PDA

View Full Version : Tyrant needs a buff



puff_ng
21st Feb 2015, 05:11
Charge is so easily avoided with a dodge roll or even a sharp turn around a building. Your line of sight is also blocked by the Tyrant's huge frame, which is both stupid and frustrating. Hit detection also seems a bit wonky, where the Charge brushes against a human but no hit is registered. Any competent human team will CC and focus fire him to bits before he can do any decent damage. Blinding Shot and Sunlight Vial also disrupt it.

We should be able to control the direction of Throw after the grab and not just toss the hapless human in whichever direction we're facing.

ApollosBow
21st Feb 2015, 05:49
+1

Agree with all of it, controls on Tyrant seem wonky compared to other vamps and this isn't the only thread addressing right now. Also Charge and Marathon seem to be bugged, its a 50/50 split on knocking some people even when you go straight through them.

Khalith
21st Feb 2015, 09:03
I posted this about this issue some time ago, so I will repost it again for my point about Tyrant with a bit of alteration with the current meta in mind:


As for Tyrant, the issue with Tyrant is part of a larger one. Human damage, particularly Hunter and Prophet, is still way out of control right now. Tyrant being such a large target and with current mechanics is too easy to lock down and kill. The extra hp doesn't really make a difference and the subpar escape mechanic that can be locked down, so right now the best way to play tyrant is to charge in, use your cooldowns to initiate, then back off while the other classes do the work while you mop up whatever is left. I feel that hit and run goes against the whole point of the Tyrant's design, but that's just my opinion, I feel the class was designed to wade in, soak damage, and be the last man standing at the end of the skirmish.

Ignore pain is nice, but it's not very useful as an escape mechanic, pop ignore pain and try to climb? The humans bola you so you fall, wait for your cooldown to end while they chase you down and blow you to bits. Once the damage is brought under control, Tyrant would be far more useful again. Not to say it's useless of course, Tyrant is still pretty strong if played correctly but overall I think it's the weakest class, and again, it's also my favorite one to play, saying this brings me no joy.

I feel my point still stands. Current meta and mechanics do not favor the abilities of the Tyrant, not to mention the class has been stagnating for a while. The other classes have gotten some significant new abilities and changes to play around with, the Tyrant abilities haven't really changed at all, the only new ability it's gotten is Throw and it got a few stat buffs and that's about it.

puff_ng
21st Feb 2015, 09:39
Leap is also very hit and miss, literally.

Sometimes I land on the humans, other times I land on the edge of the roof of the building the humans were standing next to.

Ugh.

Da_Wolv
21st Feb 2015, 10:28
Leap is also very hit and miss, literally.

Sometimes I land on the humans, other times I land on the edge of the roof of the building the humans were standing next to.

Ugh.

The only reason to use Jump Attack is when the humans camp indoors, and tbh this feels like an exploit.

Charge and Marathon also seem very inconsistent. Sometimes, as human, it looks like I dodged it perfectly, yet I get pushed anyway. When I play Tyrant and charge someone, they sometimes jump from my left hand side to my right and still manage to dodge me, eventhough I can clearly see their model clipping through mine as I'm going through.

But the worst part of Charge is that you can hardly see anything but your own fat ass.
Even with highest FoV I can only really go for Humans that are static or that have health bars hovering over them.

...and don't even get me started on melee hit recognition.

WoG-Hazaa
21st Feb 2015, 11:45
Ignore pain ability needs to have changes also. It feels like after ignore pain ends you still are unable to use skills or attack in 1-2s still taking full damage already.

Other thing is tyrant's vulnerability to hex or bola during throw. Throw is having so long animation you basically pick up the guy and have chance to get hexed or bolaed, without having chance to inflict damage and still getting cooldown on the skill.

puff_ng
21st Feb 2015, 12:15
^Sadly, Hex just wrecks Tyrants in general.

Archsaint
21st Feb 2015, 14:32
I completely agree with the above; the Tyrant is way overdue for a buff. He’s the least intimidating vampire (imo), and I have 1v1’d many of them while playing a Hunter. I really want to love the class but his abilities are frustrating, buggy… especially the Jump Attack! It’s so hard to aim it, almost like it’s completely random. I wish there was a training mode where I could practice instead of landing off target and getting shot in the face. Perhaps the Tyrant should become partially transparent for the player during a Charge?

Duffie7
21st Feb 2015, 14:59
Jump should remove CC on use and should grant CC immunity after falling a certain distance.

