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View Full Version : Tranquilizer rifle can kill people? Please respond.



juhh
25th Aug 2011, 18:28
:confused:

I have bought the Aug Edition on first day on PS3, and I'm really enjoying it.

But me, and a lot of other players noticed, that when they were backtracking, they found the people they put in sleep with the tranq rifle and the game was showing the skull icon above their bodies, even if they got the merciful soul XP bonus for them...

This would be quite the annoyance of course, because a lot of us going for the pacifist trophy.

We would really appreciate a response from someone on the dev team or just anybody from Eidos.

Thank You in advance.

FluffyPuppy
25th Aug 2011, 18:44
its weird that everyone i have put to sleep wether knock out from tranq rifle stun gun or sneakups ends up dead alot. some ppl die when i move them. its like wtf.

juhh
25th Aug 2011, 18:52
its weird that everyone i have put to sleep wether knock out from tranq rifle stun gun or sneakups ends up dead alot. some ppl die when i move them. its like wtf.

There was one guy who I stunned, then decided to hide his body by throwing it down a manhole, I checked, and he died.
That's OK I reloaded the game and I didn't threw him next time.
But why do they keep on dying? because of the non lethal rifle?? Because I shot them on the head?

timothydog76
25th Aug 2011, 19:03
I tranq'd a punk in the sewer trying to be "nice". Well he passed out and fell into the electrified sewage! hahaha. What a way to go.

jaywalker2309
25th Aug 2011, 19:31
There was one guy who I stunned, then decided to hide his body by throwing it down a manhole, I checked, and he died.
That's OK I reloaded the game and I didn't threw him next time.
But why do they keep on dying? because of the non lethal rifle?? Because I shot them on the head?

well u shoot anything at the head, lethal or not its gonna bloomin hurt, and most likely kill :) catapult between the eyes and all that ;)

juhh
25th Aug 2011, 23:13
well u shoot anything at the head, lethal or not its gonna bloomin hurt, and most likely kill :) catapult between the eyes and all that ;)
:scratch:
Well thanks for the heads up...
A warning in the game would have been nice, OR they could DIE right away, without you receiving the merciful soul xp so it won't FOOL US.
Oh, and if you don't shoot the, head the drug teaks way too long to kick in, they gonna notice.
I got used to MGS where you could make a person to look like Pinhead, from Hellraiser with tranq rounds...

Well there goes my gold trophy, I guess.
FUU..

sea
25th Aug 2011, 23:19
I don't think the non-lethal weapons can outright kill, but depending on if the body falls from a height, onto an environmental hazard, etc. they can still die. Also, exploding bots can kill (which lost me an achievement late in the game).

juhh
25th Aug 2011, 23:25
I don't think the non-lethal weapons can outright kill, but depending on if the body falls from a height, onto an environmental hazard, etc. they can still die. Also, exploding bots can kill (which lost me an achievement late in the game).

Yeah, we knew that.
But a lot of people are having the same issue:

Shoot a guy with the tranq rifle,
he falls,
you get the mercy bonus,
look at his body : Zzz
you come back later : DEAD.

And the bodies weren't exposed to any kind of lethal threat.

Jerion
25th Aug 2011, 23:26
The thing about Deus Ex is that it's logical and makes you think. Area look out of bounds behind a pane of glass? Chances are good you can break that glass and check it out. Gonna apply a hi-speed projectile to the face? Chances are it's going to do unpleasant things to the soft mushy grey matter within. ;)

Although, that does sound like an odd series of events. I don't think I ever encountered that, maybe there was something else that happened?

Meia
25th Aug 2011, 23:34
The thing about Deus Ex is that it's logical and makes you think. Area look out of bounds behind a pane of glass? Chances are good you can break that glass and check it out. Gonna apply a hi-speed projectile to the face? Chances are it's going to do unpleasant things to the soft mushy grey matter within. ;)

Although, that does sound like an odd series of events. I don't think I ever encountered that, maybe there was something else that happened?



Negative, as this obvious bug has happened to me too.


The scope on the rifle isn't exactly uber accurate because of the darts falling thing(unless it's over sucha great distance it doesn't matter), but I saw two guys on a couch, tranqed one, hid, silenty took out the other, got non lethal takedowns for both, saw the dart in the enemy's armpit, and is flagged as dead.

No idea if he was immediately flagged as dead, or when I backtracked after the objective of the mission, but yeah, he has a skull icon next to the search icon, so....


