PDA

View Full Version : Square Enix is either fixing their development problems



Shralla
27th May 2013, 18:56
or screwing us over.

http://www.joystiq.com/2013/05/27/square-enixs-three-initiatives-to-reform-its-aaa-business


And, finally, it will overhaul large-scale, long-term development to increase asset turnover (i.e. get games out the door).

Sure sounds like yearly iterations by way of over-inflated development teams to me!

Ashpolt
27th May 2013, 23:02
"We're no longer in an age where customers are left in the dark until a product is completed," said Matsuda. "We need to shift to a business model where we frequently interact with our customers for our products that are in development and/or prior to being sold, have our customers understand games under development, and finally make sure we develop games that meet their expectations."

This quote is so very, very amusing given the history of this forum. "We learned from the mistakes of the DXHR forum...." :lol: Still, any positive change in the future will be welcomed!

nomotog
28th May 2013, 00:30
Well doing yearly installments might be better then there current plan of announcing games and then not releasing them.

Tverdyj
28th May 2013, 00:35
The focus on mobile and tablet market isn't reassuring. Too many publishers are trying this and failing (RIP, THQ). I'd hate Squeeenix to fail. I want to see the end of the Legacy of Kain, dammit.

CyberP
28th May 2013, 01:00
Just make good games goddamn it!? I love most of the Square classics, I love most of the eidos classics. Most have now been butchered. Tomb Raider? Sub-par. Final Fantasy? Sub-Par. Hitman? Sub-par. Thief? Extremely likely to be sub-par. Good thing EA held the rights to System Shock 2 and not Eidos/SE otherwise.... At least EA left it alone (Likely only because of it's initial mystifying poor sales and shared rights).

The only good game I've seen published by Square-Enix since Final Fantasy XII (7 years ago, which was good, nothing special) is Deus Ex: Human Revolution. I dislike the final product for not living up but I cannot deny it is a good (though seriously flawed) game and that it entertains me.

Just give us good games. Look to all the classics' design as a firmly established model and expand on it.

Also lol at all the FF7 fanboys begging for their remake. Sure it would probably rake in the money but I don't want a remake, it's perfect as it is. I'd like a new FF game that's actually good. Or just any game that's actually good! DX4 better be good!

ZakKa89
28th May 2013, 09:33
Please Squeenix don't fail. You published the great DEHR after all!

Reven
28th May 2013, 15:51
Many good points have been raised already but also of note is that Square is just behind the times. No longer are they the big third party developer they were in the Playstation era. And even as a RPG developer they have been surpassed by Namco Bandai and Atlus (of persona fame) in the sheer amount of time it takes them to put one game out the door, one game that then fails to ignite the gaming media and gamers in general while the new tales games make people beg for euro and north American releases.

As for their affiliate releases they are either good (DXHR) series damaging (Hitman) lackluster and arguably series damaging as well (Tomb raider) forgettable (dungeon siege 3) and awful in the form of Ghost hack. And I can't say honestly say that I am looking forward to Thief either.

The whole of Square Enix needs to reform from the ground up and do a Hideo kojima (San !) by getting a damn clue.

Ilves
28th May 2013, 17:32
Maybe SE should make the 8 bit HR happen if they're really after a quick buck, nudge nudge.

Shralla
28th May 2013, 17:59
As for their affiliate releases they are either good (DXHR) series damaging (Hitman) lackluster and arguably series damaging as well (Tomb raider) forgettable (dungeon siege 3) and awful in the form of Ghost hack. And I can't say honestly say that I am looking forward to Thief either.

DXHR was still series damaging, don't fool yourself. Regardless of how "series damaging" or "lackluster" those games may have been, DXHR, Hitman, and Tomb Raider all sold well and were well received by the gaming media and public.

They're probably wondering why they're taking four years to make a game that gets 8s across the board when other companies pump out a game every year or every other year and get 9.5 every time. Of course, they might not understand the tried and true American tradition of money hats for reviewers, so this whole effort might just be misguided, because it's not like Call of Duty is actually better than any of those games.

ZakKa89
28th May 2013, 20:36
The thing that really REALLY bugs me is Sleeping Dogs. Marketing was terrible, the temporary cancellation didn't help and the trailers made the game look very ugly. Obviously, it underperformed. I also don't understand the 8/10's the game got.

Can't speak for consoles, but the end product on pc was GREAT.

nomotog
29th May 2013, 01:33
The thing that really REALLY bugs me is Sleeping Dogs. Marketing was terrible, the temporary cancellation didn't help and the trailers made the game look very ugly. Obviously, it underperformed. I also don't understand the 8/10's the game got.

