PDA

View Full Version : Freeport's handling of kidnap/adbuct over water needs to be addressed.



GenocidePete
31st Aug 2015, 16:21
Currently, if a Sentinel tries to drag a human over the water, his victim will immediately drop, effectively nullifying the kidnap attempt. It would be clearly unfair to allow Sentinels to drop their victims into the water to die, but the way this mechanic is currently handled is nonsensical, unbalanced, and greatly diminishes the effectiveness of Sentinels on this map. From a realism standpoint, there is no way to handle this mechanic in a way that makes sense, but we CAN make it more fair to Sentinels by treating the water's edge as an invisible barrier when kidnapping someone. It might look a bit strange, but it's certainly better than the current implementation.

Da_Wolv
31st Aug 2015, 16:35
Either that, or just respawn the human after being dropped in the ocean at the shoreline at about the height of the drop.
Less damage can be balanced out by a short stun while being respawned.

Razaiim
31st Aug 2015, 19:06
The water needs a consistency pass, as some thrown abilities from vampires such as reaver bombs and especially the Summoner's spells can get hung up on the barrier.

Equanimityjohn
1st Sep 2015, 01:20
This wouldn't be so bad if it didn't play the world's loudest thunder.wav file whenever it happened.

TheDreamcrusher
1st Sep 2015, 03:20
I'm probably by myself in this corner but if the water is going to be a hazard to vampires, it should be a hazard to humans as well. Vampires have many ways of accidentally traversing the border and sentinels can be shot down over it. Humans carried or thrown out should die as well.

That said, the harbor area could probably do with a pass to redo buildings to make it not so abusable by sentinels. Hell, give me an option to Dominate Mind a human and walk them into the water to die.

GrayPhilosophy
1st Sep 2015, 09:20
I'm liking the invisible barrier option so there's a chance to grab someone hugging the edge without instantly dropping them again.

Alternatively, although this might be a bit far fetched, you could remove the barriers completely and allow humans to swim back to shore themselves. Dropping them in the water now could serve to just disable a human until they're safely back on land again. It'll also protect them sort of though, since vampires can't handle the water and likely won't be suicidal enough to attack a human floating around out there.
There is of course the possibility of summoners firing bolts out there, and having sentinels drop humans off in the water to make them easy targets. But I don't see how that's too different from doing a reaver pounce and summoner bolt combo.

We could take it even further once the Rahabim are introduced! (hopefully!)

KaininitePriestess
3rd Sep 2015, 03:58
Honestly, I never saw much of a problem while playing Sent with the fact that it forces me to drop the human if I grab them too close to the edge. It just means I have to be more strategic in my direction of attack. If I accidentally drop them, I know I went in at the wrong angle and need to try again.

It's not the best option, maybe, but it works.

Da_Wolv
3rd Sep 2015, 08:10
I'm liking the invisible barrier option so there's a chance to grab someone hugging the edge without instantly dropping them again.

Alternatively, although this might be a bit far fetched, you could remove the barriers completely and allow humans to swim back to shore themselves. Dropping them in the water now could serve to just disable a human until they're safely back on land again. It'll also protect them sort of though, since vampires can't handle the water and likely won't be suicidal enough to attack a human floating around out there.
There is of course the possibility of summoners firing bolts out there, and having sentinels drop humans off in the water to make them easy targets. But I don't see how that's too different from doing a reaver pounce and summoner bolt combo.

We could take it even further once the Rahabim are introduced! (hopefully!)

This wont work
On the base level they would have to do swimming animation work, which is too expensive and takes too much time for just one map to implement.
On a balance level, this would make Sentinels and Throw Tyrants completely OP on Freeport.

Gugulug5000
6th Sep 2015, 00:02
I'm probably by myself in this corner but if the water is going to be a hazard to vampires, it should be a hazard to humans as well. Vampires have many ways of accidentally traversing the border and sentinels can be shot down over it. Humans carried or thrown out should die as well.

That said, the harbor area could probably do with a pass to redo buildings to make it not so abusable by sentinels. Hell, give me an option to Dominate Mind a human and walk them into the water to die.

I actually agree, humans should be able to die there too. Of course if they were to do this, they would probably need to give the humans a couple of abilities that could be used to throw/drop/knock vampires into the water as well. A rework of that part of the map would probably be needed as well, and they'd have to say that the Rahabim haven't developed their water resistance yet, but it could work. A possible option for the instant death upon coming in contact with the water could be the "Eaters of the Dead" mentioned in the Vanguard lore article. The humans could tread water for a second and then get pulled under the water and get eaten. Vampires would just burn up of course.

GenFeelGood
6th Sep 2015, 05:59
I do think this area of the map offers too much of an edge to humans. I'd like there to be something in the water to land on, maybe a wrecked galleon that is crash connected to that area of the pier behind that shack the Scouts like to snuggle up to.

xNarcissusx
7th Sep 2015, 12:58
Because sentinel is the class that needs a buff... Sure freeport is the map where humans tend to win the most but that is only because the buildings around the harbor are much shorter and there are less sides to attack from. Making it so vampires can instakill humans (by dropping them in the water) would just be a way for that to be abused and make that half of the map unplayable for humans.

Making it so you just move upwards with a victim is also not feasible because that would remove the possibility for sentinels to attack from that side.

The only problems is like someone already pointed out the thunder that causes you to go deaf for a few minutes.

KaininitePriestess
7th Sep 2015, 15:02
I do think this area of the map offers too much of an edge to humans. I'd like there to be something in the water to land on, maybe a wrecked galleon that is crash connected to that area of the pier behind that shack the Scouts like to snuggle up to.

Actually, There's a dock behind the Scout-hole and a ship in the water by the docks that's on fire and that hanging box from the crane and the crane itself as well as the fish-market-y area behind the other end of the dock that can all be climbed and jumped onto. ;D You just have to be strategic in your jumps.

Psyonix_Ryan
9th Sep 2015, 00:14
Invisible wall might be tricky, especially with the aforementioned "scout-hole" (sounds weird, by the way). We'll pass this into the team.

KaininitePriestess
9th Sep 2015, 06:02
Yeah, I didn't know what else to call it. XD;;; I just know they duck into that little dock area and it basically acts as a very small choke-point where they can try and do their dirty work.

Sometimes my brain no make the word-things work right. :P