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MasterTaffer
19th Mar 2013, 23:53
http://download.gamezone.com/uploads/image/data/1141535/Deus-Ex-Human-Revolution-Wii-U.jpg

Though "speculation" at this point (AKA, unconfirmed by Square), it's looking like a pretty sure bet that Human Revolution is heading to the Wii U. Earlier today the game was listed on Amazon touting additional content and functionality with the Wii U controller (Adam's "Neural Hub"). It was listed as being released May 7th for $49.99 USD.

I'm wondering what the additional content is and how much of it is linked to the Wii U's functionality.

Regardless, I think I'll be picking it up. My Wii U has seen little use since I picked up the console last year and it would be nice to play soemthing on it, even if it's something I've already played quite a bit.





__

*Moderator Edit* / UPDATES


Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

mattig89ch
20th Mar 2013, 00:32
This is the only thing I would consider buying a wii u for.

Do tell us what the differences are between the 2 versions, won't you?

Shralla
20th Mar 2013, 00:50
Not enough to warrant $50, I guarantee it.

Jerion
20th Mar 2013, 01:23
If I had or was interested in having a Wii U, I would buy it. As it is, I don't and am not, so I won't.

MasterTaffer
20th Mar 2013, 01:44
This is the only thing I would consider buying a wii u for.

Do tell us what the differences are between the 2 versions, won't you?

I'll let you know when the curtain lifts on the actual game.

-Neon-
20th Mar 2013, 05:10
Rating Pending? Ha.

ZakKa89
20th Mar 2013, 07:31
minimap on the controller I'm sure. Hacking on the controller as well. That kind of stuff..

That is on daym fine piece of artwork on the cover

68_pie
20th Mar 2013, 14:05
Though "speculation" at this point (AKA, unconfirmed by Square), it's looking like a pretty sure bet that Human Revolution is heading to the Wii U. Earlier today the game was listed on Amazon touting additional content and functionality with the Wii U controller (Adam's "Neural Hub"). It was listed as being released May 7th for $49.99 USD.

And in news nobody cares about...



That is on daym fine piece of artwork on the cover

Why is he doing the Tim Henman fist-pump?

SDF121
20th Mar 2013, 14:36
Here is an article on some of the changes made to this version of the game, most notably the boss fights.

http://kotaku.com/5991489/deus-ex-human-revolution-coming-to-wii-u-with-some-key-changes

Now if only they would implement a lean function along with first person take downs!

Unstoppable
20th Mar 2013, 15:39
Here is an article on some of the changes made to this version of the game, most notably the boss fights.

http://kotaku.com/5991489/deus-ex-human-revolution-coming-to-wii-u-with-some-key-changes

Now if only they would implement a lean function along with first person take downs!

Seems like it's going to be worth it considering you get all the extra DLC and an improved game. However should the game be $40 instead? Hard to say I mean if they are putting work on it they have to make a profit.

KenTWOu
20th Mar 2013, 16:51
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-03-20-deus-ex-human-revolution-directors-cut-for-wii-u-confirmed-and-yes-theyve-fixed-the-boss-battles

Another good article about this Director's Cut edition. I hope they will release this at least for PC, cause Steam doesn't take payments for certification process anyway.


Not enough to warrant $50, I guarantee it.
You were definitely wrong.

Spyhopping
20th Mar 2013, 17:04
I'd like to find out how the game will work on this platform, but I just want to share my amusement at the angle of Jensen's eyebrows.

https://fbcdn-sphotos-b-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/487441_479084515478235_1365026045_n.jpg

EricaLeeV
20th Mar 2013, 17:16
Drawing certain emotions when the character has sunglasses is difficult. With hilarious results at times.


It kind of looks like the riot crowds stopped fighting while this augmented guy just waltzed on by. There is enough of a background/foreground thing going on to make it work though.

MasterTaffer
20th Mar 2013, 17:27
Bought!

68_pie
20th Mar 2013, 17:31
DXHR was worth $20 when it was new. I can't imagine paying $50 for a two year old game. :nut::scratch::lol:

-Neon-
20th Mar 2013, 17:51
Here is an article on some of the changes made to this version of the game, most notably the boss fights.

http://kotaku.com/5991489/deus-ex-human-revolution-coming-to-wii-u-with-some-key-changes

Now if only they would implement a lean function along with first person take downs!

My favorite comment on that article is

Wait. Does that image mean he actually pulls out a WiiU controller in-game to perform hacking? The neural-enhanced cyber super hero pulls out a ******* Nintendo game controller to perform his "enhanced hacking" techniques? Seriously?

That'd ruin the sense of immersion for me right there. I hope that's just a mock up for a promo video like they did for the ZombiU release videos.

http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/18i2fche996agjpg/original.jpg

Yes. Adam Jensen will pull out a monitor and a WiiU controller to hack the computer in front of him, with the WiiU controller serving as a visual medium for his neural hub hacking augs.

68_pie
20th Mar 2013, 17:59
:lmao::lmao::mad2::mad2:

Darthassin
20th Mar 2013, 18:08
I have bought DXHR + all DLCs on Steam at launch.

I demand this director's cut on PC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Shralla
20th Mar 2013, 19:59
Another good article about this Director's Cut edition. I hope they will release this at least for PC, cause Steam doesn't take payments for certification process anyway.


You were definitely wrong.

Oh yes, because "improved map layouts for bosses" is completely worth paying for the game twice, or in any way justifies them charging new-game price for a two year old game. Get real, seriously.

VectorM
20th Mar 2013, 21:48
Oh yes, because "improved map layouts for bosses" is completely worth paying for the game twice, or in any way justifies them charging new-game price for a two year old game. Get real, seriously.

Well, this very thread has people who are willing to pay that much for the game, so, yes, it is justifiable. Then again, my avatar.


Also, the Witcher 2 on Xbox...

Ilves
20th Mar 2013, 21:50
What I wanna know is did they grasp the golden opportunity to pimp out the endings...? http://l.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/4.gif

FrankCSIS
20th Mar 2013, 22:04
Bah everything is justifiable, seeing as there are different layers of crowds prepared to pay different amounts. The game will go for 29$ three months after release anyway, and I don't see the rush to replay a game on its second release day.

49$ will do just fine for fanatics, and first-time players looking for a game to justify their impulsive wii u purchase.

MasterTaffer
20th Mar 2013, 22:11
Adam just posted on the Eidos Montreal blog about the various features in the Director's Cut.

Check it out here (http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced).

Lady_Of_The_Vine
20th Mar 2013, 22:31
The new features and improvements sound very interesting. :cool:

-Neon-
20th Mar 2013, 22:51
Oh yes, because "improved map layouts for bosses" is completely worth paying for the game twice, or in any way justifies them charging new-game price for a two year old game. Get real, seriously.

If you don't wanna pay for it twice, then don't. It's that simple, seriously.
It includes all DLC, a visual upgrade, and more features. You may not feel all this justifies the $50 price tag, but apparently Square Enix does, hardcore fans with WiiUs might, and people who have wanted to get in on the series but didn't have the console/PC for it will.

El_Bel
21st Mar 2013, 00:12
What I wanna know is did they grasp the golden opportunity to pimp out the endings...? http://l.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/emoticons7/4.gif

Nope, in an interview they said that the endings were like a powerpoint presentation by design.

b1skit
21st Mar 2013, 00:59
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

MasterTaffer
21st Mar 2013, 01:35
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

Beat you to it, Adam. ;)



Adam just posted on the Eidos Montreal blog about the various features in the Director's Cut.

Check it out here (http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced).

El_Bel
21st Mar 2013, 01:39
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

You mentioned that the AI was polished. Does that include the augmented zombies at the end? Maybe make them look less ridiculous?

Shralla
21st Mar 2013, 04:07
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced


I think a lot of people would agree that one of the coolest movies to come out in the last 20 years or so was Ridley Scott’s Blade Runner.

Ah yes, one of the coolest movies of the last twenty years or so was a movie that came out 31 years ago.

Aside from that, so basically this is the version of Deus Ex that we should have been given from the beginning? And no evidence at all of any of this reaching the platforms that your actual loyal customers purchased the game on?

neonfish
21st Mar 2013, 06:20
Aside from that, so basically this is the version of Deus Ex that we should have been given from the beginning? And no evidence at all of any of this reaching the platforms that your actual loyal customers purchased the game on?

Exactly!!! How Dare you eidos !

ZakKa89
21st Mar 2013, 07:07
New Game + is a mistake

Shralla
21st Mar 2013, 07:48
Exactly!!! How Dare you eidos !

Well I'm not quite THAT butthurt, but yes, indeed!

68_pie
21st Mar 2013, 10:41
I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

No.

Spyhopping
21st Mar 2013, 11:56
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

Good to hear that the boss battled are updated. Resolving them without using bullets sounds appealing, but I wonder if it can be done non-lethally.