Can't speak for consoles, but the end product on pc was GREAT.

It was nice. I enjoyed the callback to old style sand box put everything in it gameplay, but it wasn't GREAT in my box.

HERESY
29th May 2013, 03:18
This was taken from one of the comments in the link and I agree with it:


Also, they need to hire someone with a vision and the confidence to push that vision forward. Don't hire idiots who have no ideas and thus their best plan is to "listen to our fans". Fans don't know jack **** what they want and entrusting your future to them will be the biggest downfall.

El_Bel
29th May 2013, 13:56
Yeah funs are stupid. Oh wait.

http://playthroughline.com/2011/09/18/short-script-deus-ex-human-revolution/

Yeah, the script by that woman Mary Demarle, about some dude, searching for his ex, who clearly doesn't want him anymore, while ignoring a global conspiracy and as a last minute climax, she threw the threat of augmented zombies at us and the world, is clearly superior.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPpAdh06FVU

Also it's usually a bad thing if the tie in book is more exciting then the main game. So yeah, fans where right all along and DeMarle shouldn't work on any game again ever.

CyberP
29th May 2013, 17:39
Fans dont know Jack? It depends on the individual you heretic.

I have completed the game many times and developed a Deus Ex mod. I have also developed mini-games and own a large collection of games from over the years that span many genres. Even with that experience I still don't know everything there is to know about Deus Ex, but aiming for that would be futile.

Jack is a cool guy, maybe you should get to know him.

Remember, individuals.

Also, feedback should always be valued when It comes to game design, no matter how it is presented.

Also, the response has been mostly spot on in this thread: just make good games. Clever, no? :lol:

@EL_Bel: Your post even less tasteful than mine and HERESY's.

HERESY
29th May 2013, 19:06
Fans will have your game all over the place. Just look at THQ and DS2. You can't please everyone but at some time you do need to listen to certain feedback (like feedback from a demo or beta) but you shouldn't let the fans dictate the design of the game. They've done no feasibility studies, no SWOT analysis and the vast majority don't even know anything about content creation.

SE needs to get back to making games people want to play but they can't do that if the company culture is lacking and the leadership lacks vision. You don't look to the fans to correct these issues, you correct them yourself.

CyberP
29th May 2013, 19:19
SE needs to get back to making games people want to play but they can't do that if the company culture is lacking and the leadership lacks vision. You don't look to the fans to correct these issues, you correct them yourself.

Indeed....well, they could just hire me ;)

HERESY
29th May 2013, 19:50
Indeed....well, they could just hire me ;)

They probably should. I'm the type of person that think people should be hired based on what they bring to the table and if they're capable of pulling things off, not who their uncle is, what school they went to, etc.

CyberP
29th May 2013, 20:06
They probably should. I'm the type of person that think people should be hired based on what they bring to the table and if they're capable of pulling things off, not who their uncle is, what school they went to, etc.

For all you know my mod is crap ;)

It isn't, I'm very proud of it, but it is lacking optimal polish that can only be accomplished by my modding partner stopping having a real life and getting round to finishing his contribution.

Play Deus Ex dude.

Can you really call a game with quality such as this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b-bijO3uEw#t=00m36s) a relic?

I'll happily accept your opinions once you have completed it. And don't turn off the music!
Only then can your heresy be taken seriously.

Jerion
29th May 2013, 20:15
Oh, oh my word. Are you two finally making up? Praise the heavens.

nomotog
29th May 2013, 20:42
I think more damage comes from not listening to fans then could ever come from listening to them. You just can't use that as your main source for ideas.

HERESY
29th May 2013, 20:49
For all you know my mod is crap ;)

It isn't, I'm very proud of it, but it is lacking optimal polish that can only be accomplished by my modding partner stopping having a real life and getting round to finishing his contribution.

Play Deus Ex dude.

Can you really call a game with quality such as this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1b-bijO3uEw#t=00m36s) a relic?

I'll happily accept your opinions once you have completed it. And don't turn off the music!
Only then can your heresy be taken seriously.

All my opinions are to be taken as classic.

I'll tell you what, I said I was going to build a new pc for gaming (I already have to build one for work) and told Viktoria I would play all of the Thief games. I'll go back to ED and I'll play it with your mod.

I've been checking for parts now, but I assure you I will play the game.

CyberP
29th May 2013, 21:18
All my opinions are to be taken as classic.

