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_Kine_
6th Mar 2015, 17:16
What can tyrants do that no other Vampires can do better ?

Trying to level it up to 25 and having a hard time understanding the class. What role to fill, his function on the team. Initiator is not even possible. Pops in 2 seconds from focus fire. Stuns are close range, can't get close enough against good players.

So what exactly is the Tyrant's forte in Nosgoth other than CC bait ?

Gozetassj9
6th Mar 2015, 17:49
I really enjoy Tyrant, he feels really powerful with semi competent players even against a better overall team. He plays fast and is key to a fast human wipe without the need for a lot of pokes. The role I usually play is physical initiator and singling people out.

What he can do that no other vampire can do is lock people down from full to 0 health without them being able to even shoot. The potential for a team stun and causing them to spread or LOS each other is pretty unique too.

That answers your question if you wanna stop reading, but I wanna talk about Tyrant some more.

Generally will start off with IP to feel out the enemy team, then switch to Zerk if I've got a good handle on them for the extra damage. Sometimes I stick with IP if they are a pre-made and seem to focus really well.

I use Charge and Throw and initiate from an angle I don't think they'll expect me from in relation to my team mates. I'll wait for soft initiators like reaver/sentinel bombs and summons/strikes. If there is a deceiver I'll start charging a split second before he attacks, as I see him going toward them while invis. The key is not to telegraph your position until you actually start charging, and have that roar distract them while signaling your team to move in. I can focus a particularly pesky player if needed with throw. If running Zerk I can kill a player with just a bit of chaos before they can do anything. Charge + Throw and a swipe if they had taken no damage from the pokes. Even if I end up dieing, taking out their top player is often worth it for a 4/1-2.

CC bait is definitely useful, but the stun potential of a well planned charge is invaluable, not to mention that if the team isn't well organized or get out of sink he can just mow through them repeatedly with charge's low CD. I leveled Tyrant the fastest, usually getting around 2k exp a game. Some cons of Tyrant are that it's harder to hit and run and a missed or obvious charge usually means death.

Sanguise23
6th Mar 2015, 18:42
Jump can also be useful if not playing against a warbow scout, but you have to jump in after the battle begins.I tend to hit berserk then jump in (all after reavers bomb and or deceiver just as stated above) i usually run after this but sometime if teammates are good you can hit with ground slam then finish the enemy off.

--Ram--
6th Mar 2015, 19:12
For me the tyrant is the least fun class to play at the moment, and least necessary. His stuns take so long to trigger that it is easy to cc him at the end of charge and render them useless. Jump tyrants are even easier to shut down. He is the worst at cleaning up since he is too slow to catch anyone, so relies on his abilities to have any impact. His abilities are all avoidable with sufficient awareness. He needs some love. Yes charge can be devastating, but if it is it is basically because the humans messed up. If they don't it isn't a big deal.

ApollosBow
6th Mar 2015, 19:33
Don't open with them, go in to battle in the middle of the fight. Right now hes not as great as he deserves to be!

Ygdrasel
6th Mar 2015, 21:56
What he can do that no other vampire can do is lock people down from full to 0 health without them being able to even shoot.

...Literally never seen that happen. Ever. I mean, you can Charge them then stun them but they'll still get some shots off.

AnsweRs
7th Mar 2015, 00:41
What he can do that no other vampire can do is lock people down from full to 0 health without them being able to even shoot. The potential for a team stun and causing them to spread or LOS each other is pretty unique too.


...Literally never seen that happen. Ever. I mean, you can Charge them then stun them but they'll still get some shots off.

Half life for sure but full is a stretch

FireWorks_
7th Mar 2015, 02:05
...Literally never seen that happen. Ever. I mean, you can Charge them then stun them but they'll still get some shots off.

Enrage, charge, throw, charged melee. -> death without a chance for retalation

Full health to Zero, like he explained.

Ygdrasel
7th Mar 2015, 03:07
Enrage, charge, throw, charged melee. -> death without a chance for retaliation

Full health to Zero, like he explained.