So yeah, definite bug with a supposedly non-lethal weapon. Also make a scope a heck of a lot more precise for the weapon if you're going to have it coded that a headshot with a non-lethal weapon still counts as lethal. I was happy to see this weapon was way better than the tranq crossbow from the original, but with this bug, using it for non-lethal purposes is more risk than it's worth.

juhh
25th Aug 2011, 23:37
The thing about Deus Ex is that it's logical and makes you think. Area look out of bounds behind a pane of glass? Chances are good you can break that glass and check it out. Gonna apply a hi-speed projectile to the face? Chances are it's going to do unpleasant things to the soft mushy grey matter within. ;)

Although, that does sound like an odd series of events. I don't think I ever encountered that, maybe there was something else that happened?

I like the game because of the logic and strategy elements, and all the other cool stuff within.
BUT the logic is MISSING from this scenario:
You get the MERCIFUL SOUL XP when you do it,
The target is just sleeping the whole time you are there,
It has happened on multiple locations and on multiple targets,
the rifle has almost none effectiveness in stealth gameplay if you don't go for the head.

IT IS an odd series of events and it has been encountered by many.
I humbly ask for any consideration of looking into this issue.
(BTW Sorry for my english, Im Hungarian)

juhh
26th Aug 2011, 10:25
Negative, as this obvious bug has happened to me too.



Also make a scope a heck of a lot more precise for the weapon if you're going to have it coded that a headshot with a non-lethal weapon still counts as lethal. I was happy to see this weapon was way better than the tranq crossbow from the original, but with this bug, using it for non-lethal purposes is more risk than it's worth.

Yeah, the aiming is not easy with it, try the target tracker (or something like that) upgrade for it.

WarBaby2
26th Aug 2011, 10:39
... maybe alergic shock?^^

juhh
26th Aug 2011, 11:02
... maybe alergic shock?^^

MAYBE!

So we should ask them if they're allergic before shooting them.

sjvan0
26th Aug 2011, 16:26
I think I know what's causing this. So far, I've only seen this happen to enemies that aren't hostile by default, but will go hostile if pressed, eg the two MCBs sitting on the couch in Double-T's apartment, the DRB guards that tell you to go away, etc. Now, usually when I headshot civillians with the tranq-rifle (eg, the two being questioned on the main floor of the police station) it causes them to die, so what I think is happening is that the game is still treating the non-hostile guards as civillians, instead of enemies. What's made me think this is that no matter what I did, shooting a certain DRB with the tranq rifle was always killing him, despite any "merciful soul" awards I got. However, when I missed a shot, it sent him into "alert" mode, and then when I shot again, this time getting a HS, it actually knocked him out instead of killing him.

AcousticToad
26th Aug 2011, 16:49
Same problem here, only way around seems to be alerting them first, i've shot them point blank in the eye and its not killed them before, only seems to be while they're in idle animations that it happens.

madmassey
26th Aug 2011, 23:54
I registered just to respond to this thread. Not to be inflammatory guys, but to me it's really not cool that Eidos representatives are being flippant about this issue. It's a real, reproducible bug that is causing major confusion with an already complex and difficult achievement, Pacifist.

If you're in the first downtown area and use the Tranquilizer Rifle against any gang member or other opponent that is not hostile by default, and that opponent is not alerted to your presence, he will SOMETIMES show up with a skull icon after he drops - even though you will get the Merciful Soul bonus. This is regardless of what body part you hit them. For instance, I took down 3 gang members at the same time with the rifle. The first 2 showed the skull. The third detected one of the bodies first, and as a result, showed ZZZ. And yes, sometimes the game decides that formerly untouched, sleeping gang members later show the skull for no reason.

Does this bugged skull icon represent failing the Pacifist achievement, or is it the Merciful Soul feedback that is important? This issue could be resolved with a simple communication from a programmer on the development team.

Obviously, you could alert every enemy before you tranquilize them - but this of course renders the guns main function useless. And, jeopardizes the other extremely difficult game-wide achievement, Foxiest of the Hounds. So you can see the achievement hunters dilemma.

This is really killing my excitement of the playthrough right now. If I get stuck in a part trying to get Pacifist, I'll feel like a sucker - reloading over and over - only to realize at the end of the game I was doomed by this bug from the start.

juhh
27th Aug 2011, 00:25
I registered just to respond to this thread. Not to be inflammatory guys, but to me it's really not cool that Eidos representatives are being flippant about this issue. It's a real, reproducible bug that is causing major confusion with an already complex and difficult achievement, Pacifist.

