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View Full Version : BOTH FACTIONS Nosgoth and why i see this game is broken



SethSamson
17th Jan 2015, 15:01
Frist
Logic .. or lack of it

Little thin woman Alchemist 1050 hp ... Big %$$ 1 pound Tyrant 1350 hp .. so only 300 hp come on .. where is the logic in that .. if Human have that amount of HP .. then Tyrant should have like 1800 or 2100 hp ..

Speed ..
Humans are too fast in comparison to Vamps ...

Unbalanced Classes
Reaver is OP ...
Tyrant is broken .. he is like Tank made from cardboard box ... he jumps i swing he is dead or he runs away sad with tomake

Lack of some Functions ...
ALL Vamps classes should have Crouch ( Ctrl ) that would speed up the regen .. and it would look AWESOME as Tyrant for example would be able to take a knee on the ledge of building looking for is prey and then jump

Cooldowns ..
Humans have their ranged weapons ... + cooldown skills
Vampires have only their claws ... so they depend on their cooldown skills which at the moment are way too long ..

Aiming
Humans have crosshair ..
Vamps are swinging blind .. so they should have some kinda look target with cool vampire animation that they would see the heartbeat and the blood running in human veins ... or have wider swing dmg that would hit multiple targets

ps. there are soooo many things that are broken in this game and soooo many ideas to fix them .. i hope that Devs will finally implement them and fix what is broken

FireWorks_
17th Jan 2015, 15:34
The basic concept of the game is the Range vs Melee principle. Vampires' challenge is to get close avoiding the ranged abilities of the humans. This is further extended by the humans' higher damage and the evasive abilities of the vampires that makes leads to a) hit n' run and b) coordinated team attack. Means if you go in solo as vamp, all 4 humans will melt you in no time.

I like this concept a lot and it is definitly not broken. However it takes a different approach than just run in blindly and expect to destroy everything. The game is designed with relative equally strong factions, but each in their own way.

Act accordingly ;)

Where your strike a point though is the crosshair for vampires. The devs allowed to use 3rd party crosshairs which makes abilities like dominate mind of the deceiver so much easier to use and defies downsides of no aim assist in the savage pounce. New players will also benefit a lot from it in aiming each melee strike.

--Ram--
17th Jan 2015, 15:57
Frist
Logic .. or lack of it

Little thin woman Alchemist 1050 hp ... Big %$$ 1 pound Tyrant 1350 hp .. so only 300 hp come on .. where is the logic in that .. if Human have that amount of HP .. then Tyrant should have like 1800 or 2100 hp ..

Speed ..
Humans are too fast in comparison to Vamps ...

Unbalanced Classes
Reaver is OP ...
Tyrant is broken .. he is like Tank made from cardboard box ... he jumps i swing he is dead or he runs away sad with tomake

Lack of some Functions ...
ALL Vamps classes should have Crouch ( Ctrl ) that would speed up the regen .. and it would look AWESOME as Tyrant for example would be able to take a knee on the ledge of building looking for is prey and then jump

Cooldowns ..
Humans have their ranged weapons ... + cooldown skills
Vampires have only their claws ... so they depend on their cooldown skills which at the moment are way too long ..

Aiming
Humans have crosshair ..
Vamps are swinging blind .. so they should have some kinda look target with cool vampire animation that they would see the heartbeat and the blood running in human veins ... or have wider swing dmg that would hit multiple targets

ps. there are soooo many things that are broken in this game and soooo many ideas to fix them .. i hope that Devs will finally implement them and fix what is broken

agree humans feel too fast until you learn to move by alternating swipe and roll, then it's fine (albeit a little silly)

Tyrant is a good class but don't expect to "tank", the game doesn't work that way unless the human team is clueless. There will always be tweaks to be made for balance but overall it's not in a bad place.

BalaGi
17th Jan 2015, 18:19
Little thin woman Alchemist 1050 hp ... Big %$$ 1 pound Tyrant 1350 hp .. so only 300 hp come on .. where is the logic in that .. if Human have that amount of HP .. then Tyrant should have like 1800 or 2100 hp ..
If vampires get x10 hp (like 13000 hp tyrants) but humans get x10 weapon and skills damage, then you'll be happier?


