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View Full Version : buff reaver



kLauE187
21st Aug 2015, 03:35
seriously after so many nerfs reaver is trashtier since a few patches and still no buffs. meta gets kinda stall. reaver hp got nerfed, shadowstep got nerfed, melee-dmg got nerfed, shadow bomb got nerfed with this AWESOME new graphic and now he's the most useless vampire-class. There's no reason to pick reaver over deceiver or even summoner in competitive play. An abyssal bolt blocks more vision than a shadow bomb and even deals dmg with a lower cooldown. Sonic shriek 20s cooldown which is full of overpowered features, meanwhile shadow bomb who does completely nothing except give away ur position on 25s cooldown. Reaver has the lowest healthpool with summoner, but summoner has 2 abilities to soak up dmg meanwhile reaver has 1 with a 0,5s delay. Kick is so easy to dodge and i think reaver is the only class where it's better to just go into meleerange because if you dodge his kick you just laugh about his melee-dmg and kill him in no time. The smokebomb nerf was the worst what could happen, it doesn't block enough space anymore to make this class useful. Also you're pretty much forced to land a charged melee + kick, otherwise you're just a sitting duck and even then a lot of the times you just die before you get your last 2-3 melees off.

Arydious
21st Aug 2015, 19:45
I semi agree with you on this. I don't play enough reaver to really speak to how much he needs a buff or how much it has been nerfed, I can say it's not seen in competitive play nearly as much as it used to be.

Most teams by pass reaver altogether choosing to go the extra Tyrant or bring in a Deceiver now.

The smoke is basically useless. It still has some merit, but anyone with a brain can shoot through it or avoid it. Choking haze has seen a rise in play because of this, but let's be serious here hitting a team with choking haze is next to impossible. Both skills play as an area of denial now.

I imagine someone with much more reaver knowledge can come in and correct any bad information here.

SonixSquad
22nd Aug 2015, 13:12
As someone who mains with Reaver, I would be inclined to agree, but purely because what you say has truth to it.

Smoke, I find very sort of pointless. Not sure how it used to be, but right now I will get shot in smoke and its not really cover for my team at all (when used vs good premades). I find the choking haze is more useful as Health station denial and herding tool if used correctly. I don't use it for damage.
But I would like to use the smoke more for alternative approaches and to vary up the gameplay.

The kick, I am bad with. I am trying to get more used to it but it misses an awful lot, I would say more misses with my kick than with my savage pounce. right now, but admittedly %50 of the fails are down to me and not just the ability.

But I agree as I have recently started playing vs better premades and the Reaver is very vulnerable. I find myself switching out to Deceiver after 2 deaths.
I don't think buffing melee damage is the answer as Reaver can be very effective within combos, but the tools like smoke & kick hitbox need a look IMO.

Increase AOE of smoke for sure. Right now everyone is so used to just stepping/rolling to the left/right when a haze is thrown, they do the same for smoke automatically but if it took a second longer for them to move out of the smoke it would help a ton.

Perhaps buffing savage pounce damage might make it more worthwhile to run the risk of midrange pouncing because right now you really have to pounce from a distance to land minimum 400 damage and anything less seems like too much risk for minimal return. See my video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrC4X8Pd4eY) where I deliberately labelled the initial pounce damage so I could see the range required to achieve optimal damage return.

Brainfart /Idea: Wouldn't it be cool if smoke could be used as a sort of portal. SO summoner could send minions thru some portal ability into anywhere that had smoke down.

PencileyePirate
22nd Aug 2015, 14:02
I agree that smoke bomb is pretty lackluster at the moment. It really should be restored to its former glory.

ApollosBow
22nd Aug 2015, 14:37
+ 1 to smoke buff....I think it needs to have a wider area of effect, whatever the buff it needs something to make it better.

Also the amount of time it takes of reaver bombs to blow is just ridiculous, far to slow, players can do a little sprint and jump before it even blows.

On another note I still say Leap Attack needs its minimum damage boosted by 25 at least, the other attacks are to powerful to pick it over them, regardless if you take its "mobility" into consideration.