Pretty sure both abilities and basic shooting can be done while a Tyrant is enraged and charging...No chance for retaliation indeed.

There's nothing a Tyrant really does much better than the rest. Except maybe survive with Ignore Pain.

lastnewbie
7th Mar 2015, 06:13
There's nothing a Tyrant really does much better than the rest. Except maybe survive with Ignore Pain. I love and hate the ignore pain, you can eat without stop with it, but if you are a human, you'll hate it.

Morigh
7th Mar 2015, 06:16
There's in my opinion, as a tyrant player with most of my vampire time as a tyrant must say that the best build is;
Charge
Throw
Enrage

My reasoning is as follows.
Charge is far more reliable than jump, if you know how to curve with a charge it can be somewhat difficult to dodge and actually impossible for a vanguard to dodge, Jump is far too easy to see coming and far to difficult to correct, you can only correct in a single axis and not by alot.
You want to begin your charge in a sweet spot, you want the charge to be endable right next to cover that you can run straight behind, but far enough that its hard to hear your initial first few steps, as those steps the tyrant can't keep his mouth shut, marathon would make this easier.
Charge is just far better than marathon because of the in-combat charge, let me explain.
A minimum duration charge right infront of the human will knock them on their ass, do 325-487 depending on enrage and actually allow you to get another hit in now thanks to the melee speed buff. This has a cooldown of 3 seconds, if minmaxed 2 seconds whereas marathon cannot really do this like 4 times in a single fight thanks to its cooldown being around 5-6, This min distance charge also really ruins vanguards day especially if they keep trying to hide behind their shield.

Next is throw, theres no real great Q with tyrant but atleast throw allows you to deal as much spike damage as possible before you croak and enrage helps that, it also makes 1v1ing a tyrant absolutely impossible by a huge health margin, even agaisnt vanguard prenerf. Ground slam was slowed down and even then ground slam was basically just throw but agaisnt multiple people in that it has the exact same weakness of locking you down except for the people you are killing, allowing humans free hits on you, throw just locks down one person longer and i prefer it for this. Shockwave can be useful and it would be, i'd probably take it except for one problem.
Its hit detection is absolutely awful, elevation being its biggest enemy, throw and ground slam can still stun with a slight change in elevation, (There actually is a patch of dirt that is raised on one map which blocks shockwave)

Enrage allows the best thing in my opinion about tyrant and thats going back and forth with 419+ damage charges and then when enough of them are occupied/dead going in and throwing people around.

In conclusion hes not the greatest vampire but he can under certain situations ruin peoples day, examples are the manor where a tyrant can't do **** alot of the time.

_Kine_
7th Mar 2015, 07:28
Enrage
Marathon +8% dmg and melee attack speed when below 33% health
Berzerker +20% dmg when below 33% health
Throw

Pre-melee nerf patch, this Tyrant is 100% THE best 1 v 2 Vampire. I'm confident in that claim because I am Nosgoth's worst melee player to have ever installed the game. And I could win 1 v 2's consistently with this loadout.

Melee strike distance (measured in Fane's floor tiles) were
3, 2.75, 2 pre patch
2.5, 2.5, 2 post patch

Charged melee distance = unchanged but still gimped in the first place anyhow (no hit detection mid lunge)

I also need 1 extra melee hit to kill post patch compared to what it was. I think it was 3 pre patch and 4 hits after.

The throw takes 1st human out of the equation for 3 seconds, enough time to kill the 2nd. Charge the 1st after killing 2nd and you should be able to 1-2 shot him depending on how much dmg you took so far. Eat once job's done and I'm ready to rock all over again.

--

After the melee speed 'buff'

Tyrant can no longer 1 v 2 consistently now. Problem is, about every other vampire is just as good at 1 v 1. Hence this topic. Is he good at anything else now that he has lost his one and only specialization that I know off ?

Rago600
7th Mar 2015, 09:46
I also use that Setup.