Charge should have a bit of it's ending animation clipped off to allow a faster combo.

It would be cool to give ignore pain some support love. Perhaps absorb 50% of the damage of very close friends.

As for giving him more survivability, that seems pretty tricky without making him overpowered in lower level games.

DesolatedMaggot
21st Feb 2015, 16:31
I love Tyrant and would love to see him go places, but I don't think you can buff his natural toughness much, if at all, without nerfing Enrage. I think any toughness-buffs would have to come from Ignore Pain or some other ability. Perhaps making Charge's TK Shield also reduce damage taken?

As for other the stuff mentioned in this thread, I think Charge is fine as is. Though hit detection has been really poor lately in general, not just with Tyrant or Charge. Dev's have already stated that his basic attacks are being looked at. And as for Throw, it is direct-able, but timing when to turn is very important and I definitely agree it should be smoother. The timing almost feels like directing the throw is a bug.

The kind of things Tyrant needs are quality of life stuff, imo...

Roll Canceling: Would be amazingly helpful for reducing damage/CC taken, as well as preventing you from uselessly using cooldowns. Shockwave, Throw* and Jump Attack are most in need here. Eg. it's especially annoying when a teammate tosses a Choking Haze just as you start a Jump, and it scatters the tiny humans like roaches, leaving your jump utterly nullified.

Air Control (Jump Attack): Not calling for anything crazy but as it stands humans can easily just happen to mosey out of the way, even when completely unaware you're coming. They just happen to walk a little bit to the left or right and now you're perfectly aimed Jump is gonna do 100 damage tops. An aware human should still be able to easily dodge/sprint out of your Jump, but one that just happens to start slowly walking around a bit after I start a jump -- I should be-able to hit that guy.

Throw: As mentioned before, better control over your where you're throwing someone would be great.


* Roll cancelling Throw without using the cooldown could be horrifically overpowered via infinite CC, but I'm 110% fine with it still burning the cooldown. Small price to pay for avoiding a Bola/Hex/Firewall...

TheDreamcrusher
21st Feb 2015, 19:47
I've put my thoughts up before about Tyrant's abilities but I have some new suggestions.

Jump Attack
What I'd love to see is a chargeable jump where the amount of charge put into it affects distance and flight path. A smaller jump leaps forward and knocks aside humans you collide with while jumping higher results in the current implementation, increasing the radius you strike by the higher you jump. The reason I mention this is that Jump Attack's form (and the indoor immediate damage exploit) is not always ideal just because of map layouts. Having to make blind Jump Attacks just because humans are in a corner is a huge pain and detriment to the ability.

Charge/Marathon
Should probably roll these special abilities into one and give it 4.5 seconds of duration with a faster activation, meaning getting up to enough speed to do damage and get moving. The first 1.5 seconds of getting moving with Charge is painful if you're trying to use it with Enrage and you need an escape.

New Special Ability: Telekinesis
This fits in the Charge/Jump Attack slot. Sort of like a short-moderate range "Get over here!" Scorpion kind of move that launches a human towards the Tyrant. Probably deal low damage, 200 or something, since it's putting a human directly in the path of a Tyrant who does great melee damage. Uses: Steals a human from a group, gets him out of line of sight, uses some of that Turelim TK lore, possible pulls him from ledges and causes more fall damage, opportunity to finish a human who has a running lead on a Tyrant. Can be followed up with Throw for large damage. Gives the Tyrant a better hit and run move.

Throw
Like other people have said, I wish you could aim this while you have a human in hand after the grab has connected since it has such a long animation to complete aiming would improve it quite a bit. It's strong as is. It definitely beats most people one on one with Enrage. I wouldn't wish for more damage, but one thought is the ability to disable a human because he's flying. If I could disable a human longer by throwing him up in the air versus forwards, that would be an awesome choice to have.

Shockwave
I wish the path was a bit wider. It's still pretty easy to avoid but overall I like how Shockwave performs and behaves.

New Secondary Ability: Command
The Tyrant shouts a command to nearby vampires in a large area of effect (like Arrow Volley), causing them to break disabling effects. Could be toned down with being unable to attack for a brief time, or unable to be affected by Command again for 3-5 seconds. Uses: Fairly obvious, but at least encourages some supportive play.

I'll edit this post for more later as I'm thinking.

