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Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:32
i dont quite remember, but has been said that there will be no melee weapons in dxhr?

pringlepower
10th Oct 2010, 01:35
i dont quite remember, but has been said that there will be no melee weapons in dxhr?

Yes.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:36
then what will we do when we run out of ammo?

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 01:38
Use the takedowns, at least we don't know if there is a gun with infinite ammo

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 01:38
It's the thing I'm most angry at them for.

I like takedowns and cover-systems. But there's just no good excuse to remove melee weapons from the Deus Ex formula.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:40
Use the takedowns, at least we don't know if there is a gun with infinite ammo

man, that doesnt sound very good

maybe the prod doesnt count as a melee weapon, atleast i hope so

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 01:43
The prod is a melee weapon, but there is probably a lightning gun, so a short range weapon, I mean the PEPS, even if it can be something else but it sounds to be a short range weapon
I know there is 20 weapons so 14 guns and 6 explosives.
The guns sounds to be somewhat highly customisable

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 01:44
You may occasionally run out of ammo for your favorite weapons, but I imagine every enemy you kill will have a gun and some bullets you can loot.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:47
what is EM's official excuse for not including melee weapons?

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 01:48
Cause disturbances for things they want to do and the whole focus on takedowns, as far as I know they were these.

Deltaslayer
10th Oct 2010, 01:49
This game will make Invisible War look good...
No melee weapons, pfft... just put a knife for the people who don't want to use takedowns and the problem is solved...
For the god's sake, EM!

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:49
i guess thats reasonable

pringlepower
10th Oct 2010, 01:51
i guess thats reasonable

That's a very odd response. No fire and brimstone?

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 01:57
Cause disturbances for things they want to do and the whole focus on takedowns, as far as I know they were these.

He said "official reasons". ;)

Though my own suspicions are very close to what you wrote.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 01:59
haha

even if i went arguing hardcore, EM wouldnt listen

but maybe if we get a large petiton going, we can get some melee weps thrown in at best

this worked in the badcompany 2 forums to get rid of the horn in conquest mode

but the thread had around 100 or so pages, i dont think this forum's population could achieve that

Jerion
10th Oct 2010, 02:04
haha

even if i went arguing hardcore, EM wouldnt listen

but maybe if we get a large petiton going, we can get some melee weps thrown in at best

this worked in the badcompany 2 forums to get rid of the horn in conquest mode

but the thread had around 100 or so pages, i dont think this forum's population could achieve that

Pretty sure it's been done in the past. :hmm:

Granted it worked in BC2, but removing that annoying-as-**** horn in conquest was a relatively simple tweak that didn't at all require weapon and equipment rebalancing like this would. Compared to what you're suggesting it was tiny.

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 02:07
Unfortunately Pinky they were the reasons that I remember now there is probably a lack of accuracy in putting the whole thing

I will just sum the weapons we know

1 Pistol
2 Revolver
3 PEPS (non lethal)
4 Machine Pistol

5 Assault Rifle
6 Sniper Rifle
7 Crossbow
8 Shotgun

9 Grenade launcher
10 Rocket launcher
11 Minigun

12 FRAG grenade
13 Remote explosives
14 Flashbangs
15 EMP grenades
16 Smoke grenades
17 CS grenades

So there is 3 unknown weapons from the pack, and we know there will be probably one more less lethal weapon that sounds to be certain (tranquilizer rifle or gun since they promised them), and the rest will be more prototypes.

@ Jerion I think that's a bit the problem here, but I also thought melee weapons were a given since people talked a lot about them and how they loved them, but the takedowns are their replacement, we know that Hand to hand and melee with arm blades were done with takedowns.

EDIT: added one weapon and think about the hypothetic tranquilizer rifle / pistol, grenade launcher is multishot if people wants to know

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:08
if it was something like the dragon tooth sword it wouldn't really need balancing :D

but i get what you're saying though

Jerion
10th Oct 2010, 02:12
Actually, I do wonder if the arm blades could be changed out for other melee-type weapons. Like batons, dual crowbars, or lightsabers.

