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Rolphy
31st Jan 2015, 16:39
Greetings Staff,

First i would like to thank you for your never ending continuous work and effort for providing us with such an amazing game like Nosgoth you really deserve it. :thumb::worship:


But there is something that is so irritating for most of the players (or myself at least) regarding the points division for kills and assists that i see and happen to me and others all the time.

The scenario goes like this i do most of the damage to an enemy :cool: and then a team member come and steal the kill from me then i get around 100-130 points (which i have no problem with) :whistle: and he gets 150+ points :mad2::mad2: for landing the last hit (see that's the problem). :eek:

This Points Division System is unfair, encourages on kill stealing and on creating conflicts between players :mad::mad::mad: .

My modest suggestion is >>> to adjust the point division system by The Damage Dealt instead, for instance: if X player does 800 damage and Y player does 200 [out of 1000 hp total] , X player earn 80% for his 800 damage (120 points out of 150) and Y player earn 20% for his 200 damage (30 points out of 150) .

Like this players wont wait for others to do most of the damage :friends: and land their last hit to steal the kill and even get more points for it.

What do you gamers think? ;) :)

That's it, waiting for a moderator's/staff reply and thanks in advance.

Ghosthree3
31st Jan 2015, 16:44
More points should be given for damage, but kills are important too, it is deathmatch. You could do 10,000 damage, but if all that damage was healed and didn't lead to kills then it was worthless. A kill furthers your chance to win directly.

IMO leave the points kills grant and instead slightly up the points damage grant.

Rolphy
31st Jan 2015, 16:53
Sure but not 150 points for just the last hit :nut: as u said at least increase the points damage grant and/or decrease the points kills grant :flowers: .

--Ram--
31st Jan 2015, 16:56
While sometimes this does bug me when I have a particularly unlucky game and score few kills while doubling the damage of players with higher kill counts, that is just how the cookie crumbles. Sometimes you snag a lot of killing blows and sometimes you miss them. I've also had people yell at me for taking 16 kills when they have dealt similar damage to me and only taken 5. I never do this intentionally but some games you just get lucky. In the end it evens out and if you do a lot of damage you will get a lot of kills/points.

I really don't think kill stealing is much of an issue in this game. Don't see it much, don't hear about it much, and to be honest there isn't that much value in getting a few hundred extra points. After 800 games played I can't really think of a time when I have noticed someone routinely waiting around not dealing damage just to time those killing blows.

Ghosthree3
31st Jan 2015, 17:03
Sure but not 150 points for just the last hit :nut: as u said at least increase the points damage grant and/or decrease the points kills grant :flowers: .

It's not 150, it's 100.


While sometimes this does bug me when I have a particularly unlucky game and score few kills while doubling the damage of players with higher kill counts, that is just how the cookie crumbles. Sometimes you snag a lot of killing blows and sometimes you miss them. I've also had people yell at me for taking 16 kills when they have dealt similar damage to me and only taken 5. I never do this intentionally but some games you just get lucky. In the end it evens out and if you do a lot of damage you will get a lot of kills/points.

I really don't think kill stealing is much of an issue in this game. Don't see it much, don't hear about it much, and to be honest there isn't that much value in getting a few hundred extra points. After 800 games played I can't really think of a time when I have noticed someone routinely waiting around not dealing damage just to time those killing blows.

I'd much rather someone seal a kill sooner than sit back and allow me to try to take it myself possibly taking more damage or dying.

Rolphy
31st Jan 2015, 18:13
I tell u something for me as mainly a tyrant i suffer from this a lot, if not kill stealing then its for the points assists grant, i play him a tank when we dont have one but i would always be low on score due to the points damage or assists grant...one of them must be raised.
100 not 150? ohh i have a 50% booster that's why :P

Phytik
31st Jan 2015, 19:00
wait a second... People really care for the score ?

--Ram--
31st Jan 2015, 19:35
I'd much rather someone seal a kill sooner than sit back and allow me to try to take it myself possibly taking more damage or dying.

Preaching to the choir.

PencileyePirate
31st Jan 2015, 19:41
Not sure what this guy is talking about; the scoring system makes perfect sense. You get variable points for any damage involved in an assist, full points for kills, and zero points for damage that doesn't contribute to a kill.

Also ... kill stealing does not exist in Nosgoth. This is a team game.

Obisher
31st Jan 2015, 19:41
If you care too much about being on the top of the scoreboards, you have a wrong mindset. This is a TEAM game. I won't lie, it is nice to see yourself as the top player of your team, but it's much more important to be a functional member of the team. Every member is doing their part. If you do 90% of damage to someone as a tyrant, then retreat and your teammate kills the guy, the whole team gets a point. You made them soft, your teammate(s) finished them off. It's called teamwork.

OK, there are some extreme examples where your "teammates" are waiting for you to get killed and then they jump in to finish the job. But most of the times your teammates are trying to help, but they happen to get the killing blow. And why should you be mad at them? Many times I survived only because my teammate "stole" my kill, because he was able to land a killing blow straight after my hit. And if I was alone, I would certainly get killed because I wouldn't have enough health/time to land the final hit. Or when you're simply out of range, but your teammate is closer and secures the kill.

In conclusion: It's a team game. Everybody does their part. One player weakens them, other player finishes them off. TEAMWORK. And last but not least... Stats are **** Stop caring about stats, and you will have much better time.