If you're in the first downtown area and use the Tranquilizer Rifle against any gang member or other opponent that is not hostile by default, and that opponent is not alerted to your presence, he will SOMETIMES show up with a skull icon after he drops - even though you will get the Merciful Soul bonus. This is regardless of what body part you hit them. For instance, I took down 3 gang members at the same time with the rifle. The first 2 showed the skull. The third detected one of the bodies first, and as a result, showed ZZZ. And yes, sometimes the game decides that formerly untouched, sleeping gang members later show the skull for no reason.

Does this bugged skull icon represent failing the Pacifist achievement, or is it the Merciful Soul feedback that is important? This issue could be resolved with a simple communication from a programmer on the development team.

Obviously, you could alert every enemy before you tranquilize them - but this of course renders the guns main function useless. And, jeopardizes the other extremely difficult game-wide achievement, Foxiest of the Hounds. So you can see the achievement hunters dilemma.

This is really killing my excitement of the playthrough right now. If I get stuck in a part trying to get Pacifist, I'll feel like a sucker - reloading over and over - only to realize at the end of the game I was doomed by this bug from the start.

Thanks for the input.
Thats exactly what I'm thinking.
We'll need to keep bumping up this thread until someone from the (devs or something) finally give an ACTUAL response.

Locutus of BORG
27th Aug 2011, 01:07
From what I heard, 'non-lethal' deaths don't affect your achievement - the game registers a takedown at the moment it happens, so when enemies die afterwards it's not counted against you.

juhh
27th Aug 2011, 01:13
From what I heard, 'non-lethal' deaths don't affect your achievement - the game registers a takedown at the moment it happens, so when enemies die afterwards it's not counted against you.

Well, we all hope so...

Algent
27th Aug 2011, 01:15
I don't think it's linked to the Tranquil Gun, in detroit while backtracking to validate a quest I found one guy I got KO with a takedown has now a Skull.

It could be an issue linked to loading (like the ragedoll spawning and taking fall damage).

Phsion
27th Aug 2011, 03:07
For me, they mostly die when I stuff them into a vent. Guess it must be the pretzel like shape their bodies keep taking.

sea
27th Aug 2011, 05:37
From what I heard, 'non-lethal' deaths don't affect your achievement - the game registers a takedown at the moment it happens, so when enemies die afterwards it's not counted against you.
This would contradict my experience with the bot explosion killing an incapacitated guard. Unless, of course, kills during the prologue/intro sequence are registered, in which case I was probably doomed from the start.

juhh
27th Aug 2011, 11:17
This would contradict my experience with the bot explosion killing an incapacitated guard. Unless, of course, kills during the prologue/intro sequence are registered, in which case I was probably doomed from the start.


I dunn why people think that the prologue didn't count.
You can easily avoid them.

juhh
27th Aug 2011, 15:49
Still no one thinks, that we deserve a response?

Dodgy1210
27th Aug 2011, 21:21
Typical from Eidos - a couple of useless, flippant responses, yet when it's proven to be an issue affecting a number of their customers, who then provide scenario based evidence to nullify the Eidos staff member's initial flippant remarks - they're now nowhere to be seen or heard from.
Brilliant.

Helmic
28th Aug 2011, 04:32
The thing about Deus Ex is that it's logical and makes you think. Area look out of bounds behind a pane of glass? Chances are good you can break that glass and check it out. Gonna apply a hi-speed projectile to the face? Chances are it's going to do unpleasant things to the soft mushy grey matter within. ;)

Although, that does sound like an odd series of events. I don't think I ever encountered that, maybe there was something else that happened?

Yes, that's why this happens with the same NPC dying over and over again to a stun gun jolt to the leg (example would be two of the three guys near a barrel fire in the sewers underneath Derelict Row, one sitting on a couch), but not another NPC no matter how many times you reload and try to kill him with a tranq dart to the eye socket. Trying to pass off something unintentional as deliberate, eh? icwutudidthar

Whenever this happens, you still get the "Merciful Soul" bonus, and it apparently people have still gotten the Pacifist achievement in spite of it. But enemies recognize their comrade as dead.

I found a workaround - if you first put the NPC into alarmed mode (shoot a tranq near the ground where he can hear it, running around), he'll return to normal and won't be killed by nonlethal weapons. It seems NPC's in nonstandard animations (like sitting on a couch or leaning on a wall) are the ones most affected. Nonlethal takedowns are also always safe, though since you can't take down an NPC sitting on a couch without standing directly in front of him that's often not an option. This makes it quite clear it's a bug.