Facebyface
10th Oct 2010, 02:15
Unfortunately Pinky they were the reason that I remember

I will just sum the weapons we know

1 Pistol
2 Revolver
3 PEPS (non lethal)
1. I love the way the pistol looks. I actually wouldn't mind looking at it for half the game.

2. Haven't seen it yet, kind of iffy on the point of a futuristic revolver.

3. WANT WANT OM NOM


4 Assault Rifle
5 Sniper Rifle
6 Crossbow
7 Shotgun
Standard fare. Still don't get why crossbows are used... Ever. In any time period.


8 Grenade launcher
9 Rocket launcher
10 Minigun
8. Cuz we don't all ready have enough grenades! Also considering that Adam Jensen is a human war machine, he'd probably be able to throw them at a faster speed than he could shoot.

9. As seen in the demos.

10. Gonna deploy from his arm like that one guy? That'll teach him to call me boyscout...


So there is 4 unknown weapons from the pack, and we know there will be probably one more less lethal weapon that sounds to be certain (tranquilizer rifle or gun since they promised them), and the rest will be more prototypes.
I think that we will get one more non-lethal weapon apart from the tranq gun just for good fare from EM. I know most people will play it guns blazing, but having only two weapons to be stealthy is completely mundane.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:17
Actually, I do wonder if the arm blades could be changed out for other melee-type weapons. Like batons, dual crowbars, or lightsabers.

well

batons would be kind of worthless because you could just slap the mess out of someone with your big metal arms, actually id like to see that

kind of the same thing with crow bars

and light sabers would just be a bit much to make a reasonable reason to fit that in that time period

i like the idea but there is nothing i can think that could replace blades

Jerion
10th Oct 2010, 02:18
well

batons would be kind of worthless because you could just slap the mess out of someone with your big metal arms, actually id like to see that

kind of the same thing with crow bars

and light sabers would just be a bit much to make a reasonable reason to fit that in that time period

But c'mon...who doesn't want to be a cyberpunk Jedi? :(

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:21
But c'mon...who doesn't want to be a cyberpunk Jedi? :(
hold on i was thinking the lighsaber effect, but maybe the energy blade effect could replace the metal kind

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 02:26
Standard fare. Still don't get why crossbows are used... Ever. In any time period.

Because it's another stealth weapon, and it's very powerful... pretty much guaranteed to kill with one shot.

I'll be using it often.


2. Haven't seen it yet, kind of iffy on the point of a futuristic revolver.

http://dxhr.nanoaugur.net/dx3-screenshot47.jpg

http://www.xbox360achievements.org/images/news/1360DXHR_conceptart_revolver_632x409.jpg

http://dxhr.nanoaugur.net/mag-playstation-uk-1.jpg

http://dxhr.nanoaugur.net/mag-playstation-uk-2.jpg

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:32
i hope that sideways-break action is a mod

that sort of efficiency breaks the BA attitude of the .357 in my opinion

and the front grip of the flechette isnt very ergonomic

Gaunt88
10th Oct 2010, 02:43
Blade Hunter, you forgot the SMG/machine pistol.

That leaves us with 3 unknown weapons.

^Wait, being efficient means it's less badass?

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:47
not at all times, but i feel more badass loading round by round in the traditional cylinder hinge thing while my victim is trying to crawl away in a panic

and it looks straight up ugly

Gaunt88
10th Oct 2010, 02:51
I'm sure you'd still be able to do that with the sideloading design :) I'd want a speedloader in a combat situation, though.

As for your last point, well, t's subjective, isn't it? I for one think it looks awesome.

Bushmonster
10th Oct 2010, 02:53
I'm sure you'd still be able to do that with the sideloading design :) I'd want a speedloader in a combat situation, though.

As for your last point, well, t's subjective, isn't it? I for one think it looks sweet.

i said with the traditional cylinder hinge

and my whole post was subjective, thats why i hope its a weapon mod so everyone is happy-ish

Facebyface
10th Oct 2010, 02:55
Jeez Pinky... You always seem to have an answer to all things that I'm wondering. Stop fishing my brain!

