pump out new troops from the barrack ASAP (I'd say 2/3 of legions and 1/3 of archers).

Put one or more legions outside of the gate but inside the range of your archers. Use these soldiers to destroy the incoming siege machines and slow down incoming troops. The archers on the walls will help them.

Keep troops (legions and spearmen) on the walls as well, ready to destroy ladders and/or close fight enemy climbing on the walls and coming out from siege towers.

Keep one formation of auxiliary soldiers close to the gate and let them repair it during and after every assault.

Good luck! ;)

Cicero
15th Mar 2003, 20:23
another style...

those allied cavalry outside the gates? dont sacrifice them there, they cant delay the rush that much. bring them in, and beef them up with new cavalry recruits.

when the catapults appear near the bridge to your side (with few support), ride out to destroy them. watch out for these catapults because they easily kill your archers in the towers.

then get your cavalry back to camp at once after the attack.

then the batering rams will come near one by one, also with few escort, let them approach the walls to let your archers start flaming them, and do the same thing: ride out with cavalry to destroy them. dont give the rams the chance to be too near the wall that they can slam their thing.

again, save the cavalry inside.

the archers can kill lots of the enemy approaching your walls, sometimes ride out with horses for a swift blow, but watch out for pikes

then when the siege towers come, do the same...within archers range and ride out with horses.

by this time, you can position testudo legions and balistas outside with no fear.

you also keep on recuiting archers, legions, etc...and you still can hold the fort for another 20 mins, I hope so.

in the left part of fort, put legions on top of the walls. enemy archers take out your pikemen and archers there easily. also put legions near the gate and near wall ladders inside just in case the enemy got past the archers and cavalry attacks.

if you want a thrilling NBA last 1 minuite, ready all your legions, maybe 7 units, in open formation and let them attack everything thats outside the fort. commit all pikemen, auxilliaries and cavalries too.

it's showtime! you'll love it!

im in mission 15 now. also tried online games, so far my score is 2 wins and 2 losses.

in the meantime, i dont wana work, i dont wana study, all i want is to play Praetorians.

Sejanus
16th Mar 2003, 06:24
This mission is also getting me really pissed. I tried putting legions and pikemen in front of the gates to stop the ram - BUT THE ******** RAM KEPT RUNNING THROUGH MY TROOPS LIKE THEY WEREN'T EVEN THERE!:mad: And all of my troops are too ******** lazy to fight this **** which keeps ramming down my gates, and so I can't do anything.:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

Sejanus
16th Mar 2003, 06:35
Erm...sorry about that last post.:( I was abit angry.:rolleyes:

Sentient Cheese
16th Mar 2003, 08:06
Originally posted by Gatt
[B]First, put all your archers on walls and towers ASAP. Remember to set all them as "aggressive".


...

Did you even read my post?



Put one or more legions outside of the gate but inside the range of your archers. Use these soldiers to destroy the incoming siege machines and slow down incoming troops. The archers on the walls will help them.


Doesn't work. As my post said, the rams in whatever wave it is where two rams come at once for the first time (about 5 minutes into it), they have a vast escort who rush the gates before the rams. My troops would never be able to get through the enemy troops and to the rams. These are legionaires and equites we're talking here, not Egyptian chariots.



Keep troops (legions and spearmen) on the walls as well, ready to destroy ladders and/or close fight enemy climbing on the walls and coming out from siege towers.


As my post also said, I'm not having any trouble in this area. Just those damnable rams.



Keep one formation of auxiliary soldiers close to the gate and let them repair it during and after every assault.


*sigh*



Well, thanks for the post, but next time read more than just the title, okay? Your attempt at help might be a bit more successful then. :^\

Sentient Cheese
16th Mar 2003, 08:14
Originally posted by Cicero
another style...

those allied cavalry outside the gates? dont sacrifice them there, they cant delay the rush that much. bring them in, and beef them up with new cavalry recruits.

when the catapults appear near the bridge to your side (with few support), ride out to destroy them. watch out for these catapults because they easily kill your archers in the towers.

then get your cavalry back to camp at once after the attack.

