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TehDude
2nd Sep 2011, 09:11
There have been a few of these threads already made, however they seem to be created by people attempting to both bash Human Revolution and hold the original Deus Ex up as some kind of perfect title, with attempts at a discussion shot down by bias. I was hoping to side step that this time, and a get a real discussion on Deus Ex: Human Revolution rolling.

Anyway, I feel it needs to be said that Deus Ex, while still an absolutely amazing game, was far from perfect when it was released. Nostalgia blinds. Since the year 2000, its gameplay has held up while its visuals and presentation elements have painfully aged. It wasn't then - nor is it now - perfect.


http://www.gamehead.com.au/images/pc_downloads/screenshots/ce6d9e5a1961814edb7833e0b3dd1224/original/1.jpg

I love it to death, but damn - its uglier than my wife.

Human Revolution, at least to me, is the Deus Ex of our age. It mimics an eleven year old game that was built when 'bump mapping' required graph paper and a grey-lead pencil, and yet it schools most of the current generation in just about every regard because it still adheres to the primary principles that Deus Ex adhered to; those of the 'immersive simulation' sub-genre pioneered by Looking Glass Studio.
In my opinion, while HR's writing isn't as exploratory philosophy-wise as the original Deus Ex, it's writing feels far more natural, and the game world resonates as a result. In the original Deus Ex, for example, the NSF leader atop the Statue of Liberty plunged headlong into a ramble about politics. It was random, and felt forced. Human Revolution's dialogue almost always feels, at the very least, natural. This is more important to the immersion factor, at least to me.
Furthermore, Deus Ex had some terrific characters, but they were simply that; 'characters'. HR has people; David Sarif is a terrifically developed character, however even other characters like Tong are still somewhat well developed and pack a tonne of personality. When I realised what the Harvester's actually were, I sat for a moment; I hadn't thought of that particular scenario when playing Deus Ex, and the implications were thought provoking.
To me, the philosophy is explored in a more modern technique; like Half-Life, HR's stuff is all in the world, rather than explained or written. Its there if you're willing to look for it.


http://www.2d-x.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Deus-Ex-Human-Revolution.jpg

Pictured: philosophy.

Lastly, I wanted to touch on the core gameplay. The shooting and stealth of the original Deus Ex were serviceable; the shooting, at least for me, always felt weak. In HR, however, they're far more polished, and it makes for a better moment-to-moment experience.

The only real complaint I have with HR is the damn Boss Fights. These fights are responsible for the biggest issue; XP Balance. A Stealth playthrough practically allows you to have all of the augmentations for one character - something the original Deus Ex wisely avoided. This is because the game needs to ensure that you can steal deal with those Boss Fights if your hacking/stealth focused, and so gives you enough XP to ensure you can snag a few combat Augs to help out. Deus Ex didn't really lean towards 'combat' or 'stealth'. HR heavily leans towards stealth, and it dulls the experience somewhat.

Overall, I think Human Revolution is the best game I've played since the original Deus Ex. The original will always have a special place in my heart, and I will never uninstall the damn thing from my harddrive or delete its soundtrack from my iPod. But, Human Revolution - at least to me - stands beside it as an equal. Its not perfect, and it has its flaws, but so did the original.


http://onlivefans.com/news/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/deus-ex-human-revolution-release.jpg
Was it good for you?

What did everyone else honestly think of Human Revolution, and why? :scratch:

jtr7
2nd Sep 2011, 09:35
Eh?

Ashpolt
2nd Sep 2011, 09:40
There have been a few of these threads already made, however they seem to be created by people attempting to both bash Human Revolution and hold the original Deus Ex up as some kind of perfect title, with attempts at a discussion shot down by bias. I was hoping to side step that this time, and a get a real discussion on Deus Ex: Human Revolution rolling.

Jesus, terrible way to start a thread. If you want discussion - and honest discussion, as you ask for in the last line of your post - you have to accept that people are capable of having different opinions to yours without it being purely down to bias.

I don't think I've seen anyone on here claim that the original Deus Ex was perfect in the 3 years I've been on here - even its most staunch advocates (such as myself) still recognise a number of flaws. Saying that people are calling it a "perfect title" is just a lazy way to try and make those who you disagree with seem irrational, and a transparent attempt to de-legitimise any suggestion that DXHR may not be as good as the original. And sadly, this lazy straw-man nonsense is not limited to you, it's quite prevalent on these forums.

You ask for a "real" discussion with "honest" opinions - then you're going to have to accept that not everyone is going to agree with you.

