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enkaku-silence-
15th Aug 2015, 15:14
I just opened this thread to do a poll on the most recent problem in Nosgoth: matches with uneven teams.

Let's be honest, penalties for leavers are fine and a must have (as long as the game and servers run stable).

But what happens to the other players after one player left? They are doomed to lose (in ranked at least).

So this thread is not about how to deal with leavers, but how to help the ones being left behind by the leaver!

There were several suggestions floating around.


The Bench:
If there is a game with 3vs4, one player of the 4 player team should be put on pause. The next player who dies in the 4 player team gets put on pause, and the previous paused player respawns. So the players are rotating.
This can be applied to other constellations.
It still has to be figured out what the benched player(s) see(s) or do(es) during the timeout (they should not be able to help their team per chat, etc.).

More on that idea: http://forums.eu.square-enix.com/showthread.php?t=159508



The Bot:
The missing player(s) should just be replaced by a bot. Note that the bot probably hardly can simulate a human player who knows teamwork and choses classes and loadouts wisely.

More on that idea: http://forums.eu.square-enix.com/showthread.php?t=160093



The Surrender Vote:
Teams can vote on surrendering and ending the game without extra penalty. The game should end and count as normal lost game for the surrendering team, they just don't have to play through an aweful match.



The other threads can be closed. This should be the main thread for this topic now.

Endsequenz
15th Aug 2015, 15:55
Mhm...would be good to have an option to say that you don´t like these options, and that you want to keep it as it is.

Maybe I am just lucky..but I had no 3vs4 since the last patch.
And if so, I personally prefer to get slayed, rather then these options.

enkaku-silence-
15th Aug 2015, 16:36
Mhm...would be good to have an option to say that you don´t like these options, and that you want to keep it as it is.

Maybe I am just lucky..but I had no 3vs4 since the last patch.
And if so, I personally prefer to get slayed, rather then these options.

I unfortunately can't edit the poll anymore. But why would you want it to be as it is?
You really rather get slayed?
Just because you didn't have a 3vs4 with the last patch?
I have to say I had less, but I still had them.

3vs4 should never be left as it is, and every other competetive game has a solution for this.
It doesn't matter how often it occurs, it is unfair and there should be a workaround.

Saying "Oh it didn't happen to me, so I don't care" is selfish.

Endsequenz
15th Aug 2015, 16:45
Lol...
I am not saying it did not happend to me , so I don´t care.
I am saying that I don´t care to get slayed...yes.
If you create a poll, all opinions should be covered to have a good fair poll.

If someone is not your opinion..it is not the right way to attack him...
that way you cannot have a good discussion.

If you cannot change it anymore...fine...but I cannot be a part of it then...cuz as I said.

selfish is...if you just think from your perspective btw, or you only understand statements the way you want to understand them.^^

However...good luck with your poll.

enkaku-silence-
15th Aug 2015, 18:00
This is about ranked mode, so being slaught is not cool. Especially if you could've won.
I would add your desired option, if I could. Unfortunately I would need to open the thread again. Sorry for not thinking about that. Next time I create a poll I will keep in mind that some people don't want change.

I didn't mean to attack you. It's just that this is one of the plenty weaknesses of Nosgoth in my opinion.
I just never thought someone would "like" to play 3vs4. Guess you never learn. My bad.

Endsequenz
15th Aug 2015, 18:17
It´s no problem dude...
I know most ppl will want to have the surrender vote or I guess nothing..we will see.

I know you tried to add it...I just don´t like to be called selfish just because I asked for something and tried to make clear that this issue should downsize itself..
but it´s fine dude.

I don´t really love to get slaughtered^^
I just don´t know how a bot would work...
and about balance as someone is benched...
and I don´t want to surrender in a game where one side eats or kills the other....like if we were terrorists agains a special unit...that could fit...but zombies surrending against humans...idk.

But I did not meant to take down your poll when I said this.
Maybe you could make another one against the winner or something (there is no need to do this..I am just trying to find a good end^^)...
like...change it or not...
I don´t see many ppl will be my opinion about this anyways.

However...at least we might see what of these three might be the most wanted and can discuss it then.

Have a nice evening...
need to do my three games....tired...so hot man...stress stress.

enkaku-silence-
15th Aug 2015, 18:24
Ok, sorry for calling you selfish. Was stupid.

Well for the surrender option I guess the whole team has to surrender, so if you don't, you still can get slaughtered. ;)

I know what you mean. This is war between humans and vampires. Surrendering seems weak and unappropiate. So does the pre-end of the match (which I still not support).

Let's see what the poll tells in the end, maybe we can really do a yes-or-no-poll about the winning feature.

Same man, just playing some ranked now, too. Cya ingame.

Endsequenz
15th Aug 2015, 18:45
Ok, sorry for calling you selfish. Was stupid.

