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SilentVirtue
7th May 2015, 12:10
Please add a "Do Not hot join Games" button to the Menue when searching for games, I will not hot-join a game (under any circumstance except for crashing out of it)

All it does is frustrate everyone by not having it, Cus as soon as i get hot joined into it im leaving it, to re-que again. and the people in the game don't want to repeatedly have people leaving a match cus they don't want to be there in the first place.

KaininitePriestess
7th May 2015, 13:13
I'm assuming "hot-join" means to join a game that's in progress?

And I don't think this would be a good idea at all. People keep leaving and if you put in an option to not join any of those games, then they'll never rebalance. Like this morning when I had my entire team quit on me, leaving me in a 1v4 match. It wasn't until the second half that I had more people join and make it a full team for me, but it was absolutely infuriating before then.

HoopleDoople
7th May 2015, 13:47
I definitely understand the annoyance of hot joins but this is the wrong solution. If players could opt out everyone would. All it would take is a single player crashing or leaving an otherwise balanced match to ruin it.

Instead efforts should be focused on reducing the frequency of imbalanced matches and creating a way to end stomps early. This would drastically reduce the number of players quitting matches, resulting in fewer hot joins. A massive score disparity could give the losing team the ability to vote to surrender. This would give players the ability to exit stomps without setting up some other poor player to hot join into it.

SilentVirtue
7th May 2015, 13:53
I definitely understand the annoyance of hot joins but this is the wrong solution. If players could opt out everyone would. All it would take is a single player crashing or leaving an otherwise balanced match to ruin it.

Instead efforts should be focused on reducing the frequency of imbalanced matches and creating a way to end stomps early. This would drastically reduce the number of players quitting matches, resulting in fewer hot joins. A massive score disparity could give the losing team the ability to vote to surrender. This would give players the ability to exit stomps without setting up some other poor player to hot join into it.

And so me joining and wasting 30 secs of your game time to leave again is more helpful to the people in the game? I've already stated im not going to stick around in a lobby that has already started, so making me join it to leave, re-search, possibly find the same lobby again to leave Helps who exactly? the people in game? NOPE cus im not playing that match, me? NOPE cus im just going to leave regardless of the 3 mins timer (if it applies)

So what your saying is, that by not having the option people will stick around? don't think so, I'm going to leave ANY game that i hot join, regardless of whether its approved by the devs or not.

HoopleDoople
7th May 2015, 14:16
And so me joining and wasting 30 secs of your game time to leave again is more helpful to the people in the game? I've already stated im not going to stick around in a lobby that has already started, so making me join it to leave, re-search, possibly find the same lobby again to leave Helps who exactly? the people in game? NOPE cus im not playing that match, me? NOPE cus im just going to leave regardless of the 3 mins timer (if it applies)

So what your saying is, that by not having the option people will stick around? don't think so, I'm going to leave ANY game that i hot join, regardless of whether its approved by the devs or not.

Is it hot joining in general you find objectionable or just the fact that it almost always puts you onto a decisively inferior team?

If my ideas were implemented all hot joins would either put you into a fair match or a match in which you could vote to surrender if things didn't improve shortly. Personally I have no problem joining mid match so long as I'm joining a quality match, particularly if it results in reduced search time.

SilentVirtue
7th May 2015, 14:36
Is it hot joining in general you find objectionable or just the fact that it almost always puts you onto a decisively inferior team?

If my ideas were implemented all hot joins would either put you into a fair match or a match in which you could vote to surrender if things didn't improve shortly. Personally I have no problem joining mid match so long as I'm joining a quality match, particularly if it results in reduced search time.

Hot joining in general, I'f someone quits, they should be able to re-join, but aside from that, noone else should.

Ygdrasel
7th May 2015, 15:01
Hot joining in general, I'f someone quits, they should be able to re-join, but aside from that, noone else should.

...Why?

SilentVirtue
7th May 2015, 15:04
...Why?

If someone wants to re-join (as in a crash) then they can't cus of the 3 mins.

If someone quits cus they are losing badly... why should someone else have to fill his shoes?

If hot joining occurs in ranked, the stats are going to be laughable anyway, And I'm asking for the option, if you don't mind hotjoining a game, just leave it un-checked.

Ygdrasel
7th May 2015, 15:12
If someone quits cus they are losing badly... why should someone else have to fill his shoes?

They don't have to. They can leave. Or they can stay and play the game since their goal is to play a game anyway.

The bigger problem though is the lobby system/player pool. Hot joins wouldn't happen so much if there were just more games to join. This would correct a symptom, not the sickness.

MasterFurbz
7th May 2015, 19:40
Please add a "Do Not hot join Games" button to the Menue when searching for games, I will not hot-join a game (under any circumstance except for crashing out of it)

All it does is frustrate everyone by not having it, Cus as soon as i get hot joined into it im leaving it, to re-que again. and the people in the game don't want to repeatedly have people leaving a match cus they don't want to be there in the first place.
Opting out of live games isn't a solution. The whole point is to prioritize joining games that have empty slots. A re-join option would be far more preferable for players who crashed or accidentally got booted from their game.

I'm not intending to be salty here but maybe you need to develop thicker skin regarding matches in progress. I join games in progress consistently, and I can count the number of games I abandoned on ONE HAND. I always suck it up and help finish the game before moving on to the next one. As an ESL player you should hold yourself to a higher standard of good sportsmanship. I can appreciate your honesty about not wanting to be in these kinds of matches but we have to look towards solutions to the core issue and not the individual symptom.

