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View Full Version : ive read the guides, still asking for help



absinthesize
18th Dec 2014, 20:58
on key points. i understand and am working on basic things.

1:traversing the map as a vampire so as to maintain sight of the enemy while not exposing myself to there fire.

1A:i actually started this game as tyrant doing this cuz i knew his size would make him a easy target...so i actually decided NOT to wall climb and isntead use passageways/doors

2:trying to attack humans as a group as opposed to trying to go in alone

2A:This is very reliant on having teamates that know what they are doing. so it doesnt always work out...but thats not a complaint of the game really

3:staying with the group as humans but not staying on top of eachother

3A: again this is easy enough for me, but other players seem to want to run WAY too far away from the group, making it impossible to cover them

4:covering teamates
4A: i have this down as well tho i find many players will just stand there and watch you get mauled....

5:changing class/loadout that suites the party/moments need
5A:i dont have many skills to change yet (level 15) but i do understand it. does the enemy have a lot of sentinels? go scout, lot of tyrants? go alchemist, tho im not really certain what hard counters (if anything) prophet/hunter/deceiver/reaver. Also vice versa for the ones i listed.

Now what im having trouble with, more then anything, is specific scenarios where humans have a good spot to stick to. like near the docks, or near the bridge, etc...where there is a good amount of open space.

I CANNOT find a good way to approach them without being torn to shreds before i engage.

Anything else i feel i lack i also feel i can work on, but this, im at a loss.

Persiphas
18th Dec 2014, 22:03
The idea is to MAKE them move. Use Reaver and get Choking Haze. Problem solved (thats one of the reasons why 3 Reaver 1 Tyrant seems to be meta...). An alternative would also be Sentinels bomb skill. As a Tyrant it is suicide to initiate with a non-premade team (you'll pop like a ripe fruit before you even reach the humans + most non-premades will stay in their hideout and watch you die, then go in alone and also die), so it would be your job to charge/jump in at the moment the humans dodge the Choking Hazes (thats how most players I see do the initiate). It is important to keep in mind that Tyrant CAN protect his fellow vampires, but this is very situational. Don't think of him as a tank (the official description is highly misleading), he is more like a brawler/interruptor guy (he crowd-controls his enemies mid-fight, so that his teammates can do the kills).


(Please note that everbody has a different playstyle, but this is roughly how it works)

absinthesize
18th Dec 2014, 22:40
hmm so thats why everyone likes reaver, best at flushing.

ill have to invest towards choking bomb maybe, i just have the roundhouse kick with him righ tnow

GenFeelGood
18th Dec 2014, 22:50
For Tyrant I jump in, pop stone skin as I escape, and jump back in with shockwave once they stop focusing on me. From there I either press the attack or retreat again. This is how I use the Tyrant in a hit & run style; and often aids my team in giving them an opening to move in as I am shot at.

Passarbye
19th Dec 2014, 18:02
hmm so thats why everyone likes reaver, best at flushing.

ill have to invest towards choking bomb maybe, i just have the roundhouse kick with him righ tnow

Just note that with choking haze they can see through the smoke, whereas with shadow bomb they can't see through it.

Shutenti
20th Dec 2014, 12:42
2:trying to attack humans as a group as opposed to trying to go in alone

2A:This is very reliant on having teamates that know what they are doing. so it doesnt always work out...but thats not a complaint of the game really

The easiest solution to this in pubs is to either talk about it in team chat or get in position and wait for one other team member to engage. When they go, go with them. That way at least two of you will be going in together, preferably from different directions!


Now what im having trouble with, more then anything, is specific scenarios where humans have a good spot to stick to. like near the docks, or near the bridge, etc...where there is a good amount of open space.

I CANNOT find a good way to approach them without being torn to shreds before i engage.

The Sommerdamm bridge notoriously favours humans and I think Corey said they were going to look at subtle changes to address that. However, in general closing (or maintaining) the gap is where much of the teamwork in Nosgoth comes from.

The general technique used most often in competitions is to have reavers throw in a smoke or two. The goal isn't to land them on a human but to use them to split the human team up so that they cannot all focus fire on the ones being attacked. You can't shoot what you can't see. Then the rest of the team focuses on the player(s) visually cut off first.

At level 15 you'll be lucky to be playing with other people who even attack together, much less can pull off some kind of coordinated assault in a public server. On the bright side, the humans also probably aren't very good either. Just improving your approach and timing will probably help here.

For example, on Sommerdamm as a Sentinel you can often stand on the large outcrop of rubble behind the human team on the bridge and directly above the favourite Scout spot without being noticed. From here I would wait until another teammate engages and then immediately swoop down and e.g. pick off the scout before he has a chance to set up a volley to support his team.

As a deceiver you can usually close the gap while invisible without being noticed even on maps like Sommerdamm; the trick is to time is such that your team starts the fight before you become visible and not after the human team has killed you for backstabbing their scout.

I don't play much Tyrant but charge followed by a CC or ignore pain and running around blocking human line of sight is a very common way to break the ice and disrupt a human team's cohesion across even quite large distances. You should always start your charge from out of sight so that you're already charging by the time the humans see you. An alternative is to use marathon and charge straight through the human position and out the other side, then come back and reengage while they are distracted fighting the teammates who hopefully followed you in.

So there are options for closing even large distances. In general they revolve around smoke bombs, timing and misdirection/attention control.

If you happen to be playing against me then ignore all of his advice and jump in as a Tyrant with Leap. I LOVE warbowing those juicy little cherubs to the ground then sticking a bunch of knives in them when they try to CC :-)