It would make sense to use Charge instead of Marathon for some ppl thou.
I also use Maraton because it fits my playstyle better :)

Especially for rushing corners, i would use "Grondslam & Charge" together in the 2nd Built.

puff_ng
8th Mar 2015, 11:28
A decent human team will be defending an open area and constantly scanning. You're not going to be able to round a corner and go surprise **** and Charge them.

Tyrant is utterly terrible right now.

- Being big and slow makes him easy target
- Melee is slow and has short range
- Throw has even shorter range and can easily be dodge rolled
- Charge is difficult to control, blatantly telegraphed and has recovery time
- Leap is even harder to control, easily spotted, and Tyrant can be CC'd during the jump
- Ground slam no longer combos from Charge, so good luck getting close enough to a human player to land it
- Ignore Pain is OK, but you can still be Bola or Hexed. It's just sad that a Prophet can chase a Tyrant down and beat him in 1v1 every time.

I hear people say, "Oh, but if a teammate initiates/distracts and Tyrant enters battle while the enemy is occupied then he'll be devastating." Guess what? That's true for every single Vampire. The difference is that Tyrant is utterly unplayable unless he attacks after the enemy is distracted. And chances are, you'll only by hitting one or at most two players with Charge.

The only reason he's so bad right now is because Psyonix is balancing the game for Recruit level play, and new players are getting rekt because they stick too close together and don't know how to dodge a Charge/Ground Slam combo.

_Kine_
8th Mar 2015, 23:20
So I've been thinking, trying to look at the Tyrant from a different angle and asked myself:

Who can the Tyrant 1 v 1 duel with and win ?

- Definitely NOT Prophet
- Alchemist is his natural counter
- Vanguard, Nope
- Hunter, depends if the Human lands his Bola or not
- Scout ? Yea maybe Scouts. Unless Tyrant gets Warbow'd, Knifed, outmaneuvered by hook.

Also noticed Prophet's dodge roll is further or same distance as Tyrant's melee strike making it that much easier to aggressively dodge Tyrant during a duel.

Thing is, the 2 'easiest' duel victims are the hardest to approach when they come in 4's

2 Hunters 2 Scouts pops you in 2-3 seconds if exposed. no abilities, no stuns just primary weapons.

uNborn-
9th Mar 2015, 02:51
A tyrant is very dependent on the team. It has one of or if not the best vampire CC in the game though and is very hard to deal with in high level coordination. Talespin usually runs tyrant for our team in ESL.

_Kine_
9th Mar 2015, 05:39
Talespin usually runs tyrant for our team in ESL.

ya well his level of melee isn't exactly representative of us mortals. he is able to stay alive not because of the Tyrant per se but his superhuman ability to read and judge melee moves so much so he can dodge and weave in between bullets, crossbows and arrows.

He is able to make Tyrant work not because the class is viable

But because Talespin

--Ram--
9th Mar 2015, 08:04
A tyrant is very dependent on the team. It has one of or if not the best vampire CC in the game though and is very hard to deal with in high level coordination. Talespin usually runs tyrant for our team in ESL.

Mind sharing what tyrant setup you guys are finding effective, or your thought process on how to best maximise his effect on a fight? Its a shame we never get to see recordings of your games.

PollyEsther
9th Mar 2015, 23:05
I'm not the best Tyrant, however I run charge, Throw, Enrage, Berserker.

I just don't like the feel of ignore pain, and kinda banking on grabbing a human after charging them with enrage and hoping their team shoots you while your throwing so the throw does more damage from enrage, enough to atleast be able to finish them off, now if they cc you, then you're pretty boned though.

flyklm
10th Mar 2015, 11:44
I'm not much of a tyrant pro, but imo he is not supposed to duel humans or rack top kills.
He's a tanky initiator, throwing cc's and making enemies burn thru their ammo and cooldowns, soaking damage with IP. In order to do so, I start charge from concealed spot and hide round the corner as it ends. If humans are grouped up I chain shockwave and either a) wait for charge to come off cooldown if vampires are not following or b) pop IP and soak the damage/body-block humans to protect my pals.
This simple yet effective strategy proved to be useful to me, with some exceptions (terrain etc).