then the batering rams will come near one by one, also with few escort, let them approach the walls to let your archers start flaming them, and do the same thing: ride out with cavalry to destroy them. dont give the rams the chance to be too near the wall that they can slam their thing.

again, save the cavalry inside.

the archers can kill lots of the enemy approaching your walls, sometimes ride out with horses for a swift blow, but watch out for pikes

then when the siege towers come, do the same...within archers range and ride out with horses.

by this time, you can position testudo legions and balistas outside with no fear.

you also keep on recuiting archers, legions, etc...and you still can hold the fort for another 20 mins, I hope so.

in the left part of fort, put legions on top of the walls. enemy archers take out your pikemen and archers there easily. also put legions near the gate and near wall ladders inside just in case the enemy got past the archers and cavalry attacks.

if you want a thrilling NBA last 1 minuite, ready all your legions, maybe 7 units, in open formation and let them attack everything thats outside the fort. commit all pikemen, auxilliaries and cavalries too.

it's showtime! you'll love it!

im in mission 15 now. also tried online games, so far my score is 2 wins and 2 losses.

in the meantime, i dont wana work, i dont wana study, all i want is to play Praetorians.

First off, what does "testudo" mean? Heh. :o



Anyway, again, the siege engines have a much large escort than you seem to realize. The troops always rush the gates first, well ahead of the slow moving rams. My troops can't just ignore the initial escort forces and run past them to the ram in this game. Well, 'cept for the chariots, of course.


Anyway, I have a new idea now. In between waves, I will station a single legion troop in the center forest and have them hold ground there, on Defensive mode. Then, as the rams roll by and their escort is already hacking away at my gates, I'll have the legionaires kamikaze the rams. Hopefully this'll work. We'll see. Dunno, depends on if I can keep producing archers and spearmen for the walls and still have enough time and resources to get enough legionaires out, and if I can successfully get them hidden in between each wave.

Gatt
16th Mar 2003, 08:38
Anyway, Cicero's tips are great, better than mine. Try playing using his hints.

Yes, I've read more than the title of your post. Dont worry, eventually you'll be able to end successfully the mission. Judging from your post, it might take you a thousand times but you'll do it

:p ;)

WhiteSkull
16th Mar 2003, 09:19
i didnt even bother keeping the gate up :) i suck 3 spearmen in stationary formation behind the gate 4 legions behind them, archers on walls with legions on each side stoping laders.

Used aux to make 4 cats to fire out suide my walls. reaplceing spearmen as needed at the gate.

they never broke theru once the spearmen are godly hehe.

Cicero
16th Mar 2003, 16:20
TESTUDO: the turtle defense formation so characteristic of the Romans. Was this also referrred as "fish scale" formation?

This formation was recently used in the Lord of the Rings fortress assault, but they dramatically forgot to cover their sides and Legolas had some target practice.

When I suggested the ride out with cavalry, I didnt mean just 1 unit. Use 3 units of cavalry plus, if available, 1 unit cavalry archers. Let them attack together, with just one click. The cav archers will simply stop from a distace to shoot arrows, while the regular cavaly will engage in close fighting. This should be hard to resist. If it doesnt work, try using use 4 units of cavalry, but keep replacing lost ones.

Also, depending on position of enemy, you could commit or sacrifice a legion or two in open position.

The Catapults, Rams and Siege Towers are the real dangers and must be destroyed.

Sentient Cheese
16th Mar 2003, 17:38
Originally posted by WhiteSkull
i didnt even bother keeping the gate up :) i suck 3 spearmen in stationary formation behind the gate 4 legions behind them, archers on walls with legions on each side stoping laders.

Used aux to make 4 cats to fire out suide my walls. reaplceing spearmen as needed at the gate.

they never broke theru once the spearmen are godly hehe.

Hmm......I wondered if this would work.....I love the spearmen, too. Use 'em all the time in open battle missions, supported by archers and being healed and beefed up by physicians and Centurions.

But as I looked at those MASSIVE waves of enemy infantry, I didn't think it could be possible. :o Well, I guess I'll try it if my previous post's idea doesn't work.