And hell, while we're on pacifist run issues, why isn't there an option to simply knock out an enemy on the other side of a breakable wall? He's quite clearly OK after the blast in the animation, but Jenson decides to snap his neck anyways. Uncalled for, Jenson. You wasted my praxis point.

Fasterkatt
28th Aug 2011, 04:52
Not to disregard the issue people are having, but just a friendly reminder it is Saturday, most places of businesses only operate Monday to Friday. Try to save the hate until Monday :).

dimljajvbu
28th Aug 2011, 09:30
I had one body, that I had non-lethal-takedowned, who was "Zzz" but died as soon as I tried to grab him. I also had another (NLT) body die after I had pulled several into a small area. I'm guessing these are because of overly-sensitive physics damage or something like that. I've also had it where tranqing someone leaning against a wall made them die straight away. Not sure what's going on there...

juhh
28th Aug 2011, 12:27
OK, I've tried it.
You CAN make your enemies pinhead. I shot 15 needles in the face of a guy, and when I returned he was still Zzz.
So that should put an end to these 'of course they die, it's logic!' responses.
I still can't understand this bug.

Legionarius
28th Aug 2011, 13:22
Bumped. Please respond. I'm enjoying this game immensely but this bug is highly reproduce-able and gives me great cause for concern. I have been very careful but I just happened upon a body that is not sleeping that I took out SEVERAL hours ago.

I too have noticed two things: firstly, sometimes after a load old bodies will display as dead (does this hurt achievement progress?) Secondly, some enemies are ALWAYS killed by tranq rounds, regardless of where they are shot. The guard outside the gangbanger apartment is a perfect example of this.

Long story short - will a mod please respond as to whether or not the Pacifist achievement is still possible so long as we are getting 'Merciful' messages on every guard elimination? Does the achieve "look" at bodies or does it register on every take down? Please respond as soon as you can.

EDIT: Concussion grenades can also kill, but I assume this intended.

juhh
28th Aug 2011, 14:47
Bumped. Please respond. I'm enjoying this game immensely but this bug is highly reproduce-able and gives me great cause for concern. I have been very careful but I just happened upon a body that is not sleeping that I took out SEVERAL hours ago.

I too have noticed two things: firstly, sometimes after a load old bodies will display as dead (does this hurt achievement progress?) Secondly, some enemies are ALWAYS killed by tranq rounds, regardless of where they are shot. The guard outside the gangbanger apartment is a perfect example of this.

Long story short - will a mod please respond as to whether or not the Pacifist achievement is still possible so long as we are getting 'Merciful' messages on every guard elimination? Does the achieve "look" at bodies or does it register on every take down? Please respond as soon as you can.

EDIT: Concussion grenades can also kill, but I assume this intended.

Thanks for contributing.
Why would it be intended?
It's marked as a non lethal weapon , that's stunning people .

DeeGeeFi
28th Aug 2011, 15:11
Yup, also registered to verify this. Physics seem to kill sleeping enemies (expecially if moved after they've been sleeping on one place for some time) and tranquilizer also seems to kill certain enemies always. Also when shot enemy standing next to a friend, the friend seemed to walk over him and cause physics caused death...
Then there is also the wall breaking aug. If there is enemy on the other side, he gets necksnapped automatically...

Legionarius
28th Aug 2011, 15:22
Yup, also registered to verify this. Physics seem to kill sleeping enemies (expecially if moved after they've been sleeping on one place for some time) and tranquilizer also seems to kill certain enemies always. Also when shot enemy standing next to a friend, the friend seemed to walk over him and cause physics caused death...
Then there is also the wall breaking aug. If there is enemy on the other side, he gets necksnapped automatically...

As if this achievement / playstyle wasn't hard enough on the hard difficulty, they had to go and make the non-lethal weapons lethal on us :mad2: I would enjoy the game more if I wasn't having to COMPULSIVELY check the bodies :)

Brockxz
28th Aug 2011, 15:47
I don't understand how tranq rifle can kill people if it's info states that it does 0 dmg (0 dmg means 0 dmg and it is 0 dmg also if you hit enemies head)? I haven't experienced that yet but if someone says he killed someone with that gun than it is clearly some kind of bug.

MrxknownJG
28th Aug 2011, 16:36
This isn't caused by the tranq gun. Just happens after they are sleeping. I was moving a body through a door way in DRB territory and they became dead. It must be somehow tricking the game into thinking they suffered a fall or something.

Nevos
28th Aug 2011, 22:29
I've seen two ways a non-lethal move can kill.