TeeSin
10th Mar 2015, 17:57
haha , dont play tyrants much but imo they are the strongest class atm .

Facing against 4 tyrants before ? Well , it is challenging , if they all four having IP or one of them have the Enrage . 2 jumping , 2 charge in ... well , u said 1 charger is simple to dodge , how about that . And even if they have bad engage , they will just pop up IP then running around to distract you , you have no clues which one will go off first . ****

And not to mention alot of CCs that tyrant can do . Playing burst classes to counter 'em , impossible with IP . The one who have enrage will do the sneaky stuff , they will pick up human one by one . Tyrants are great at 1v1 too , thier combo charge + throw are insane . Without enrage , do can still do a ton of dmg around 600~800 hp .:mad2:

With enrage on , if u decide to put him low when he is charging , well it is bad for you if you let him grab . 1 grab + low hp tyrants + enrage on + berseker perk = 500~600 dmg , if u get hit by his charge ( full combo i mean ) => You a done for , not to mention the combo are great to splitting up humans . :gamer:

P/s : and solo tyrants are impossible if they are decent . Cause tyrant have 1k3hp . No matter how disable you landed , after they all goes off , it is for his turn to throw disable/CCs for you . And a fight without skills , you are still dead , since you are will 100% the one who would die first just simply bcuz tyrant have higher hp than yours :whistle:

HoopleDoople
10th Mar 2015, 20:56
My problem with Tyrants had always been that more than any other class their effectiveness is dependent on the quality of the team. I personally found that in almost all cases where I was doing well as Tyrant my team would have won handily regardless of which class I picked. And if my team was bad, there was nothing worse to play than the Tyrant. Allies wouldn't create any openings nor would they properly follow up Tyrant initiation.

Then the Vanguard/Vampire Melee nerf patch hit and it has had a really odd effect on the Tyrant. In theory the Tyrant was massively nerfed - he lost the ability to combo his slams, had the damage lowered on his melee attacks and the Vanguard's knockdown is a huge headache for the Tyrant. However, it seems to me that the Tyrant is a better asset to have than ever.

I believe the primary reason is that because melee combat is less rewarding, riskier, and more difficult than before, there has been a premium on both damage via abilities and CC/disruption. A Tyrant, particularly with Enrage, can deal hefty damage with his abilities and provide the disruption (or at least distraction) needed for allies to engage. Odds are the Tyrant dies quickly but so long as his team works with him it is usually a worthwhile exchange.

It is also notable that the meta seems to have shifted away from the Reaver and more towards the Sentinel and Summoner. Both of these classes are far more dependent on distractions to land their abilities than the other Vampires. A Tyrant Charging in keeps eyes off rooftops and skies long enough to create an opening. Knockdown can render Humans easy targets for Air Strike and Hell Strike as well. The meta has also de-emphasized the Tyrant's worst matchup, the Prophet. The accuracy nerf has made the Hunter the go to choice for versatility. Bolas are no fun but I'll take being hit with one over a Hex any day.

Finally, the new Vampire melee really penalizes hit and run tactics. It is harder than ever to reach and stay in melee range, while the damage you deal per hit is lower. An early exit costs the Vampires far more than before. Thus going "all in" on an assault has a more favorable risk/reward than before, and an Enrage Tyrant is the epitome of all in tactics. There will be assaults that end as miserable failures but the higher shot at wiping the Humans is usually worth it now.

Persiphas
10th Mar 2015, 21:37
Tyrant just needs a skill where he throws a stone or some debris at the enemy, similiar to abyssal bolt with less damage but a stagger XD I dropped Tyrant after the latest patch because the game is ~80% poke damage now as vampires and Tyrant can't poke (and I honestly don't know why Psyonix balances a skill-based, esl-ready game mainly according to rank 5 level of play, but that's another topic...). At this point there is just no reason to pick Tyrant against good players, because it's all about poke and hit&run. Imo Tyrant is still ok and not completely underpowered, against many random players he can still kick ass, but if it is a close game you probably want to pick another vamp.