I personally think the revolver's a bit too bulky, but that's for a different place. As for the crossbow, sniper rifle works just as well. The metal clunk of a flying projectile will be about as loud as a bullet firing off from a sniper rifle to those in the immediate vicinity. Always seemed to me like more of a close range weapon. It'd be sick though to fire a crossbow directly at someone's chest like Rorschach and send him out a window.

mad825
10th Oct 2010, 03:02
Standard fare. Still don't get why crossbows are used... Ever. In any time period.

It was the medieval equivalent to a pistol, the weapon remains cocked without any effort thus the shot can be more accurate and faster.

pringlepower
10th Oct 2010, 03:10
It was the medieval equivalent to a pistol, the weapon remains cocked without any effort thus the shot can be more accurate and faster.

Also using a bow takes training. With crossbows you stick in the bolt, do some winding, and release a trigger. And it pierces armour pretty well.

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 03:28
and it looks straight up ugly

The concept art looks a bit odd, but the in-game screenshot is just awesome. :cool:

And the thing is going to do some exquisite carnage.


As for the crossbow, sniper rifle works just as well.

Sure, but it's another weapon. And it's stealthy without needing a suppressor mod. And it's meant for closer range than your military-grade sniper riffle.

If you don't have a sniper riffle, or a good long-rage silenced weapon, or if you're out of ammo for your preferred poison... I'd rather have it in the game than not.

Angel-A
10th Oct 2010, 03:31
There's an old saying 'round here, and it goes "Stick with the prod".

Don't these fools realize that they need to prod with the prod?

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 10:51
Blade Hunter, you forgot the SMG/machine pistol.

That leaves us with 3 unknown weapons.

^Wait, being efficient means it's less badass?

Thanks yes I forgot the Machine pistol

Kvltism
10th Oct 2010, 11:06
...there's just no good excuse to remove melee weapons from the Deus Ex formula.

THIS

As someone who has enjoyed numerous stealth play-throughs of DX, it would kill me having to endure those TP takedowns again and again and again. I understand that Eidos Montreal are excited about their flashy little gimmick and want to show it off. That's fine. But would it have killed them to give us some degree of choice?

The lack of melee weapons takes away many cool scenarios I could have cooked up, using my surroundings (and objects strewn about the place) to my advantage. As such, it has a negative impact on the gaming experience.

DavidPlisken
10th Oct 2010, 11:28
Are there no non-lethal grenades, like gas grenades? You could have some funny situations with gas granades!

Corpus
10th Oct 2010, 11:43
Are there no non-lethal grenades, like gas grenades? You could have some funny situations with gas granades!

Stun grenades are confirmed. Not sure about gas.

Blade_hunter
10th Oct 2010, 13:16
Look at my weapon list dudes, the stun grenade is the flashbang, and the CS is the gas one.
As for the mine function there is a specific device where you can place a grenade of your choice (between the five) to make a proximity mine

As for the weaponry I'm quite satisfied by them except for the lack of melee weapons.
I mean I like the overall look of them, they are truly "cyberpunk" for some of them.

The great complaint that I and some people does it's the non presence of melee weapons.
normally there is two non lethal guns in the pack, two non lethal grenades and since there no melee weapons there is non lethal takedowns.

Tverdyj
10th Oct 2010, 16:21
gas grenades are back? yay!

*relives happy moments: UNATCO busting up the 'ton, me throwing gas grenades in the lobby and headshotting them all with a sniper, whist Paul makes his getaway*

St. Mellow
10th Oct 2010, 19:24
Great. I'm losing the last shred of hope I had left for this game.


This game will make Invisible War look good...

You said it, man.

OwlSolar
10th Oct 2010, 19:44
http://www.xbox360achievements.org/images/news/1360DXHR_conceptart_revolver_632x409.jpg

Oh my. I've been looking everywhere for a picture like that.

Is there a bigger version? :D

Pinky_Powers
10th Oct 2010, 23:38
Oh my. I've been looking everywhere for a picture like that.

Is there a bigger version? :D

I stumbled upon it whilst Googling. It was the largest version I could find.