Lighting looks nice.
http://cdn.eidosinteractive.com/mtl/marketing/Community/Blog/WiiUVisuals.jpg

InGroove2
21st Mar 2013, 14:02
Good to hear that the boss battled are updated. Resolving them without using bullets sounds appealing, but I wonder if it can be done non-lethally.

Lighting looks nice.
http://cdn.eidosinteractive.com/mtl/marketing/Community/Blog/WiiUVisuals.jpg

it says explicitly in one of the articles that because of the story/cut scenes (which cannot be altered) non lethal is not possible.

3rdmillhouse
21st Mar 2013, 14:09
I'm really disapointed that the WiiU is getting reworked boss fights while the rest of us are stuck sucking our thumbs. It would be far more profitable to release these reworked boss-fights as paid DLC on the three major platforms, than to spend any money developing this game for a platform that hasn't sold enough units to recuperate the development costs.

Spyhopping
21st Mar 2013, 14:40
^Sorting out the boss battles will make the game more enjoyable, but I don't feel like I'm terribly missing out by not owning this console. The best bits of the game were right there in the original release.


it says explicitly in one of the articles that because of the story/cut scenes (which cannot be altered) non lethal is not possible.

Cheers, makes sense!

InGroove2
21st Mar 2013, 19:18
^Sorting out the boss battles will make the game more enjoyable, but I don't feel like I'm terribly missing out by not owning this console. The best bits of the game were right there in the original release.



Cheers, makes sense!

sure.

too bad though... who wouldn't love a scene with barrett being berated by namir for getting knocked out by adam?

MasterTaffer
21st Mar 2013, 19:24
sure.

too bad though... who wouldn't love a scene with barrett being berated by namir for getting knocked out by adam?

Why did I just picture Barrett, Yelena, and Namir as the Three Stooges?

HERESY
21st Mar 2013, 20:11
Based on various pics I saw, Adam does not pull out the Wii U controller. I think those are marketing/promo shots to reflect what can be done with the Wii U controller and that they used his hands because you're supposed to be him.

Look at these pics and you'll see what I'm talking about:

http://www.joystiq.com/screenshots/deux-ex-human-revolution-directors-cut/5748895/#/0

ZakKa89
21st Mar 2013, 22:15
no sjit

FrankCSIS
22nd Mar 2013, 00:45
Funny Blade Runner should be mentioned. Along with Star Wars, it's the one movie that has been released in a plethora of varying cuts over the years, and one which many fans have shoved money towards to experience in all its shades of ultimate cuts. It's not entirely uncommon to see two or three different copies of Blade Runner in one's DVD bookcase.

Jerion
22nd Mar 2013, 01:22
Funny Blade Runner should be mentioned. Along with Star Wars, it's the one movie that has been released in a plethora of varying cuts over the years, and one which many fans have shoved money towards to experience in all its shades of ultimate cuts. It's not entirely uncommon to see two or three different copies of Blade Runner in one's DVD bookcase.

I have five. Does that make me a bad person? I don't think so.

FrankCSIS
22nd Mar 2013, 01:31
Was that the ultimate suitcase edition with all the versions?

Jerion
22nd Mar 2013, 01:54
Was that the ultimate suitcase edition with all the versions?

Yeah, it was a Blu-ray pack. The "final" cut is my favorite.

CyberP
22nd Mar 2013, 09:38
I applaud the use of an optional in-game guide. That is a far better solution than dumbing everything down. Other developers should take note before they implement a plethora of hand-holding mechanics and indicators into their game.
Boss fights are not a big deal to me at all. Yeah they were heavily flawed (along with the accompanying cutscenes), but they are over in seconds- it's the other stuff, core mechanics mostly, that bothers me.
Throw back grenades? That will make Flash Suppressant and EMP shielding even more useless, unless those augs are improved too.
Other than that it's cool that the Wii people can experience this game, that console needs some good titles and I wonder how it feels/handles gunning down Belltower on a Wii mote....not that i'll ever cough up the money for the Wii and the game to find out ;) Good luck Eidos.

Oh and New Game + was a horrible design decision, but from a business perspective probably spot on! Sigh.

KenTWOu
22nd Mar 2013, 14:31
Oh yes, because "improved map layouts for bosses" is completely worth paying for the game twice, or in any way justifies them charging new-game price for a two year old game. Get real, seriously.
Read Eurogamer article (http://forums.eidosgames.com/showpost.php?p=1886898&postcount=11) already, the game will have more improvements than that: engine, AI, UI, audio comments, The Missing Link will be inside the game.

-Neon-
23rd Mar 2013, 05:44
Why are people knocking New Game+? It's an optional choice, isn't it? You guys can't tell me you've never wanted to have every augmentation unlocked just because at some point.

CyberP
23rd Mar 2013, 10:41
Why are people knocking New Game+? It's an optional choice, isn't it?

For people like us, yes. Most players will play though it just because it's something they have unlocked (if they enjoyed the game to begin with). Hmm, it's only positive use is having more time with the plasma rifle, if the devs place ammo for it in NG+
And who knows, maybe there will be other features exclusive to NG+. Would have been better if the game was good enough to not need NG+ though.


You guys can't tell me you've never wanted to have every augmentation unlocked just because at some point.
Yes I can. Ruins challenge and choice and consequence. If nothing new is added for NG+ except keeping your augs & equipment then it will be a terribly boring experience.

68_pie
23rd Mar 2013, 21:06
Why are people knocking New Game+? It's an optional choice, isn't it? You guys can't tell me you've never wanted to have every augmentation unlocked just because at some point.

It's often indicative of the overall direction of the design. Often towards the "Cool **** TM" end of the spectrum.

Shralla
23rd Mar 2013, 22:24
Damn, the Wii gamepad is clunky and terrible for shooters, and the default control scheme for Deus Ex is completely retarded.

Those are the only impressions I walked away from PAX with.

sadmachine
24th Mar 2013, 04:09
Hey guys, check out my blog for more details on what to expect from Deus Ex: Human Revolution - Director's Cut. I hope you're as excited as we are! :)

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Announced

I actually kind of feel like a sucker for pre-ordering on PS3 and buying The Missing Link as soon as it went up on PSN. Seeing a better version come out for a different console for less money--why would I be excited about that?

Darthassin
24th Mar 2013, 15:06
I actually kind of feel like a sucker for pre-ordering on PS3 and buying The Missing Link as soon as it went up on PSN. Seeing a better version come out for a different console for less money--why would I be excited about that?

You are not the only one.

Ashpolt
24th Mar 2013, 16:03
I actually kind of feel like a sucker for pre-ordering on PS3 and buying The Missing Link as soon as it went up on PSN. Seeing a better version come out for a different console for less money--why would I be excited about that?

Why feel like a sucker? By the time this comes out you'll have been playing the game for two years or more.

Count D
24th Mar 2013, 17:27
Why feel like a sucker? By the time this comes out you'll have been playing the game for two years or more.

The game was improved based on the criticism by those, who played it all this time and what do they get for providing all that valuable feedback, that allowed them to improve the game so dramatically and make it 10\10 material? Nothing, they now have to buy the game again or play the same old inferior version.

JCpies
24th Mar 2013, 18:10
Don't worry Count D, something something patience, afterlife eternity heaven god, bla bla. We'll get our reward in the end. Just wait.

sadmachine
24th Mar 2013, 18:44
Why feel like a sucker? By the time this comes out you'll have been playing the game for two years or more.

I usually wait and buy games used when they're dirt cheap. On the rare occasion I go so far as to pre-order something it's to show support for a project I feel deserves all the support it can get. Stunts like this remind me how stupid that mindset is. This game is the product of a corporation, and all corporations care about is money. If they can make money by privileging a set of consumers I'll never join (WiiU owners), why shouldn't they?

Lesson learned. Thanks for the wake-up call, Square Enix.

WildcatPhoenix
24th Mar 2013, 18:52
Stunts like this remind me how stupid that mindset is. This game is the product of a corporation, and all corporations care about is money. If they can make money by privileging a set of consumers I'll never join (WiiU owners), why shouldn't they?

Lesson learned. Thanks for the wake-up call, Square Enix.

So, presale bonuses, "augmented editions" with whole missions cut out from the primary content, and DLC released one month after the main game didn't send this message to you already?

vallux
24th Mar 2013, 18:52
To me it just seems silly how bent out of shape people are getting over this. I mean the game came out almost two years ago. Most people on these forums have played it to death, myself included. People were just fine living their lives not really demanding reparations from Squeidos and then this comes out and all hell breaks loose.

Ah **** it. I tried to make a point - I suppose people are just mad it's on the WiiU. It's not really surprising though, it seems a few games have gotten "ultimate editions" on the WiiU with gamepad support (the big selling point on most of them). And besides, we'll probably see it in some form down the line. I hope.

