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View Full Version : Question for the Oldschool DX fans DX vs. DX:HR



OldSchooldenton
29th Aug 2011, 01:40
ok im from the oldergeneration, well mid 20 lol but i already feel old when i check newer dumped down crap games compared with the older ones. no i dont want to spam but you have to be very naive not to see how much variety, love, and complexity we had in games and now got dumped down games and many more copies :(.

let's get to the topic.

i bought DX when it came out, played it a couple of times and i never was and still am not a graphic whore, i think DX already looked great, so graphic aspect aside, let'S get into gameplay. pardon me i played a longer time no DX but planned already to do this year again (too much to work, other things to do, girl and so on :/ ) so i cannot remember my beloved DX game always!

so when DX2 was announced and we had some PC gameplay i was like "WOAH" finally! a new successor on its way but in my opinion DX2 was everywhere dumped down, the story was laughable, poor jc denton, what have they done. there were some nice parts and the music was different but it was also very nice done! so DX2 is for me a dumped down DX in every aspect and only ok compared to DX which is just awesome a pure classic and i dont know how they could have made this DX2 so **** as they knew most DX fans are more complex gaming fans and the consoles also had DX1! so it is not their fault.

ok i leave out DX2 now.....

what i already didnt like about DX:HR (i had no faith in it as the bad DX2 was in my mind + newer games cannot be so great and complex like in the past do they?!?! i lost nearly all faith in it!):

- dlc crap with extra weapns
-> come one, wtf! DX is a free of choice game, why should others get some more stuff and maybe advantage? stupid really even if the items are not dramatical!

- jensens voice
-> too much extra coolness.... i dont like his voice...

- melee quickkills
-> this i cannot understand, i want to be able to kill with different melee weapons and decide where to hit, defend etc. and not let a quickbutton do it, again a complexity point removed = simpler

- regenerative health
-> again wtf? i want to eat chocoloate, chips, nice proteinpacks etc. and restore my health, if im nearly dying I AM and cannot be magically restored..... also it's a prequel, why do prequels mostly are more advanced? cause they are released later? then do it more realistical in the world of the game.

well those points were my big concerns cause more you cannot know of trailers and so on. but those already got on my nerves.

so my questions now, the music seems to be of course not in the old school soundstyle but it sounded promising with a new touch! nice.
the style looks also nice.

how is this game compared to DX1? dumped down? simpler? or DX1 taken + enhancements? or DX1 taken, aspects removed/simpler/dumped down + enhancements?

i will buy this game a bit later but im curious! it seems what i saw so far to be better than DX2, better than most newer games and a bit more complex again but it seems not to be on the same level or more added than DX1.

it's sad cause why cant they do games on the same level as in the past?....... i dont talk about the graphics.

LeMoN_LiMe
29th Aug 2011, 01:44
tl;dr :thumb:

OldSchooldenton
29th Aug 2011, 01:50
tl;dr :thumb:

please then dont reply, nobody forces you and you dont have to, as you are no mod or whoever. ok last time i reply to a spammer or give a mention at all.

Grunthex
29th Aug 2011, 01:57
- regenerative health
-> again wtf? i want to eat chocoloate, chips, nice proteinpacks etc. and restore my health, if im nearly dying I AM and cannot be magically restored..... also it's a prequel, why do prequels mostly are more advanced? cause they are released later? then do it more realistical in the world of the game.


Right. Because when someone shoots you, popping open 3 chocolate bars and a bag of Frito-Lays should close those wounds right up! If you want realistic, gunshots, electrical burns and the like should all require weeks to months of healing time, probably in a hospital. Of course, that means you fail all missions, but hey, let's be more realistical (sic)!

OldSchooldenton
29th Aug 2011, 02:00
Right. Because when someone shoots you, popping open 3 chocolate bars and a bag of Frito-Lays should close those wounds right up! If you want realistic, gunshots, electrical burns and the like should all require weeks to months of healing time, probably in a hospital. Of course, that means you fail all missions, but hey, let's be more realistical (sic)!

where did i say realistical for this aspect? (sic)
seems you are a young gamer again too, no idea of what fun it is to collect items whoich regenerate health in different amounts and find gimmicks like snacks etc. nah you want it more simple, just wait a few secs and regenerate. again, simpler and takes aways items and managing. it's too hard to do for newer gamers i think, im glad older gamers could do that and still could live in reality without so many tutorials :D.

