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sharp461
22nd May 2015, 04:37
So while reading the forums someone mentioned that what if in the original timeline, Max has now also disappeared just like Rachel because she went back to save Chole's father. Well this got me thinking.

What if, and this theory might sound too far fetched (though with time travel I guess anything goes :P), back when Rachel was around she also had the time powers and found a way to go back in time like Max did and try to save Chloe's father because she sounded like Chloe's best friend and seems like something she would try to do. Upon doing this though she sets in motion the tornado while also becoming stuck in this new alternate timeline because of her changes.

In the original, Rachel is now missing because she is stuck in the other timeline, and somehow (which seems to have taken months) Rachel found a way to communicate with Max in the original timeline and lend her the time powers. Now here is where it gets more crazy I think. When Max goes back in time and saves Chloe's father, she changes the timeline just like Rachel may have done, causing Max to become "stuck" in this new timeline. Max from the original time may have just vanished but we won't know that unless we get back. And to make it more confusing, what if this new timeline is the same one Rachel got stuck in, so maybe in episode 4 Max finally finds her and they try to find a way back to the original timeline together!

Also just a side note: Max was able to go back in time by focusing on her picture; what if Rachel mastered that but has been able to use all those "holes to another universe" graffiti around town to travel between time and space, like maybe shes either traveling around town or maybe even jumping to different timeline? I don't know, the whole time travel thing can get really confusing, lol.

Hope this theory doesn't sound too crazy!

MosesKarada
22nd May 2015, 04:53
I love this theory!

julietxjules
22nd May 2015, 04:57
Good idea, but if Max can now use photographs to travel back and forth in time how can she be stuck? Or have I misunderstood you?

sharp461
22nd May 2015, 05:13
Good idea, but if Max can now use photographs to travel back and forth in time how can she be stuck? Or have I misunderstood you?

Well to be honest, we don't know if she (Max) is stuck, maybe she can travel back, but maybe Rachel got stuck and had no other way to get back because the method she took to change history was different? This would make Max try to bring Rachel back with her. Trying to make sense of anything is hard lol.

julietxjules
22nd May 2015, 05:18
Yes. But in your thread you mention that Max is stuck in the timeline that she is currently in. I am sure I have read you right.

sharp461
22nd May 2015, 05:41
Yes. But in your thread you mention that Max is stuck in the timeline that she is currently in. I am sure I have read you right.

True, but I did use quotations because she may not really be stuck, we just don't know enough information yet. If she still has that picture then I guess she could just go back and let the dad die; the main point is that maybe Rachel got stuck somehow in this timeline, and now Max ended up in the same timeline that Rachel has been in for the last few months.

julietxjules
22nd May 2015, 05:43
Okay. I just wanted to be clear what it was that you actually meant.

Nox_Dogma
23rd May 2015, 00:07
i don't think that Dontnod copy the Plot from "The Butterfly Effekt" in which die Main-Char is "stuck" in a timeline, because he has never written a journal
his father used a privatefilm to "jump" into a specific time
-- as i wrote, no copy of a existing story/Plot, mechanic --

but you have a good statement in your theory


Max was able to go back in time by focusing on her picture;
what if Rachel mastered that but has been able to use all those "holes to another universe" graffiti around town to travel between time and space, like maybe shes either traveling around town or maybe even jumping to different timeline?

reference to JulietxJules "mystery" thread we found some of these
holes to another universe

AND only one

hole to the universe

i don't think this is a mistake by Dontnod

maybe there are some timeframes which all results in a fatal tornado
and only 1 timeframe leads to a happyend

how does it work?
Please ask JulietxJules ^^ she has realy good ideas (i love her idea that the bus crashed into Chloe's truck in the new timeline, it sounds good)
or read my thread which contains a (not good) idea for a EP4 plot

hm better read julietxjules threads ^^

---
addition for your theorie and how she can be stucked:
max used a photo to go back in time 5 years
content of the photo -> chloe and max
maybe she (max) can only go to a time with a picture which shows her younger self
and returned after a few minutes (as it does) back to the "now" timeline (with all changes)
thats not new --
but if Rachel has the same power, maybe she changed something bad that she never met Chloe and (like butterfly effekt movie) then she didnt have a picture to change the past again
this timeline is the same as in which max started in EP1
and/or maybe she lost the power and within her memories to alternative timelines/changes she did (she cant remember that she knew Chloe)
---- photo = hole to another universe ----
-
we didnt know how Rachel met Chloe nearly 5 years ago and where she acutal is
i think Rachel is fine, alive



only my thoughts while reading posts (esp. julietxjules)
-- addition to julietxjules thread about the meanings "Dark Room"

maybe all your ideas are right (julietxjules).
i dont want to discus your excelent post, i only add a littel bit