DesolatedMaggot
8th May 2015, 01:39
I have to admit I'm of the same mind, Furbz. Personally I enjoy the uphill battle and attempting to turn a losing game into a winning one. It's a fun challenge. Perhaps y'all should stop being so concerned with your w:l ratio. You'll have a better time of it in general.

On the argument of why should you be punished because someone else left their game; that coin has two sides. Why should the remaining people be punished with a 3v4, or worse, just because someone lost their internet connection or got salty and left?

KaininitePriestess
8th May 2015, 06:21
DesolatedMaggot said it better then I ever could. This this this.

Saikocat
8th May 2015, 10:12
I definitely understand the root of the suggestion, but I don't think it's really something that's totally feasible (and definitely not at the moment). It would likely mean any in-progress games where someone drops (for any reason) will never have the empty spot filled.

SilentVirtue
8th May 2015, 12:03
I definitely understand the root of the suggestion, but I don't think it's really something that's totally feasible (and definitely not at the moment). It would likely mean any in-progress games where someone drops (for any reason) will never have the empty spot filled.

Does that not seem to imply that people would want this? Just ban the person for leaving in the 1st place

KaininitePriestess
8th May 2015, 12:09
Sometimes you have to take a ding for the greater good of the community. I know I wouldn't opt out of them, but I know that there are far too many people who would, and it would completely ruin it for everyone else.

In the end, the fact that the system fills up in-progress matches with empty slots before putting people in a lobby means that there are lots of games everyone plays that don't get completely screwed up in balance because someone quits halfway through the first round. You yourself have definitely benefited from it, the same as everyone who's played. The same way other people have to bite the bullet and play when they're dumped into your game (general you, not specific) you also have to bite the bullet and help other people when you're dumped into theirs.

lucinvampire
8th May 2015, 12:32
I don't mind getting put into games that are in progress if it's win or loose, though I'm in no way a w/l counter. The only thing that bothers me is when you join a game and then you get abuse as you've joined part way through.

I can see why some people would not want to join some in progress games though.

SilentVirtue
8th May 2015, 14:02
Sometimes you have to take a ding for the greater good of the community. I know I wouldn't opt out of them, but I know that there are far too many people who would, and it would completely ruin it for everyone else.

In the end, the fact that the system fills up in-progress matches with empty slots before putting people in a lobby means that there are lots of games everyone plays that don't get completely screwed up in balance because someone quits halfway through the first round. You yourself have definitely benefited from it, the same as everyone who's played. The same way other people have to bite the bullet and play when they're dumped into your game (general you, not specific) you also have to bite the bullet and help other people when you're dumped into theirs.

I'm not disagreeing that people joining has not benefited me, but then the other guy should not have left in the 1st place, and the 3 mins leaver penalty does nothing to discourage leaving.... it just punishes people for crashing out.

So my point being, if you don't add the option to opt out, Were going to just opt ourselves out anyway, and 3 mins is no deterrent (in anyway)

So im asking for this so that those who don't mind hot joining actually join rather than forcing someone who doesn't want to, who is going to leave anyway, I know of people who take it one step further and join the game and go AFK, that helps noone... so why not just give us an option for a choice we already made.

KaininitePriestess
8th May 2015, 15:43
So you'll take the advantage others give and not return the favor.

If that's something that becomes an option, then there should be a stipulation that you only be put into games where there will be no people joining to fill the empty slot if someone quits. It's only fair.

SilentVirtue
8th May 2015, 18:08
So you'll take the advantage others give and not return the favor.

If that's something that becomes an option, then there should be a stipulation that you only be put into games where there will be no people joining to fill the empty slot if someone quits. It's only fair.

This does not bother me in the slightest.

Khalith
8th May 2015, 18:33
Psyonix already did something related to this, taken from the February 25th patch notes.


Matchmaking will no longer place you into a game with a massive score disparity

So you should never get put in to a game with large disparity in score. What you could argue though is what defines a "massive disparity." 20 points? 15 points? 10 points? Etc. What I would suggest as an alternative is change the number to a smaller number. 10 seems like a fair amount to me.

I'm also going to play devil's advocate here for a moment and ask, should we fill games where someone leaves in the first place? I think of cases where it's going for a bit, team is down by 5-10 points and someone leaves. Why keep going? Just have the match end right there and move on to the next game with people that hopefully won't quit. Speaking purely from personal experience, when one person leaves, it just ends up as each player that gets in just tends to leave right away also rather than sit and be stomped for however many minutes is left. I don't blame them for that either, it's not a fun experience, better to just quit and find another lobby.

Rarely do they stay, just yesterday I had a situation where my team stomped the other team in the first round by 18 points, second round started, we end up down by 5 and someone quits or disconnects or whatever. Then we have another person join and I immediately say "before you quit, we were up by 18 in the first round" and that was enough to convince them to stay, but I will say that is usually not the case.

The reason I'd rather see the matches ended right away also ties in to another thing, I've been watching a lot of streamers lately and the wait time for the lobby is a huge turn off for a lot of them. I'd rather see more players in the matchmaking rather than stuck in one sided losing matches where not much of anything is really happening.

Vampmaster
8th May 2015, 19:39
On that note, maybe the displayed score should show the total from both rounds. Or it could include both separately, with the score from the previous round dimmed out or moved to the side.

I'd suggest making it so that if you join in the second round you only need to win that one for it to count as a win, but I think it would be too hard to explain to players who just want to join quickly.