Oh yeah whatever...or maybe I am just a little ****
At least we can talk..that´s cool...glgl dude ;)

SonixSquad
15th Aug 2015, 22:20
I voted bench. I also would vote for Surrender but you know whats going to happen when someone starts a surrender vote and 1 guy doesn't want to surrender? The players will just leave, back to square one.
A combination of surrender and bench would be best IMO.
Surrender vote, match ends. if not and players leave, bench mode.

GenFeelGood
16th Aug 2015, 01:52
I'd prefer getting a bump in stats: health increase, cooldown reduction, ammo/attack speed increase or weapon/melee damage increase, etc., to compensate for the lost player.

I knows it isn't a popular suggestion but it is still something I prefer.

I don't like bots in PvP, waiting in limbo during a match after waiting for a match would be beyond infuriating, and while I'm okay with surrender, I don't like quitting.

ApollosBow
16th Aug 2015, 03:47
Bench seems like a great idea, could get the game some good attention for innovating it.

Grisamentum
16th Aug 2015, 10:18
I'd prefer getting a bump in stats: health increase, cooldown reduction, ammo/attack speed increase or weapon/melee damage increase, etc., to compensate for the lost player.

Best solution. No bench, no bots.
:thumb:

JokuPew
17th Aug 2015, 02:26
The bench system seems like a great idea, so does the surrender idea.

Although it should be made so that if a player chooses to leave a 3v4, 3v3, 3v2, et cetera, or surrender one, then no punishment should be dealt. However, points should still be awarded to the winning team as usual, regardless of the player count.

GrayPhilosophy
17th Aug 2015, 11:51
What about adjusting the respawn timers according to team balance? in a 3v4 scenario, the team with 3 players could respawn significantly faster to make up for their missing teammate, while the team of 4 players might even have a slight delay in respawn.

Now of course you could still wait it out so you're able to attack with all 4 against the 3, but at least it's something

barthez36663
17th Aug 2015, 16:33
I like ideas you guys are posting. Just yesterday i had a streak of few 3 vs 4 in matches, most of which i was on losing end. its too big problem and it needs solution, myself, i crushed 3 times yesterday , and one time i was unable to reconnect. It looks like crashes are much more often in ranked league. I knew my team was propably demolished cos i crushed in the beggining and unable to reconnect. Its very, very annoying to lose match not because you lack skills but because of this game bugs.
Bench seems the best solutuion for me. Buffs and diffrent respawn times sounds fine too.

Quillathe
18th Aug 2015, 00:52
So werid today i lose 5 of 9 game casue of leavers and next 3 casue feeders and how i can pimp my rank if i give for free or i ahve hard to play to win :/ and still lose becasue i got newbie on blood 1 ranks....

enkaku-silence-
20th Aug 2015, 09:57
Just wanted to mention that I added the Explanation about the poll back to the first post, because the mods have merged two Topics together.
The original Topic was about the Suggestion of the bench mode, the new Topic was meant to be a discussion about three suggested Solutions (minus the ones who were suggested later, unfortunately).

Wolf_the_Legend
21st Aug 2015, 05:47
I like the Bench, because I had this Idea myself ;) ... probably there should be a 1 minute pause in ranked play (to give at least the chance to reconnect without influencing the game), before the Bench kicks in, because the game is balanced around 4v4 not 3v3. for normal games this pause wont be needed imo, because it far more casual and ppl just want to play.

Firehex
30th Sep 2015, 09:02
Please, devs, implent The Bench variant ! :group_hug:

ParadoxicalOmen
1st Oct 2015, 00:01
Bench is best IMO, but that doesn't mean i don't want surrender option or bots implemented.

Sometimes matches are just hopeless, so surrender option would be good.
And i'd like bots, so we could have a more casual "players vs bots" mode (4 players vs 4 bots)

Guardian1uk
4th Oct 2015, 03:37
Personally I'd prefer a surrender option and just take a loss especially if it ends up 2v4 instead, generaly anything less than 4v4 and the smaller team is VERY likely to end up loosing anyways, so having a surrender option thats available after 4? mins of someone "leaving/crashing" means you can just take the hit loss wise and then move on to the next match, however this is also open to being "Gamed" same with the bench or bot option.

ParadoxicalOmen
4th Oct 2015, 13:10
Personally I'd prefer a surrender option and just take a loss especially if it ends up 2v4 instead, generaly anything less than 4v4 and the smaller team is VERY likely to end up loosing anyways, so having a surrender option thats available after 4? mins of someone "leaving/crashing" means you can just take the hit loss wise and then move on to the next match, however this is also open to being "Gamed" same with the bench or bot option.

I disagree with you, i played many matches where my team was losing, and thus 1 or 2 leaved the matched...the new players often were much better than the leavers and we'd win.

One thing i dont know is if Leagues allows for mid-game joining...if not, then you're right and a surrender option is better (FOR LEAGUES)...
But the bench/spawn queue is best solution FOR UNRANKED.