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View Full Version : Human augmentation theme just lost all its value (New COD Trailer)



AdrianShephard
24th Apr 2015, 01:04
Well, it looks like Call of Duty is getting in on the human augmentation debate and the resulting societal backlash. New Black Ops 3 trailer could easily be a Human Revolution or Mankind Divided trailer. That in itself should be a huge disappointment to Eidos-Montreal, though somehow I feel they are happy that the largest gaming franchise is also exploring the augmentation theme (free advertisement for their game).

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My prediction: like EM's Deex, Black Ops 3 will sell you on the setting of the story but not actually refer to it much during the course of the game.

This is usually the part where I go on about how augmentation should be merely a vehicle to tell a story about conspiracies and how the societal "revolution" should be more about the abuse of power rather than about morality (which fails to connect with many), but I know I'm wasting my time.

Siddhartha_
24th Apr 2015, 03:19
I'm just going to pretend that was a fan-made trailer for Human Revolution.

xaduha3
24th Apr 2015, 03:47
I see...

https://youtu.be/JnI30mIKW2k?t=33

Avenging_Teabag
24th Apr 2015, 07:06
Human bionic enhancement theme has lost all value because Activision made a trailer? Because only one publisher is allowed to make games with any specific theme? Wow, people around here do love unnecessary drama.



This is usually the part where I go on about how augmentation should be merely a vehicle to tell a story about conspiracies
Please no.

xaduha3
24th Apr 2015, 07:44
That's a tactical quite if I ever saw one.

Are you for real though? What do you picture exactly when the word conspiracy is mentioned here?

DX1musicROCKS
24th Apr 2015, 08:15
That's a neat trailer though

Lady_Of_The_Vine
24th Apr 2015, 09:42
I expect to see a lot more games exploring human augmentation.... times are changing.... and so are we. :cool:

Irate_Iguana
24th Apr 2015, 09:46
I don't care if CoD does augmentation. I care when Squeenix says: "we want the CoD audience."

IvanaKC
24th Apr 2015, 11:56
Since genetic engineering became pretty advanced, and major discoveries happen every year, I'm not surprised to see the theme of human advancement being used in game. Augmentation especially because that's in the interest of the people who are living in the moment (genetic engineering helps future generations more, can't really affect the genome of all cells in fully grown adult).

However, I wish they could come up with something other than "scientists play God". :hmm:



This is usually the part where I go on about how augmentation should be merely a vehicle to tell a story about conspiracies and how the societal "revolution" should be more about the abuse of power rather than about morality (which fails to connect with many), but I know I'm wasting my time.

Because you're word is word of God when it comes to DX. So yeah, don't.


I don't care if CoD does augmentation. I care when Squeenix says: "we want the CoD audience."

Looks like CoD is doing a great job on the audience transfer, then. :D

AdrianShephard
24th Apr 2015, 13:44
Human bionic enhancement theme has lost all value because Activision made a trailer?

They're making a game.


Because only one publisher is allowed to make games with any specific theme?

CoD is one of the most influential franchises in the industry, if only for its fanbase. If the reception is good, I expect to see a new wave of games dealing with the theme. I consider to many games on such a one-dimensional topic to degrade the value of the theme as a whole. This is assuming, of course, that the morality of augmentations, etc. will be the main focus.


What do you picture exactly when the word conspiracy is mentioned here?

The paranoid neck beard type in a dark room somewhere with skimpy anime girls plastered over his walls, you know, the usual.



Because you're word is word of God when it comes to DX. So yeah, don't.

Don't cut yourself on that edge, bud.

Avenging_Teabag
24th Apr 2015, 14:58
That's a tactical quite if I ever saw one.

Are you for real though? What do you picture exactly when the word conspiracy is mentioned here?Absolutely for real. The loony bin of conspiracy theories was the worst part of Deus Ex. Just embarrassing. Starting with the monastery my eyeballs were permanently on standby to commence with the rolling. Human Revolution did a good thing when they piped that stuff down, and my hope is that MD will keep doing just that.

xaduha3
24th Apr 2015, 15:16
Absolutely for real. The loony bin of conspiracy theories was the worst part of Deus Ex.
Those weren't conspiracy theories though. Loony? Some were over the top, but the Illuminati in particular are at the very core of Deus Ex. Deus Ex is a game about the human nature and the nature of power.