Shralla
24th Mar 2013, 19:11
To me it just seems silly how bent out of shape people are getting over this. I mean the game came out almost two years ago. Most people on these forums have played it to death, myself included. People were just fine living their lives not really demanding reparations from Squeidos and then this comes out and all hell breaks loose.

It's more that people spent a good year complaining about all these things with literally no indication as to the possibility of them being fixed, and when they finally give some word, it's a year and a half out from launch, and it's for a new system.

sadmachine
24th Mar 2013, 19:12
So, presale bonuses, "augmented editions" with whole missions cut out from the primary content, and DLC released one month after the main game didn't send this message to you already?

Ha. Good point.

HERESY
24th Mar 2013, 21:06
So, presale bonuses, "augmented editions" with whole missions cut out from the primary content, and DLC released one month after the main game didn't send this message to you already?

The bold, where did you hear that at?

WildcatPhoenix
24th Mar 2013, 21:57
The bold, where did you hear that at?

Tong mission.


You Scratch My Back, I'll Scratch Yours is a mission in Deus Ex: Human Revolution. It is available only with the Explosive Mission Pack and is interjected between the completion of the Find Vasili Sevchenko's GPL Device objective and the start of the Stowing Away objective, during Jensen's second visit to Hengsha.

Ashpolt
24th Mar 2013, 21:58
The game was improved based on the criticism by those, who played it all this time and what do they get for providing all that valuable feedback, that allowed them to improve the game so dramatically and make it 10\10 material? Nothing, they now have to buy the game again or play the same old inferior version.

It doesn't sound "dramatically" improved. So they've improved the boss fights and tweaked the graphics a bit - it's hardly a massive difference. Even with the benefit of perfect foresight, I'd take DXHR in 2011 over DXHR:DC in 2013/2014 any day.

Incidentally, I now own a WiiU (with HMV's ridiculous discount, I couldn't resist) and I still don't plan to get this unless they release it as an update for the PC version. Why? Because it's not that big a deal, and not worth getting worked up over. I'm as much as an advocate for consumer friendly policies as the next guy - more, most likely - but this really isn't that big a deal. It's no better or worse than "Game of the Year" editions including all DLC.

68_pie
24th Mar 2013, 23:55
10\10 material

LOL

Tverdyj
24th Mar 2013, 23:57
It doesn't sound "dramatically" improved. So they've improved the boss fights and tweaked the graphics a bit - it's hardly a massive difference. Even with the benefit of perfect foresight, I'd take DXHR in 2011 over DXHR:DC in 2013/2014 any day.

Incidentally, I now own a WiiU (with HMV's ridiculous discount, I couldn't resist) and I still don't plan to get this unless they release it as an update for the PC version. Why? Because it's not that big a deal, and not worth getting worked up over. I'm as much as an advocate for consumer friendly policies as the next guy - more, most likely - but this really isn't that big a deal. It's no better or worse than "Game of the Year" editions including all DLC.

So, they fixed the one thing EVERY SINGLE REVIEWER EVER pointed out was the game's biggest flaw.
They improved the graphics to the same level that their own DLC(!!!) was showing.

They incorporated the same DLC into the main game, where it's supposed to be (after assuring us, the buying public that "it couldn't be done"

and then they release it on a new platform.

And we're supposed to NOT feel like we've been their beta testers?

Count D
25th Mar 2013, 00:20
LOL

Okay, "10/10, except for fanboys of the original" material.

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 00:52
Okay, "10/10, except for fanboys of the original" material.

well, if you eliminate the original game (and IW) as a metric, what is your scale based on? Bloodlines? Are there any other FPS/RPGs out there? I mean, sure, if you consider Bioshock as your metric for the genre, then yeah, HR is leaps and bounds ahead.

That being said, it still has issues such as the unbalanced EXP system (which promotes one play style over all others, since it allows you to game the system), inferior physics, and generally not very interesting NPCs. And don't get me started on the "zombies"

10/10? hardly. Though it certainly IS a solid 9. maybe even 9.3/10

Jerion
25th Mar 2013, 01:19
It's often indicative of the overall direction of the design. Often towards the "Cool **** TM" end of the spectrum.

Hey now. Cool ****™ isn't always bad just for being Cool ****™, and honestly I would enjoy an optional change of pace.


Tong mission.

That tiny thing? That barely qualifies as a full mission. It's more like a little sideshow between missions.


So, they fixed the one thing EVERY SINGLE REVIEWER EVER pointed out was the game's biggest flaw.
They improved the graphics to the same level that their own DLC(!!!) was showing.

They incorporated the same DLC into the main game, where it's supposed to be (after assuring us, the buying public that "it couldn't be done"

and then they release it on a new platform.

And we're supposed to NOT feel like we've been their beta testers?

Well, no. You're not supposed to feel that way. The base game came out in 2011. The Missing Link DLC (which was in an offset development cycle from the core game) came out a couple months later with some under-the-hood upgrades which would have required some "interesting" adjustments to the base game via update in order to be smoothly integrated. That would have meant more QA, more patches, more things to track down. It could have been done, but not quickly. Simpler and cheaper to just release it as a separate package. Over a year later, and they've been working on applying those same rendering improvements to the base game, they've been redesigning, testing and tweaking more than a little bit of in-game content, been adding fan-pleasing goodies to the game, been making sure it's stable and properly supported on a new system. Do you feel like a beta tester for a car company when they make mileage or performance improvements to your car model two years after you bought it? Or when a tech company improves a smartphone? You bought a complete product, albeit an imperfect one. You've gotten support and post-launch patches for it. They've opted to revise said product and at the same time bring it to a new system. It's not like you purchased the right for them to provide you with brand new content for nothing two years after the initial purchase. If they end up doing that, GREAT! Don't feel entitled to it though. It feels weird and I want the improved content on the PC/Mac edition as much as anyone, but let's not be unreasonable here.


well, if you eliminate the original game (and IW) as a metric, what is your scale based on? Bloodlines? Are there any other FPS/RPGs out there? I mean, sure, if you consider Bioshock as your metric for the genre, then yeah, HR is leaps and bounds ahead.

That being said, it still has issues such as the unbalanced EXP system (which promotes one play style over all others, since it allows you to game the system), inferior physics, and generally not very interesting NPCs. And don't get me started on the "zombies"

10/10? hardly. Though it certainly IS a solid 9. maybe even 9.3/10

FPRPS..there are more than a few. The line between them is getting pretty blurry. Even Borderlands qualifies, though if you're talking about something more closely related then Dishonored or potentially the newer Fallout games would also fit.

Count D
25th Mar 2013, 01:25
well, if you eliminate the original game (and IW) as a metric, what is your scale based on? Bloodlines? Are there any other FPS/RPGs out there? I mean, sure, if you consider Bioshock as your metric for the genre, then yeah, HR is leaps and bounds ahead.

That being said, it still has issues such as the unbalanced EXP system (which promotes one play style over all others, since it allows you to game the system), inferior physics, and generally not very interesting NPCs. And don't get me started on the "zombies"

10/10? hardly. Though it certainly IS a solid 9. maybe even 9.3/10

How about evaluating the game on its own? Not comparing it? And I don't even consider BioShock to be the same genre (now IW and BioShock are in the same basket, as far as I'm concerned).

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 01:33
Hey now. Cool ****™ isn't always bad just for being Cool ****™, and honestly I would enjoy an optional change of pace.



That tiny thing? That barely qualifies as a full mission. It's more like a little sideshow between missions.



Well, no. You're not supposed to feel that way. The base game came out in 2011. The Missing Link DLC (which was in an offset development cycle from the core game) came out a couple months later with some under-the-hood upgrades which would have required some "interesting" adjustments to the base game via update in order to be smoothly integrated. That would have meant more QA, more patches, more things to track down. It could have been done, but not quickly. Simpler and cheaper to just release it as a separate package. Over a year later, and they've been working on applying those same rendering improvements to the base game, they've been redesigning, testing and tweaking more than a little bit of in-game content, been adding fan-pleasing goodies to the game, been making sure it's stable and properly supported on a new system. Do you feel like a beta tester for a car company when they make mileage or performance improvements to your car model two years after you bought it? Or when a tech company improves a smartphone? You bought a complete product, albeit an imperfect one. You've gotten support and post-launch patches for it. They've opted to revise said product and at the same time bring it to a new system. It's not like you purchased the right for them to provide you with brand new content for nothing two years after the initial purchase. If they end up doing that, GREAT! Don't feel entitled to it though. It feels weird and I want the improved content on the PC/Mac edition as much as anyone, but let's not be unreasonable here.