PencileyePirate
21st Feb 2015, 19:53
IMO the only part of tyrant that needs to be looked at is Jump. It's much too easy to counter / susceptible to CCs (relative to Charge/Marathon.)

TendrilSavant
21st Feb 2015, 21:40
The biggest misconception people have about the Tyrant is that he has to be the designated initiator. But all vampires are able to initiate and ambush, it's all in how you use the abilities.

While all the suggested changes here would make him easier to initiate with, they would also make him a much better ambush class. It would most likely make me better for cleaning up mid engagement than the Reaver.

Aside from adjusting his melee hit detection, the only thing that I feel needs change on Tyrant is Throw. Throw should cause 75-125 damage in the initial grab (while the actual throw damage would be adjusted). In my experience, if humans are positioned well, it's fairly easy to take down a Tyrant at 500-600 health before his Throw animation finishes.

Halpachino
22nd Feb 2015, 17:45
Yeah as someone who mains Tyrant i feel he really under preforms at high level.
Mainly due to the fact that he is so limited and animation locked in his skills that it makes the skill ceiling so low and thats why you never see great tyrants at high level.

I think he needs a greater of control on his skills e.g controlling arc and distance of jump or maybe a greater ricochet effect on charge when hit walls or turn rate .
I think shockwave and ground slam are fine and for throw you should be able to move freely and direct the throw when you grab someone.
Also the big issue with the melee tracer which puts the tyrant at HUGE disadvantage as he is not able to hit reliably with his charged attack as other vampires.
I also feel he is still too slow and that the extra health dosent really do much but thats just me.
I really hope they give tyrant another look and see where he can improve

Jallford
22nd Feb 2015, 18:35
The biggest misconception people have about the Tyrant is that he has to be the designated initiator. But all vampires are able to initiate and ambush, it's all in how you use the abilities.

While all the suggested changes here would make him easier to initiate with, they would also make him a much better ambush class. It would most likely make me better for cleaning up mid engagement than the Reaver.

Aside from adjusting his melee hit detection, the only thing that I feel needs change on Tyrant is Throw. Throw should cause 75-125 damage in the initial grab (while the actual throw damage would be adjusted). In my experience, if humans are positioned well, it's fairly easy to take down a Tyrant at 500-600 health before his Throw animation finishes.

I agree with this. Tyrant can initiate, but a Deceiver doing a hit and run or a Reaver throwing a smoke bomb is way, way more effective.

Charge can be hard to aim, but if you use it when the humans are already distracted (and you know where they are) it's much easier to score hits without dying. Jump Attack is too random to be useful in my opinion. Directional throw would be great.

ApollosBow
22nd Feb 2015, 19:34
He's essentially the biggest and slowest vampire in exchange for what?.....an extra Fullbore canon shot and arrow or pistol shot, of which can happen in the space of a second. Hes at a serious disadvantage in high level games because of the common sense to focus fire him and in low level random game I find the Tyrant always getting pressed into being the initiator, which gets him killed, unless you have ignore pain...but cmon, its not very exciting being a bullet sponge, and leaving the fight with maybe 500 health after regen, only to see that your team hasn't killed everyone (no food) and there expecting you to initiate yourself into death next fight.

If I was to make any other suggestions on top of the ones above Id say do something about his speed, in any aspect :(.

Vampmaster
22nd Feb 2015, 19:41
I agree with this. Tyrant can initiate, but a Deceiver doing a hit and run or a Reaver throwing a smoke bomb is way, way more effective.

Charge can be hard to aim, but if you use it when the humans are already distracted (and you know where they are) it's much easier to score hits without dying. Jump Attack is too random to be useful in my opinion. Directional throw would be great.

The thing is, if you miss the narrow window opportunity to jump/charge in, then there's not much else you can do, but trigger ignore pain and flail around like a headless chicken and then bail out before it wears off. I'm not saying there's nothing at all he can do if he messes up like that, but he does become a much less viable choice of class if that happens a lot. Other classes can just choose a different load out and adapt their strategy, but his two main abilities have the same depencancy on absolutely perfect timing.

Jallford
22nd Feb 2015, 20:42
The thing is, if you miss the narrow window opportunity to jump/charge in, then there's not much else you can do, but trigger ignore pain and flail around like a headless chicken and then bail out before it wears off. I'm not saying there's nothing at all he can do if he messes up like that, but he does become a much less viable choice of class if that happens a lot. Other classes can just choose a different load out and adapt their strategy, but his two main abilities have the same depencancy on absolutely perfect timing.