The Hand that looms over the Earth? A conspiracy to control the whole globe! That's what it's all about.

NUMBER8ISGREAT
24th Apr 2015, 18:59
This is usually the part where I go on about how augmentation should be merely a vehicle to tell a story about conspiracies and how the societal "revolution" should be more about the abuse of power rather than about morality (which fails to connect with many), but I know I'm wasting my time.

Abuse of power and morality go hand in hand. You can't discuss one without discussing the other. History proves this time and time again. As for what resonates with the people more? That depends on the people, their circumstances and their value sets.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
24th Apr 2015, 21:09
Since genetic engineering became pretty advanced, and major discoveries happen every year, I'm not surprised to see the theme of human advancement being used in game.

Indeed.

And I'll just leave this THIS (http://www.vg247.com/2015/04/24/deus-ex-devs-take-the-piss-out-of-black-ops-3/) here. :naughty:

__

Update/New

Latest tweet
That cat... (https://twitter.com/SSG_Beans/status/592701622645628928/photo/1)

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j472/Twizted_Viewz/cat.jpg

IvanaKC
24th Apr 2015, 21:50
Indeed.

And I'll just leave this THIS (http://www.vg247.com/2015/04/24/deus-ex-devs-take-the-piss-out-of-black-ops-3/) here. :naughty:

My literal reaction:

http://i59.tinypic.com/2hmdaw7.png

Almost fell from my bed.


"Hey @Treyarch, Adam Jensen says welcome on the bandwagon!" - A certain pic came to my mind:


http://i62.tinypic.com/2cs6nhz.jpg

There's room for everyone, it seems. :p

Lady_Of_The_Vine
24th Apr 2015, 22:00
Yeah. :D

EternalAmbiguity
25th Apr 2015, 00:00
CoD is one of the most influential franchises in the industry, if only for its fanbase. If the reception is good, I expect to see a new wave of games dealing with the theme. I consider to many games on such a one-dimensional topic to degrade the value of the theme as a whole. This is assuming, of course, that the morality of augmentations, etc. will be the main focus.

How many themes have been devalued by popularity? Can you name a couple?

AdrianShephard
25th Apr 2015, 01:15
How many themes have been devalued by popularity? Can you name a couple?

WWII, desert -- "modern" -- warfare (inspired by modern Middle East conflicts), zombies, music based games like Guitar Hero, sports games in the mid-2000s (before it was only 2K/Madden), etc.

Those are the obvious ones. Hope that is satisfactory.

EternalAmbiguity
25th Apr 2015, 02:58
WWII, desert -- "modern" -- warfare (inspired by modern Middle East conflicts), zombies, music based games like Guitar Hero, sports games in the mid-2000s (before it was only 2K/Madden), etc.

Those are the obvious ones. Hope that is satisfactory.

Your response makes me wonder what you mean by "devalued." Because while i agree that these over-saturated the market, I don't see how that makes the theme itself inherently devalued.

Maybe I'm not the best to argue it, since I didn't care for any of those themes when they first appeared and still don't. But I would say a theme exists separate of how it's portrayed. Did the oversaturation lessen the impact of The Last Of Us (I've never played it, but I know it's highly regarded) or The Walking Dead (same)? And in one specific instance it only gave impact to the theme on modern warfare--Spec Ops: The Line.

Falconer084
25th Apr 2015, 09:18
Deus Ex devs take the piss out of Black Ops 3 (http://www.vg247.com/2015/04/24/deus-ex-devs-take-the-piss-out-of-black-ops-3/)

Lol the devs are having fun :D

Lady_Of_The_Vine
25th Apr 2015, 12:05
JJB is crazy funny. :lol:


We lied guyz. Deus Ex: Mankind Divided actually takes place on the Eastern Front during World War 2. We felt inspired

https://twitter.com/Jonatchoo/status/591331563071086592

IvanaKC
25th Apr 2015, 13:26
JJB is crazy funny. :lol:

https://twitter.com/Jonatchoo/status/591331563071086592

I knew it! :mad:


They shouldn't stop pushing with this humor, though. Otherwise when CoD and DXMD come out, fanboys will point a finger and say that DX is a rip off of CoD. -.-

Shralla
25th Apr 2015, 17:09
Absolutely for real. The loony bin of conspiracy theories was the worst part of Deus Ex. Just embarrassing. Starting with the monastery my eyeballs were permanently on standby to commence with the rolling. Human Revolution did a good thing when they piped that stuff down, and my hope is that MD will keep doing just that.