FPRPS..there are more than a few. The line between them is getting pretty blurry. Even Borderlands qualifies, though if you're talking about something more closely related then Dishonored or potentially the newer Fallout games would also fit.

lol
The existing precedent of CDPRed and the Witcher 2--first with the awesome 1.4 patch (the Dark Mode), and later with the Enhanced Edition makes me feel entitled, lol. In fact, TW2 was probably the best game I played in 2012.... AFTER the enhanced edition came out, for free. Given there are a number of similarities, yes, I do wish for a similar outcome. Personally, I haven't touched HR since I played through TML over the winter holidays, but I would like to play the game again, without having to lug around the bloody heavy rifle exclusively so that I can kill Fedorova and Namir.
Given the game's Steamworked, I hope they just provide previous owners a chance to "upgrade" it, for the cost of a regular expansion pack.

Dishonored wouldn't count, since it came out AFTER HR.
I did miss Fallout 3 on that list. But given that (and esp New Vegas) leans far more towards the RPG side of things, i'm not sure it's an apt comparison.

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 01:42
How about evaluating the game on its own? Not comparing it? And I don't even consider BioShock to be the same genre (now IW and BioShock are in the same basket, as far as I'm concerned).

ok. you say it's 10/10. What are your criteria?
Please keep in mind, I may seem a bit pedantic, but I'm simply curious. saying "10/10" indicates a level of quality that's essentially superior to anything else. By assigning the game a numerical value, you are putting it on a scale, which inevitably invites comparison to other games.

It is my understanding that a 10/10 game would have to offer a flawless gameplay experience. As you can see, I don't consider HR to be such a game (though if I didn't have to put up with the tedious boss battles it would easily be A. Very. Good. Game. As is, it is merely A. Good. Game.) I still wouldn't consider it to be a "flawless" game.

so, if we treat HR on its own merits, presumably not looking at so-called "industry standards", what is it that you think makes HR a 10/10 game?


btw, as far as such games go, the closest equivalent to "flawless" I could think of would be a modded S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Call of Prypyat with the Complete mod. but that's a totally other topic, i'm merely listing it here as a reference.

Jerion
25th Mar 2013, 02:00
lol
The existing precedent of CDPRed and the Witcher 2--first with the awesome 1.4 patch (the Dark Mode), and later with the Enhanced Edition makes me feel entitled, lol. In fact, TW2 was probably the best game I played in 2012.... AFTER the enhanced edition came out, for free. Given there are a number of similarities, yes, I do wish for a similar outcome. Personally, I haven't touched HR since I played through TML over the winter holidays, but I would like to play the game again, without having to lug around the bloody heavy rifle exclusively so that I can kill Fedorova and Namir.
Given the game's Steamworked, I hope they just provide previous owners a chance to "upgrade" it, for the cost of a regular expansion pack.

Dishonored wouldn't count, since it came out AFTER HR.
I did miss Fallout 3 on that list. But given that (and esp New Vegas) leans far more towards the RPG side of things, i'm not sure it's an apt comparison.

CDPR is one company that has been unbelievably awesome in what they've given to their existing customers. They are also the exception. If ten high-profile companies did what they've done, maybe they would not be the exception. As it is...

FrankCSIS
25th Mar 2013, 02:20
There are quite a few games with 10/10 moments in them, but using 10/10 to qualify a whole game, let alone HR, is a whole new level of rating inflation. Although I'm sure IGN is itching to give 12/10 ratings!

I'm with Jerion on this one. You bought a full product, and some of you made the choice to pre-order (which defies any logic, especially considering the complete lack of information we had on the game), and as far as I can tell you've enjoyed the product you purchased.

As a consumer I'm not a fan of this particular product strategy, because of where it potentially leads in the longer run, but it makes perfect sense for both Square and Nintendo, whereas it makes little financial sense to devote resources to a free port of those mods. If you're not in accord with this, don't buy this Wii U game, and don't pre-order their future products. It's often said we have the politicians we deserve. We also have the market and product strategies we deserve. Pre-ordering something, anything, is exposing yourself to this kind of business decisions later down the road, because it means you endorse decisions not yet announced, instead of NOT paying until changes demanded were made.

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 02:41
CDPR is one company that has been unbelievably awesome in what they've given to their existing customers. They are also the exception. If ten high-profile companies did what they've done, maybe they would not be the exception. As it is...

oh, I know, sadly.

But, as a consumer, is it not my right, nay, my duty to demand that the companies that want me to spend money on them strive to better themselves?

FrankCSIS
25th Mar 2013, 02:55
oh, I know, sadly.

But, as a consumer, is it not my right, nay, my duty to demand that the companies that want me to spend money on them strive to better themselves?

Sure, but money is your only bargaining chip. If boss battles were such a deal breaker for some of you, the only effective way to fulfill your duty would've been not to buy the game, or at least not buy it at full price on release week. Games are a lot like movies now, the first weeks are critical.

And when people pre-order, no matter the noble or philosophical reasons, they end up willingly removing themselves from this negotiation commonly referred to as market.

I'm not saying people are not entitled to resent this decision. I guess my point is we've endorsed a game with its flaws when we bought it, some endorsed a game they did not even know when they pre-ordered, and others will get a chance to play this modified game as their first experience as a result of these endorsements. Next time around, be less liberal with your purchase choices if you don't like what's going on, and perhaps the messages some are expressing in this outburst will actually get across.

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 02:59
Sure, but money is your only bargaining chip. If boss battles were such a deal breaker for some of you, the only effective way to fulfill your duty would've been not to buy the game, or at least not buy it at full price on release week. Games are a lot like movies now, the first weeks are critical.

And when people pre-order, no matter the noble or philosophical reasons, they end up willingly removing themselves from this negotiation commonly referred to as market.

I'm not saying people are not entitled to resent this decision. I guess my point is we've endorsed a game with its flaws when we bought it, some endorsed a game they did not even know when they pre-ordered, and others will get a chance to play this modified game as their first experience as a result of these endorsements. Next time around, be less liberal with your purchase choices if you don't like what's going on, and perhaps the messages some are expressing in this outburst will actually get across.

Lol. I didn't pre-order. I bought this after it was out for something like 3 weeks? I think. And I bought the DLC way later for pennies on a Steam Sale.

I've stopped pre-ordering a while ago. I have enough games in my Steam and GOG libraries to last me for years, had I the free time. These days I tend to only throw money liberally on DRM-free games.

FrankCSIS
25th Mar 2013, 03:27
Bah I mentioned pre-orders because I'm baffled by this practice. Good on you if you avoid it.

Short version: Studios are extremely vulnerable, more so today than fifteen years ago. As a consumer, where your dollar goes in the first few weeks can make or break a title. If you want to bargain, that is your window of opportunity. Discussions prior to release and resentments later down the road will not get you much once you've endorsed through a purchase.

It still makes sense to explain your resentment, though. This way, if this Biskit gentleman is paying any attention, he will get a chance to know why you might not encourage their future titles unless they release a port for this mod. I just think feeling "cheated", as some expressed, is going a bit overboard.

HERESY
25th Mar 2013, 05:30
Tong mission.

I have the Tong mission and forgot that was a preorder bonus. My bad.

MasterTaffer
25th Mar 2013, 07:43
I have the Tong mission and forgot that was a preorder bonus. My bad.

It's not exactly all that memorable, even for the lore connections.

68_pie
25th Mar 2013, 11:02
Okay, "10/10, except for fanboys of the original" material.


10/10? hardly. Though it certainly IS a solid 9. maybe even 9.3/10

Sure, 10/10 if you are only comparing it to other mainstream, AAA titles. There was enough fundamentally broken about DXHR that I'd say 7/10 is fair - that still means it's a good game. (N.B. if I was judging at as a Deus Ex game I would give it 5/10)


They've opted to revise said product and at the same time bring it to a new system. It's not like you purchased the right for them to provide you with brand new content for nothing two years after the initial purchase. If they end up doing that, GREAT! Don't feel entitled to it though. It feels weird and I want the improved content on the PC/Mac edition as much as anyone, but let's not be unreasonable here.

Calling it a Director's Cut says to the consumer "this is the product we actually wanted and should have given to you in the first place". I think it's understandable why we might feel aggrieved


Sure, but money is your only bargaining chip.

I bought DXHR for 12 quid rather than 40 - that tells the publisher how much I value their game but it doesn't tell them what my issues were or what would make me pay more. They could as much think it was because it wasn't shooty enough rather than it being because it didn't feel like a Deus Ex game.

Count D
25th Mar 2013, 11:15
Sure, 10/10 if you are only comparing it to other mainstream, AAA titles. There was enough fundamentally broken about DXHR that I'd say 7/10 is fair - that still means it's a good game. (N.B. if I was judging at as a Deus Ex game I would give it 5/10)
Wonder what IW would rate on such a scale. Though... I better don't know. And yeah, I prefer comparing it to other mainstream AAA titles - it's a product of its time and it's only fair to judge it against other products of its time. I mean, what, should we evaluate old games by comparing them to new ones? Boy the audiovisual side will lose points.