Rago600
22nd Aug 2015, 15:11
Yeah, i also think of the reaver as to Vunerable. i love to play the class buts it lost a lot of it´s glory.

BUFF THE SMOKE !
(i rarely use it) but it was a lot better in the past when i got team cover... so i support this idea.

Arydious
22nd Aug 2015, 15:25
[B]On another note I still say Leap Attack needs its minimum damage boosted by 25 at least, the other attacks are to powerful to pick it over them, regardless if you take its "mobility" into consideration.

I agree leap attack could be amazing, but it's damage is low and the self stagger sucks!

TAli0n
23rd Aug 2015, 10:30
reaver definitely needs a buff , it used to be my main vampire class , but now i mainly play senti or deceiver , depending on the enemy team
its not awful , with effort and a bit of luck i can make it work, its just i can do alot more with the same effort being a deceiver or senti

maybe we can
- buff leap attack or better yet, change the animation to remove the self stagger
- increase AOE of the smoke
- change the mechanics of the kick so its more reliable in fights (i didn't use kick that much so i am not sure maybe its good as it is )

Kootkha
24th Aug 2015, 03:16
Yes, I think the best way to buff them is to remove self stagger from leap attack (or to redesing it, as it was with eholocation, bcz in the way it appears now - it's almost useless ability) , and encrease the duration and aoe of smoke bomb.

calypso-694
24th Aug 2015, 04:01
agreed.

I play reaver a lot and remember how it was before all the changes.

Smoke bomb got changed so much because of the oomplaints. the effect would last too long so the humans were blind for quite a long time after. this was changed where it simply clouds the vision for humans now and not for very long. Smoke bomb is best used if you throw it in and you get humans in the center of it. other than that its useless.

Spinning kick was super OP and was pretty much a one two punch. now its a bit weaker. its still a good move but you have to be spot on with your aim. its good with smoke bomb if you manage to blind the humans correctly and go in with it. or getting a human from behind with kick is pretty much instant death after melee attacks.

leap attack was my main move until I got good with kick. yes the self stun sucks but if you land a leap attack then roll forward and melee ur ass off you win. leap attack with choking haze is great.

pounce and savage pounce are meh for me. I used to use them but then gave up. too much of a chance of getting interrupted. if you have a good vamp team and you pounce someone pulling them out of the fight ur golden but regular pounce doesn't do that great of damage and savage pounce if you miss ur screwed. yes practice makes perfect but still.

shadow step has gotten better believe it or not. before when you used it, it would just drop you straight down, now it has an arc like it should with physics and all that stuff. it has a risk reward thing. you use it to get out of a jam but that arc shoots you a bit from the fight. you can also use it to trick enemies in hectic situations.

Haste I don't really use on account that your instaescape is gone if you have it equipped. its best used if you are the clean up crew going in while ur team is kicking ass and you rush in pull HASTE and got to town.

the health for all the vamps and humans was increased by about 50 points if I recall. but the human weapons and melee got a bit nerfed.

everything on both sides is pretty balanced and the team had to make some sacrifices likewith smoke bomb and such to keep it balanced and to have noobs quit crying.

I agree reaver needs a bit of a buff but if he goes back to how he was before then no one would play any other class.

go watch Nosgoth gameplay vids of old gameplay (trust me loads of it is out there) and youll see what I mean.

riccetto80
24th Aug 2015, 14:31
agree, reaver atm is useless at close range, even deceiver is a better choice in a 1vs1 even after the nerf who turn him in a vampire incapable or move almost, lol

Arydious
24th Aug 2015, 14:34
I agree reaver needs a bit of a buff but if he goes back to how he was before then no one would play any other class. .

Yeah before the Meta was 1 Tyrant 3 reavers, it's tough to balance a class and make the great without making them OP, and it's just as tough to bring a class in balance without making them almost not playable.

I think we can all agree Reaver is playable, it's just currently everything a reaver can do another class can do, and they can do it a little better or have some better tools. Maybe if the pounces got some sort of changes, something to add diversity to the old reaver play could help.