1. Being hit with a tranquilizer dart and falling onto a shelf that causes them to slide down.
2. Moving the body near a crate or moving the crate will kill them.

Also I found out for some reason bodies will move randomly and end up as dead when they were just sleeping before. Like I hid two of the DRB gang members under a walkway, found both dead with one stuck between the upper area and lower area. Then I found one I took down with a non-lethal take down and moved him by a barrier. He was considered unconscious when I last checked him, but I just checked up on him and found him to be dead.

Now I hope these types of deaths will not count against me, but I'm not keeping my hopes up at a perfect pacifist run. :(

Madsfincter
29th Aug 2011, 04:54
I registered just to respond to this thread. Not to be inflammatory guys, but to me it's really not cool that Eidos representatives are being flippant about this issue. It's a real, reproducible bug that is causing major confusion with an already complex and difficult achievement, Pacifist.

If you're in the first downtown area and use the Tranquilizer Rifle against any gang member or other opponent that is not hostile by default, and that opponent is not alerted to your presence, he will SOMETIMES show up with a skull icon after he drops - even though you will get the Merciful Soul bonus. This is regardless of what body part you hit them. For instance, I took down 3 gang members at the same time with the rifle. The first 2 showed the skull. The third detected one of the bodies first, and as a result, showed ZZZ. And yes, sometimes the game decides that formerly untouched, sleeping gang members later show the skull for no reason.

Does this bugged skull icon represent failing the Pacifist achievement, or is it the Merciful Soul feedback that is important? This issue could be resolved with a simple communication from a programmer on the development team.

Obviously, you could alert every enemy before you tranquilize them - but this of course renders the guns main function useless. And, jeopardizes the other extremely difficult game-wide achievement, Foxiest of the Hounds. So you can see the achievement hunters dilemma.

This is really killing my excitement of the playthrough right now. If I get stuck in a part trying to get Pacifist, I'll feel like a sucker - reloading over and over - only to realize at the end of the game I was doomed by this bug from the start.

I could not have said any better what has been said above. PLEASE ADDRESS THIS ISSUE.

dimljajvbu
29th Aug 2011, 11:42
Quest "lesser evils"...
Tranqing either P-Gee or Bee-K (when they are idling) kills them.

juhh
29th Aug 2011, 16:29
I could not have said any better what has been said above. PLEASE ADDRESS THIS ISSUE.

Well this is coming along nicely ...

dimljajvbu
29th Aug 2011, 19:52
According to a post here (http://forums.eidosgames.com/showpost.php?p=1666909&postcount=25) someone got all achievements, with some people dying from NLT, so I'm thinking as long as you get Merciful for someone, you're safe.

Legionarius
30th Aug 2011, 01:09
Can't be bothered to respond. Its not just physics people. Some NPC's ALWAYS die to tranq shots. Try it on the guard in the hall during the lesser evils quest. He. Dies. Every. Time. Just sayin.

More XP to just do takedowns, but honestly - why even put #$%^*&! non-lethal weapons in? They are too untrustworthy for pacifist seekers to use, and rambo-types will go with a traditional projectile weapon anyway. Utterly useless.

juhh
31st Aug 2011, 10:38
So, I completed the game, and I GOT PACFIST.
Looks like it's a bug, that don't effects the trophy/achivement.
Still annoying and confusing tho.

Agent9
1st Sep 2011, 00:12
Well, it seems the bug is either related to physics calculation, or something of that sort.

I had to replay large parts of the game because of it. And so far, I've only taken down 1 or 2 enemies with a tranquil gun, so there is no connection with shooting in the head. All others are taken down with a tap of a "Q" key. Yet after some time, I notice that some of the "Zzzz" victims get skulled.

After noticing the bug for the first time, and having to replay two missions, I started to check if guards/gangers are "Zzzz" after I took them down and dragged to a hidden spot. And even if they were "Zzzz", sometimes when I came back to the same area, some of them were skulled.

Also, sometimes guards get stuck in walls/floor/barriers, so when you press "E" to drag them, they do a sudden, violent ragdoll move and get skulled.

I was cleaning the gang area in Detroit, and the bug hit again, for the 3rd time. And I have to rewind 2 hours of gameplay again. That is already getting annoying, so I stopped playing for today :( I already had to rewind ~1-2h three times, and I'm still in Detroit area, and the chip retrieval quest is not even done yet.

It would be nice to at least have a response from Eidos that this bug doesn't affect internal counters for achievements.

I'm on a regular PC version purchased from Steam.