Nebular
29th Aug 2011, 02:07
I was a huge fan of the first game and have to say I loved Human Revolution. It's not the abomination that Invisible War was. While I would have liked a few melee weapons to spice up some of the melee take downs, and would really have like the ability to fight someone hand-to-hand when you botch the timing on a take down, it's not that big of a deal. You learn to improvise - like picking up a vending machine and throwing it at the guy instead.

Things like regenerative health and energy were done to mitigate the downtime you have. No more sitting at 2% health, frantically searching around for something to eat so you can move on. You can still get things like pain killers and alcohol, but they'll increase your health above 100 to simulate dulling the pain. I think it works really well. One could write it off as nanomachines in your body that repair the damage. It makes more sense than a candy bar instantly closing up a gunshot wound.

While Jensen's voice is a little ... cliche (why must all heroes now have raspy or gravely voices) ... it never gets to the point of being grating, and the majority of the other voices are very good.

I was put off by a couple of the preview videos as well but was blown away by the final product. This really does feel like the original. These guys have actually done their homework and turned out a good game.

Ragequit
29th Aug 2011, 04:19
I didn't look at any tutorials, I doubt they were very useful as I got by most of the game without much trouble

Daedatheus
29th Aug 2011, 04:38
One could write it off as nanomachines in your body that repair the damage. It makes more sense than a candy bar instantly closing up a gunshot wound.

Actually, it's explained by Pritchard at one point I think, how your medical aug kicks in when you're hurt, and if you check it out on your aug screen, you can see the "Sentinel" health system which is basically the in-game excuse for auto health regen.

Arksun
29th Aug 2011, 12:56
I'm an old school die hard DX1 gamer too, and I had 'some' of your concerns before buying the game.

All those concerns have now dissapeared. The only thing that bothers me still is the occassional stuttering issue on the PC version. That aside, the regen health is absolutely spot on. This is much tougher than the first one, even on normal difficulty if you just get shot a few times thats it you're dead. So whilst the idea of regen may feel bad to you, trust me, they nailed it and I love it now.

As for highlighting?. Yeah its still a bit too strong for my tastes so I play with it disabled, this works really well, when you're close to useable object it still kinda highlights with little info on screen which is perfect, no silly super glowing orange wireframe.

Oh and I love Jensens voice, thats the guys real voice btw. The dialogue has turned out a LOT better than I thought it was gonna be from the online trailers that came before it was released.

In short, just buy it. I just finally reached Hengsha and ..well....mind <- BLOWN.

OldSchooldenton
30th Aug 2011, 12:21
so would you say it gets near DX1?

does it make things better?

what did you miss as options, aspects, gameplay mechanics from DX1?

ZakKa89
30th Aug 2011, 12:35
Buy the damn game and see for yourself. I think it does a lot of things better than the first Deus Ex, and defintely looks and feels and plays like a Deus Ex game. It's amazing.

I didn't miss any gameplay mechanics from the first Deus Ex. They made the hacking better, there are still consumables for your health (which regenerates very slow).

This game is Deus Ex with improved gameplay. Improved stealth, improved hacking and improved visuals (game is gorgeous because of the art direction). Even improved social elements, the social battles are very good. I feel like there is less dialoague with random people about bigger topics though.

Jason Parker
30th Aug 2011, 12:58
I'm through the game and a third through second playthrough. HR perfectly catches the feel of DX 1. It's like being back in DX 1 just with a better look. On the autoheal I agree with arksun. It's spot on and fits into the game. But still HR is close but does not fully reach the complexity of DX 1. Especialy storywise. It's a well told all worth to play storyline, the quality of the storytelling in this game is comparable to Mass Effect. But on the complexity and decision making department it is nowhere near the original.

On a more ganeral note about games: I totaly agree with you that in the course of the last 15 years gaming was so dumped down on the complexity side and so forced into being mainstreamy, that 90% of games coming out nowadays feel barely more than interactive movies.

