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Berr
13th Jul 2013, 14:24
I've played through Deus Ex: The Fall to the end and then through again in New Game Plus mode, and I really enjoyed it.

While playing though there were a few places where I thought it could be better with a small tweak, I've started this thread to list my own such ideas and for anyone else who has played it to chime in. (Please only comment if you've actually played it, asking them to port it to another platform is not a small tweak!).

Hacking:
-The node interaction radial menu should be a bit bigger to make choosing the option you want easier on a touch screen
-At the moment interaction with nodes requires two screen presses - one to bring up the radial menu, and again to make a selection. I imagined on an iPad it could be done with one touch-swipe, where you touch the node to bring up the menu, then swipe in the direction of the action you'd like to trigger and release to trigger it. This would allow much smoother interaction during hacking.
-There should be a 'panic button' for the Stop virus - a button in the hacking overlay (non-scrolling area) that can be easily hit to trigger a Stop virus - maybe right next to the countdown timer to getting traced? It's weird and not intuitive to have to choose a node to trigger a Stop virus, since its effect is not relative to a particular node.

'items inside' screen - when foraging inside drawers and bins:
-'Take all' and 'close' buttons should be larger and maybe closer to bottom corners for easy selecting on touch screen
-tapping anywhere outside of the defined buttons (items, 'take all' or 'close') should be the same as clicking close

Story events issues:

-The ambush by gang members while talking to the weapons dealer in the train station toilets seems broken as they never actually come near the bathrooms, and they all congregate around the exits of the two ventilation ducts from the bathrooms, making the ducts completely pointless as that is the only fight in the station. The only choices to pass them would appear to be to gun them down or just power up invisibility and run right past them.
-...And since I was playing stealth, if you run right past them, they remain in the station and aggressive to the player for the rest of the game, even once the weapons dealer has moved to his later meeting place. This is extra weird because there is no in-game reason for them to be aggressive to the player even in the first place, and definitely not by late game - who are you to them? You're not the weapons dealer who they are supposedly hunting.
-It really seems like the storyline about Ben urgently needing some Nu-poz or Riezene for himself just fades away .. in one playthrough I took Riezene from the slums doctor and nothing happened beyond the doctor at LIMB being worried, and in the other I didn't take Riezene, and then the LIMB doctor didn't even give me some Nu-poz at any time in my missions with her, and Ben just never got any more withdrawal dizziness etc. I guess there is supposed to more to this future content, or else something got cut?
-At the start of the final infiltration of the hotel (the dash to the roof), the greeting by hotel security in the hotel lobby feels like a weirdly forced confrontation. There is no alternate entrance to the hotel, secret tunnel (vents) past the guards, just 3 guys staring straight at you who will start shooting if you walk forwards. The only way past I can see is the hilarious 'fast dash' aug (which is basically line-of-sight teleport), stealth run past them all, or shoot them all in the face. This feels so out of place because a) it's forced confrontation, and b) they're the closest thing to good guys in the game, I really don't want to shoot them! I thought for sure there would at least be a pheromones dialog option to get them to stand down in the lobby area.
-Also the guards in the XNG lobby seem weirdly trigger-happy. It's supposed to a publicly accessible lobby that is a covert entrance hiding the Belltower base, and yet if you step over an invisible line in the lobby - into a couch and bathrooms area no less! - they draw guns and try to kill you. Uhhh ... ok, unexpected.


World building:
-I was really glad to see that flavor e-books and novelty emails made the feature list, they're a big part of the enjoyment for me. I wish there had been just a few more novelty emails though, and I miss the hilarious 'hearts of steel' romance novel snippets that were in DXHR. I hope you can add some funny in-game novels in the next installment!

Save system:
I found the single-save system to be very poor, in conjunction with the auto-save on map change it almost trashed my stealth playthrough on me by auto-saving in a transition into a deadly firefight. (What happened was I stealth snuck through the drug den not even taking out guards on into the drug lab, then on my way back out the guard positions were such that immediately on map load of the drug den several gang members were looking right at me and started shooting). The game badly needs an extra save option like maybe to keep one extra fall-back save to return to if you last save gets broken. Or maybe make an option for the auto-save on map change to actually save pre-map-transition. Of course, at least a couple of real savegame slots would also be most welcome. To anyone playing DXTF as stealth, not taking out all enemies as you proceed, I would strongly recommend you disable auto-save at the moment.



I'm not sure if this was the right place for this feedback, but I couldn't think of anywhere better. I hope this thread finds its way in front of Eidos Montreal or N-Fusion developers who worked on the 'The Fall'. Thanks for your effort, I loved the game! (Otherwise I wouldn't go the effort of this monster post ;) )

WebScud
13th Jul 2013, 15:10
Did you ever figure out a way to back out of a zoomed weapon without firing?

Berr
13th Jul 2013, 15:37
WebScud: Yeah good question! I managed to do it once by .. swiping down .. or something. I couldn't figure out how to replicate it later. I definitely would +1 to make it easier to do this.

WebScud
13th Jul 2013, 16:35
WebScud: Yeah good question! I managed to do it once by .. swiping down .. or something. I couldn't figure out how to replicate it later. I definitely would +1 to make it easier to do this.

Ah. I'll have to give that a shot.

How are you doing on the hidden achievements? I'm still missing "Hard Times" and "Boy Scout" -- any idea what the requirements for those are? Did you find a good spot to pull off "Smashing Entrance?"

AlexOfSpades
13th Jul 2013, 17:27
Boy Scout is likely related to Barrett. I speculate.

Berr
14th Jul 2013, 03:26
Regarding the hidden achievements, I don't have Hard Times or Boy Scout either sorry. May as well start a list here though, here is what I have so far, you can fill in any you have too:


Hard Times: ???