Gozetassj9
10th Mar 2015, 22:25
...Literally never seen that happen. Ever. I mean, you can Charge them then stun them but they'll still get some shots off.

Really? I do it all the time... Enrage (Charge + Throw + 1 regular melee swipe) = death. I actually like to throw them into a close wall next to me instead of away from me, unless we are on an elevated surface in which case I go for the fall damage which will usually kill them too.

barthez36663
10th Mar 2015, 22:41
I think good idea would be to give tyrant 3rd ability next to ignore pain and enrage which would give him some better defense for few second, something like receiving -50% damage but still being able to attack. It would be great tank ability. Also aimed throw and ability to knock others by throwing human at them would be great. And better hitbox of course

Persiphas
11th Mar 2015, 00:21
I think good idea would be to give tyrant 3rd ability next to ignore pain and enrage which would give him some better defense for few second, something like receiving -50% damage but still being able to attack. It would be great tank ability. (...)
I posted a similiar idea in an older thread (~40% damage reduce, but ability to attack; F-slot). If I remember it correctly most people liked the idea because it might allow the longest in-fight time of all the skills, being tanky but not tanky enough to allow body-blocking as effective as IP. It would also allow tyrant to act like the initiating shocktroop (which is how the lore depicts him) without being unstoppable during charge/jump (you can still do dmg on a 40% damage reduce, but you won't be able to burst him down in 1.5 seconds). Hope the devs think about sth like this^^

JudgeEhud
11th Mar 2015, 03:36
I posted a similiar idea in an older thread (~40% damage reduce, but ability to attack; F-slot). If I remember it correctly most people liked the idea because it might allow the longest in-fight time of all the skills, being tanky but not tanky enough to allow body-blocking as effective as IP. It would also allow tyrant to act like the initiating shocktroop (which is how the lore depicts him) without being unstoppable during charge/jump (you can still do dmg on a 40% damage reduce, but you won't be able to burst him down in 1.5 seconds). Hope the devs think about sth like this^^

I don't care if it's 50% or 40%, an ability that makes me a little more tanky but still able to fight would be the most fun and fair thing ever. A skill like this and being able to aim the throw ability would make me buy every Tyrant skin in the shop out of appreciation. Well.... at least one for sure.:naughty:

ursorlicious
11th Mar 2015, 09:31
I don't care if it's 50% or 40%, an ability that makes me a little more tanky but still able to fight would be the most fun and fair thing ever. A skill like this and being able to aim the throw ability would make me buy every Tyrant skin in the shop out of appreciation. Well.... at least one for sure.:naughty:

get tanky and still do damage would be broken as hell. tyrant is fine.

senjuj
13th Mar 2015, 22:47
Hello. Tyrant is the most useless against good players because he is very slow and huge that extra 300 HP not help (two-three shots from heavy pistols). Is it possible to add the following:
1) add aiming for throw attack.
2) zoom out the camera at charged running.
3) radius of shock wave make 3000 or something, like long-range attack of other vampires (jump attack is bad idea).
4) change the ignore pain: cooldown 12 seconds, ignoring damage 100%, duration 3 seconds.

XJadeDragoonX
14th Mar 2015, 03:44
Tyrant's third melee attack is too clucky. Hard to aim and jumps way too far forward. Change it

barthez36663
15th Mar 2015, 23:02
I agree 100%. Also his charged meelee should be change also, its too easy to miss it, i rarely land it and thats one of the biggest problems with tyrant meelee, you cant reliably use charged meelee. Change it to big uppercut or swing but not this two- handed mini jump thing. Also some jump and throw aiming would be good.