Calling it a Director's Cut says to the consumer "this is the product we actually wanted and should have given to you in the first place". I think it's understandable why we might feel aggrieved
Agreed. I almost never buy the games 'till the bundle with all the DLCs comes out - for me "Game of the Year Edition" equals to "The only edition worth owning", since any other is incomplete.


I bought DXHR for 12 quid rather than 40 - that tells the publisher how much I value their game but it doesn't tell them what my issues were or what would make me pay more. They could as much think it was because it wasn't shooty enough rather than it being because it didn't feel like a Deus Ex game.Y'know... you keep using those words and... Just, ain't it a bit unfair to say that, when all you mean is "it didn't feel like the original Deus Ex"? It's not like there are at least TWO unarguably good Deus Ex games before HR.

68_pie
25th Mar 2013, 11:34
Wonder what IW would rate on such a scale.

It get's 6/10 as a game and 6/10 as a DX game (although I am a bit of an IW apologist).


Y'know... you keep using those words and... Just, ain't it a bit unfair to say that, when all you mean is "it didn't feel like the original Deus Ex"? It's not like there are at least TWO unarguably good Deus Ex games before HR.

TBH I was just using that as one example of my problems with DXHR. But, if you are going to call it a DX game and not make it a new IP then it is absolutely fair to criticise it for not feeling like a Deus Ex game.

Tverdyj
25th Mar 2013, 18:45
Count D, there ARE 2 unarguably great Deus Ex games before HR.

They were called "Deus Ex" and "Vampire: the Masquerade: Bloodlines", lol

Jerion
25th Mar 2013, 19:58
My thoughts on the Wii U DC Edition:

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Impressions

MasterTaffer
25th Mar 2013, 21:42
My thoughts on the Wii U DC Edition:

http://community.eidosmontreal.com/blogs/DXHR-Directors-Cut-Impressions

Sounds like my Wii U will finally get some use come release...

Shralla
28th Mar 2013, 18:49
I realized what offends me most about all this. I went and started playing Human Revolution again, and realized that they've been working on this, these improvements for the WiiU version of the game, WHEN THEY STILL HAVEN'T FIXED ANY OF THE PROBLEMS FROM THE ORIGINAL PC RELEASE.

Ironsights are still completely useless on most of the weapons due to misalignment, there's still an immersion-breaking desync of the audio and animation for the combat rifle. These are two almost insignificant issues in terms of the time it would have undoubtedly taken to fix them, but they just didn't! They just never ******* bothered. And now they're trying to shove this crap out to make some more money when they should have been using the money that WE SPENT ON THE GAME TWO YEARS AGO to fix the goddamn problems that are already present in the versions that already exist.

besyuziki
28th Mar 2013, 20:19
I realized what offends me most about all this. I went and started playing Human Revolution again, and realized that they've been working on this, these improvements for the WiiU version of the game, WHEN THEY STILL HAVEN'T FIXED ANY OF THE PROBLEMS FROM THE ORIGINAL PC RELEASE.

My brain disagrees with you, but my heart agrees.

To be fair, we've had access to the full -albeit imperfect- game for almost two years now, but it really feels bad when people support the game by preordering it or buying it for full price at release, only to suffer from several issues which couldn't be resolved by EM, while they focus on the "definitive" version (whatever the **** that means) on a different platform based on those people's very feedback.

On the bright side, the WiiU owners who happen to like Deus Ex will enjoy the Director's Cut. All 8 of them.

HERESY
28th Mar 2013, 20:23
I realized what offends me most about all this. I went and started playing Human Revolution again, and realized that they've been working on this, these improvements for the WiiU version of the game, WHEN THEY STILL HAVEN'T FIXED ANY OF THE PROBLEMS FROM THE ORIGINAL PC RELEASE.

Ironsights are still completely useless on most of the weapons due to misalignment, there's still an immersion-breaking desync of the audio and animation for the combat rifle. These are two almost insignificant issues in terms of the time it would have undoubtedly taken to fix them, but they just didn't! They just never ******* bothered. And now they're trying to shove this crap out to make some more money when they should have been using the money that WE SPENT ON THE GAME TWO YEARS AGO to fix the goddamn problems that are already present in the versions that already exist.

Consoles don't have those problems, sorry.

However, if PC users are plagued with bugs that haven't been addressed that isn't right.

El_Bel
28th Mar 2013, 23:21
Consoles don't have those problems, sorry.

However, if PC users are plagued with bugs that haven't been addressed that isn't right.

Of course Consoles have the same issues. Have you tried firing a weapon using ironsights while... Oh wait, HERESY... I see...

The troll is strong with this one, but I think it's time to change name.

HERESY
29th Mar 2013, 05:11
Of course Consoles have the same issues. Have you tried firing a weapon using ironsights while... Oh wait, HERESY... I see...

The troll is strong with this one, but I think it's time to change name.

I didn't notice anything pertaining to iron sights and the audio being off. I'm not going to say consoles are better or that consoles are without problems. I've yet to play Skyrim because I felt the way Bethesda treated PS3 users was wrong. Could I have also purchased the 360 version? Yes, but I felt the way they handled it was wrong so I passed it up altogether.

In regards to your "the troll is strong with this one" statement, well, that is quite absurd since I plainly stated, "However, if PC users are plagued with bugs that haven't been addressed that isn't right."

Refrain from speaking while grown folks are talking. You do that and you'll come off a bit more intelligent.

Lady_Of_The_Vine
30th Mar 2013, 12:50
To all concerned. Discussion is getting somewhat personal again. :hmm:
If it continues, please don't be surprised if you receive an infraction. Not nice... but sometimes necessary. So hold your tongues. :p

hellrasinbrasin
30th Mar 2013, 16:15
I have a question, is the Wii U Edition of Deus Ex Human Revolution "Director's Cut"; a Nintendo exclusive licence -- if it is I guess, that means it won't be released for the PS3 or PC; if not then when can we expect an announcement for a PS3/PC release?

Shralla
30th Mar 2013, 21:15
The more I'm playing Human Revolution, the more repeated bugs I'm finding. Things like taking cover behind a wall which will let you creep to the corner of it, but for some reason won't let you lean out to fire, so you have to let go of cover and then take cover again, this time closer to the corner, and then it will work.

And I really can't even begin to describe how utterly INFURIATING the "artificial ceiling" is in some areas of some levels. Places where your super jump can clearly take you up there, but the game just gives you a "squishy" ceiling and prevents you from jumping up there. Or boxes and things disappearing after you've moved them around in an attempt to overcome said artificial ceiling.

But I think what's bothering me the most is the completely pathetic number of interactable items overall. Why did I have to scour multiple streets of Heng-sha just to find three boxes to stack on top of each other? In the first Deus Ex three boxes would have taken me three SECONDS to find.

God I really hope the next game is improved.

Ashpolt
31st Mar 2013, 02:48
The artificial ceilings and lack of interactable (is that a word? Spell check says no) items really bugged me in DXHR too. It was things like that which pulled me out of the world, and made it overall a lesser experience than the original Deus Ex. Where the original not only allowed but encouraged coming up with ridiculous solutions to problems (LAM climbing, anyone?), DXHR kind of dipped a toe in that direction and then pulled back, eventually settling for giving the impression of freedom where in reality it was just a large number of pre-defined routes. It still worked well in its own way, but was lacking compared to its forebear, and something we're unlikely to see change in any future games, I fear.

That said, never had any issue with the iron sights, and I'm playing on PC. Might be because I don't use laser sights though, as I seem to recall it's to do with the two different sights being misaligned rather than iron sights being flat out wrong? I forget.

CyberP
31st Mar 2013, 03:01
The artificial ceilings and lack of interactable (is that a word? Spell check says no) items really bugged me in DXHR too. It was things like that which pulled me out of the world, and made it overall a lesser experience than the original Deus Ex.

Just "interactive" would have been fine, I think. And yes, two of the many, many little things that makes it the lesser game for me too.



(LAM climbing, anyone?),
.
LAM climbing is a bad example of emergent gameplay imo. Well, not exactly, I'll rephrase: it is most definitely a good example of emergent gameplay, but it's unrealistic, whilst DX itself is so heavily based around realism and therefore it is contradictory to one of the games strong themes. Can break the game with it also.
Giving a better example of emergent gameplay in DX is a tough one though since we don't know what the devs actually intended and what they did not. They predicted a lot of actions the player would do, it seems that way to me anyway. Still, if any game should win awards for most emergent possibilities, it's surely DX.

Even not killing Anna I am unsure of, since Gunther still reacts to it. I know a good example of emergent storytelling though- "OMG Daddy!" :D

Shralla
2nd Apr 2013, 20:04
By the end of the Picus level, I officially ran out of augmentations I cared enough to obtain and started stacking Praxis points. Good thing too, because I had to spend four of them on dermal armor because of that stupid boss fight, before I figured out that my stun gun was just as good as an EMP mine, and didn't hurt me also.