Ysanoire
31st Jan 2015, 20:40
My modest suggestion is >>> to adjust the point division system by The Damage Dealt instead, for instance: if X player does 800 damage and Y player does 200 [out of 1000 hp total] , X player earn 80% for his 800 damage (120 points out of 150) and Y player earn 20% for his 200 damage (30 points out of 150) .


It's already proportional to the damage dealth for assists. What you're suggesting will just take away points from the killer without giving more to the asisstant. No-one is WAITING for you to deal most of the damage, they're just shooting, and sometimes they land the killing blow. Sometimes it's because you've missed your shots.

Personally I'd just like to get a bit more xp for 1k damage. I know it's the kills that count, but sometimes you get those tough games where you deal 3k damage to get 1 kill on average, I'd like that to count more.

Not that xp is really something important to strive for, but for those times I'm levelling up a weapon I don't actually like I'd like it to go faster.

Psyonix_Corey
31st Jan 2015, 20:41
We've had internal discussions about modifying how kills and the scoreboard are presented and its impact, curious what you think.

Some team games have started priotizing concepts like "Takedowns" and splitting out Killing Blows as a tracked, but less important, stat.

So when an enemy dies, everyone who contributed gets TAKEDOWN +100, and killer gets KILLING BLOW +25 (could arguably even remove entirely).
Damage is still scored as it happens, so while you don't get scaled credit there, it adds up as you deal damage.

Your Scoreboard starts to look like
SCORE | TAKEDOWNS | DEATHS | DAMAGE | SUPPORT

The tricky part is that system can overvalue skills like Shadow Bomb, which grant "Assist" credit just for touching an enemy, so you have Reavers racking up massive takedown amounts relative to, say, a Tyrant who disrupted the hell out of the enemy, but only "hit" one of them. We could potentially credit all teammates in the vicinity of a killshot with a Takedown.

Ghosthree3
31st Jan 2015, 20:58
I think it'll become even harder to keep the scoreboard fair if you did that for reasons similar to what you listed in the final paragraph of your post. In my opinion don't change anything, grant less points for a kill that you dealt very little damage too, or, grant no points for the kill itself and instead have all players who contributed to the kill get the kill assist points they do now including the killer.

BalaGi
31st Jan 2015, 21:45
Why not make it easier? So, currently you get X points for X% damage and 100 points for kill regardless for damage. It is possible to simply leave X for X% but give some extra points for last hit (finishing job is important, right?), like 30-50 points for example. So, if you did a kill alone, you get 150 points, but if someone "steal" (can't believe that you care about it SO much), damage dealer receives ~80-90 points, and killer receives ~60. Seems less unfair for me.


...relative to, say, a Tyrant who disrupted the hell out of the enemy, but only "hit" one of them. We could potentially credit all teammates in the vicinity of a killshot with a Takedown.
How should be count if i distract enemies by random moving around them? :D I mean, you cannot consider everything, can you?

zzott93
31st Jan 2015, 23:28
Good thread, I was going to make a similar thread just now.

I don't think you should get that many points for just a kill. It makes people focus on fragging and getting last hits, rather than doing damage to a proper or urgent target. I've been killed by too many tyrants when people were chasing a weak sentinel, I'm sure you guys have seen this happen too. It shouldn't matter who got the kill, since it's for the entire teams score.

This would also eliminate the whidespread phenomena of scouts running swiftbow and trap, staying far back from their team while letting the others die in the process of doing damage, and only taking last hits on the enemies. No volley for them to fight in, no damage dealt to important targets.
The trap is a poorly designed item for a game that should be promoting teamplay.

The problem is that these "egocentric" players leave their team with a disadvantage while staying safe, taking less damage and getting far more kills and a bigger score than the rest - enforcing the belief that they are in fact much better than the rest. It's a big issue on public games. Please do something about this.

Rolphy
1st Feb 2015, 10:33
@Psyonix_Corey

That's brilliant to modify how kills and the scoreboard are presented what a relief :D
If i understand right, i have a a suggestion maybe u can grant SUPPORT points for using abilities that does not do damage and/or help team mates like ''Sacrifice'' or ''Eldritch Guard'' for prophets and ''Shadow Bomb'' for reavers if an enemy is killed.
By doing so there will be no interference between TAKEDOWNS and SUPPORT as TAKEDOWNS for contributing damage to enemies and SUPPORT for helping team mates.
Cheers! :thumb: ;)

Rolphy
1st Feb 2015, 10:46
That's what im talkin about zzott93 i really feel u, couldn't agree more :cheek:

Rolphy
1st Feb 2015, 16:58
@Psyonix_Corey

May i Ask when will these scoreboard adjustments take place? or an estimation time of release?

Thanks,

Rolphy
3rd Feb 2015, 10:31
May i get a reply please???

When will these scoreboard adjustments take place or when will it be released?

Ysanoire
3rd Feb 2015, 10:45
He just said they talked about it, there won't be a release date.

Vampmaster
3rd Feb 2015, 11:14
Two things I've noticed are that damage absorbed by eldritch shield does not provide any XP. It should be treated similarly to healing. Also, vampires don't get any bonus XP in flashpoint. Humans get XP for captures, so maybe vampires should get XP for either the number of unlit dots (top of screen) at the end of the match, or periodically when humans go for a certain time without capturing.