I'll tell you what, I said I was going to build a new pc for gaming (I already have to build one for work) and told Viktoria I would play all of the Thief games. I'll go back to ED and I'll play it with your mod.

I've been checking for parts now, but I assure you I will play the game.

Great! Don't play it with my mod though, it significantly increases challenge. A specific requirement is that you have to have completed the game at least twice.

El_Bel
30th May 2013, 06:08
I'll tell you what, I said I was going to build a new pc for gaming (I already have to build one for work) and told Viktoria I would play all of the Thief games. I'll go back to ED and I'll play it with your mod.



For the love of god no! Like he said, it requires that you have played DX previously and also there is a bug with almost immortal enemies, he designed an enemy that runs as fast as the flash (and looks ridiculous) and generaly it doesn't add anything of value to the game.. yet (except for the Ocean Lab, that became much more awesome) . I suggest playing Biomod, it automates much of the menial work and it is closer to your "modern gameplay" mindset and adds hell of a lot futures to the game.

CyberP
30th May 2013, 06:40
For the love of god no! Like he said, it requires that you have played DX previously and also there is a bug with almost immortal enemies, he designed an enemy that runs as fast as the flash (and looks ridiculous) and generaly it doesn't add anything of value to the game.. yet (except for the Ocean Lab, that became much more awesome).

See what I mean...tasteless. :rolleyes:

I don't see your post as worthy of addressing but I feel I have to defend my work:

-There is a bug, yes. Now name a professionally developed game that doesn't have at least one. It will be fixed. It's hardly an issue tbh. "near immortal", lol. Noob.

-In your opinion. It's called speed enhancement, and they run no faster than JC.

If I were to call you an ******* that would make me a hypocrite.


I suggest playing Biomod, it automates much of the menial work and it is closer to your "modern gameplay" mindset and adds hell of a lot futures to the game

Well, that's only partially true. There is no "menial" work vanilla but it does automate the gameplay for special people such as yourself.

El_Bel
30th May 2013, 06:59
Muahahahaha! Come on dude, I didn't think it was going to be that easy to bait you :D

Anyway, for your information biomod does require a lot more thinking and planning for using your augmentations than vanilla and your mod *combined*. Sure you don't have to think when to activate them, since they are always on, but you have to think when to deactivate them. You have to decide things like, do I need this augmentation to get to the next area? Will I be better off trading energy for health? Also it makes you look at your energy level inside the battle, making it way more intense. I ended up using my augmentations a lot more and used much more bioelectric cells than when I was playing your mod.

CyberP
30th May 2013, 07:05
:hmm:


Muahahahaha! Come on dude, I didn't think it was going to be that easy to bait you :D


The thread is about Square Enix's development issues, not mine :lmao:

AlexOfSpades
30th May 2013, 14:32
Squeenix fixing their Dev issues, Heresy playing the first Deus Ex... whoa, good news over here

xaduha2
16th Jun 2013, 17:34
The thing that really REALLY bugs me is Sleeping Dogs. Marketing was terrible, the temporary cancellation didn't help and the trailers made the game look very ugly. Obviously, it underperformed. I also don't understand the 8/10's the game got.

Can't speak for consoles, but the end product on pc was GREAT.


It was nice. I enjoyed the callback to old style sand box put everything in it gameplay, but it wasn't GREAT in my box.

Errant Signal video reminded me about this post

xEwNkSQAWtE

I haven't really played any GTA or similar to GTA game before Sleeping Dogs. But I'm with Zakka on this one. PC + gamepad

CyberP
16th Jun 2013, 17:45
Re: the youtube vid: He should be more specific, It's Grand Theft Auto 4 which doesn't make sense at all. In GTA: Vice City you are a scumbag on his way to the top, nothing more. Every instance of madness is consistent madness, lol.

Wintermist
16th Jun 2013, 18:03
Director's Cut is an awesome example on how to get games out the door. Tweek an older game, and re-release it! Also, making simpler tablet games is another way.

Mustermann
24th Jun 2013, 09:28
I hope they fix whatever is wrong and turn out better games in the future.

Hitman Absolution was a Failure and another bad Hitman would kill off the series for good. I watched the Making of Hitman Absolution and one thing that struck me was how arrogant and delusional the team was. They seem to be caught up in the hype and that was probably their downfall. Also too much trying to copy "trends" from other games instead of knowing what make them unique.

Square Enix: My piece of free advise for the next Hitman

Stick to the basics, make gaming FUN, INTENSE and INTERESTING. Focus on gameplay, then story then graphic, not the other way around. You're not making a movie, don't try to be a Hollywood wannabe.