Ashpolt
11th Oct 2010, 09:15
Anyone else noticed the designs for chambers that hold different numbers of bullets there? Presumably that'll be a visual way of representing a "capacity" upgrade.

Pinky_Powers
11th Oct 2010, 09:45
Anyone else noticed the designs for chambers that hold different numbers of bullets there? Presumably that'll be a visual way of representing a "capacity" upgrade.

Yeah, I mentioned that in another thread. I thought it meant a variety of ammunition types. But capacity upgrade makes more sense. :D

Irate_Iguana
11th Oct 2010, 10:11
Are those rounds supposed to be caseless? That is a pretty big fail from a weapons technology point of view.

Pinky_Powers
11th Oct 2010, 10:37
Are those rounds supposed to be caseless? That is a pretty big fail from a weapons technology point of view.

I can't tell if they're caseless or not. But I do know Eidos researched what current weapon manufactures are experimenting with and developing right now. So I wouldn't be so quick to assume they've failed. ;)

Irate_Iguana
11th Oct 2010, 11:10
So I wouldn't be so quick to assume they've failed. ;)

If it is caseless ammo than it is a fail. The ammo makes up the cylinder of the revolver as you can clearly see in the concept art. Without brass and a proper cylinder with chambers the gasses are going to escape on all sides. In this design (if that is indeed caseless ammo) the gas would propel the bullet exactly zero inches, but it will do some serious damage to Adam's hands.

If that isn't caseless ammo then they are revisiting the old tround concept invented by Dardick. Pretty neat idea which allowed for a magazine fed revolver. The concept was a total commercial failure though.

xsamitt
11th Oct 2010, 11:40
THIS

As someone who has enjoyed numerous stealth play-throughs of DX, it would kill me having to endure those TP takedowns again and again and again. I understand that Eidos Montreal are excited about their flashy little gimmick and want to show it off. That's fine. But would it have killed them to give us some degree of choice?

The lack of melee weapons takes away many cool scenarios I could have cooked up, using my surroundings (and objects strewn about the place) to my advantage. As such, it has a negative impact on the gaming experience.

AGREED......I was never one for style over substance.Clearly when choice is taken away,things we couuld do 10 years ago in the first DX ....well that's a no brainer that we would feel a little short changed.I'm sure that HR will have it's own charm though.

Blade_hunter
11th Oct 2010, 12:05
If it is caseless ammo than it is a fail. The ammo makes up the cylinder of the revolver as you can clearly see in the concept art. Without brass and a proper cylinder with chambers the gasses are going to escape on all sides. In this design (if that is indeed caseless ammo) the gas would propel the bullet exactly zero inches, but it will do some serious damage to Adam's hands.

If that isn't caseless ammo then they are revisiting the old tround concept invented by Dardick. Pretty neat idea which allowed for a magazine fed revolver. The concept was a total commercial failure though.

Do you mean those triangular shells ? Caseless ammo normally sould make the cylinder shorter in length, also I find weird that they use a known caliber bullet for it

Irate_Iguana
11th Oct 2010, 15:02
Do you mean those triangular shells ?

Yep. Pretty innovative design.



I find weird that they use a known caliber bullet for it

Not really. People know the round and they know that it is a powerful round. It immediately gets the message across. People know that the revolver will be a handcannon.

AlexOfSpades
11th Oct 2010, 15:07
That revolver gave me a ... Mmm, well.

Let's just say that it almost attracts me sexually, leaving physical evidences of it.

I'm just a revolver lover.

Kodaemon
11th Oct 2010, 15:19
A revlover.

Blade_hunter
11th Oct 2010, 15:35
Well dude how much of us wanted a revolver :)
Yeah I remember that they've made a revolver that can shoot 20 rounds with those cartridges

AlexOfSpades
11th Oct 2010, 15:52
http://www.dreadgazebo.com/gunporn/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/raging_bull-3.jpg

<3

So manly.

Heh, revlover. :D

Cartridges? How?

Blade_hunter
11th Oct 2010, 16:16
You have the same taste as me, I love the raging bull !!

The revolver was pretty innovative, but I will show you what me and Iguana were talking about.
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/9093/xlgthisgun0.jpg