Aiming
Humans have crosshair ..
Vamps are swinging blind ..

Can agree, aiming for reaver is hard, why there's no crosshair? Like i should make point on my screen with a marker :)

About other things, its all about balance, like faster vamps give no chance to humans, or shorter cooldowns on vamps abilities lead to spam with them. Also can agree that vamps should be able to crouch.

Rago600
17th Jan 2015, 20:08
No need to get impolite,

@OP
How long do you Play this Game ?

Khalith
17th Jan 2015, 20:26
Speed ..
Humans are too fast in comparison to Vamps ...

Not if the vampires are using the melee roll cancel glitch.


Reaver is OP ...

Fair enough, it is.


Tyrant is broken .. he is like Tank made from cardboard box ... he jumps i swing he is dead or he runs away sad with tomake

I agree hit and run on a tyrant doesn't "feel" right. But it's the only strat right now, human dps is still too high.


ALL Vamps classes should have Crouch ( Ctrl )

I think both sides should have a crouch.


Cooldowns ..
Humans have their ranged weapons ... + cooldown skills
Vampires have only their claws ... so they depend on their cooldown skills which at the moment are way too long ..

I agree it does create a weird situation. Hit and run with vampires burning their cooldowns and hiding vs humans blowing all their cooldowns and either killing the vampires with their higher dps or driving them off.


Aiming
Humans have crosshair ..
Vamps are swinging blind ..

Agree on crosshair for vamp.

BalaGi
17th Jan 2015, 20:38
Not if the vampires are using the melee roll cancel glitch.

agree humans feel too fast until you learn to move by alternating swipe and roll, then it's fine (albeit a little silly)
It's a cancer glitch that should be removed as fast as possible. I "like" how you're advising to use this to new players. It's just like movement bug in quake 3 that even created a ****** cult (i talk about strafe jump/bunny hopping). That shouldn't be in game, it looks stupid, it ruins developers idea about what speed should be. If vamps should be faster, just do it, but, please, there's nothing good to "legalise" bugs.

Khalith
17th Jan 2015, 23:00
It's a cancer glitch that should be removed as fast as possible. I "like" how you're advising to use this to new players. It's just like movement bug in quake 3 that even created a ****** cult (i talk about strafe jump/bunny hopping). That shouldn't be in game, it looks stupid, it ruins developers idea about what speed should be. If vamps should be faster, just do it, but, please, there's nothing good to "legalise" bugs.

You're completely right. But in the current meta it's foolish not to take advantage of it.

FireWorks_
17th Jan 2015, 23:47
It's a cancer glitch that should be removed as fast as possible. I "like" how you're advising to use this to new players. It's just like movement bug in quake 3 that even created a ****** cult (i talk about strafe jump/bunny hopping). That shouldn't be in game, it looks stupid, it ruins developers idea about what speed should be. If vamps should be faster, just do it, but, please, there's nothing good to "legalise" bugs.

Dont talk that way about my strafe jumping! It is a skillful art that takes a lot of effort to master and can add a lot of depth and complexity to games. Aim is not the only skill... Movement can be an even bigger one.

PencileyePirate
17th Jan 2015, 23:59
Just wanted to chime in ... reaver is definitely NOT op. He used to be but now is pretty mediocre. Please stop with these asinine claims before Psyonix ruins him even more.


It's just like movement bug in quake 3 that even created a ****** cult (i talk about strafe jump/bunny hopping). That shouldn't be in game, it looks stupid, it ruins developers idea about what speed should be. If vamps should be faster, just do it, but, please, there's nothing good to "legalise" bugs.

Strafe-jumping is a bug that appeared in Q1, NOT Q3. The fact that it has remained in the series as an integral part of movement for so many years shows just how wrong you are. Sometimes bugs turn into good gameplay mechanics (and this is one of them.)