This is likely due in no small part to the fact that I started hacking everything some time ago instead of just using codes or finding other ways in. They really do just throw XP at you. It's totally broken. So Dishonored has a problem with being too strong on its encouragement to NOT kill anybody, and Deus Ex has a problem with being too strong in its encouragement to beat everybody up, but also to not kill them, because the former gets you more XP every single time.

I hope they fix the next one... I personally don't see any reason to reward XP for taking guards down AT ALL, considering that leaving them there and sneaking by them would be more difficult. Mark of the Ninja had a brilliant system to deal with that, where they rewarded XP for going "unseen" when a guard walks past your hiding place. Of course, you could then kill them and get the XP for that ALSO, so that was also a broken system, and that kind of feature would be almost impossible to implement in a 3D game.

CyberP
2nd Apr 2013, 20:22
snip.

I said it before and i'll say it again: Best XP system ever= Deus Ex. Insert WildcatPhoenix's sig here.
System Shock 2 was the first game with this perfect system as far as I am aware, only it was called "Cyber Modules".

Didn't Eidos Montreal get help with the RPG systems from Bethesda, IIRC? That explains why it is broken.


So Dishonored has a problem with being too strong on its encouragement to NOT kill anybody, .

It does?

Shralla
2nd Apr 2013, 21:05
If you kill people, you get the crappy ending, and nobody likes you. So yeah, pretty much.

MasterTaffer
2nd Apr 2013, 21:06
If you kill people, you get the crappy ending, and nobody likes you. So yeah, pretty much.

Also, you don't get invited to the Outsider's birthday party, which will have not one, but TWO clowns and a bouncy castle.

CyberP
2nd Apr 2013, 21:27
If you kill people, you get the crappy ending, and nobody likes you. So yeah, pretty much.

Suppose it depends on whether you care for the story. Dishonored's story I did not. Not much for the gameplay either. I preferred DX:HR tbh, which is a shame. I was hoping Arkane Would kick EM's ass, but EM came out the victor, even though their game was so heavily flawed.
DX:HR had more gameplay depth and wasn't piss easy. That's what matters most to me. Immersion, polish etc is icing on the cake.

Although Arx Fatalis>DX:HR...maybe.


Also, you don't get invited to the Outsider's birthday party, which will have not one, but TWO clowns and a bouncy castle.

Can I stop time, possess the clown, pop the bouncy castle & destroy the birthday cake, unpossess the clown by the cake with a sword in his hand, resume time and watch the madness unfold? :D

HERESY
2nd Apr 2013, 22:39
'Pedneault said the team is not currently planning to institute any changes made for the Director's Cut into the Xbox 360, PS3, or PC versions of the game.'

Don't know if it was posted but that's an excerpt from an article on penny arcade about the Wii U version.

Jerion
2nd Apr 2013, 22:45
'Pedneault said the team is not currently planning to institute any changes made for the Director's Cut into the Xbox 360, PS3, or PC versions of the game.'

Don't know if it was posted but that's an excerpt from an article on penny arcade about the Wii U version.

Raise a rally cry of support for bringing the DC content to the other platforms and it may happen.

Shralla
3rd Apr 2013, 00:47
I personally find Dishonored to be better at being a Deus Ex game than Human Revolution did. They stuck more to the tenets of allowing you to approach however you want, whereas in Human Revolution, the "run and gun" playstyle is penalized almost to the point of being impossible.

Stealth should be more difficult than killing everybody, and Dishonored did a bloody good job of that, while keeping the stealth at a reasonable difficulty. Deus Ex stealth is unbelievably easy, to the point that in order to make it even remotely interesting, you can't acquire any stealth upgrades at all. I haven't, and ghosting levels is still absurdly simple.

Dishonored also accomplished giving you more options with less choices. The amount of tools you're given in Dishonored number far less than in Deus Ex, but in terms of gameplay flexibility and the ability to use your tools in different situations, Dishonored again takes the cake. Human Revolution was full of abilities that were only useful in one or two situations. I haven't even seen a weak wall since I left Detroit, and I just came back during the riots. Redundant or borderline useless abilities are poor game design, and Human Revolution is full of them. I would rather have the relatively barebones approach of Dishonored, in which all your tools are useful, than the "fuller" approach of Human Revolution, in which you literally upgrade things because you have nothing better to spend your Praxis points on.

The AI, level design, guard placement, etc. were all also far superior in Dishonored. The game felt organic, while Human Revolution feels very much like a constructed experience. When I overhear people talking in Dishonored, I feel like it's because they were having a conversation and I happened to stumble upon it. In HR, I feel like it's because the developers put those guys there specifically so I would overhear that conversation, regardless of how true that fact is of Dishonored.

OPINIONS!

But seriously if we don't see these improvements as a patch, I just don't see how anybody could trust Eidos Montreal ever again. That's seriously just the ****tiest, shadiest, most viciously negligent thing I've seen game developers doing. "Oh hey guys, we know there were a bunch of problems with the game we released two years ago, and I know a lot of you were very loyal customers and purchased it at full price anyway, but I think that we'll just fix all those problems and release a new one on a new console and not give our already-paid customers any kind of benefit whatsoever."

Speaking of problems with Deus Ex. Anybody (potentially with an ATI card) notice weird flickering on the screen? Like sometimes you'll just "hit" a handful of black frames as you're poking around the level?

CyberP
3rd Apr 2013, 01:25
whereas in Human Revolution, the "run and gun" playstyle is penalized almost to the point of being impossible.
I disagree. Yes, the xp differences between the two playstyles is absurd, but as you said, a noticeable amount of the augs are useless anyway, so it doesn't really matter.
Yep, between the cover system/3rd person camera, plentiful stealth augs, radar by default, extra xp for stealth, 1 hit KO silent stealth weaponry & I win! takedowns, stealth is piss easy. The game is far superior played as a shooter, especially since most of the stealth weapons cannot be upgraded.

Not quite sure what you mean by impossible though. As a shooter on the hardest difficulty it can be a challenge but at no point should it be even close to impossible.


Stealth should be more difficult than killing everybody, and Dishonored did a bloody good job of that, while keeping the stealth at a reasonable difficulty. Deus Ex stealth is unbelievably easy, to the point that in order to make it even remotely interesting, you can't acquire any stealth upgrades at all. I haven't, and ghosting levels is still absurdly simple.

Yeah....I played Dishonored combat style. Was really easy on hard mode, opposite of DX:HR then for the playstyles.


Dishonored also accomplished giving you more options with less choices. The amount of tools you're given in Dishonored number far less than in Deus Ex, but in terms of gameplay flexibility and the ability to use your tools in different situations, Dishonored again takes the cake. Human Revolution was full of abilities that were only useful in one or two situations. I haven't even seen a weak wall since I left Detroit, and I just came back during the riots. Redundant or borderline useless abilities are poor game design, and Human Revolution is full of them.

Agreed that there are some pretty useless augs in HR, however the weapon upgrading in DX:HR is decent (for lethal), and there are some really stand out augs in HR: Heavy Lifting, Spring legs, Icarus, Faster Sprint, Hacking capture, cloak, hipfire accuracy, see through walls. Also, smash walls is one of the good augs. After Detroit: about 2-3 in Hengsha sewers. 2 in Hengsha district (one with hackers apartment). 3-4 in the Garden Pods, 0 in TYM, 4 or so in Picus.
These numbers are fairly accurate, I can picture them, glowing yellow. Ha ha.

Dishonored does not have an in-depth-ish weapon upgrading system, hacking (lockpicking alternative for dish), very few tools, few social opportunities....DX:HR probably had even more interactivity overall. Dish was too barebones. Combine that with too easy combat and level traversing/platforming thanks to blink for one unsatisfied customer here. I'll admit I enjoyed the hell out of blink, whilst hating it for minimizing the challenges of traversing a level or getting behind somebody for an easy kill, even in combat (though that was terribly fun too, it's so conflicting).



I would rather have the relatively barebones approach of Dishonored, in which all your tools are useful, than the "fuller" approach of Human Revolution, in which you literally upgrade things because you have nothing better to spend your Praxis points on.

Only applies to the augs though, and only halfway through the game when you run out of worthy aug choices...Well, the hacking is not much of a choice either. My last playthrough halfway through the game I just abused AUD's or blew the door off it's hinges because hacking is overused by the level designers and xp rewards are pointless once you find out half the augs are useless. Tbh I was getting a little sick of the game by that point. Combat is almost spot on though, I continued for that alone.