BobC
16th Mar 2003, 18:44
Keep the door shut and let the ram bang on it while you do the following:

Use catapults (make sure they're set on barrage) to take out archers and enemy cav outside the walls when they stop moving. I usually have 2 pairs of cats to do this, hotkeyed so I can quickly select targets. One pair by the right wall and one in the middle just behind the door. 2 Cats with barrage can pretty much take down an archer troop with one volley.

Have your archers on the walls attack incoming infantry and cav.

Once you've thinned out the infantry/cav/archers outside, send out your own cav and legionnaires to take out the ram. After the wave is gone, repair the door with your aux infantry.

I must have been stupid and didn't realize there was a rax in this mission b/c I beat it (barely) w/o making any new troops :eek:

Sejanus
17th Mar 2003, 23:35
Finished the mission. :D





FINALLY!

Athos
18th Mar 2003, 01:46
It's all patience, even though in your case it sounds like patience would make you kill a small animal....

Basically try something new, go out on a limb...be balsy, You may lose alot of guys but hey, you won, a pyrhic (sp?) victory, but a victory none the less.

Oh and multiple cavalry units really does help though, I highly recommend it ;)

malleus1
21st Mar 2003, 07:26
I pulled the cavalry inside and set all archers to aggressive. Pulled everything off the walls except archers. Put the two heroes in the bottom left corner. Put spears, legions etc around them.
Started putting out legions and archers. Built two catapults. Put one group of archers at the bottom edge of the map facing the gate in stationary position and the catapults beside them, firing 'out the gate' as it were so anything that got through the gate could be held there by a legion or two and bombarded. The far right tower I left to itself and as stated all spears, legions and aux infantry were packed into the bottom left corner, I used the wooden building as a buffer, the attackers had to go through my troops on either side of this to get to the heroes.

When archers attacked, used cavalry to rush out and massacre them. I tried to get the aux infantry to repair the gates but it didn't work and I didn't have time to fuss with it, so it remained broken open. Got a physician rather late in the piece too.

Outcome: I just survived, my heroes actually were under attack as the scenario ended and only made it because a new legion popped out just at the right time and I instantly sent it to the heroes. Yes, they got over the walls and in the fort and ran riot over just about everything, it may have been too close for comfort but it did work.

I don't like how the 'game' can charge a unit at one of mine, then suddenly dodge it at the last moment and rush past, I never seem to be able to get them NOT to engage.

Mark OHearn
21st Mar 2003, 14:10
I'm having trouble completing this mission also. However, based on the suggestions so far, as well as my previous attempts, it seems to me to do the following:

(a) archers all on top, including very top of fort sitting down, set to aggressive;
(b) two doctors and heroes inside fort close to archers;
(c) calvary inside and beefed up for rushes;
(d) legions and archers outside in wooded area - most of the enemy won't be able to fight them, since calvary, seige and (I think) spearmen can't enter forest;
(e) keep a steady supply of legions and archers going.

In a previous attempt, I used cats to destroy the wooden bridge on the left. Has anyone tried a similar offensive posture? I think it is a mistake to hold back too far in the fort. I believe (yet to win though) that sending men into the forest may be one of the keys to victory.

Thoughts.

Mark OHearn
22nd Mar 2003, 02:50
My thought about putting men in the woods didn't help much. Finally, after reading the strategy book (though not much help), I decided to put the calvary immediately inside the fort, and only use them to rush seiges and the occasional archers. SUCCESS!

It was a joy hearing the countdown to one minute! Had a sizeable army at the end. This was on Easy, however :( I will try again on Normal.

Regarding Prima's Official Strategy Guide, good - worth getting, but not as comprehensive as their SimCity 4, but that's a much more complicated game to write for.

Played a couple of "free games" against the computer (1 on 1) just on Easy. Ready to advance to Normal. Secret, use and then destroy villages as fast as you can.

Random
22nd Mar 2003, 06:10
Good stuff, Mark.