Dark Room is a simple Dark Room (photography, as you said) in which we can find photonegatives
maybe there is a "negativ" of Rachel which shows us the last place where Rachel "jumped"
if it is, we can create the original photo and follow her :)

what do you think about that simple theory, JulietxJules? (have in mind, this is a addition to yours and not the "whole" idea)
sounds to simple? not logical? yes maybe, but its fun to create new possibilities in my mind (and yours, if you want) ^^
its like a unwritten book and we can fill the pages

sharp461
23rd May 2015, 01:51
---
addition for your theorie and how she can be stucked:
max used a photo to go back in time 5 years
content of the photo -> chloe and max
maybe she (max) can only go to a time with a picture which shows her younger self
and returned after a few minutes (as it does) back to the "now" timeline (with all changes)
thats not new --
but if Rachel has the same power, maybe she changed something bad that she never met Chloe and (like butterfly effekt movie) then she didnt have a picture to change the past again
this timeline is the same as in which max started in EP1
and/or maybe she lost the power and within her memories to alternative timelines/changes she did (she cant remember that she knew Chloe)
---- photo = hole to another universe ----
-
we didnt know how Rachel met Chloe nearly 5 years ago and where she acutal is
i think Rachel is fine, alive



only my thoughts while reading posts (esp. julietxjules)
-- addition to julietxjules thread about the meanings "Dark Room"

maybe all your ideas are right (julietxjules).
i dont want to discus your excelent post, i only add a littel bit

Dark Room is a simple Dark Room (photography, as you said) in which we can find photonegatives
maybe there is a "negativ" of Rachel which shows us the last place where Rachel "jumped"
if it is, we can create the original photo and follow her :)

what do you think about that simple theory, JulietxJules? (have in mind, this is a addition to yours and not the "whole" idea)
sounds to simple? not logical? yes maybe, but its fun to create new possibilities in my mind (and yours, if you want) ^^
its like a unwritten book and we can fill the pages

I thought about the whole Rachel being stuck thing and using a photo to go back in time too. Max used a photo showing her, but what if she can use a photo that she took or maybe someone else took but is not in it? Technically speaking she IS there, just you can't see her, but time knows she is there so maybe as long as Max was somewhere (like taking the picture, meaning she is holding a camera at the time of the photo) then maybe she can still teleport.

As for Rachel, I thought, like you said, she went back to stop the dad from dying, but this results in her never meeting Chloe. Now this might sound confusing but I thought what if the picture Rachel used to get back is never taken because instead of taking a picture she was saving Chloe's dad instead. This would result in her being stuck in that timeline because she can't use the same picture again to go back to before the dad lived/died. I guess maybe if she can find an earlier photo its possible, but who knows how long she can stay that far back.

julietxjules
23rd May 2015, 02:15
The one singular thing that I keep coming back to ponder on is how was that polaroid picture taken where we see Max looking at her 'memorial wall' photo collection. Her back is facing the camera lens so who took the photo? Those older cameras models never had an inbuilt timer function so another pair of hands was holding the camera when that particular photo was taken. But there it is, inside a folder of her own journal.

Of course, another person would have to be present in order for that picture to be taken in the first place, but to our knowledge we have never seen or heard of anyone else being with Max in her dorm room.

sharp461
23rd May 2015, 05:15
The one singular thing that I keep coming back to ponder on is how was that polaroid picture taken where we see Max looking at her 'memorial wall' photo collection. Her back is facing the camera lens so who took the photo? Those older cameras models never had an inbuilt timer function so another pair of hands was holding the camera when that particular photo was taken. But there it is, inside a folder of her own journal.

Of course, another person would have to be present in order for that picture to be taken in the first place, but to our knowledge we have never seen or heard of anyone else being with Max in her dorm room.

Hmm, that is interesting. Do we know it was an old camera without a timer? Or maybe she is holding something like a remote or something?

gildedfeniks
24th May 2015, 13:57
If Rachel stucked in a parallel universe by accident, how could she send chloe a message that about someone changed her life? if you dicth the chole's lair like maniac in ep2 (i found that letter i think) she states esspecially someting like that also somebody struck out sentences I'm just saying

Mercyva20x2
27th May 2015, 04:56
where is the ''Hole to the universe'' graffiti? i didnt notice that.. i thought it all read the same to me.. :/

Mercyva20x2
27th May 2015, 05:01
The one singular thing that I keep coming back to ponder on is how was that polaroid picture taken where we see Max looking at her 'memorial wall' photo collection. Her back is facing the camera lens so who took the photo? Those older cameras models never had an inbuilt timer function so another pair of hands was holding the camera when that particular photo was taken. But there it is, inside a folder of her own journal.