KSib
1st Sep 2011, 02:23
So any response from Eidos yet? This sure is a really annoying bug considering I beat the game trying to get this achievement only to realize that tranqs have been killing people regardless of where the dart lands on their body. I wouldn't even mind an in-between patch that shows if the achievement has been ruined so I can re-load and try again in the mean-time until it's actually fixed.

Vantriztic
1st Sep 2011, 12:56
After reading the last few pages it seems people are getting the trophy even with the bug so I ask: can I continue playing; is this confirmed?

And if it isn't, should I alarm every guard before using tranq gun on them?

By the way, once I read the whole thread and a few others, it seems Derelict Row has the most glitches and problems. Its really frustrating when your only long range non-leathal weapon kills :scratch:

Please Edios, we are begging for this confusing bug to be fixed or at least addressed. Thank you.

KSib
1st Sep 2011, 20:33
After reading the last few pages it seems people are getting the trophy even with the bug so I ask: can I continue playing; is this confirmed?


They must be lucky, because I did NOT get the achievement later unless I did something crazy that I overlooked.

flib
2nd Sep 2011, 00:10
Yeah, I got my achievement without giving any consideration to the bug.

Vantriztic
2nd Sep 2011, 12:05
Oh come on guys; 1 person says yes and the other says no >_> Its like flipping a coin and having it land on its edge.

Oh wow! This is awesome. So at first I was going to write that I was just going to continue to see what happens, but for some reason I got the urge to try one last time and guess what? I was able to shoot all the bangers and none of them got killed via tranq gun!

The only thing that makes me doubt this was magically fixed on its own is that each time I tranqed one of them, they were in an alarmed state, which someone said on a previous post is the only way to bypass this bug.

If this works on every enemy, this is a great temporary solution (keyword: temporary).

I know this going to sound snobbish and whiny, but we shouldn't have to do this! Alarming every enemy before putting them to sleep defeats the purpose of stealth.

Again, thanks for listening; hopefully Edios can release a patch soon. I love this game too much just to forget about it.

Vantriztic
2nd Sep 2011, 20:14
Well I finished my Pacifist Run/Foxiest of the Hounds Run today and I got both trophies even though I "killed" some people with the tranq gun!

Seems like its just a visual glitch and doesn't affect the your Pacifist trophy. Yay! :D

flib
2nd Sep 2011, 21:16
I'm thinking that as long as you never get a "Man Down" XP bonus update, it won't forfeit you from Pacifist.

rwhit85
3rd Sep 2011, 00:03
I wish they had some sort of in-game current stats system in place, sort of like Mass Effect had. How many people you've killed, KO'd, stunned, how many successful hacks you've done, etc. That would really resolve the issue with this bug worrying people...

I'm doing my first playthrough on the hardest difficulty as non-lethal. Now I'm worried I'm wasting my time for the pacifist achievement. :(

flib
3rd Sep 2011, 00:43
Quit worrying about some dumb achievement and just enjoy the game. If you get it, great. If not, who cares?

rwhit85
3rd Sep 2011, 01:05
Quit worrying about some dumb achievement and just enjoy the game. If you get it, great. If not, who cares?

Maybe working towards that goal is part of the enjoyment for me? I'm not telling you how to enjoy your game.

Cri du chat
3rd Sep 2011, 14:42
The apologist logic is that hazardous chemicals in the local water and air supply, and any neuropozyne the subject ingested, combined with the tranquilizer substance forms a lethal toxin that instantly kills once created in the blood stream.

juhh
3rd Sep 2011, 15:49
I wonder when the consoles get a patch, tho.
Still a lot of bugs in an otherwise decent game

DarknessKnight
3rd Sep 2011, 22:03
I'm joining the chorus of baffled players, i'm having the tranq gun "kill" bug also and im worried that i wont have the pacifist achievement, if a Eidos Dev can give us a thumbs up that it will activate nevertheless while we wait for a patch, it would be HIGHLY apreciated.

Benderova
4th Sep 2011, 02:02
Just finished a pacifist playthrough on PS3 and I've never had this. I made a point of checking every single enemy I shot with it was alive because I'd read about this, but I can't understand why it's happening to people. I "tested" on afew guys by shooting them in the head, but it didn't kill them.

Vantriztic
4th Sep 2011, 02:18
I'm joining the chorus of baffled players, i'm having the tranq gun "kill" bug also and im worried that i wont have the pacifist achievement, if a Eidos Dev can give us a thumbs up that it will activate nevertheless while we wait for a patch, it would be HIGHLY apreciated.