And of course zoom that freakin camera out during charge/marathon!

ursorlicious
16th Mar 2015, 07:51
80% of your suggestions are totally ****. tyrant aint that weak at all.

you can stomp the enemy team so easily.

barthez36663
18th Mar 2015, 13:14
ursorlicious, tyrant needs a change. The thins that need to change is his meele 3rd hit, charged meeleee, camera when charging, and throw aiming. The rest is debatable

ursorlicious
18th Mar 2015, 13:49
ursorlicious, tyrant needs a change. The thins that need to change is his meele 3rd hit, charged meeleee, camera when charging, and throw aiming. The rest is debatable

like i said, 80% of the suggestions are "mimimi" and no good points at all.

tyrant melee require no buffs. maybe some vernier adjustment on his melee attacks, but they shouldn't overdo this.
if you can't hit charge, lol, srsly. it's the easiest thing in this game. even reaver jumps are harder to hit.

throw aiming and jump aiming would be cool, but in generel tyrant is really really strong.
i'm playing tyrant a lot and beat the poop out of my enemies all the time.

Sanguise23
18th Mar 2015, 14:02
like i said, 80% of the suggestions are "mimimi" and no good points at all.

tyrant melee require no buffs. maybe some vernier adjustment on his melee attacks, but they shouldn't overdo this.
if you can't hit charge, lol, srsly. it's the easiest thing in this game. even reaver jumps are harder to hit.

throw aiming and jump aiming would be cool, but in generel tyrant is really really strong.
i'm playing tyrant a lot and beat the poop out of my enemies all the time.

while i agree that he can be a beast (and my 2nd fav class) his melee does miss alot when it should hit

ursorlicious
18th Mar 2015, 14:19
while i agree that he can be a beast (and my 2nd fav class) his melee does miss alot when it should hit

if there's a bug with his melee, they should fix it of course.

barthez36663
18th Mar 2015, 20:45
like i said, 80% of the suggestions are "mimimi" and no good points at all.

tyrant melee require no buffs. maybe some vernier adjustment on his melee attacks, but they shouldn't overdo this.
if you can't hit charge, lol, srsly. it's the easiest thing in this game. even reaver jumps are harder to hit.



i'm playing tyrant a lot and beat the poop out of my enemies all the time.


throw aiming and jump aiming would be cool, but in generel tyrant is really really strong.


Well more of a problem is his 3rd hit which looks simmilar i had many instances when tyrant seemed to kinda like jum over or if enemy moves slightly he goes way too forward, with charged meelee its hard to hit enemies if theyre midway.. I dont actually have problems when landing a jump and a charge, but having more control on a camera during charge would be good. Tyrant is my 2nd favourite class, its good just need few tweaks

Ygdrasel
22nd Mar 2015, 05:20
Been playing Tyrant lately with varying success (I don't know what about The Fane makes me play so miserably...) but I'm really starting to long for some ability to aim Throw...

_Kine_
22nd Mar 2015, 13:53
I'm beginning to understand Tyrants more now I just don't have the technical phrases to explain them better so I'll use hypothetical scenarios to illustrate what I'm observing.

2 Reavers vs 2 Humans
- There really isn't much guarantee how the fight will go, who will win etc. Too many factors to consider. One thing for sure, 2 Reavers are flexible enough to fight any 2 Human compositions.


2 Summoners or Senti or Deceiver vs 2 Humans
- These vampire classes really depend on which classes are on the Human side. Whether or not they are able to counter etc. Grossly generalizing but is not necessarily inaccurate.


1 Tyrant + 1 any vampire class > 3 Humans.

Depending on who the Tyrant partners up with determines the optimal initiation tactic. But it is more of a guarantee than any other composition that if the Tyrant gets to knockdown 2 of 3 then ground slam 2 of those 3, the vampire pair will be able to finish off those 3 Humans between the two of them.

Right now, I see the Tyrant as Vampire's ultimate 2 v 1 support as opposed to how others seem to assume he is the Initiator.

HoopleDoople
22nd Mar 2015, 15:41
1 Tyrant + 1 any vampire class > 3 Humans.

Depending on who the Tyrant partners up with determines the optimal initiation tactic. But it is more of a guarantee than any other composition that if the Tyrant gets to knockdown 2 of 3 then ground slam 2 of those 3, the vampire pair will be able to finish off those 3 Humans between the two of them.