Of course, another person would have to be present in order for that picture to be taken in the first place, but to our knowledge we have never seen or heard of anyone else being with Max in her dorm room.


the most logical person, for me- is chloe. i dont think max trust anyone with that except for chloe. or maybe its just ''what happens'' and there is no explanation.. and i hope its not.. because we must know the past to make sense of the present/future. since you mentioned that those camera's that max's use does not have timers, then it wont make sense if it existed.. but i highly think thatits chloe... but how could it be her? since in the begining she didnt even recognize chloe as ''chloe her long lost friend'' ... so wow. i hope they explain that.

julietxjules
27th May 2015, 05:50
Hmm, that is interesting. Do we know it was an old camera without a timer? Or maybe she is holding something like a remote or something?

Well my model certainly didn't have a remote or timer function!

julietxjules
27th May 2015, 05:57
the most logical person, for me- is chloe. i dont think max trust anyone with that except for chloe. or maybe its just ''what happens'' and there is no explanation.. and i hope its not.. because we must know the past to make sense of the present/future. since you mentioned that those camera's that max's use does not have timers, then it wont make sense if it existed.. but i highly think thatits chloe... but how could it be her? since in the begining she didnt even recognize chloe as ''chloe her long lost friend'' ... so wow. i hope they explain that.

That photograph is the only example where we see Max with her back to the camera (all the other 'selfies' are front facing headshots). That picture, as far as we know, was taken before Max was reunited with Chloe. There may well be a timer function on her camera but it is an old analogue camera and most of those to my knowledge did not have advanced functions - mine certainly didn't. But the intriguing thing to remember is that Max actually tore that photo in half in the girls' toilets.

Tataboj
27th May 2015, 06:03
Do you know what that means then? Parallel universes. Because if Rachel saved Wiliam, then the original timeline shouldn't exist.

julietxjules
27th May 2015, 06:14
A parallel universe, hypothetically speaking, (it is not scientifically proved) is a self contained separate reality co-existing with one's own.

Tataboj
27th May 2015, 16:50
Yes, and if Rachel can alter reality and get stuck in it, and meanwhile we can live in the original reality, then we have two parallel universes, where "our" universe shouldn't exist, because Rachel altered it. And that would mean that if we choose to stay in another reality, we would be missing in our first reality. Rachel Amber mystery solved? Did she stay in better reality? *applause

sharp461
27th May 2015, 19:34
Yes, and if Rachel can alter reality and get stuck in it, and meanwhile we can live in the original reality, then we have two parallel universes, where "our" universe shouldn't exist, because Rachel altered it. And that would mean that if we choose to stay in another reality, we would be missing in our first reality. Rachel Amber mystery solved? Did she stay in better reality? *applause

Im sensing a strange "Flashpoint" vibe going on (comic reference).

KF6DBS
28th May 2015, 03:58
the most logical person, for me- is chloe. i dont think max trust anyone with that except for chloe. or maybe its just ''what happens'' and there is no explanation.. and i hope its not.. because we must know the past to make sense of the present/future. since you mentioned that those camera's that max's use does not have timers, then it wont make sense if it existed.. but i highly think thatits chloe... but how could it be her? since in the begining she didnt even recognize chloe as ''chloe her long lost friend'' ... so wow. i hope they explain that.

I would have guessed Kate. It would not have been Chloe since Max does not contact her until they meet by chance at the beginning of Episode 1. Reading the journal, Kate is probably the one that Max is closest to at the start of the game that could also be in the girls' dorm.

sharp461
29th May 2015, 06:18
I would have guessed Kate. It would not have been Chloe since Max does not contact her until they meet by chance at the beginning of Episode 1. Reading the journal, Kate is probably the one that Max is closest to at the start of the game that could also be in the girls' dorm.

Yeah Kate does seem to be the most likely choice, back when she was happy.

EternalAmbiguity
30th May 2015, 00:55
Yes, and if Rachel can alter reality and get stuck in it, and meanwhile we can live in the original reality, then we have two parallel universes, where "our" universe shouldn't exist, because Rachel altered it. And that would mean that if we choose to stay in another reality, we would be missing in our first reality. Rachel Amber mystery solved? Did she stay in better reality? *applause

IF WE'RE GOING WITH THIS THEORY, Rachel is simply in a universe where she altered history, while we're in a universe where she did not (and she definitely did not in ours, because Chloe's father is dead, she's a punk, etc.).