The AI, level design, guard placement, etc. were all also far superior in Dishonored. The game felt organic, while Human Revolution feels very much like a constructed experience. When I overhear people talking in Dishonored, I feel like it's because they were having a conversation and I happened to stumble upon it. In HR, I feel like it's because the developers put those guys there specifically so I would overhear that conversation, regardless of how true that fact is of Dishonored.

The AI did have it's dumb moments in combat in Dish, but agreed on the rest. Actually I'm not sure about the enemy conversations of HR, been a while since I done any sneaking in HR and doubt I ever will again. As for the general NPC to NPC convos such as in Detroit...some were pretty good, if only almost all of them didn't discuss the same subject over & over.

MasterTaffer
3rd Apr 2013, 16:50
Trailer for the Director's Cut edition was uploaded today.


7_PxB4ZxK2o

68_pie
3rd Apr 2013, 16:59
Lol at trailer man voice.

Count D
3rd Apr 2013, 17:01
I second that.
Also: EM, no Director's Cut on PC - no future purchases from me. I can forgive you screwing me over once, but this Human Defiance thing was too much.

MasterTaffer
3rd Apr 2013, 17:06
Yeah, the early 90s movie trailer style voice over is a bit awkward. I would have liked to see more of the gamepad functionality there, personally.

Spyhopping
3rd Apr 2013, 18:06
Yeah, same response here too. They should have got Sarif's voice actor in to do it! (Steven Shellen)

Great CGI, the rest of the trailer was good to watch. Shan't be purchasing though, don't have the console and I'm quite content with my AE copy.

xaduha2
3rd Apr 2013, 20:24
nevermind

Shralla
3rd Apr 2013, 20:51
I just don't really see any reason to give more money to a company that has officially shown that they don't give a **** about their paying customers, and are more concerned with the happiness of people who haven't given them any money yet.

I just don't know how they can honestly say "Yeah the game was broken, so we're making this new version that fixes it. What? Fixing the copies we already sold? Lol where's the money in that?"

I mean seriously.

CyberP
3rd Apr 2013, 21:05
I just don't really see any reason to give more money to a company that has officially shown that they don't give a **** about their paying customers, and are more concerned with the happiness of people who haven't given them any money yet.

I just don't know how they can honestly say "Yeah the game was broken, so we're making this new version that fixes it. What? Fixing the copies we already sold? Lol where's the money in that?"

I mean seriously.

Fixing the copies they already sold takes money out of eidos' pocket. $40.000 to release a patch on XBOX & PS3 according to Tim Schafer. http://www.thetechgame.com/News/article/sid=3012.html
Also the time & money "wasted" fixing these problems.

Now if it was released without these problems in the first place, that would have been better. But deadlines yada yada.
The game will always be considered broken by me anyway. flawed design and execution, but DX:HR is definitely not alone here in the "AAA" market. DX:HR is still a great game regardless of being "broken"...somehow.

But NEONFISH, please don't pirate, that only makes things worse. You can't fight fire with fire. Just say you'll take your business elsewhere.

HERESY
3rd Apr 2013, 22:42
Just watched the trailer for the Wii U version. Looks good but the narrator didn't do a good job. That guy sounds like he's out of the 80's or 90's. He's not "selling" the game at all.

3rdmillhouse
5th Apr 2013, 15:36
I just heard that the improvements are exclusive to the WiiU. :(

PS: I'd totally pay for those improvements.

3rdmillhouse
5th Apr 2013, 15:44
You can't fight fire with fire.

As a matter of fact, it is possible to fight fire with fire. Ask any firefighter about controlled or prescribed burning.

ZakKa89
5th Apr 2013, 15:46
hahahaha wow so much hate

3rdmillhouse
5th Apr 2013, 21:57
hahahaha wow so much hate

Oh yeah, totally, and a righteous one. We were the ones that made this game a commercial success; if anything, it's our platforms that should be getting that extra-content, even if we are charged for it.

CyberP
5th Apr 2013, 22:26
Oh yeah, totally, and a righteous one. We were the ones that made this game a commercial success; if anything, it's our platforms that should be getting that extra-content, even if we are charged for it.

Well, I as an individual told friends about the game before release, posted previews on a forum I visited at the time, bought the game, TML & extra content that was pulled from the game. But tbh I don't really care, most of the content doesn't appeal to me. Some of the new features are really good, others I think would make for a worse experience. Some of the streamlining makes sense, others just make the game easier.
Of course I cannot really say what is truly good or not without hands-on time.

Overall it is a big troll project though, but hey, who knows, maybe they will release on the other platforms in the future.
Bear in mind some of the changes are specifically to suit the functionality of the WiiU though, and not possible on the other platforms.

Doom972
6th Apr 2013, 17:08
Fixing the copies they already sold takes money out of eidos' pocket. $40.000 to release a patch on XBOX & PS3 according to Tim Schafer. http://www.thetechgame.com/News/article/sid=3012.html
Also the time & money "wasted" fixing these problems.

Now if it was released without these problems in the first place, that would have been better. But deadlines yada yada.
The game will always be considered broken by me anyway. flawed design and execution, but DX:HR is definitely not alone here in the "AAA" market. DX:HR is still a great game regardless of being "broken"...somehow.

But NEONFISH, please don't pirate, that only makes things worse. You can't fight fire with fire. Just say you'll take your business elsewhere.

Businesses do it all the time. It's called Customer Retention. You spend resources to make sure that customers remain happy and keep buying your goods and services in the future, so that you can make a bigger profit. As a customer who bought their product, I feel screwed over by this move and won't buy anything else of theirs until they do the right thing.

Shralla
6th Apr 2013, 18:00
Businesses do it all the time. It's called Customer Retention. You spend resources to make sure that customers remain happy and keep buying your goods and services in the future, so that you can make a bigger profit. As a customer who bought their product, I feel screwed over by this move and won't buy anything else of theirs until they do the right thing.

Ditto. I'm boycotting Thief until they shape the hell up, and I know that my opinion doesn't hold as much weight as all the people on facebook who are excited about it, but still. I was thinking about getting Thief and now there's no chance, and the same goes for anything else coming from Eidos Montreal, and maybe even Eidos in general or even Square Enix.

Ilves
6th Apr 2013, 18:44
^^^ I'd say punish the publisher, not the studio. Who'd you think brokered the WiiU exclusivity anyway, EM or Eidos/Square Enix?

Haven't seen anything that rules out this being a timed exclusive, either.

Doom972
6th Apr 2013, 19:02
^^^ I'd say punish the publisher, not the studio. Who'd you think brokered the Wii U exclusivity anyay, EM or Eidos/Square Enix?

Haven't seen anything that rules out this being a timed exclusive, either.

Why shouldn't we blame both? It's still a game developed by Eidos Montreal and if they put their name on it, they are responsible for it, whether it's by a contractual agreement or not shouldn't be our concern.

We still don't know whether or not it really is exclusive to the WiiU, but since they haven't said anything about a Director's Cut update for other platforms up until now, it raises a concern based on past experience.

Tverdyj
6th Apr 2013, 19:24
Well, I as an individual told friends about the game before release, posted previews on a forum I visited at the time, bought the game, TML & extra content that was pulled from the game. But tbh I don't really care, most of the content doesn't appeal to me. Some of the new features are really good, others I think would make for a worse experience. Some of the streamlining makes sense, others just make the game easier.
Of course I cannot really say what is truly good or not without hands-on time.

Overall it is a big troll project though, but hey, who knows, maybe they will release on the other platforms in the future.
Bear in mind some of the changes are specifically to suit the functionality of the WiiU though, and not possible on the other platforms.

The one change everyone will agree on is beneficial (boss fights) isn't though.

I'd like a patch adressing this, if nothing else.

Ilves
6th Apr 2013, 19:32
Why shouldn't we blame both?

Because mainstream gaming is in a rut and I hold the naive view that publishers are ruthless $$$ grabbing suits that smother the true creativity of studios. Read the Trenches, it's absolutely harrowing.

On the other hand, nothing makes as clear a statement as boycotting specific titles that bring particularly nasty business practices, like SimCity's always online crap, or any day 1 on disk DLC.

CyberP
6th Apr 2013, 19:33
The one change everyone will agree on is beneficial (boss fights) isn't though.

I'd like a patch adressing this, if nothing else.

Tbh boss fights are the least of my concerns (but still important, of course).
Also as Shralla said, they should fix the actual bugs first.

Doom972
6th Apr 2013, 20:43
Because mainstream gaming is in a rut and I hold the naive view that publishers are ruthless $$$ grabbing suits that smother the true creativity of studios. Read the Trenches, it's absolutely harrowing.

On the other hand, nothing makes as clear a statement as boycotting specific titles that bring particularly nasty business practices, like SimCity's always online crap, or any day 1 on disk DLC.