I managed to win the mission in my first attempt (a bit surprising since I'm not very good at RTS games). I sacrificed my cavalry at the beginning (I don't know why the game tells you to do this, because there's no point), but recruited some more and used them to take out the siege engines. I left my archers up on the walls and they took out most of the troops. Legions stationed just inside the gate took care of anyone who made it through, and catapults took out any stationary enemy cavalry. That mission is a real rush, as is the next one. ;)

RogueImpaler
22nd Mar 2003, 18:28
kk i read most of your posts on this,heres ma view:

1.yes, keep those horses in cuz they will die in an instant if you send em out the gate.(or if ya feelin lucky hide em to the north beside your walls to flank nme attacks)

2.Instead roll out 3 sets legionaires and 3 sets archer out to the north forest to hide;put the legionaires in front of the archers and put the whole bunch on turtle/stationary and then hold.This will give them a hard time if you have north castle towers crammed with extra archers.(you can take out the rams with the archers while the legionaires cover)DONT get out of the forest though.
Might wanna have a medic with those 6 sets also.This way the nme never crossed a bridge with their siegemachines.

3.Have one or two sets archers(you cant send out more at this time)hide in the forest to the west.Kill off the dudes with the ladders and wait till new troops come build the wooden bridge.When they finished and the nme troops advance to cross it,quickly set it on fire.You will see that stupid barbarians try crossin it anyway and burn! :D.

4.keep 3 sets spearmen right in front of the gates in stationary position,use the horses to rush between them when gate falls (if it falls).If you position them close enough some of em will even poke right through the gate :D.you can also put one set spearmen just in front of gate before the hvy rams arrive(i wouldnt)

5. As for ya alls tactics...i still have to add...of course its not good to hold back if you CAN advance,you have a small window to get those troops in position outside the gate.Those two bridges are huge bottlenecks.As for random:the game says its an option to ride out your cav,not a must :D.It must be obvious that as a roman commander you will NOT let the gate be destroyed,so keep a set aux repairing them.
Cicero, youre right, the excellent (high tech for enemies) turtle formation is also referred to as fishscale formation.

6.shruggy tip: divide your aux troops be4 you make catapults etc
or else half of em wil take a break :D

This is how i wasted them (after some really nasty defeats)
SPQR rogueimpaler
ave atque vale

Rasm
27th Mar 2003, 06:23
I was browsing through the forums and was looking for some mp strategies and i found this thread. Anyway, after hearing all the struggles, you guys got me all worried. :(

So I set out playing the SP campaign and when I got to this level I was surprised to find that it wasnt all that bad. In fact I beat it the second time playing the level. (beat it on normal) The only reason I died the first time was that I didn't know all the stuff you could do like move soldiers on the walls, repair the gate, and what not. Anyway...

Here is what I did. Right away I sellected the three groups of equites (sp?), hot keyed them, and sent them to the most eastern side of the wall, so that they are out of view from the advancing hordes.

Next I moved all archers onto the walls and all legions/pikemen just behind the door. Start queing 2 more groups of archers, 4 legions, and 3 pikemen. While instructing your infantry to build catapults and ballistas, the first wave should attack. The first wave should be simple. Make sure to target those infantry carrying the ladders with your archers. After the first wave, move a group of pikemen right in front of your gate. Then shift all your archers on the platform directly above the gate opening. Get them really crammed together. The next wave should come then. If you have about 10 groups of archers on the wall then you should start seeing most of the ground soldiers get wasted. The next part is the fun part. When almost all the enemy infantry are destroyed by your pikemen and archers, and you only see a mass of archers shooting back at your pikes... <insert nasty grin>

Remember that button you assigned the equites too?? hit it and have all your equites charge (run) out and take out those archers. I also found that the equites are good against catapults, balistas, and towers. Just make sure not to run into any pikes or soldiers. Just hide them back along the eastern wall each time. You might even want to have a physician over there to heal them.

Repeat this over for each wave. After each wave setup some more pikemen and legionairs outside the door. I put some catapults outside behind them and it helped some but not much...

You should feel almost invincible up until 1 min left... Then come the hordes. Pile all your guys at the door and don't let them get through. I won with 1002 kills and 604 losses. I only had a about 6 groups of archers left melee fighting at the door when it ended...

Oh yeah, almost forgot.... when you have an enemy battering ram at your door, have a group of legions handy right on the other side of it. When the ram starts to bash the door, have the legions walk through it. This causes the ram to stop (since the doors are open). Just walk your legions into the ram. Make sure NOT to do this when there are swarms of enemy infantry around the ram. Also make sure to cut down all the ladders along your wall before the next wave. Otherwise, get used to hitting the restart button.