I personally can't stand the multiverse theory so I hope they don't do anything like this.

Tataboj
30th May 2015, 05:41
Well, I believe when Max alters timeline and then goes back, time she was in the second timeline will pass and Max is missing in the original one. It makes sense. And what if Rachel altered reality, but didn't "erase" the previous one? She would be missing then. So if we go back to the original timeline, we'll make Wheelchair Chloe really sad. :(

Alvare
30th May 2015, 23:51
Lol another thing:
What if someone stole Max's journal? They would read about her powers? xD

sharp461
31st May 2015, 21:13
Lol another thing:
What if someone stole Max's journal? They would read about her powers? xD

Yeah but who would actually believe any of it? As it stands now, Max is supposed to be the quiet type who keeps to herself, so most people would assume the diary is just her fantasies.

Alvare
31st May 2015, 22:12
Yeah but who would actually believe any of it? As it stands now, Max is supposed to be the quiet type who keeps to herself, so most people would assume the diary is just her fantasies.
True, still, every single situation she went through is written in there.
If they wouldn't believe it, they would bully her by reading it aloud anyway.

sinfulpledge
5th Jun 2015, 01:36
It just hit my thoughts and I listened to something they made max say within in the game tht made me rethink this whole thing its exactually like the butterfly effect movie and max needs to find the right point I time where everything is back to normal and than give up her friendship so tht the timeline doesn't mess up the future if u play episode 1 lay on maxs bed shes says how edgar allen poe rights about a dream within a dream mabey max needs to keep moving throughout the photos fixing certain things until the timeline gets put back to normal and chloe is the center finding Rachel is the main priority but if u think about the technicality of this u can rewind time so the original timeline is actually Chloe dyeing by Nathan shooting her but u alter it buy saving her which makes it technically and alternate time line and u change more things throughtout episode 1and 2 what if kate was suppose to die as well my point is this at the end of episode 3 ur in a alternate time line again this tiem chloe is paralayzed and max is the cool kid like Rachel this somewhat supports the dream within a dream theory which again make me go back t the butterfly effect my theory is lall the photos tht max takes mess up the time line because u take potos in dif timeline when u save chloe u take photos throught out all the episodes and at the end of episode 3 after change the photo tht u travel through it messes up the time line again so in my honest opinion the end of the game well prolly be max burning her mural with all her photos and erasing all of the things tht happened after all the photos are the most important thing in the game and seem to have some effect on it

aktrolbas
13th Jun 2015, 11:32
It just hit my thoughts and I listened to something they made max say within in the game tht made me rethink this whole thing its exactually like the butterfly effect movie and max needs to find the right point I time where everything is back to normal and than give up her friendship so tht the timeline doesn't mess up the future if u play episode 1 lay on maxs bed shes says how edgar allen poe rights about a dream within a dream mabey max needs to keep moving throughout the photos fixing certain things until the timeline gets put back to normal and chloe is the center finding Rachel is the main priority but if u think about the technicality of this u can rewind time so the original timeline is actually Chloe dyeing by Nathan shooting her but u alter it buy saving her which makes it technically and alternate time line and u change more things throughtout episode 1and 2 what if kate was suppose to die as well my point is this at the end of episode 3 ur in a alternate time line again this tiem chloe is paralayzed and max is the cool kid like Rachel this somewhat supports the dream within a dream theory which again make me go back t the butterfly effect my theory is lall the photos tht max takes mess up the time line because u take potos in dif timeline when u save chloe u take photos throught out all the episodes and at the end of episode 3 after change the photo tht u travel through it messes up the time line again so in my honest opinion the end of the game well prolly be max burning her mural with all her photos and erasing all of the things tht happened after all the photos are the most important thing in the game and seem to have some effect on it

I'm sorry. Your post makes me panic when trying to read it. I just can't dude, sorry.

Alvare
13th Jun 2015, 16:00
Rofl. It's a text-wall indeed. Try using paragraphs in the future.

zackdollars
14th Jun 2015, 01:42
There are not multiple universes because this game has never suggested it. It is a single universe with a single timeframe (exactly as we know in real life). Don't forget about 'space' in the space-time continuum. Max can change location (through space) as well as time. When she does this, she can change events in history. If Max can move forward in time, she would be 'missing'.

This means that it is only possible for Rachel to move forward in time to be considered 'missing'. If Rachel moved back in time, she would change events in the same universe as Max. Rachel would not be 'missing' because this is a single time-frame. (Of course, Rachel may not have any powers, and would only be missing if she was kidnapped or killed.)