TehDude
2nd Sep 2011, 09:58
Forgive me, I didn't mean to imply that anyone who disagreed with me was wrong, only that people claiming to want to talk about HR's were using a smoke screen to blindly bash it.
If someone has a different opinion than mine, terrific - let them post it and explain their point of view. That's what I want. I love Deus Ex, but I can't honestly say I've seen everything its got - nor have I delved into its philosophical musings as deep as others here. Others are going to have seen, felt and understood things in Deus Ex differently, and this would undoubtedly have an impact on their opinion of HR. I'd like to hear it. Well, read it. :nut:

As for the straw-man argument claim, I think you're confusing my statement. I'm not saying "if you think Deus Ex is better than HR you're wrong" nor did I mean to imply such; my apologies if that's the way it came across. I simply meant to say that "Deus Ex isn't perfect, so please don't simply day something like 'HR isn't DX, therefore DX is better than HR, I don't need to explain why'".
I'll happily post a screenshot of my desktop showing the Deus Ex logo sitting on my desktop. Its been there for eleven years, and it'll be there for another eleven (probably not, but I like to exaggerate).

I've played all the DX games, and liked them all (though Invisible War is my least favourite).
All I wanted to do is talk to others who enjoyed DX and HR, and discuss what we liked and what we didn't. That's why I posted this on the forums. If you this post is really as bad you claim, request it be locked and that'll be the end of it.
I'm new here, I don't have to post.

Jason Parker
2nd Sep 2011, 09:59
I enjoyed and still enjoy playing DX:HR. The 89 point Metascore rating on steam and the high 80s ratings in most magazines are more than justified. DX:HR seen for itself for what it is is a great game. There's no question about that. Even most of the people I've seen here saying it's no match to the original admit that besides that it's still a great or even awesome game.

In one of the other numerous threads I already said that living up to the legend that the original has grown into is almost impossible. I mean for most of us playing the Original is a childhood memory. We've discussed ways of handling certain situation in breaks at school with our friends. There's no possibility a new game todate can deliver that because it's past.

Still when looked at objectively there are at least two things Deus Ex clearly handled better in my opinion: Melee Combat and decision making regarding the storyline (Multipathing main story arc). The latter of those points leads to me saying that the original despite of it's aged visuals is still the better of the two but DX:HR is close behind. Very close.

But to me it is pretty obvious that the frame of how the story continues from DX:HR is already there at EM and they have plans for sequels based upon DX:HR continueing adams story. Which leaves me thinking if that's the reason for having not much multipathing in the first game of a series. Because honestly: I believe that the multipathing, multiending approach and the decision to continue the story from one canonical ending of the first game were one of many things that lead to IW being a fail in the view of many.

That said I also believe that having various endings for DX:HR was barely more than a concession to us die hard oldschool Deus Ex fans. When a complete series of say three games is planned then to me it totaly makes sense to have a straight forward linear story in the first part to get everyone on the same level of information regarding the game world per se and to properly introduce the protagonist and the characters he's close to, The multi pathing stuff then can start in part two when the protagonist switches from pursuing only his personal story to unraveling the bigger picture of things. And part three should start from whatever ending was chosen in part two in fact every decision made in part two should have impact on what happens in part three (this is how IW should have handled things back in the day).

Brockxz
2nd Sep 2011, 10:03
TehDude, why you had to make another topic when there is already one topic you could put in your thoughts about game: http://forums.eidosgames.com/showthread.php?t=120648

Ashpolt
2nd Sep 2011, 10:13
Forgive me, I didn't mean to imply that anyone who disagreed with me was wrong, only that people claiming to want to talk about HR's were using a smoke screen to blindly bash it.

Where on this forum has it been "blindly bashed"? Why is that bashing - if and when it is occurring - blind? I've seen people criticising it, sure, and I've seen a small number of people criticising it to a degree that I may think it doesn't deserve, but as far as I've seen it's been well reasoned criticism - things like "I feel DXHR's static environment was detrimental to immersion" rather than "LOLOLO DXHR SUCKS, DX IS KING!"


As for the straw-man argument claim, I think you're confusing my statement. I'm not saying "if you think Deus Ex is better than HR you're wrong" nor did I mean to imply such; my apologies if that's the way it came across. I simply meant to say that "Deus Ex isn't perfect, so please don't simply day something like 'HR isn't DX, therefore DX is better than HR, I don't need to explain why'".

This is exactly the kind of straw man I'm talking about. I didn't say that, and other than maybe one over-zealous poster, I haven't seen anyone say that. People are more than willing to admit the flaws of the original Deus Ex, and even that, in some areas, DXHR improves upon those flaws. People aren't saying "The original Deus Ex was perfect" or "X, Y and Z was a bad choice in DXHR only because it's different to the original Deus Ex" - the only time these claims are being made is when people who prefer DXHR to the original (a valid viewpoint) want to exaggerate and therefore de-legitimise the opposite view. It's putting words in people's mouth and then criticising their view based on the words you said.

ZakKa89
2nd Sep 2011, 10:39
There way too many threads like this...

-what did the dx1 fans think?
-what did forum regulars think?
- Was this good for deus ex?

And more... There is a reviews and opininon sticky! Post there please