I think thats it.... :) I can't wait to play it on hard. :( j/k Well, back to the campaign for me... hope that helps someone. :D

LordJohnDrinksalot
27th Apr 2003, 21:32
(I was replaying the campaign at "hard" setting and I saw this old post. Somebody new to the campaign might still find it useful.)

All of the above suggestions were very useful (aggressive archers, auxiliary catapults, repairing gate), but I won't repeat all those details. They tend to obscure what I think is the single most important key to success:

Use your Gaul CAVALRY to intercept and destroy enemy catapults, rams, towers, and ladders. Don't fight enemy melee units ever.

Avoid enemy troops (it can be done), retreat back into fort and heal, recruit equites as replacements. Use the east gap at times to hide cavalry from direct attack and then sally forth and hit catapults while their supporting infantry are attacking the fort.

My Gaul cavalry units (which I had hotkeyed) had something like 100+ kills and survived until the last enemy assault. This was at the hard level. I've played it four times at hard and won (barely, but a win is a win) twice.

I was using a game controller so I could quickly order my cavalry to charge enemy siege equipment.

No doubt there are other ways to win, but this felt the most active and worked very well for me.

bond0bhave
28th Apr 2003, 08:43
It is a bit late in the postings, but the first time I finished this level I had a nice picture of my 2 heroes cowering in the corner with not one other unit left to fight, and a massive barbrarian horde. That victory sign was a gift from heaven.

After sucking a lot in this level I decided to try beat it nicely, so this is the basics of what I did.

First: made physicians and as many centurions as I could, also made four catapults, sent 2 to each coside of the fort, and set them on barrage.

Second: Made 2 units of archer cavalry and sent them to the nice little side bit by my base along with 2 sets of the nobleman, after them I just pumped out the normal archers, placed them in the little towery things on the corners.

Now when any enemy units came I would let the melee units attack and then send out my nobleman to take out archers and cav arch to take out siege, one or 2 volleys from cav arch is enough to set them on fire, then use the nobleman to finish them off. Then I took out the wooden bridge and placed a wolf in each of the forests on my side of the map so I could see what was goign on, every ime I saw a siege trying to cross the bridge I would pop out with my cav arch, attack it them fall back.

went pretty easy from then on.

soverign
16th May 2003, 00:25
Hmm.... how odd.
I am probably one of the worst (if not hte worst) RTS players on this here forum and i crushed the opposition second time through.

Here's my battleplan.

Bring every body in the fort and send the archers and spearman on the walls (centered around the gate)

Hold that position and...
keep pumping out troops (archers at first, and then leigons and equites)
Keep the gate at full Hp's
send cavalry to get rid of annoying
a. Assult towers
b. Catapults, balistas, and espicially battering rams
c. archers :mad: (hate those cursed archers)
Keep infantry on the inside and out of harms way, they will sereve as your last resort if the walls are taken

Oh yeah and the most important port of my "strategy"...PLAY ON EASY!!!

Gaius Julius
24th May 2003, 03:50
I just finished this mission, on my 3rd attempt; in normal mode.
I must say, I'm sure I made my share of mistakes, but I was able to recover, for victory.
I think the one thing you have to remember to beat this level, is to stay calm.
It's easy to get frustrated, when all those enemy units are coming at you from every side.
Especially, when you're informed that there is 1 minute left; it's the longest 1 minute you'll encounter.

As far as my battle plan went:
Used many archers on the walls, put some legioners along with them for protection.
Used 4-5 cavalry units, kept them inside fort.
When a ram, or cat. came towards door of fort, I unleashed them to destroy them; it worked everytime.
Spearmen were put in stationary formation, behind door of the fort.
Also had 1 group of aux. inf., at door for repairs.
I built 1 catapult, but did'nt use it much.
I also placed 1 unit of aux. inf. beside each of my heros; as a last line of defence in case i was overrun by the enemy at the gate.
Finally, I created as many legioners as I could, and kept them in the yard of the fort; for possible gate rushes, and in case enemy units overran defences at the walls.

This plan wasn't perfect; I'm sure but it worked for me.:)