Hey DarknessKnight, try this: shoot a tranq beside the enemy to get them in an alarmed state before tranqing them to sleep. I read this in a previous post and it worked for me. Unfortunately I got tired of alarming every enemy before sleepy-time, so I just played normally and "killed" enemies with the tranq. I wasn't expecting it, but the Pacifist trophy popped up during the credits :)

Good luck and please post back here if it works, so people can have a temporary solution until the almighty patch is released.

evouga
5th Sep 2011, 00:27
This bug happened to me too.

After stunning Double-T with a nonlethal takedown during the Cloak & Dagger quest, I tried to move him and he died (failing the quest).

rob444
5th Sep 2011, 19:34
I played the game without killing anyone, yet I didn't get the damn pacifist achievement.. I am 100% sure I did not kill anyone, eg. blow someone up, stun/takedown someone who would then fall into something hazardous, break walls when there was a guy at the other side etc. etc...
In other words, it had to be the stun gun or tranqualizer rifle!

I know no game is bug free but this made me sad panda. How am I going to get the pacifist achievement now? I refuse to play through the game again the very same way I did earlier (no killing) and I don't think I should have to...

Anyone have a pacifist save file for the PC I could borrow :mad2:? :rolleyes:

Pengalor
6th Sep 2011, 04:47
I certainly hope the "admins" replying here aren't developers for the game because if they are then their responses are disgustingly unprofessional. This is not an issue to be made light of and I'm fairly positive there is no way a bug like this should have been able to get through testing. This is already a very well-known bug with plenty of documentation and it's infuriating to try and deal with this bug, especially since I was originally going for a no-kill run and didn't find out till long after it happened that one of my targets had died for no reason. There are multiple places where enemies standing completely still will die for no reason when tranqed or stunned.

ekkmanz
6th Sep 2011, 10:32
Registered just to confirm this problem on PC version.

I tazed one MCB dude while they're sitting in the couch during "Cloak & Dagger". The guy is dead. The next guy become alerted and stand up looking for me. I stunned another guy, he became slept. Similar death occurs during my trip in Derelict Row. In front of the door on the ground floor, which leading me the ladder for the satellite, there is one DRB guy leaning his back to the wall. I tazed him and the skull indicator appeared over his body, even I got mercy skill points.

docsteely
6th Sep 2011, 14:06
This is a serious bug. I've done a double takedown on two DRBs just before the crossroads in their territory (either ahead under a gate or right through a door). I've left them there without moving them, both asleep and went through the door, where I got rid of the DRBs there. When I got back to the crossroads one of the guys is dead and in a different position than I left him. Perhaps some voodoo?
And I've ran into the "tranquilizing kills" both with MCBs and DRBs.

rob444
8th Sep 2011, 09:45
Okay guys. I've been lurking around on the Steam forum and I found a save file which you can use to get the pacifist achievement (PC - Steam version). Note that there's tons of other achievements in the save file too that you will most likely get unlocked but at least you get the pacifist achievement...

I uploaded the save file here (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/6822536/DEHR_Pacifist-Stealth-Hardest-The%20End.zip) or here (mirror up most of the time) (http://skadad.nu/DEHR_Pacifist-Stealth-Hardest-The-End.zip) (All credits to Mad_Dog (http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/member.php?u=736841)!).

Now how to install the save file (copied from Steam forum thread (http://forums.steampowered.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2099325) and a bit modified for the specific savefile posted above):


1. Start by turning off Steam Cloud for now. (Not needed, but keeps things more organized)
2. Create a backup folder and copy all your current saves, saveindex, and user file to the folder. All save files can be found under "Steam folder\userdata\<ID>\28050\remote\"
3. Delete all the files in your Deus Ex:HR save folder.
4. Start a new game with the same difficulty as the save file you're trying to copy over (hardest in this case).
5. When you get control of your character (In Megan's Office), save the game.
6. Exit the Deus Ex:HR
7. Exit Steam
8. Go back to your Deus Ex:HR save folder with your newly created save. Delete "gamer1" and then extract the save from the file above and rename it from "gamer99" to "gamer1" without quotes. DO NOT REPLACE YOUR SAVEINDEX. As for the user file, I have no idea, I always left it alone and it would still work for me.
9. Start up Steam (if you have Cloud enabled, it will add files into your save folder that seem to be missing, but it won't overwrite the ones you currently have in there. Just makes more clutter)
10. Start up Deus Ex:HR
11. Load desired File, Enjoy!