Bargain Hunter: ???

Spilling the Beans: You tricked the Skulls leader Diego into exposing where he is getting his Riezene!
- I think you may need the Social Analyzer augmentation to do this, carefully choose your answers with Diego and use Pheromones when you get to the end of the conversation and are trying to force the supplier information out of him.

Boy Scout: ???

Piss Off Barrett: You challenged Barrett's criticism for sparing Kontarsky and he wasn't too happy about it.
- Capture rather than kill Kontarsky, then confront Barrett in his room on the plane.


Also for smashing entrance, a good place to do that is
right at the end of the Garage level. When you have cleared the last room stealthily, going out the garage door you'll face the sentry gun, but there is also a breakable wall that will get you out behind the truck, and there is a guard permanently leaning against that wall perfect for the wall-break takedown.

WebScud
14th Jul 2013, 04:12
Bargain Hunter: You sly dog! You convinced Alvarez Araujo to give you a LIMB card for free.

I earned this one on my second playthrough by using the social enhancer and pheromones.

Casshern
14th Jul 2013, 09:45
Berr, I do agree with you 100%,

And for the record I have played all the Deus Ex games,

At a time Deus Ex was for me the "pinnacle of pc gaming" but as the years went on and i grew up, my perspective changed a bit and went from pinnacle of pc gaming to old favourite, I did finish DEus Ex 10 pr 12 times.

Played Invisible war when it came out (that game in the series for me was an insult!!!)

Deus Ex Hr ? I liked, a lot!!!! yes it has its flaws but still a terrific game!

now we come to the fall, "Outrage a tablet game for those casual game noobs ! burn them! "(sarcasm rant off)

There is a complaint I'd like to make though : you can't resell items you have acquired and that sucks.

I actually like this game, and for those who will flame on, everybody has a right to express his/her opinions, I do understand that die hard fans will feel insulted, but that's a point to direct to EM/Squeenix

Feel free to discuss but keep it civil

Thanks

AdamK
15th Jul 2013, 18:54
Thanks a lot for the constructive feedback Berr, hacking bits are especially interesting and I'd love to see them in the game.

As for 'story bits', I'm pretty sure there is a way to avoid confrontations in most of the mentioned situations, even without stealth.
3 things you should check out:
On the train station, you should be able to leave via vent in opposite bathroom and go around the room cover to cover (or carefully avoid enemies while moving to the left).
As for XNG, the office is closed at that moment so you're instructed to back away by the guards, you can talk to reception lady without problems though. However, if you have your gun out and this gets seen by camera, or if you push too far, things might get ugly. I suggest going to the bathroom
In the hotel, I'm pretty confident you can move to the bathroom on the left and avoid enemies by using vents.

Berr
15th Jul 2013, 23:00
Thanks a lot for the constructive feedback Berr, hacking bits are especially interesting and I'd love to see them in the game.
Cool those ones get a +1 :) Are you reading this Eidos? Super-easy to implement improvements, could easily be added to the game!


As for 'story bits', I'm pretty sure there is a way to avoid confrontations in most of the mentioned situations, even without stealth.
3 things you should check out: (snip)

Thanks for the tips!

For XNG and the final hotel lobby, thanks I think I can imagine a path to follow without them starting to shoot now. I think I just struggle to identify the 'invisible line' that they'll start shooting if you cross. It's so unclear, since they start saying things about 'go away' almost as soon as they see you, there is not much to go on as to which direction you can safely step before they will go into 'murder mode' :P

For the train station, yeah I found all the ducts to be sure, I scouted the place thoroughly before the confrontation. But the vent from opposite bathroom opens out right into of the pack of gang members - there is one patrolling who is looking right at that vent half the time. And all the guards are right on top of each other, I really can't imagine taking down any of the guards without the others seeing and going hostile. Did you actually get through without them turning hostile?

AdamK
16th Jul 2013, 00:05
@Berr
XNG - going through the bathroom should be fine. Train station - I did manage to navigate around enemies by using the vent in the 2nd bathroom. I might have used stealth takedown though, it was a couple weeks ago (Eidos might not read this, but SEE defenitely is ;))
Thanks again!

Berr
16th Jul 2013, 13:59
@Berr
Eidos might not read this, but SEE defenitely is ;)
Thanks again!

Awesome! Really glad to know you guys are seeing this :) Love your work guys, must be fun pushing the envelope on mobile games like this :wave:

Now I'll just cross my fingers that someone over there is authorised to respond to my question in the other thread about (roughly) how & when the next chapter of DXTF will arrive.

HERESY
16th Jul 2013, 19:36
This thread deserves a :thumb:

TheYouthCounselor
29th Jul 2013, 09:51
I've played through Deus Ex: The Fall to the end and then through again in New Game Plus mode, and I really enjoyed it.

While playing though there were a few places where I thought it could be better with a small tweak, I've started this thread to list my own such ideas and for anyone else who has played it to chime in. (Please only comment if you've actually played it, asking them to port it to another platform is not a small tweak!).

Hacking:
-The node interaction radial menu should be a bit bigger to make choosing the option you want easier on a touch screen
-At the moment interaction with nodes requires two screen presses - one to bring up the radial menu, and again to make a selection. I imagined on an iPad it could be done with one touch-swipe, where you touch the node to bring up the menu, then swipe in the direction of the action you'd like to trigger and release to trigger it. This would allow much smoother interaction during hacking.

+1 Level Up!

I agree with everything you said, but I bolded the statement that rang the most for me. Even after learning how to play the hacking minigame properly on a touch screen, I still kept doing what you suggested because it felt more natural.