No offense, but it is naive. Eidos Montreal aren't slaves and they don't do anything they haven't chosen to do. Publishers would like us to think this way, because this way they know that no matter how much they screw us, we'll keep buying their games because of the poor little developer. If we don't enable them, we won't keep getting screwed over so much.

As for mainstream gaming being in a rut, don't worry. We can slowly see more developers developing towards niche audiences, since the mainstream is a bit fickle, plus many of those over-budgeted games are not as profitable as they used to be. Also, indie games have gotten really good lately.

Ilves
6th Apr 2013, 21:12
No offense, but it is naive. Eidos Montreal aren't slaves and they don't do anything they haven't chosen to do.

Non taken. :D But when you say EM, you think of the decision making suits on top; I think of the individual, talented creative folk with a passion for game making, who I imagine are happy at the chance to deliver the ultimate, super polished version of HR, and would gladly distribute it to as many platforms as possible, but eventually have no say in this.


As for mainstream gaming being in a rut, don't worry. We can slowly see more developers developing towards niche audiences, since the mainstream is a bit fickle, plus many of those over-budgeted games are not as profitable as they used to be. Also, indie games have gotten really good lately.

You know I was actually contemplating my rut statement while doing the dishes just now, and I was happy to come to the conclusion that indeed things probably aren't so grim, particularly on the indy/kickstarter front. Hopefully the trend will trickle down (up?) to the triple A league to remedy the slew of recent titles that are unforgivably rushed, unpolished and marred by filthy business practices.

Doom972
6th Apr 2013, 21:43
Non taken. :D But when you say EM, you think of the decision making suits on top; I think of the individual, talented creative folk with a passion for game making, who I imagine are happy at the chance to deliver the ultimate, super polished version of HR, and would gladly distribute it to as many platforms as possible, but eventually have no say in this.



You know I was actually contemplating my rut statement while doing the dishes just now, and I was happy to come to the conclusion that indeed things probably aren't so grim, particularly on the indy/kickstarter front. Hopefully the trend will trickle down (up?) to the triple A league to remedy the slew of recent titles that are unforgivably rushed, unpolished and marred by filthy business practices.

I used to think like you, but eventually I learned to view companies as entities, rather than groups of individuals. When a "suit" makes a decision, he makes it because it's his job to make the decision, like a coder's job is to code. if either of them doesn't do his job right, both of them will feel the consequences.

Publishers (and non-gaming related big companies) thrive on people who separate the simple worker from the "suit", because it gives them a free pass to screw over customers. I won't enable them even if it means that a hard-working talented developer will have to look for another job.

Kamikave
11th Apr 2013, 20:33
If EM thinks I'm gonna buy a Wii U to play a "perfect" version of DX, they're sorely mistaken. From my point of view, the Wii U doesn't sell well. What's the point of making Director's Cut a Wii U exclusive ? I call that digging your own grave.
Now, If they don't plan on or can't release it on PC, it's their loss, not mine. I'm not playing the game anymore, I've done everything I could think of already. But I'd be interested in trying a polished version like the director's Cut... on PC.

bobwalt
12th Jun 2013, 17:57
I truly hope that those of us who purchased DeusEx:HR when it first came will at least get a get a discount. Having to pay $60 would be a bit raw. Also doesn't SmartGlass only work with the Xbox 360? From the way they are talking about it like it will work with the PC version of the game. Does anyone know if this is true? If it is that would be cool. BTW - just so you know Microsoft has a version of SmartGlass for all three mobile OSes.

Doom972
12th Jun 2013, 19:57
If they want to get their fanbase back, they should probably just patch it in.
If they won't: Steam sometimes offers an upgrade price for those who have the older edition of a game. I remember it being the case with Magic: The Gathering: Duels of the Planewalkers 2013 and Doom 3 BFG Edition. Of course, that depends on the publisher.

Count D
13th Jun 2013, 04:53
If they want to get their fanbase back, they should probably just patch it in.
If they won't: Steam sometimes offers an upgrade price for those who have the older edition of a game. I remember it being the case with Magic: The Gathering: Duels of the Planewalkers 2013 and Doom 3 BFG Edition. Of course, that depends on the publisher.

I'd not go as far as to say D3BFG had it. I mean, it was just a 30% discount from a full price.

SageSavage
13th Jun 2013, 08:31
I won't buy it again. The new stuff isn't worth it, I think.

Doom972
13th Jun 2013, 21:10
I'd not go as far as to say D3BFG had it. I mean, it was just a 30% discount from a full price.

I never said it was a good deal. IIRC it was available only to those who already had Doom3. The game wasn't worth it for me even at a lower price, so I just ignored it. Doom 3 + mods is much better.

Imperator
22nd Jun 2013, 14:05
I'd buy this as DLC but the only way I'd pay full price a second time is if they included the axed content from India.

Mustermann
24th Jun 2013, 09:35
To answer the thread topic: No, unless somebody is forcing you with a gun, it's your choice entirely whether to open the wallet and buy this game.

In my view, the updates are just that, updates. And in this day and age, I expect them to be a patch for free, not going to pay for something that should be done properly in the first place. They can charge $40-$60 for the PC version, I doubt they find too many takers and they'll alienate alot of fans in the long run, if they think it's worth the risk.

AlexOfSpades
24th Jun 2013, 14:24
Can we please keep this discussion over the Director's Cut thread? I remember seeing this topic appear there from time to time.

lolwot
24th Jun 2013, 15:37
Can we please keep this discussion over the Director's Cut thread? I remember seeing this topic appear there from time to time.

Why contain it? S'cool.

hybridex
29th Jun 2013, 19:32
I won't buy it again. The new stuff isn't worth it, I think.

Rent it from gamefly or something and try it out first..

Shralla
29th Jun 2013, 19:53
Rent it from gamefly or something and try it out first..

That totally works for PC games also.

chabbles
1st Jul 2013, 20:36
So the directors cut is now releasing on ps3 and 360 too

http://www.playstationlifestyle.net/2013/07/01/deus-ex-human-revolution-directors-cut-dated-for-september-30th-and-priced-at-29-99-by-gamestop/

Psychomorph
6th Jul 2013, 02:51
PC release date please!

I started to replay DX3 some months ago, but didn't continue, but want to, but must wait for the Director's Cut.



Now if only they would implement a lean function along with first person take downs!

I craved so much for this in DX3! I felt like castrated on immersion without the ability to lean. Perhaps it is my soul being corrupted by the original Thief games, but 1st person stealth must have certain realism features or it feels like fighting a stale system too much instead of doing what is simply natural in a fully immersive 1st person environment.




Read Eurogamer article (http://forums.eidosgames.com/showpost.php?p=1886898&postcount=11) already, the game will have more improvements than that: engine, AI, UI, audio comments, The Missing Link will be inside the game.

I love Missing Link, awesome that you got it all put together. I like it how you treat DX3 as your flagship game and take care of it years after. A bit like Valve and Half-Life 2, they still use their 9 years old game for the Oculus Rift demos. That's love, that's how games must be made. Needless to say the Episodic content for HL2, which unfortunately was discontinued.

The boss fights nearly made me quit game in DX3, great that this was taken care of. The Missing Link boss fight was awesome.

Psychomorph
6th Jul 2013, 04:22
I also hope for Oculus Rift support. I'd love to replay DX3-DC once the Rift is available.

hellrasinbrasin
27th Jul 2013, 12:25
And we now have a release date for Multi-Platform release of Deus Ex Human Revolution Directors Cut.
November 15, 2013.

:worship:

Darthassin
27th Jul 2013, 13:08
And we now have a release date for Multi-Platform release of Deus Ex Human Revolution Directors Cut.
November 15, 2013.

:worship:

Source?

hellrasinbrasin
27th Jul 2013, 16:41
Source?

http://www.amazon.com/Deus-Human-Revolution-Directors-Playstation-3/dp/B00DJ42BUQ/ref=sr_1_3_title_2?s=videogames&ie=UTF8&qid=1374943269&sr=1-3&keywords=Deus+Ex+Human+Revolution

Shralla
27th Jul 2013, 20:03
Using Amazon as a release date source, really? That means nothing.

HERESY
27th Jul 2013, 20:05
Using Amazon as a release date source, really? That means nothing.

I think it's legit. Even so, if the price is more they'll give it to you at the preorder price. If it's less you get it for the lesser price.

Shralla
27th Jul 2013, 23:41
They were talking about the release date, not the price.

chabbles
28th Jul 2013, 00:32
Does anyone know if the engine or visuals have been tweaked for the Directors cut, on ps3/360 and pc ?

HERESY
28th Jul 2013, 02:23
They were talking about the release date, not the price.

Who said they weren't talking about the release date? You say it means nothing and I said I think it's legit. I then say "even so" and start talking about how preorder prices are subject to change.

You get it now?


Does anyone know if the engine or visuals have been tweaked for the Directors cut, on ps3/360 and pc ?

I don't see why they wouldn't be.