If a moderator feel that this file or method is against any forum rules (It shouldn't be), feel free to edit this post out.

Moork
8th Sep 2011, 11:30
Definite bug... The responses from the Eidos dudes are completely wrong, it's not "logical" as they put it at all! And it's not just the tranq rifle/stun gun. I'd like to report that during the Cloak and Daggers mission, when I went to Derelict Row, I knocked out some dudes in the alleyway in front of DR with hand to hand non-lethal takedowns and left them lying in the street. I went ahead and completed the objective. On my way back, I decided that one of the bodies looked a bit, err, untidy(?? God knows why I did it, I just did :)). I walked over to it, sure enough I saw "????" in the icon showing he was unconcious (ie. NOT DEAD). I dragged him over to one of them concrete tube things and hid him in there and this killed him! WTF??

Also, I'm playing the PC version, so it's not just the PS3 version. I assume the XBox has this issue as well. Just another thing to be fixed in the upcoming patch. In all honesty not something I want to make a huge deal of, there are far bigger problems with the game.

Tell you what Eidos, I'll happily test Thief 4 for you if you want! :) A bug like this would never get passed me

PugPug
11th Sep 2011, 18:55
Add my name to the list of people disappointed with the response from Eidos. Are they investigating this issue?

On the other side of the coin, I can fill sleeping people with bullets and they don't die.

rwhit85
12th Sep 2011, 05:05
Fantastic.

Just beat the game for the first time, entirely on pacifist. I refused to even carry lethal weapons (except for a laser rifle for the next to last boss fight) so I never 'accidentally' shot anybody. I didn't even use explosives on turrets/robots - I bypassed them, so they never 'blew up' killing anybody around them.

I finish the game... and dammit, I didn't get the pacifist achievement.

They should really put SOME sort of counter/warning in game. A good example would be the GTA status sheets - example here: http://www.johng.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/p1000021.jpg

Meh. Disappointing.

flib
12th Sep 2011, 19:28
For those who earned but didn't receive the achievement, quit complaining and just load up Rob444's savefile. (above)
Although, if you're a console player, well, you're SOL.

Xadorus
12th Sep 2011, 22:11
Count me in as another gamer who has encountered this problem. First noticed it on the "Cloak and Daggers" mission. The MCB guard that stands outside the apartment near the couch almost always dies when I use the tranq rifle, he even dies if I use a non-lethal takedown. Almost lost all motivation to play the game since this is my 2nd playthrough. Not really looking forward to restarting. Getting through the first part of Detroit takes me forever because I sell a lot of guns and have to go back and forth to pick them up and then sell them.

I find it a little ridiculous that this bug is very well known, and very repeatable and yet the only answers we've gotten is that "it's logical if you think about it". I love this game but bugs like this really kill my motivation. This game has been out for 3 weeks! I don't expect it to be patched yet, but at least some clarification would be nice. :confused:

rwhit85
13th Sep 2011, 00:36
For those who earned but didn't receive the achievement, quit complaining and just load up Rob444's savefile. (above)
Although, if you're a console player, well, you're SOL.

Does anybody know what other achievements it gives? I don't really want to get any achievements I haven't earned.

fresh fish 101
13th Sep 2011, 05:34
Maybe working towards that goal is part of the enjoyment for me? I'm not telling you how to enjoy your game.

^this^


on another note, eidos (montreal) if you read this, please stop making games. its not for you. give up.

rajkosto
16th Sep 2011, 10:42
Here's video proof of me CLEARLY not shooting the guy's head, the tranquilizer taking a few seconds to act, and the guy falling down DEAD for no reason.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VaN1KkTqw5k
as the video shows, this is on version 630, the latest
he died even when i did a takedown on him and then dragged him near the window so nobody could see him (he died after i left the window area)
and then another guy who i knocked out and he was ZZZ, dragged somewhere, left room, come back, dead.
these MCBs really dont like sleeping, they have sleep apnea or something

flib
16th Sep 2011, 21:24
It's because he as green when you shot him.

rajkosto
16th Sep 2011, 22:16
well all the guys are green before i take them down...im a ghost...

flib
16th Sep 2011, 22:41
Throw something to make him suspicious, then take him down.

Tainted
17th Oct 2011, 15:45
yea i just noticed i was getting this bug aswell , has anyone that got the bug finished the game and got the Pacifist Trophy/Achievement?

Gamefreek
29th Oct 2011, 00:00
Any word on when this bug will be fixed or if this bug effects the pacifist achievement or not?