I miss charge all the time and run away like a grade A chump. But that's why I use charge and not marathon, it gives me time to charge again while the fight's in it's latter stages if I have to.

Personally I think the Tyrant is the opposite of a tank. You have to attack when people are distracted or they'll focus you down. A sneaky throw+enrage or shockwave out of nowhere can always let you claw your way back into a fight if you mess up an initial attack.

TendrilSavant
22nd Feb 2015, 23:17
The thing is, if you miss the narrow window opportunity to jump/charge in, then there's not much else you can do, but trigger ignore pain and flail around like a headless chicken and then bail out before it wears off.
I'd argue that that's true of most vampires, if you miss you're heavy hitter, Kick, Infect, or Puncture, your best bet usually is to retreat and try again.

I'll agree that Tyrants specials are harder to land, but they are also CC and usually hit multiple targets. And that's the trade off, abilities that are slower and easier to dodge but that could potentially have a huge impact by hitting multiple targets.


I'm not saying there's nothing at all he can do if he messes up like that, but he does become a much less viable choice of class if that happens a lot.
I think this might be a result of limited game modes. Tyrant is quite strong in Flashpoint (provided you don't spawn too far away) due to the fact that humans have to group up. But Flashpoint still needs some tweaking so he can't really shine there at the moment.

The fact that humans don't have to group up in TDM indirectly counters Tyrant Special abilities. Abilities that are meant to mow down unaware groups are turned into low damage 1 hit stuns when humans position themselves far away from each other. So the problem you end up with is that if you buff these abilities for these situations, you end up indirectly making them substantially stronger at hitting multiple distracted targets, making him too good at ambushing.

Sanguise23
23rd Feb 2015, 14:17
IMO the only part of tyrant that needs to be looked at is Jump. It's much too easy to counter / susceptible to CCs (relative to Charge/Marathon.)

for the most part i agree with this,except i think throw should be aimable. Jump is not random like ppl are saying you just need practice i can land a jump almost on a dime almost everytime. and do tons of damage, heres how i roll:
1. I use Jump, ground slam, beserker and bloodlust
2. let reaver or deceiver initiate
3.jump in while enemy is destracted
4. roll closer if needed and groundslam (or run if really got lit up)
5.then a few swipes kills whats left
all this depends on your team though, if they are distracting the enemy well then this should work, unless against those really really good teams.
YMMV

PencileyePirate
24th Feb 2015, 19:44
for the most part i agree with this,except i think throw should be aimable.

It's pretty aimable before a certain point. I setup my throws so I'm facing the direction I want to throw before I activate, and when I'm off it seems like I can twist a little in the start of the animation to adjust 20-30 degrees.

Firehex
24th Feb 2015, 20:02
Tyrant is the only class in the game which i don't want to play at all...
Big model - easy to hit, awful attack animation, very difficult to perform 500 damage jump attack and very easy to dodge charge attack.
Maybe increase max hp to 1500 and change attack animation ? Let it be unstoppable meat tank.

ApollosBow
24th Feb 2015, 20:51
Tyrant is the only class in the game which i don't want to play at all...
Big model - easy to hit, awful attack animation, very difficult to perform 500 damage jump attack and very easy to dodge charge attack.
Maybe increase max hp to 1500 and change attack animation ? Let it be unstoppable meat tank.

His Health use to be 1420 if I recall correctly, and I think it should be returned to that (or movement made less slow), along with fixing the hit detection on his melee attacks and charge + marathon abilities. Wouldn't mind seeing throw being aimed as I dont understand why it isn't. :scratch:

Firehex
24th Feb 2015, 22:35
His Health use to be 1420 if I recall correctly, and I think it should be returned to that (or movement made less slow), along with fixing the hit detection on his melee attacks and charge + marathon abilities. Wouldn't mind seeing throw being aimed as I dont understand why it isn't. :scratch:

right now his hp is 1350. So buff to 1500 will be fine.

Ygdrasel
24th Feb 2015, 22:44
Tyrant cons:

- Big target

- Slow

- Extra health basically amounts to nothing

- Abilities are ridiculously timing-dependent and/or have long animations.


Pros:

- ...He looks threatening.

Firehex
24th Feb 2015, 23:03
Pros:
- ...He looks threatening.

That is why he is good tank :D His dangerous look taunts people to attack him.