Squigiligimous
18th Jan 2015, 00:18
Just wanted to chime in ... reaver is definitely NOT op. He used to be but now is pretty mediocre. Please stop with these asinine claims before Psyonix ruins him even more.



Strafe-jumping is a bug that appeared in Q1, NOT Q3. The fact that it has remained in the series as an integral part of movement for so many years shows just how wrong you are. Sometimes bugs turn into good gameplay mechanics (and this is one of them.)

while most of the initial posters feedback is uh... questionable. I agree with the speed one as for the roll cancel speed bug being a good one I disagree. The fact that this bug is both tedious and even more probably just done by macro by the experienced players is a bad sign. Just fix it and either buff vampire speed if that's the intent or allow a well equipped sprinter to flee.

PencileyePirate
18th Jan 2015, 01:37
while most of the initial posters feedback is uh... questionable. I agree with the speed one as for the roll cancel speed bug being a good one I disagree. The fact that this bug is both tedious and even more probably just done by macro by the experienced players is a bad sign. Just fix it and either buff vampire speed if that's the intent or allow a well equipped sprinter to flee.

My second paragraph was mostly talking about strafe-jumping in Quake. It was a really bad analogy. I'd be okay with the attack-dodge speed boost being removed from Nosgoth so long as base vampire movement speed is increased accordingly. However I do think that cancelling attacks w/ dodge should stay; knowing when to cancel an attack and instead dodge away is an important skill.

--Ram--
18th Jan 2015, 03:34
while most of the initial posters feedback is uh... questionable. I agree with the speed one as for the roll cancel speed bug being a good one I disagree. The fact that this bug is both tedious and even more probably just done by macro by the experienced players is a bad sign. Just fix it and either buff vampire speed if that's the intent or allow a well equipped sprinter to flee.

What on earth makes you think anyone would need a macro for this? Allowing humans to flee at will would break the game.



Strafe-jumping is a bug that appeared in Q1, NOT Q3. The fact that it has remained in the series as an integral part of movement for so many years shows just how wrong you are. Sometimes bugs turn into good gameplay mechanics (and this is one of them.)

Exactly this. Strafe and circle jumping remained in quake because both the devs and the players liked the mechanic. I'm not going to claim that swipe-roll should remain, but it doesn't hurt the game much. Some people are massively overreacting suggesting that it is "cancer" etc. New players with a brain or who do any kind of research to learn the game will pick up on it very quickly. Other than that it only really offends the slightly precious people who feel immersion or aesthetics are ruined by it. Taking it out of the game is possibly tricky, since slowing down the ability to roll after a swipe would create clunkier movement in combat. I never liked initially the way movement and attacks are one and the same, but that design decision basically led to this. So be it.

Vamps having a crosshair seems like it would please many people, I'm sure this is something that would not be overly hard to introduce so will likely make it in at some point. That said this game doesn't require a great deal of precision with swipes (unless using the slippery dip banana split tyrant charge attacks), personally I've never felt the need.

Lol at the reaver OP bandwagon 2.0

BalaGi
18th Jan 2015, 11:32
Haha, cultists, after 16 years of mastering youself in bugs, it's hard to understand. That's the reason why melee roll cancer glitch should be removed faster.
Just kiddin. Strafe jump in quake may be fine, but there's difference. Quake 3 is only a competitive game, Nosgoth have it's own aesthetics, so it's my mistake to compare game (Noshoth) and "r_picmip 6" esports discipline with no soul.
Sorry for being emotional though.

Rago600
18th Jan 2015, 12:06
Haha, cultists, after 16 years of mastering youself in bugs, it's hard to understand. That's the reason why melee roll cancer glitch should be removed faster.
Just kiddin. Strafe jump in quake may be fine, but there's difference. Quake 3 is only a competitive game, Nosgoth have it's own aesthetics, so it's my mistake to compare game (Noshoth) and "r_picmip 6" esports discipline with no soul.
Sorry for being emotional though.

Beware of the ADMIN :D

I would love to see more movement in Nosgoth.
More Dodging , more movements, more skill !

But anyone has his own way.