Being an outsider with no real insight whatsoever into the gaming industry I feel this is by huge part caused by the fact that Developers are too dependant on Publishers to get the money for making a game. While in the early days of gaming that wasn't that huge of a problem as publishers and Developers alike shared the goal to first and foremost get out a great and entertaining game, nowadays this dependency is a huge problem as the publishers top priority nowadays is to make the most possibly amount of money with a game and that leads them to forcing deadlines upon their Developers who in turn are then forced to cut content and the publisher is happy about any cut out content as that can be made into extra money by throwing out DLCs. Also for the big AAA+ games they seem to throw about the same amount of money into advertising as they put into development which would not be nearly as needed if they'd just focus all resources into making a great game. Old day hits like the original DX, Half-Life 2 and few others proved that not much advertising is needed if the game is great.

I don't give much on the argument, that the bills of the dev team must be paid. Granted. That's fine with me and I'd happily pay for a game if I didn't have the subtle feeling that the biggest amount of the money I pay goes straight into the wallets of the Publisher's shareholders who don't give the slightest **** about the game or the customers.

CarpeNukemXVIII
30th Aug 2011, 13:39
Couldn't disagree more. The game is far and away better than DX, and I am one of those gamers that played it, and replayed a bunch more, when it first came out. Regen health works better here than most games that use it. Regen is slow, and you die fast. This means you still need to take pain killers and eat/drink to stay alive in a firefight. It's a improvement over both regen and health pack systems. HR had a better story, characters, and gameplay than DX. Stealth was more fun, and so was going around guns blazing. The augs were tons more fun to use vas well. I love DX just as much as the next guy, but I'm not going to let being a cynic or nostalgic ruin what is one of the best games this generation has put out.

flipperflopper
30th Aug 2011, 14:08
I see DX:HR as a halfway point between IW and the original in terms immersion/overall game.
Don't take me wrong DX:HR is good attempt and executes a lot of things nicely.
Although things such as the regenerative health made it way to easy for me, especially when combined with 3rd person traversing of levels and automated takedowns.. not to mention the illusion of choice with what you decide to spend your praxis on, because by the end of the game you have them all pretty much.
Also lets not forget that one Energy bar that magically regenerates itself.. :(
This all points to one thing sadly, a streamlined game that can play on all platforms equally.
Wheres the depth damn it!!!!!

Also the whole storyline seems a bit dulled to me, in the first DX you would find yourself reading many emails, PDA's and they all had unique content in them touching on many different topics and it really felt like you were really deep down in some huge conspiracy. HR seems very lacking in this department and even with its shallow plot manages to somehow confuse you as to whats going on, only eluding to a conspiracy and thick plot, never really placing you in it.

Also NPC's in DX1 always had interesting things to say which would really get ya thinking, compared to HR were there only seems to be 15-20 scripted lines they spit out randomly. All the emails in HR seemed repetitive and boring and i simply stopped reading them after a while.

The one thing that saves HR is the great artwork/artstyle. This was really pulled off nicely.
Although imo doesn't really save the game when its crunch time.

Ludogator
30th Aug 2011, 15:40
I find the new game quite similar to the first one. A few levels reminded me, what could be found in J.C.'s adventures.

However I didn't find a lot of things I was waiting for in the game. Everyone mentioned meelee weapons, so I will not repeat.

Lack of more varied levels was one of the things I didn't like. In the first DX, there was a subway station, statue of liberty, a transport ship, airfield with a boeing in a hangar, hidden underground places for mole people, Area 51...
Human revolution has only cities with some not so varied buildings (excl labs), and one base (panchea).

There were more things - books (I really liked "Sun Tzu - The art of War" quotes related to the situation in the game), maintenance and medical bots + a whole lot more military bots, zyme which gave a bullet time effect, better crossbow, shooting skill which influented efficiency, hazard suits, termooptic camos, protecting vests...

I must admit, that the new game was great, it made me loose a lot of my sleeping time, but it was contaminated with todays standards and trends, and it hurts a lot seeing how made-for-gamepad it was (only 4 augs turned on manually, strange bahaviour of the mouse buttons...).