Human Revolution had a dull and uninteresting story thanks to "piping that stuff down." Is pathetically chasing your ex-girlfriend so much more entertaining than unraveling global conspiracies? And then the conspiracies that did exist were shallow and unbelievable. The entire franchise is about conspiracies, and always has been. The conspiracies are what drive the whole story for every game. Human Revolution only suffered for it sitting on the backburner. You talk about the original Deus Ex like it was all so unrealistic when the fact is that almost everything they talked about in that game is and has been happening in real life to some extent. The original Deus Ex had a story rooted in real life, and overwhelmingly relevant commentary as a result. Human Revolution is just another futurist playground with nothing unique to say about modern society. Oh, the haves and have-nots? What an original idea that totally hasn't been beaten to death by the real life news.


Your response makes me wonder what you mean by "devalued." Because while i agree that these over-saturated the market, I don't see how that makes the theme itself inherently devalued.

Over-saturation is the same thing as devaluation, or at the very least leads directly to it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_saturation


For example, in advanced economies an extremely high percentage of households own refrigerators (more than 97% of households). Hence, the diffusion rate is more than 97%, and the market is said to be saturated; i.e. further growth of sales of refrigerators will occur basically only as a result of population growth and in cases where one manufacturer is able to gain market share at the expense of others.

I realize this isn't entirely relevant, as there is no 97% of gamers who own any one game or system, but it also applies to how readily available something is. Eight e-cigarette shops opened up within two towns of me over the last three years, and all but two of them have closed. Same with multiple developers using one specific setting, theme, or genre across the industry.

EternalAmbiguity
25th Apr 2015, 18:08
Over-saturation is the same thing as devaluation, or at the very least leads directly to it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Market_saturation



I realize this isn't entirely relevant, as there is no 97% of gamers who own any one game or system, but it also applies to how readily available something is. Eight e-cigarette shops opened up within two towns of me over the last three years, and all but two of them have closed. Same with multiple developers using one specific setting, theme, or genre across the industry.

Not comparable. We're not talking about a good. We're talking about a concept.

And this really brings up the difference between a "fiscal" value and a "quality" value. Market saturation forces a product to improve to remain competitive. So while the monetary value of something may decrease, the quality is forced to remain the same or higher (outside of some industry-wide change).

To address your example, did the overabundance of the shops mean the cigarettes were now poor quality? Of course not (but that's what's being argued here). There just wasn't a market for so many.

You're talking about money, when the OP is talking about quality.

xaduha3
25th Apr 2015, 18:25
It might be a good thing, IF EM shifts their focus from "Augs vs Purists" theme to something a bit more sophisticated. Leave the former to CoD.

Dvaythavvar
25th Apr 2015, 18:52
I knew it! :mad:


They shouldn't stop pushing with this humor, though. Otherwise when CoD and DXMD come out, fanboys will point a finger and say that DX is a rip off of CoD. -.-

fanboys are always going to claim random things with or without jokes. I think healthy humor does good for both games. I prefer humour stance to all-too-serious-stance.

IvanaKC
25th Apr 2015, 20:53
fanboys are always going to claim random things with or without jokes. I think healthy humor does good for both games. I prefer humour stance to all-too-serious-stance.

They have nothing to be serious about anyway. It's not like there is a copyright to using augmentation theme or something and, for all I know at the moment, neither side can yell that the other is a ripoff.

3rdmillhouse
26th Apr 2015, 01:38
Human augmentation theme just lost all its value

No, it didn't.

Dvaythavvar
26th Apr 2015, 12:38
They have nothing to be serious about anyway. It's not like there is a copyright to using augmentation theme or something and, for all I know at the moment, neither side can yell that the other is a ripoff.

Exactly. Let angry 'fanboys' claim what they want.

AdrianShephard
26th Apr 2015, 16:29
They have nothing to be serious about anyway. It's not like there is a copyright to using augmentation theme or something and, for all I know at the moment, neither side can yell that the other is a ripoff.