Ygdrasel
24th Feb 2015, 23:10
That is why he is good tank :D His dangerous look taunts people to attack him.

Looking threatening has nothing at all to do with being a good tank. He's a garbage tank because he dies as easily as the rest. Either he needs a buff to survivability or human damage needs a nerf to make his extra health matter.

Equanimityjohn
25th Feb 2015, 01:27
I don't think tyrant needs a buff per say, but a lot of quality of life improvements for sure. They need to fix his basic attack hit registration first and foremost. He really does need some new skills too, that's way overdue. I think his kit as he stands is great, but there's nothing wrong with expanding it, it would make him more dynamic, which he needs. He does, currently, still make a good tank. The way to tank as tyrant is rather simple, you body block once you're forced to pop ignore pain. His massive health pool makes the damage taken while ignore pain is up seem rather useless, unless he popped ignore pain too late and he was already quite low. If your team initiates with you, your body blocking (absorbing the DPS of at least one human) helps turn the tides of the battle immensely. Him having more health is useful too, in the AMOUNT that he regenerates when out of combat. He doesn't need more health, certainly not.

TheDreamcrusher
25th Feb 2015, 08:05
I don't think tyrant needs a buff per say, but a lot of quality of life improvements for sure. They need to fix his basic attack hit registration first and foremost. He really does need some new skills too, that's way overdue. I think his kit as he stands is great, but there's nothing wrong with expanding it, it would make him more dynamic, which he needs. He does, currently, still make a good tank. The way to tank as tyrant is rather simple, you body block once you're forced to pop ignore pain. His massive health pool makes the damage taken while ignore pain is up seem rather useless, unless he popped ignore pain too late and he was already quite low. If your team initiates with you, your body blocking (absorbing the DPS of at least one human) helps turn the tides of the battle immensely. Him having more health is useful too, in the AMOUNT that he regenerates when out of combat. He doesn't need more health, certainly not.

All the quality of life improvements I suggested for the various abilities are strictly from a point of view playing with Enrage and in pick-up games. I play the tyrant as a damage dealer and confusion-hit and run, similar to a typical deceiver playstyle. I'm all for anything that makes the tyrant tankier, but I hardly ever run Ignore Pain.

ApollosBow
25th Feb 2015, 14:53
Apparently they improved the vampire melee of all vamps but believe it or not they have nerfed the Tyrant....his Ground slam is now slower to activate, I dont run this, but with threads created on how the Tyrant is at a disadvantage I was'nt expecting a nerf.

Sasha_Vykos
25th Feb 2015, 14:54
Apparently they improved the vampire melee of all vamps but believe it or not they have nerfed the Tyrant....his Ground slam is now slower to activate, I dont run this, but with threads created on how the Tyrant is at a disadvantage I was'nt expecting a nerf.

actually.. I was expecting some type of buff

Duffie7
25th Feb 2015, 15:56
And tyrant was nerfed

Khalith
25th Feb 2015, 16:41
Apparently they improved the vampire melee of all vamps but believe it or not they have nerfed the Tyrant....his Ground slam is now slower to activate, I dont run this, but with threads created on how the Tyrant is at a disadvantage I was'nt expecting a nerf.

The reason for that was nerfing combos. That is to say, getting hit by charge results in getting hit by a ground slam with nothing you can do while in the charge stun. This is a good change, nerfing the combos such as this means the Tyrant can get some real buffs rather than relying on mechanics that were very effective against newer players that aren't as good at dodging charge.

Psyonix_Corey
25th Feb 2015, 17:01
We adjusted a single ability that was causing problems for low-to-mid skill players in unavoidable combos. That doesn't mean Tyrant won't be addressed in other ways for high MMR play. We can't do everything at once.

Please play with the new melee some before coming to conclusions.

ApollosBow
25th Feb 2015, 18:25
We adjusted a single ability that was causing problems for low-to-mid skill players in unavoidable combos. That doesn't mean Tyrant won't be addressed in other ways for high MMR play. We can't do everything at once.

Please play with the new melee some before coming to conclusions.

Keep up the good work Corey, new class is great, hes looks badass and makes for a very good teammate to have.

TheDreamcrusher
26th Feb 2015, 00:39
With the new melee in place, there has definitely been some life breathed into the tyrant. Being he is traditionally the slowest of the vampires, the lessened delay after melee strikes makes him feel much more capable already. I didn't get a chance to use Ground Slam today, just ran with my typical setup of Charge/Throw/Enrage/Bloodlust.