Right now, I see the Tyrant as Vampire's ultimate 2 v 1 support as opposed to how others seem to assume he is the Initiator.

What you're seeing is that Tyrants can punish Humans who are too close to one another and/or don't pay attention more than any other Vampire. This has always been the issue with Tyrant balance - they obliterate newbies but are often ineffectual against veterans.

What I've determined is that in high skill matches there are two ways to use the Tyrant successfully. The first is your standard initation - Charge in to draw attention and force dodges, entice most humans to waste their CC on/at you, and then hopefully escape with Ignore Pain. The point of this play style is to sacrifice personal effectiveness to create a much needed opening for your team.

The second play style is to let another Vampire initiate and then take advantage of the confusion to win the fight. Use of Enrage is encouraged for this play style, but you can choose between Charge and Jump (my personal loadout for this is Jump/Ground Slam/Enrage/Frenzy). Timing is key - wait too long and your allies will be dead or too weak to support you after you engage. Go too early and you will be dodged and CCed immediately. If you can manage to hit even two enemies the fight will almost always be a win for the Vampires. Dealing that much damage while temporarily taking some humans out of the fight is incredibly effective.

ursorlicious
24th Mar 2015, 07:59
What you're seeing is that Tyrants can punish Humans who are too close to one another and/or don't pay attention more than any other Vampire. This has always been the issue with Tyrant balance - they obliterate newbies but are often ineffectual against veterans.

What I've determined is that in high skill matches there are two ways to use the Tyrant successfully. The first is your standard initation - Charge in to draw attention and force dodges, entice most humans to waste their CC on/at you, and then hopefully escape with Ignore Pain. The point of this play style is to sacrifice personal effectiveness to create a much needed opening for your team.

The second play style is to let another Vampire initiate and then take advantage of the confusion to win the fight. Use of Enrage is encouraged for this play style, but you can choose between Charge and Jump (my personal loadout for this is Jump/Ground Slam/Enrage/Frenzy). Timing is key - wait too long and your allies will be dead or too weak to support you after you engage. Go too early and you will be dodged and CCed immediately. If you can manage to hit even two enemies the fight will almost always be a win for the Vampires. Dealing that much damage while temporarily taking some humans out of the fight is incredibly effective.

veterans can counter classes with skill and knowledge, no **** brah. that's the same for all other vampire classes too.

would be really sad if noone could counter a tyrant. they're strong enough atm.

HoopleDoople
24th Mar 2015, 15:50
veterans can counter classes with skill and knowledge, no **** brah. that's the same for all other vampire classes too.

would be really sad if noone could counter a tyrant. they're strong enough atm.

Let me clarify, as you seem confused on my point.

Obviously, every last class is more effective against beginners than veterans. It is also well known that Vampires are the superior faction at lower skill levels and Humans are at higher skill levels.

But even more than the other Vampires, the Tyrant really dominates against newer players. Players who overly cluster and are poor at dodging are easy prey for the Tyrant's multiple abilities that are both AoE and minor CC. The Tyrant has also long struggled even by Vampire standards against high skill players. He is a huge target and his primary skills are fairly easy to dodge for an undistracted player.

However, I do believe the Tyrant is perfectly viable for high level play. The caveat is that he is extremely dependent on good teamwork, so I went into detail on how to coordinate with the team. Again, all Vampires perform better with teamwork than without, but this counts double for the Tyrant. For example, a good jump and follow up slam from an enraged Tyrant can quickly win the battle for the Vampires. But this isn't going to happen unless the Humans are otherwise engaged when the Tyrant jumps - it is simply too easy to dodge and chain CC the Tyrant otherwise.

_Kine_
24th Mar 2015, 17:36
Here's the simple fact - Tyrant has the highest potential burst damage than any other vamps.

Delivering that damage safely is the major obstacle hence why I consider him a dps support class.

Summoner is a close second but should you suddenly realize your team fight isn't going as planned, Tyrants are in a better position to retreat safely.