They shouldn't stop pushing with this humor, though. Otherwise when CoD and DXMD come out, fanboys will point a finger and say that DX is a rip off of CoD. -.-

Before you devolve into the "us vs them" mentality and rely on the newer forum members to boost your ego, take time to read and understand the argument made in this thread. No where does anyone mention "ripoff". Implicitly calling others who aren't happy with HR/MD "fanboys" -- when ironically you are the one tirelessly defending HR in other threads -- is unoriginal and says a lot about your ability to effectively counter an argument.

IvanaKC
26th Apr 2015, 16:44
Before you devolve into the "us vs them" mentality and rely on the newer forum members to boost your ego, take time to read and understand the argument made in this thread. No where does anyone mention "ripoff". Implicitly calling others who aren't happy with HR/MD "fanboys" -- when ironically you are the one tirelessly defending HR in other threads -- is unoriginal and says a lot about your ability to effectively counter an argument.

Before indulging in further discussion I must ask you how did you come to conclusion that I think people who don't like HR are CoD fanboys? By Dvaythavvar's reply, I thought it's very obvious that I referred to CoD 'fanboys' (not all fans), childish people with tendency to complain about everything. :scratch:

AdrianShephard
26th Apr 2015, 16:51
Before indulging in further discussion I must ask you how did you come to conclusion that I think people who don't like HR are CoD fanboys? By Dvaythavvar's reply, I thought it's very obvious that I referred to CoD 'fanboys' (not all fans), childish people with tendency to complain about everything. :scratch:

If you did indeed mean to only refer to the COD audience then I am at fault.

IvanaKC
26th Apr 2015, 16:56
If you did indeed mean to only refer to the COD audience then I am at fault.

No probs. I didn't mention anyone else and my intention definitely wasn't to insult half of the world. :)

Lady_Of_The_Vine
26th Apr 2015, 17:50
The only insult I am reading is in AdrianShephard's post when he states you rely on newer forum members to somehow boost your ego; advises you to read and understand arguments made in this thread and complains that you tirelessly defend HR blah blah.

No more personal insults or memberating please. Check the ToU.

__

Back on topic.
I pay no heed to these 'rip-off' claims as its not a legitimate claim most of the time. Blatant plagiarism is the only claim of importance.
"Rip off" heavily implies that nothing new was added; which is usually not the case. "Inspiration" is a more realistic description as most things are derivative and just about every creative process is inspired by something before and pays homage to their works.

AdrianShephard
26th Apr 2015, 18:05
The only insult I am reading is in AdrianShephard's post when he states you rely on newer forum members to somehow boost your ego; advises you to read and understand arguments made in this thread and complains that you tirelessly defend HR blah blah.

It was already established that I ****ed up. What is your goal in bringing it up again?

Lady_Of_The_Vine
26th Apr 2015, 18:30
The fact that you misunderstood IvanaKC is a separate issue that was sorted out, yes.
That aside, I am discussing how some of your comments violated the ToU (personal insult and memberating); irrespective of whether you understood or misunderstood IvanaKC.
I've already sent you a PM about it, so, likewise, what is your goal in bringing it up again in the thread?

We can move on now, or PM me.

DX1musicROCKS
27th Apr 2015, 08:03
There's a gameplay trailer up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58Pspqx0XGs

Seems to have some nice use of first person movement.

vallux
27th Apr 2015, 12:02
It looks okay. E3 will probably have campaign gameplay, I'm waiting for that.

Shralla
27th Apr 2015, 22:30
There's a gameplay trailer up: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=58Pspqx0XGs

Seems to have some nice use of first person movement.

It looks like Titanfall but slower, and you know it has a bunch of dumb Call of Duty stick and carrot stuff.

dlux99
27th Apr 2015, 22:49
CoD ripped off Deus Ex...

which isn't a bad thing, but everybody should know where Treyarch got their inspiration from.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
28th Apr 2015, 17:28
Latest tweet... (https://twitter.com/SSG_Beans/status/592701622645628928/photo/1) :naughty:

http://i1087.photobucket.com/albums/j472/Twizted_Viewz/cat.jpg

IvanaKC
28th Apr 2015, 20:09
^ So, the 9gag community isn't the only one obsessed with cats. :lol:

Ex_Zero
29th Apr 2015, 10:09
I knew this was going to happen the moment I started up the new Call of Duty warfare trailer. It will be highly interesting if they do their own game with the flavor of ours. If they do our game their way, screw it. I say the more the merrier, cyberpunk rules, bring it on!