I still hope he gets the Telekinesis ability I mentioned in a previous post though. :P

Halpachino
26th Feb 2015, 01:42
We adjusted a single ability that was causing problems for low-to-mid skill players in unavoidable combos. That doesn't mean Tyrant won't be addressed in other ways for high MMR play. We can't do everything at once.

Please play with the new melee some before coming to conclusions.

Just out of curiosity what ways have you been thinking of addressing him for high play bar the obvious hit detection ?

Firehex
26th Feb 2015, 05:32
Telekinesis ability will be perfect ... He needs new play style or normal buff.

puff_ng
1st Mar 2015, 15:13
Just out of curiosity what ways have you been thinking of addressing him for high play bar the obvious hit detection ?

The Tyrant's barely viable in mid-level play right now. No one with working headphones gets consistently hit by the Charge -> Ground Slam -> Melee combo. That's like Christmas for the Tyrant player. Even if he lands it, a Hunter/Prophet team mate will Bola/Hex the Tyrant before he can finish the human off or at least deal significant damage.

Only people <lvl 15 group up together and get mass stunned and double/triple killed. I remember cause that's what happened to me. Then I learned to roll.

crutchie
2nd Mar 2015, 18:25
The Tyrant's barely viable in mid-level play right now. No one with working headphones gets consistently hit by the Charge -> Ground Slam -> Melee combo. That's like Christmas for the Tyrant player. Even if he lands it, a Hunter/Prophet team mate will Bola/Hex the Tyrant before he can finish the human off or at least deal significant damage.

Only people <lvl 15 group up together and get mass stunned and double/triple killed. I remember cause that's what happened to me. Then I learned to roll.

I connect quite a bit. All you got to do is wait for some sort of distraction and connect. It's not 100% but if it was where is the skill? In most pugs I still initiate cause hey why not? It wakes people up instead of everyone waiting for someone else to start. If I'm on Ventrillo I'll wait for a plan. It's still good to wait for choking haze, or a hell strike, without that your dead. I think that's balanced. The skill comes from when it feels right to go. starting a charge/jump from a mile away when everyone is waiting for it would be suicide. If it wasn't suicide people would be screaming for nerfs.

Instead of asking for extra abilities I would work on fixing what should be the vampires core on him, make him more of a brawler than a football player. His melee abilities are the worst of any vampire class while his abilities are the strongest. To be clear on what I say about his melee, he's too slow to attack roll like the other classes (melee, melee, roll, melee) . The only way I seem to be able to make him work is to run with berserk and get in a slug fest with who ever I'm soloing. However if I use an ability like ground slam, I win a good chunk of the time. The rotation turns into melee, melee ground slam melee, then jump away before I get focused. If we could make him more agile so you could roll and connect in a fight, it would feel a lot better. I use to main the deceiver till he hit level 25. It feels like you cannot miss with the deceiver especially with his charged attack hitting multiple people. You literally feel like Nightcrawler in Xmen 2 running through the Whitehouse. With the Tyrant you feel awkward and retarded when you constantly miss the hunter. The problem is that his hit points are too high to put him on par with the other characters. You could argue that this would still be balanced due to his lack of escape and large hit box.

Playing the tyrant still gives you a good sense of contribution, however it's hard to get on a roll with him. I normally play wingman style where literally your job is to eat grenades and cause a ruckus. I find he's hard to get a 1 kill per death ratio. With good team who jumps in together it helps. But generally I'm focused on first and my team cleans up while I'm waiting to respawn.

The main problem I have with him is getting out of a fight if it goes wrong. Reavers have the shadowstep, Summoners have shields minions etc (harder) Deceivers have shroud/illusions invisible Tyrants have to charge/jump away or ignore pain. The worst is when people start to get half way decent. You charge in, ignore pain, wait around and watch your teammates die then get focused on. Not fun. The other way is to play enraged. But this mode makes you literally a grenade. Where your gonna die unless all the humans die.

I think ignore pain should get worked on, though I don't know how. Any skill that locks out the ability to do things is a very gamey mechanic. While I'm not good at it, the vanguards blocking shield is far superior as it takes skill to block and hit back.

So yes he needs love and the recent melee changes are a big help. Take this from a scrub player who has put about 400 hours into the game but probably will never be in the high mmr bracket. He's still fun to play, but he can be the most frustrating as he's the easiest to shut down.